NASASpaceFlight.com Forum
International Space Flight (ESA, Russia, China and others) => Russian Launchers - Soyuz, Progress and Uncrewed => Topic started by: anik on 02/12/2013 08:37 am
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Live coverage for Progress M-19M.
Docking coverage begins on Page 11
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Progress M-19M (419) arrived at Baykonur on January 27, 2013.
According to TsENKI, Progress M-19M was transported to the vacuum chamber on February 28.
Launch is planned on April 24 at 1012UTC, using the 11A511U Soyuz-U (Л15000-138) launch vehicle from the PU-5 LC1 'Gagarinskiy Start' (17P32-5) launch complex.
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I was told the launch will be moved to April 22nd soon.
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Is the launch time known? Somewhere around 09:30 Zulu I guess?
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Because of conflict with Bion-M launch, Progress M-19M will be launched on April 24th and use two-day rendezvous scheme with ISS.
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Because of conflict with Bion-M launch, Progress M-19M will be launched on April 24th and use two-day rendezvous scheme with ISS.
I saw your post at the NK forums stating that at Baiknour the Soyuz launches have a minimum turn around time of 4 days from the two different pads. Is that a man power constraint? (do the two launches share the same launch team?)
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Is that a man power constraint? (do the two launches share the same launch team?)
Yes. The problem is if Bion-M launch will be postponed to April 20 then Progress M-19M can not be launched on April 22nd. So Roskosmos has decided to use April 24th launch date for Progress M-19M.
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The launch time is 10:12:17 UTC.
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According to NK forum, the docking is planned on April 24th at 12:28 UTC.
http://novosti-kosmonavtiki.ru/forum/messages/forum10/topic13452/message1051832/#message1051832
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April 24, Wednesday
6 a.m. - ISS Progress 51 Launch Coverage from the Baikonur Cosmodrome, Kazakhstan (Launch scheduled at 6:12 a.m. EDT) - JSC via Baikonur (All Channels)
April 26, Friday
7:45 a.m. - ISS Progress 51 Docking Coverage (Docking scheduled at 8:27 a.m. EDT) JSC (All Channels)
http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/MM_NTV_Breaking.html
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According to http://www.gctc.ru/main.php?id=1967 (http://www.gctc.ru/main.php?id=1967), a new Russian treadmill will be delivered to replace the good old TVIS on this flight.
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A meeting of the Technical management
At Baikonur launch site the preparations continue for the launch of Progress M-19M cargo vehicle under the International Space Station program.
The Technical Management meeting took place, which made a decision to fuel Progress M-19M cargo vehicle with propellant components and compressed gases.
http://www.energia.ru/en/iss/iss35/progress_m-19m/photo_04-11.html
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Progress M-19M cargo vehicle was delivered to the Spacecraft Assembly and Testing Facility
At Baikonur launch site the preparations continue for the launch of Progress M-19M cargo vehicle under the International Space Station program.
Progress M-19M cargo vehicle fuelled with propellant components and compressed gases was delivered to the Spacecraft Assembly and Testing Facility for final processing operations.
http://www.energia.ru/en/iss/iss35/progress_m-19m/photo_04-16.html
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A transfer compartment was docked with Progress M-19M cargo vehicle
At Baikonur launch site the preparations continue for the launch of Progress M-19M cargo vehicle under the International Space Station program.
Progress M-19M transport cargo vehicle was docked with the transfer compartment in the Spacecraft Assembly and Testing Facility.
http://www.energia.ru/en/iss/iss35/progress_m-19m/photo_04-18.html
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April 24, Wednesday
6 a.m. - ISS Progress 51 Launch Coverage from the Baikonur Cosmodrome, Kazakhstan (Launch scheduled at 6:12 a.m. EDT) - JSC via Baikonur (All Channels)
April 26, Friday
7:45 a.m. - ISS Progress 51 Docking Coverage (Docking scheduled at 8:27 a.m. EDT) JSC (All Channels)
http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/MM_NTV_Breaking.html
So the Glonass launch will be in between this launch and the docking, if all goes according to plan?
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=30062.0
"The launch is planned at 05:23:41 UTC on April 26th."
Cool!!! Busy rest of the month, that's for sure!
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April 24, Wednesday
6 a.m. - ISS Progress 51 Launch Coverage from the Baikonur Cosmodrome, Kazakhstan (Launch scheduled at 6:12 a.m. EDT) - JSC via Baikonur (All Channels)
April 26, Friday
7:45 a.m. - ISS Progress 51 Docking Coverage (Docking scheduled at 8:27 a.m. EDT) JSC (All Channels)
http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/MM_NTV_Breaking.html
So the Glonass launch will be in between this launch and the docking, if all goes according to plan?
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=30062.0
"The launch is planned at 05:23:41 UTC on April 26th."
Cool!!! Busy rest of the month, that's for sure!
Yup, although don't expect any webcasts for any Soyuz launches out of Plesetsk. ;)
There's also a Chinese launch thrown into the measure just 10 minutes before the Glonass launch, although chances of seeing any live video is close to zero... ;)
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Designers inspection of Progress M-19M cargo vehicle and payload shroud roll were performed
At Baikonur launch site the preparations continue for the launch of Progress M-19M cargo vehicle under the International Space Station program.
Designers inspection of the Progress M-19M cargo vehicle was completed.
Payload shroud roll on to the Progress M-19M cargo vehicle was performed.
http://www.energia.ru/en/iss/iss35/progress_m-19m/photo_04-19.html
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Progress M-19M launch and docking
Mission events:
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April 19, 2013.
The orbital module of the LV Soyuz-U with CV Progress M-19M transportation for the general integration with LV
At Baikonur launch site the preparations continue for the launch of Progress M-19M cargo vehicle under the International Space Station program.
Orbital module of the Soyuz-U launch vehicle, containing Progress M-19M spacecraft was transported from the spacecraft processing facility for the general integration with LV.
http://www.energia.ru/en/iss/iss35/progress_m-19m/photo_04-19_2.html
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April 19, 2013.
The orbital module of the LV Soyuz-U with CV Progress M-19M transportation for the general integration with LV
At Baikonur launch site the preparations continue for the launch of Progress M-19M cargo vehicle under the International Space Station program.
Orbital module of the Soyuz-U launch vehicle, containing Progress M-19M spacecraft was transported from the spacecraft processing facility for the general integration with LV.
http://www.energia.ru/en/iss/iss35/progress_m-19m/photo_04-19_2.html
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Designers inspection of Progress M-19M cargo vehicle and payload shroud roll were performed
At Baikonur launch site the preparations continue for the launch of Progress M-19M cargo vehicle under the International Space Station program.
Designers inspection of the Progress M-19M cargo vehicle was completed.
Payload shroud roll on to the Progress M-19M cargo vehicle was performed.
in photo_04-19-16.jpg - are those guys actually sitting on a part of the vehicle or payload or what? On top of the railcar carrier?
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Designers inspection of Progress M-19M cargo vehicle and payload shroud roll were performed
At Baikonur launch site the preparations continue for the launch of Progress M-19M cargo vehicle under the International Space Station program.
Designers inspection of the Progress M-19M cargo vehicle was completed.
Payload shroud roll on to the Progress M-19M cargo vehicle was performed.
in photo_04-19-16.jpg - are those guys actually sitting on a part of the vehicle or payload or what? On top of the railcar carrier?
Looks like the rocket's third stage.
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in photo_04-19-16.jpg - are those guys actually sitting on a part of the vehicle or payload or what? On top of the railcar carrier?
Looks like the rocket's third stage.
If so... Maybe it's just me but that seems like a Really Bad Idea (tm) ... subjecting the vehicle to side loads it wasn't necessarily designed for (nor should it have been)
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Designers inspection of Progress M-19M cargo vehicle and payload shroud roll were performed
At Baikonur launch site the preparations continue for the launch of Progress M-19M cargo vehicle under the International Space Station program.
Designers inspection of the Progress M-19M cargo vehicle was completed.
Payload shroud roll on to the Progress M-19M cargo vehicle was performed.
in photo_04-19-16.jpg - are those guys actually sitting on a part of the vehicle or payload or what? On top of the railcar carrier?
Looks like the rocket's third stage.
No, they are sitting on the transfer compartment, which is interstage/payload adaptor used with Progress and Soyuz SC
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in photo_04-19-16.jpg - are those guys actually sitting on a part of the vehicle or payload or what? On top of the railcar carrier?
Looks like the rocket's third stage.
No, they are sitting on the transfer compartment, which is interstage/payload adaptor used with Progress and Soyuz SC
Still part of the vehicle though, or part of a carrier that doesn't fly into space?
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in photo_04-19-16.jpg - are those guys actually sitting on a part of the vehicle or payload or what? On top of the railcar carrier?
Looks like the rocket's third stage.
No, they are sitting on the transfer compartment, which is interstage/payload adaptor used with Progress and Soyuz SC
Still part of the vehicle though, or part of a carrier that doesn't fly into space?
It is the flight piece that connects the Progress to the stage three and when Progress separates from this piece this piece remains attached to forward end of the stage three.
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NOTAM for second stage debris
P1808/13 - ATS RTE SEGMENTS CLSD: B156 KUDEB-BOKIS, G96 KUDEB-ADARO. SFC - UNL, 24 1010-1050, 25 0950-1030, 24 APR 10:10 2013 UNTIL 25 APR 10:30 2013. CREATED: 20 APR 05:48 2013
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.....and another Soyuz rocket transported to the launch pad (this time pad 1/5 at Baikonur). ::)
http://www.federalspace.ru/main.php?id=2&nid=20051 (http://www.federalspace.ru/main.php?id=2&nid=20051)
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http://www.energia.ru/ru/iss/iss35/progress_m-19m/photo_04-22.html
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http://www.mcc.rsa.ru/progress_m19m.htm
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NOTAM for first stage/fairing and second stage debris
K0188/13 - ATS ROUTE SEGMENTS CLSD: 1.B944 ZHEZKAZGAN-REMTI 2.A370 ZHEZKAZGAN-DITSO 3.A359 ZHEZKAZGAN-LEMDU TO 50 KM 4.R482 ZHEZKAZGAN-BURIK TO 40 KM 5.A73 ZHEZKAZGAN-ASLIK TO 40 KM 6.R366 AMASO-KUROL FROM 30 TO 90 KM 7.A360 DITKI-KUROL FROM 10 TO 65 KM 8.B156 BANOV-BOKIS FROM 5 KM. SFC - UNL, 24 APRIL 1005/1050 25 APRIL 0945/1030, 24 APR 10:05 2013 UNTIL 25 APR 10:30 2013. CREATED: 22 APR 15:05 2013
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Roscosmos video of the roll-out:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=srb9eOgxidM
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Moved for live coverage.
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T-2 hours
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T-85 minutes
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Nice shot of the launch pad...
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T-50m for launch...
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Service tower retracting...
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When I visited Baikonur, our guide told us "Don't take pictures of the antennas or you will have problems"...
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T-30 minutes
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T-20 minutes. NASA TV coverage in 8 minutes.
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T-15 minutes
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T-12 mins
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10 minutes for launch... all looks good! Nice day at Baikonur...
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Flight recorders and gyros activated.
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ISS config:
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Looks rather gusty..... (shades of Antares? ::))
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Some guys in a Jeep rushing past at T-5 mins! :)
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Vents:
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T-4 mins.
Nitrogen purge in work.
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Nitrogen purge began...
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Prop drainback.
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Pressurization began...
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T-120 seconds. Booster tanks into re-press.
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T-60 seconds. Internal power.
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And launch!!!
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LAUNCH!!
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Nominal first stage.
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STAGING.
1-2 sep.
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Vehicle is behaving well.
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STAGING 2-3 Sep.
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MECO!
Shutdown and Sep!
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And there's MECO. Well done Soyuz-U!
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Antenna and Arrays deployed.
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Notice that the MCC-Moscow seems to be rather empty at this time.... (yeah I know this is not the LCC)
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Congrats, well done! :)
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http://novosti-kosmonavtiki.ru/forum/messages/forum10/topic13452/message1063305/#message1063305
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Article:
http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2013/04/soyuz-u-progress-m-19m-iss/
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Congrats team! :)
I see NASA haven't noticed their caption says Conrol Room yet. ;D
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Expedition 35 - Progress M-19M / 51 Launch
http://www.space-multimedia.nl.eu.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=8220
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NASA on Twitter:
NASA @NASA
Update: Once in orbit, an antenna used as a navigational aid on the Progress did not deploy. Russian ground controllers are assessing a fix.
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I guess this is not exactly a concern, given that the antenna can be re-commanded for deployment, and if that didn't work the docking can simply be done with TORU? ;)
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Very nice launch ! (1400 meters away from the launch pad !)
http://hfr-rehost.net/self/63f15908fdd31486e3135721724e6166a60e932a.jpg
http://hfr-rehost.net/self/032c67e513974e91095b63f30a1b1adf73a2c801.jpg
http://hfr-rehost.net/self/827df5750f179c3b3450aa04cfe7bbb50ef2898d.jpg
http://hfr-rehost.net/self/dcab8bc9ca2dd1b57842a8189ef39828efcea659.jpg
http://hfr-rehost.net/self/24d9d8a0a5bc57f2b368c8080f9fa70fbb90697f.jpg
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Looks like another attempt in unfolding that antenna was unsuccessful: http://ria.ru/science/20130424/934355519.html (http://ria.ru/science/20130424/934355519.html)
Will the ISS accept using the TORU manual controls right from the start? ???
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Launch photos from Energia http://www.energia.ru/en/iss/iss35/progress_m-19m/photo_04-24.html
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Launch Video from Roscosmos
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLHwDtrinMo
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Will the ISS accept using the TORU manual controls right from the start? ???
Well this article says they will dock this Progress no matter what. I'm sure the Russians have got some backup plans for such occasion as they always seem to have a plan B in case plan A doesn't work :) And Plan C in case plan B doesn't :)
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The Kurs antennas that deploy are for the last moments of the rendezvous and docking. The requirement is that the short range antennas all be deployed to successfully complete the fly-around, and then the station-keeping once the flyaround is completed.
AFAIK, no Progress vehicle has had a Kurs failure prior to achieving station-keeping. Kurs failures normally occur in the short range phase after station-keeping.
Soyuz T-8 suffered a similar antenna failure and was unable to dock. The problem was in matching speed and orientation with Salyut without a functioning antenna set.
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Danderman: that sounds interesting. Hopefully the Russians figure this out. At least there's a bit of time for solving&planning. When was TORU used last time?
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Danderman: that sounds interesting. Hopefully the Russians figure this out. At least there's a bit of time for solving&planning. When was TORU used last time?
AFAIK these are the last few times the TORU was used:
Progress M-53 - June 2005
Progress M-01M - November 2008
Progress M-67 - July 2009
Progress M-05M - May 2010
Progress M-08M - October 2010
The problem is that in all these cases the Kurs system failed on final approach, while this time you have a Progress without Kurs right from the start. I don't recall any instance of such a problem at least in the history of ISS.
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I believe that TORU has a range of 7 kilometers, so that won't be a problem - as long as TsUP can figure out a way to safely get Progress within that 7 kilometers. I am not sure how Kurs works in this "mid-range" phase of rendezvous (from 200 km out to station-keeping). In particular, I don't know how Kurs controls the fly-around. We might find this out this week.
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I believe that TORU has a range of 7 kilometers, so that won't be a problem - as long as TsUP can figure out a way to safely get Progress within that 7 kilometers. I am not sure how Kurs works in this "mid-range" phase of rendezvous (from 200 km out to station-keeping). In particular, I don't know how Kurs controls the fly-around. We might find this out this week.
Well the main issue currently is that with the Progress requiring manual control from at least several kilometers away, could there be issues with using it a la Progress M-34?
But I guess the cosmonaut training should have improved greatly since 1997.....
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Well the main issue currently is that with the Progress requiring manual control from at least several kilometers away, could there be issues with using it a la Progress M-34?
But I guess the cosmonaut training should have improved greatly since 1997.....
That was completely unrelated to Kurs failure at long range. There is no station at long range.
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Well the main issue currently is that with the Progress requiring manual control from at least several kilometers away, could there be issues with using it a la Progress M-34?
But I guess the cosmonaut training should have improved greatly since 1997.....
That was completely unrelated to Kurs failure at long range. There is no station at long range.
I guess the major issue right now isn't that the Kurs have failed, it's with whether TORU + cosmonaut can be trusted to control the Progress right from the start of fly-around, as opposed to during final approach.
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Well the main issue currently is that with the Progress requiring manual control from at least several kilometers away, could there be issues with using it a la Progress M-34?
But I guess the cosmonaut training should have improved greatly since 1997.....
There was a change in flight rules for Progress since 1997. For ISS missions, the Progress is targeted at a point where the plane of the orbit is offset to that of ISS, so there is no chance of collision. I believe that even with a missing Kurs antenna, Progress can get to that offset point.
The first burn is targeted to result in an out of plane point one kilometer from ISS, and subsequent burns refine that out of plane point to within a few hundred meters.
This offset point is not be confused with the Ballistic Targeting Point.
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I guess the major issue right now isn't that the Kurs have failed, it's with whether TORU + cosmonaut can be trusted to control the Progress right from the start of fly-around, as opposed to during final approach.
I suppose they have been trained for such operation. Everything fails once in a while, so I think they should be ready for that.
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Uh-oh, didn't expect to log on and see this. :(
Hope they can get it fixed, or else that shiny new treadmill will be heading down to the drink.
Good job this was a two-day rendezvous from the start, because if it had been a six hour rendezvous, then they would have had to revert back to two days anyway.
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Hope they can get it fixed, or else that shiny new treadmill will be heading down to the drink.
Is this confirmation that the mission is not salvageable without the deployment of that antenna?
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Is this confirmation that the mission is not salvageable without the deployment of that antenna?
No - not confirmed at this time - just my personal speculation.
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Picture of the antenna in question (or is it?) , and some commentary, on Space Station Live program:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KeBA8LJ5Auo
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Is this confirmation that the mission is not salvageable without the deployment of that antenna?
No - not confirmed at this time - just my personal speculation.
Russian reports seems to be completely opposite (http://interfax.ru/russia/txt.asp?id=303503): RSC Energia chief Vitaly Lopota claimed that even without that antenna the spacecraft can still reach the 200 meter decision point, then automatically dock to the ISS!
Probably I need to review those L2 documents to see which antenna is affected....
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Russian reports seems to be completely opposite (http://interfax.ru/russia/txt.asp?id=303503): RSC Energia chief Vitaly Lopota claimed that even without that antenna the spacecraft can still reach the 200 meter decision point, then automatically dock to the ISS!
Probably I need to review those L2 documents to see which antenna is affected....
After reading some NK forum I've got the impression that the failed antenna is close-range antenna, if it's true then they would have no issues during rendezvous, and then switch to TORU if issue won't be fixed somehow. We probably need to wait a bit until the dust settles so we would get more accurate picture.
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Picture of the antenna in question (of is it?) , and some commentary, on Space Station Live program:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KeBA8LJ5Auo
Ah, so it's the 2ASF-VKA antenna that can't be deployed. This is used during the final approach to the ISS (it measures the pitch and yaw angles from the station's different Kurs antennas within 1 km from the station), so the spacecraft may simply maneuver towards the ISS, then let the cosmonaut take over control on the last km.
Some information about how Kurs works in French: http://www.kosmonavtika.com/vaisseaux/kours/tech/1.html (http://www.kosmonavtika.com/vaisseaux/kours/tech/1.html)
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Thanks Satori and dedead. I enjoyed the view of the flame trench and vehicle--could really see the turbopumps come up to flight speed.
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Is this confirmation that the mission is not salvageable without the deployment of that antenna?
No - not confirmed at this time - just my personal speculation.
Russian reports seems to be completely opposite (http://interfax.ru/russia/txt.asp?id=303503): RSC Energia chief Vitaly Lopota claimed that even without that antenna the spacecraft can still reach the 200 meter decision point, then automatically dock to the ISS!
Probably I need to review those L2 documents to see which antenna is affected....
Nice.
"Если даже антенна не откроется, то мы сможем войти в 200-метровую зону и в автоматическом режиме состыковаться."
Google translate:
"Even if the antenna is not open, we will be able to enter into a 200-meter area and automatically dock."
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Ah, so it's the 2ASF-VKA antenna that can't be deployed. This is used during the final approach to the ISS (it measures the pitch and yaw angles from the station's different Kurs antennas within 1 km from the station), so the spacecraft may simply maneuver towards the ISS, then let the cosmonaut take over control on the last km.
Correct.
The problem is the translation from 1 kilometer out to the stationkeeping point where TORU is normally used (for off-nominal operations).
Energia will probably figure out a work-around, but I have no clue what it would be.
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Well the main issue currently is that with the Progress requiring manual control from at least several kilometers away, could there be issues with using it a la Progress M-34?
Progress M-05M was controlled manually since 1000km.
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2ASF1-M-VKA-03 antenna did not deployed immediately on Progress M-01M. Deployment was achieved after several attempts.
So, wait and see...
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So, back to a nominal mission then!
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So, back to a nominal mission then!
Off-nominal, but the prospects for cargo delivery are not that bad.
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So, back to a nominal mission then!
Off-nominal, but the prospects for cargo delivery are not that bad.
If the antenna is deployed, what else is off nominal?
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So, back to a nominal mission then!
Off-nominal, but the prospects for cargo delivery are not that bad.
If the antenna is deployed, what else is off nominal?
I think you read Nicolas' post incorrectly. He was referring to a previous launch (M-01M), where antenna deployment was finally successful, not this one (yet).
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So, back to a nominal mission then!
Off-nominal, but the prospects for cargo delivery are not that bad.
If the antenna is deployed, what else is off nominal?
I think you read Nicolas' post incorrectly. He was referring to a previous launch (M-01M), where antenna deployment was finally successful, not this one (yet).
Oops...I think you are correct.
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So, back to a nominal mission then!
Off-nominal, but the prospects for cargo delivery are not that bad.
If the antenna is deployed, what else is off nominal?
I think you read Nicolas' post incorrectly. He was referring to a previous launch (M-01M), where antenna deployment was finally successful, not this one (yet).
2ASF-VKA antenna and that antennas systems have been verified total fail via Russian sources. Antenna is not drawing power since launch and 2ASF-VKA antenna failed health check due to no response to preprogrammed commands. At this time 2ASF-VKA antenna is not considered possible to use and exact reason is unknown. 2ASF-VKA antenna's deployment mechanism is believed source of failure but data from this mechanism was not properly received. Work is underway to determine if 2ASF-VKA antenna systems software is in need of reupload or revision. A final decision is expected within two to four hours on whether to mess with the software, delay docking a bit, not use 2ASF-VKA antenna, or proceed to ISS with problem and most likely use TORU near or under 1km.
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Houston had no update available for the crew on the Progress during the morning DPC--Moscow is still trouble shooting.
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According to NK forum EVA might be needed as this antenna might interfere with achieving hard dock (capture is still possible and in fact this is likely what would happen). Someone is proposing to use crowbar to tear this antenna apart :) There are also mentioned that things like that had happened in the past.
If so that would be kinda cool to watch (I hope there will be coverage) :)
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According to NK forum EVA might be needed as this antenna might interfere with achieving hard dock (capture is still possible and in fact this is likely what would happen). Someone is proposing to use crowbar to tear this antenna apart :) There are also mentioned that things like that had happened in the past.
If so that would be kinda cool to watch (I hope there will be coverage) :)
What's wrong with using Dextre? I mean, this is a perfect opportunity to try something like this and avoid an EVA.
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Wow, this is getting exciting!
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What's wrong with using Dextre? I mean, this is a perfect opportunity to try something like this and avoid an EVA.
Even if they wanted to, could it actually reach that far?
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What's wrong with using Dextre? I mean, this is a perfect opportunity to try something like this and avoid an EVA.
I don't know. As far as I understand "soft-docked" Soyuz/Progress basically hangs on the probe and can sway around (I recall some docking videos which see quite a movement after soft-dock). Which could make robotics op quite dangerous if it sways wrong way duing op.
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According to NK forum EVA might be needed as this antenna might interfere with achieving hard dock (capture is still possible and in fact this is likely what would happen). Someone is proposing to use crowbar to tear this antenna apart :) There are also mentioned that things like that had happened in the past.
If so that would be kinda cool to watch (I hope there will be coverage) :)
What's wrong with using Dextre? I mean, this is a perfect opportunity to try something like this and avoid an EVA.
On the end of Zvezda? That's probably very far from the closest PGDF that I doubt this could be possible.
Russian sources are claiming that an EVA will not be required, but reports on L2 seems to refute that....
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Russian sources are claiming that an EVA will not be required, but reports on L2 seems to refute that....
Yea my research turned up contradicting assessments of the situation, so I guess let's wait for more details. Still such a EVA would be cool! :D
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What's wrong with using Dextre? I mean, this is a perfect opportunity to try something like this and avoid an EVA.
I don't know. As far as I understand "soft-docked" Soyuz/Progress basically hangs on the probe and can sway around (I recall some docking videos which see quite a movement after soft-dock). Which could make robotics op quite dangerous if it sways wrong way duing op.
Well, Dextre has 2 hands, and is designed to stabilize itself against something (Progress in this case).
I do have doubts now about reach...probably is too far.
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If the antenna is stuck in its undeployed position, that indicates a pyro bolt that has not blown. There may also be a backup bolt that has not blown, indicating a total system failure for deployment.
There is a second pyro system, which is used in the final stages of docking to "push" the antenna cone away from the front of Progress, and which may be tried tomorrow, but if the entire system is shot, it probably won't activate.
As for Progress docking locations accessible to Dexter, Zvezda rear is too far, Rassvet is good, and the Pirs/Poisk docking locations are marginally accessible.
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Daily ISS update just mentioned ongoing discussions, showed a close-out photo of the antenna boom on the Progress, but no real news.
Is it time for a space history geek to list all the post-docking EVAs needed to complete docking missions? I can't get to it myself, alas.
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Daily ISS update just mentioned ongoing discussions, showed a close-out photo of the antenna boom on the Progress, but no real news.
Is it time for a space history geek to list all the post-docking EVAs needed to complete docking missions? I can't get to it myself, alas.
I do not believe that Progress or ISS flight rules would allow a Progress to hang off a docking port in soft dock mode for more than a few minutes, so an EVA or RMS ops are unlikely. Also, the multiple undeployed pyro bolts make this risky for EVA.
I would not rule out a decision to simply fire the thrusters after soft dock to bend the antenna back and allow hard dock.
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Daily ISS update just mentioned ongoing discussions, showed a close-out photo of the antenna boom on the Progress, but no real news.
Is it time for a space history geek to list all the post-docking EVAs needed to complete docking missions? I can't get to it myself, alas.
Discussions on the Russian net about a Radiogram indicate confusion by the crew because Moscow indicated an automated approach but the crew is being told to review the Radiogram--indicating a non-automated approach. The required "specialists" are not immediately available--a fairly common occurrence from listening to the ISS feed. There was no mention of the specific technical issue.
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1528 gmt -- media interviews, antenna question -- Marshburn: "that's the story as we've got it".... "we've got backup plans , spacewalk is one of the backup plans plans, that's right."
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Moscow just confirmed to the crew an automated approach is planned with monitoring at 1500 and 400 meters and no planned changes to the normal plan.
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Moscow just passed that a meeting about the issue is ongoing which is why details the crew wants on the plan are unavailable. The crew is free to call someone (missed the name) in about 2 hours--presumably via the IP phone.
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I should mention that if the cone of the antenna obscures the docking collar, then there would be real problems.
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Also, for those who do not these missions closely, the Progress only passes over Russian ground stations for about a third of the orbits each day, and then for a maximum of 12 minutes per pass. That means that time to download telemetry and upload software is limited.
Communications will get better as the Progress comes into range of ISS, as the Russian segment is now linked to the ground via TDRS.
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I do not believe that Progress or ISS flight rules would allow a Progress to hang off a docking port in soft dock mode for more than a few minutes, so an EVA or RMS ops are unlikely. Also, the multiple undeployed pyro bolts make this risky for EVA.
Apparently there are no flight rules forbidding that. It has been done in the past, here is example: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progress_M1-7 The Progress was hanging on the probe for several days.
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What's wrong with using Dextre? I mean, this is a perfect opportunity to try something like this and avoid an EVA.
Dextre would not be able to be used for this, since:
A) There would not be enough reach to get Dextre to the SM Aft location, even if the SSRMS was based from the FGB PDGF (which wouldn't be doable at this time anyway since the FGB PDGF is not yet active).
B) Although Dextre is commonly referred to as having "hands", all it really has is a grasping mechanism that is only compatible with so-called "micro fixtures" - and there aren't any of those on the Progress.
C) I doubt the robotics operators would want to place Dextre anywhere near an antenna that could suddenly spring open and cause damage.
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I do not believe that Progress or ISS flight rules would allow a Progress to hang off a docking port in soft dock mode for more than a few minutes, so an EVA or RMS ops are unlikely. Also, the multiple undeployed pyro bolts make this risky for EVA.
Apparently there are no flight rules forbidding that. It has been done in the past, here is example: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progress_M1-7 The Progress was hanging on the probe for several days.
How Progress M1-7 managed to hang on to ISS until hard dock is a bit of a mystery to me. It happens that I was with Energia docking experts when this incident occurred, but I can't remember the details now, as there was mass consumption of alcohol by me immediately after hard dock. I would guess that M1-7 somehow achieved more than soft docking (ie "capture") but that electrical circuits could not be mated, due to a tiny amount of rubber in the way. In other words, that Progress M1-7 may have been structurally mated to ISS, but the interfaces were not connected.
The flight rules exist to prevent a visiting vehicle from "flopping around" when ISS is not in free drift, ie returning to a nominal attitude.
Until the docking process complete signal is given, ISS is to remain in free drift. That signal is not given until hard dock is complete.
If the Progress is only in soft dock mode, where the connection is simply the probe in the cone, the Progress would be liable to moving around during ISS attitude maneuvers. Or, if a DAM were required, things could get difficult.
IF the Kurs antenna is obscuring the docking collar and preventing the hooks and latches to engage, I don't think the flight rules are going to allow the Progress to sit there in soft dock mode for very long.
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Daily ISS update just mentioned ongoing discussions, showed a close-out photo of the antenna boom on the Progress, but no real news.
Is it time for a space history geek to list all the post-docking EVAs needed to complete docking missions? I can't get to it myself, alas.
I do not believe that Progress or ISS flight rules would allow a Progress to hang off a docking port in soft dock mode for more than a few minutes, so an EVA or RMS ops are unlikely. Also, the multiple undeployed pyro bolts make this risky for EVA.
I would not rule out a decision to simply fire the thrusters after soft dock to bend the antenna back and allow hard dock.
can the pyro bolts be unbolted without danger?
Seem to remember explosive bolts that needed to be replaced somewhere on the ISS like last year. Anyone remember that?
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Golly, if the sequester 'cuts' hurt NASA so much, why don't they just outsource the MCC functions to this forum? Dang but there are insightful, experienced, candid folks loose hereabouts. Delightful. Molodtsi, all around, y'all.
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Seem to remember explosive bolts that needed to be replaced somewhere on the ISS like last year. Anyone remember that?
The issue was pyro bolts on the Soyuz, based on a previous failure
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What is the likelihood that issue will cause any delay with future Soyuz & Progress missions to ISS?
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NASA:
Managers meet tonight to determine if Progress will press for docking. If approved, NASA TV coverage begins Fri@6:30a- Docking planned@8:26a
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I do not believe that Progress or ISS flight rules would allow a Progress to hang off a docking port in soft dock mode for more than a few minutes, so an EVA or RMS ops are unlikely. Also, the multiple undeployed pyro bolts make this risky for EVA.
Apparently there are no flight rules forbidding that. It has been done in the past, here is example: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progress_M1-7 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progress_M1-7) The Progress was hanging on the probe for several days.
IF the Kurs antenna is obscuring the docking collar and preventing the hooks and latches to engage, I don't think the flight rules are going to allow the Progress to sit there in soft dock mode for very long.
It's close...
picture of m-11m below, assuming its the kurs antenna on the right of the picture, if its the other one, its blocking the docking collar.
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And a picture of m-14m showing both of them.
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picture of m-11m below, assuming its the kurs antenna on the right of the picture, if its the other one, its blocking the docking collar.
Yes, it is picture on the right of the picture.
http://www.kosmonavtika.com/vaisseaux/kours/tech/2.html
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Daily ISS update just mentioned ongoing discussions, showed a close-out photo of the antenna boom on the Progress, but no real news.
Is it time for a space history geek to list all the post-docking EVAs needed to complete docking missions? I can't get to it myself, alas.
In march 1991, there was an EVA from Mir to assess damages on a Kurs-P (passive) antenna. Story is discussed here :
http://www.kosmonavtika.com/vaisseaux/mir/missions/mireo08/6.html
In october 2006, the antenna 2AO-VKA of Progress M-58 did not retract before docking. Two EVAs had been achieved by the crew of Expedition 14.
http://www.kosmonavtika.com/vaisseaux/mks/missions/mkseo14/5.html
http://www.kosmonavtika.com/vaisseaux/mks/missions/mkseo14/13.html
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In october 2006, the antenna 2AO-VKA of Progress M-58 did not retract before docking. Two EVAs had been achieved by the crew of Expedition 14.
http://www.kosmonavtika.com/vaisseaux/mks/missions/mkseo14/5.html (http://www.kosmonavtika.com/vaisseaux/mks/missions/mkseo14/5.html)
http://www.kosmonavtika.com/vaisseaux/mks/missions/mkseo14/13.html (http://www.kosmonavtika.com/vaisseaux/mks/missions/mkseo14/13.html)
And here's the NASASpaceflight.com thread on Progress M-58: http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=4030.msg79448#msg79448
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NASA:
Managers meet tonight to determine if Progress will press for docking. If approved, NASA TV coverage begins Fri@6:30a- Docking planned@8:26a
I like that "If approved" surprised this wasn't questioned at the congress meeting yesterday.
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In october 2006, the antenna 2AO-VKA of Progress M-58 did not retract before docking. Two EVAs had been achieved by the crew of Expedition 14.
http://www.kosmonavtika.com/vaisseaux/mks/missions/mkseo14/5.html
http://www.kosmonavtika.com/vaisseaux/mks/missions/mkseo14/13.html
To be clear, Progress M-58 achieved hard docking before the cosmonauts went out to see why the Kurs antenna did not retract.
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And a picture of m-14m showing both of them.
It looks bad, but don't forget that there is a separate pyrobolt that can be blown to move the antenna away, just before docking. The question is whether that additional pryobolt system is also dead.
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Seem to remember explosive bolts that needed to be replaced somewhere on the ISS like last year. Anyone remember that?
The issue was pyro bolts on the Soyuz, based on a previous failure
Pyro bolts connecting the PAO to the descent module. Different system.
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Per the evening DPC. Standard docking planned and belief is that a good seal can be achieved with the undeployed antenna.
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Russian crew is being asked to photograph the Progress antenna with the best lens possible. The cupola shutters are usually closed during dockings (thruster firings) so photography from there probably isn't an option.
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US crew has told Houston they are willing to help with photographing the Progress as it approaches. CAPCOM reported that video from both the Progress and of the Progress from the ISS is planned for downlink to document the antenna configuration.
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Tomorrow events will be very exciting!
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Is docking(-attempt) still at 8:26 a.m (EDT) / 1226 UTC?
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Is docking(-attempt) still at 8:26 a.m (EDT) / 1226 UTC?
Appears so until otherwise noted...
NASA:
Managers meet tonight to determine if Progress will press for docking. If approved, NASA TV coverage begins Fri@6:30a- Docking planned@8:26a
Per the evening DPC. Standard docking planned and belief is that a good seal can be achieved with the undeployed antenna.
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Appears so until otherwise noted...
I wouldn't expect anything else from "managers". It should be engineers who make a call, not managers.
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Appears so until otherwise noted...
I wouldn't expect anything else from "managers". It should be engineers who make a call, not managers.
no this is managers from all MCCs to ISS-MCB who decide and agree with risks. Information is from the engineers and this info is passed up MCC chain of command and given to ISS-MCB Manager chain of command and they determine plan. Majority of these managers were engineers when they started.
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Remember that there is also an Energia engineer on board ISS.
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I got the tail end, so not 100% sure, but thought I heard no go for docking...
Which is in line with the analyses just posted on L2.....
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From Chris Hatfield via Facebook
Col. Chris Hadfield
Good Morning, Earth! The Progress resupply ship approaching Station has a failed, obstructing antenna. Roman & Pavel will manually dock it.
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USOS window shutters being closed per the timeline--Progress timeline still being discussed.
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Listening to the live ISS stream, it seems that the astronauts are doing preparations of the docking, but I am not sure.
Are they going to press on the docking or not? What I saw on L2 is, um, "interesting"...... ::)
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NASA TV apparently started the docking coverage much earlier than planned. Plan is to use Kurs to rendezvous and take over with TORU close to the station.
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As per NASA TV, Progress is in automated rendezvous mode now.
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L2 members should go here for a mass of great info and graphics etc on this Progress' issue:
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=31768.0
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All pretty quiet on the loop at the moment.
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View from the naughty Progress.
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Active part of KURS activated. Next will be the passive system.
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Wouldn't be an ISS loop if they weren't talking about bags.....and that's what the conversation is!
US loop, but no Russians talking about concerns, so all very smooth.
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Something on the loop about seeing KURS signal, but they still have Chris talking about his bags at the same time ;)
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1hr 26 mins to docking. Progress out of ground station range.
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A lot of group discussion have been happening at MCC Houston. Many involving the Flight Director and Capcom. Anybody recognize who the Capcom and Flight Director are for this shift?
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I saw Holly Ridings walking around--Orbit 2 Flight Director?
Russian crew discussing photography limitations with Russian hatches.
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Third of six burns. Still good for automatic docking.
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MCC-M tell the crew all is nominal.
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48 kms
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I get the impression from reading various sources that NASA would like to postpone the docking, but Russia are ignoring them and pushing on regardless.
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If required:
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I get the impression from reading various sources that NASA would like to postpone the docking, but Russia are ignoring them and pushing on regardless.
Are you able to expand on this impression?
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10 miles distance.
Short test of KURS.
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I get the impression from reading various sources that NASA would like to postpone the docking, but Russia are ignoring them and pushing on regardless.
Are you able to expand on this impression?
Lots of concerns in the L2 notes on this. Will use some in the updated article.
They are worried about the out of config Progress catching an antenna, which will require inspection and a possible EVA after it eventually undocks.
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9 km, closing 14 m/s
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7.2 km from the momentary progress video
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Looking for Progress:
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Some epic views from time to time if anybody can capture it. Waiting now for 3 km zone.
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4+ km from progress video closure 10 m/s
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Tally ho!
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Nice view from the US Seg:
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Sounds like they are going to TORU.
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tally ho from the station cameras
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PAO says "if" right now for TORU, so not given up on KURS yet.
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toru activation
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2kms. Progress can really move.
Activating TORU - IF needed.
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They just activated that system, so that it is ready for use if needed.
edit: and didn't one progress not too long ago abort the automatic KURS docking when TORU was accidentally activated too early by the crew.
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nominal so far. TORU test went well.
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About 30 mins to docking.
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Impulse 5 and 6 burns complete.
500 meters.
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Flyaround in four mins.
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impulse 5 and 6 as planned
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soft docking only planned pending interference analysis of the antenna
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Hmmm..... it seems that there's a chance that the antenna was actually damaged in this view? :o
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fly around started
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I thought I heard deployed to fully forward but not so sure if I heard clearly.
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Flyaround.
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One of the ELCs:
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22 mins to dock.
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700 feet.
Still on KURS.
Stationkeeping next.
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Hard to capture the thruster firings.
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Rolling.
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Now in stationkeeping.
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Thruster firing! :)
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Final approach.
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Pressing to soft dock
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50 meters.
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antenna visible at 4 o'clock
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20 meters.
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looks like it may interfere
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Failed antenna visible - looks like it could be obstructing the docking collar.
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Really slow approach now, on purpose.
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hope they are recording the ISS views for analysis...
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Five meters.
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Contact and Capture - Soft Dock!
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contact and capture
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"Do you see anything out of the window?"
"No".
"Do you hear any grinding?"
Not the sort of questions you want to hear! :)
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Probe being retracted!
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listening for grinding noises as retract docking probe
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"Some unexpected noise" (can't tell if that was from the ground or Roman).
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"be ready for the command but do not hurry"
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a few more seconds before noise would come
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Crew hearing no sounds, nothing.
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do you hear any sound? So you hear no sound. Nothing.
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Really ratty com.
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No sound confirmed.
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Capture hooks powered up.
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So far so good.
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a light flapping sound. a small pop. 8-10 seconds before the gear stopped. did not hear any other sounds that are not to be there. nothing that would sound strange.
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probably all normal. "although we could go look [eva] an hour or hour and a half. why not. {I think that is a joke}
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That's got to be Roman offering to pop out and do an EVA in an hour ;)
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Waiting for command to deactivate TORU.
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Hooks are now closed.
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Cosmonaut: We could just go look.
MCC-M: What, you mean an EVA?
Cosmonaut: Yes, just an hour and a half - why not?
;D
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the soft dock only plan didn't last long...
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Capture at 7:25. Hooks closed at 7:34. (central time)
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We heard the sound from the control room and the voice of Solovyov...
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The next issue is who wants to risk opening the hatch with the possibility of an impeded seal.
Too bad the SSRMS can't be used to do an inspection. Let's see if we get an EVA...
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now to pressurize and watch for delta-P
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now to pressurize and watch for delta-P
yup - that's the telling sign
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Probably they will take a look at the Progress only during the next planned EVA. When the next one? Because the port has to be cleared for the ATV in June...
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Anyone know how long to pressurize and do leak checks?
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Probably they will take a look at the Progress only during the next planned EVA. When the next one? Because the port has to be cleared for the ATV in June...
Next EVA is on June 26 - and M-19M will undock prior to that.
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Are we close to shift handover in MCC Houston? Seems to be a lot of people in the control room.
Handover time today is at 1300z in MCC-H
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Probably they will take a look at the Progress only during the next planned EVA. When the next one? Because the port has to be cleared for the ATV in June...
Next EVA is on June 26 - and M-19M will undock prior to that.
That would still be a good chance to look for any damage left by the Progress.
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Probably they will take a look at the Progress only during the next planned EVA. When the next one? Because the port has to be cleared for the ATV in June...
Next EVA is on June 26 - and M-19M will undock prior to that.
So no inspection required if all things continue to go right. Or after the Progress departure and before the ATV arrival.
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Are we close to shift handover in MCC Houston? Seems to be a lot of people in the control room.
Handover time today is at 1300z in MCC-H
Thanks. That explains it.
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Updated the article to include some L2 content:
http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2013/04/soyuz-u-progress-m-19m-iss/
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As per NK forum, the docking has been completed in "backup automatic mode".
Sounds like this antenna needs to be gotten rid of :)
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Right, thanks to all that joined in. Keep an eye on things as I've got to rush off and do some day job work to pay the bills.
Who's stupid idea was it to start a website that costs so much to run?! ;D
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Looks like Russian MCC team went to celebrate :) "It was one of the hardest days on ISS program for me and others. But we made it!"
Well done!
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Expedition 35 - Progress M-19M - 51 Docking
http://www.space-multimedia.nl.eu.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=8226
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It would be great to get an explanation of how Kurs operated in this "backup automatic mode". The system isn't known for being a robust software environment, where patches and upgrades can be easily implemented. In fact, AFAIK, Kurs is an analog system (I confess to being ignorant of the computer type), based on observation of the insides of a Kurs active box.
The other question is whether the pyro bolt that "unhinges" the lateral Kurs active antenna was fired during the last stages of docking, and whether this freed the antenna.
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and whether this freed the antenna.
According to the pictures posted on this thread, it is clear that 2ASF1-M-VKA-03 was still retracted at the moment of docking.
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I've been away for an hour. Did the pressure check pass?
14:59 gmt -- Daily ISS Status Report on NASA TV about to start -- let's see what they say.
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I've been away for an hour. Did the pressure check pass?
I have not heard anything yet to believe not, but I heard crew being told on ISS Mission Audio that MCC-M is continuing to review data and make final assessments and a decision is expected on whether or not to delay hatch opening is to be sent by next DPC or in a radiogram to crew.
It was mentioned earlier that MCC-M would perform prop transfers to RS earlier in the event that hatch opening is not possible once final decision is made.
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It would be great to get an explanation of how Kurs operated in this "backup automatic mode".
IMHO When two antennas (ASF1 and ASF2), these antennas operate with different axes (the first port-starboard and other top-bottom). When we have a single antenna ASF it switches the mode control on both axes.
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MCC Moscow just gave a GO to open the hatch.
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and whether this freed the antenna.
According to the pictures posted on this thread, it is clear that 2ASF1-M-VKA-03 was still retracted at the moment of docking.
The photos in this thread don't show the Progress antennas more than 20 or 30 meters closer from ISS. The lateral antenna pyro is blown about that point, since TsUP needs the antenna to work for most of the closing in process.
There should have been a comment from TsUP about the pyro bolt blowing (or not), since that is a normal operation during docking.
I should note that during nominal dockings with SM Aft, there is no technical requirement to retract the Kurs antenna, but the pyro bolt is blown anyway (there are no obstructions at SM Aft, the obstructions were at FGB Nadir, but those are no longer an issue after Rassvet was installed). This pyro bolt blowing is an artifact from when FGB Nadir was used, and it has not been removed from the programming for consistency's sake.
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It would be great to get an explanation of how Kurs operated in this "backup automatic mode".
IMHO When two antennas (ASF1 and ASF2), these antennas operate with different axes (the first port-starboard and other top-bottom). When we have a single antenna ASF it switches the mode control on both axes.
I do not understand how Kurs can provide range, rate and location data with only one functional ASF antenna. It's kind of like trying to get distance perception with only one working eye.
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MCC Moscow just gave a GO to open the hatch.
And the hatch is open - no odors or debris.
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MCC Moscow just gave a GO to open the hatch.
And the hatch is open - no odors or debris.
phew. Thanks
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Whew!! That was interesting.
Congrats to the Russian teams, they certainly earned their months pay this week.
Time to celebrate - the vodka must flow! ;)
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Whew!! That was interesting.
Congrats to the Russian teams, they certainly earned their months pay this week.
Time to celebrate
and find out why the antenna didn't deploy in the first place...
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and find out why the antenna didn't deploy in the first place...
Unless they can figure that out from close-out photos, build documentation, telemetry and such, I don't see how they can do it. As far as I know, they aren't going to go out and take a look, and they certainly aren't getting the part back on the ground, so what else is there?
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and find out why the antenna didn't deploy in the first place...
Unless they can figure that out from close-out photos, build documentation, telemetry and such, I don't see how they can do it. As far as I know, they aren't going to go out and take a look, and they certainly aren't getting the part back on the ground, so what else is there?
Point taken. They should investigate the failure and try to find the cause. Numerous failures are identified without retrieving the offending parts.
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It has been mentioned that mission control moscow only had a short span of time every day to download the telemetry and upload patches etc, are they still unable to utilize those two Luch satellites they have launched last year?
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It has been mentioned that mission control moscow only had a short span of time every day to download the telemetry and upload patches etc, are they still unable to utilize those two Luch satellites they have launched last year?
Luch-5A and Luch-5B will become operational before the end of the year.
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It has been mentioned that mission control moscow only had a short span of time every day to download the telemetry and upload patches etc, are they still unable to utilize those two Luch satellites they have launched last year?
Luch-5A and Luch-5B will become operational before the end of the year.
I don't understand why a so long time is necessary for such a satellite to enter operational working mode...
Two spacecrafts are necessary for operation, but from the second launch...
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As I understand it, one of the primary concerns was that antennas on the SM of the ISS would be damaged/moved by the out of place antenna on Progress. Is it correct that there is currently no way of knowing if that happened or not? If so, that means we have to wait until undocking to get camera views of the ISS antennas and find out if any damage took place. Am I correct?
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As I understand it, one of the primary concerns was that antennas on the SM of the ISS would be damaged/moved by the out of place antenna on Progress. Is it correct that there is currently no way of knowing if that happened or not? If so, that means we have to wait until undocking to get camera views of the ISS antennas and find out if any damage took place. Am I correct?
I'm more concerned at the moment if we have a complete seal; any leaks yet?
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MCC Moscow just gave a GO to open the hatch.
As I understand it, one of the primary concerns was that antennas on the SM of the ISS would be damaged/moved by the out of place antenna on Progress. Is it correct that there is currently no way of knowing if that happened or not? If so, that means we have to wait until undocking to get camera views of the ISS antennas and find out if any damage took place. Am I correct?
I'm more concerned at the moment if we have a complete seal; any leaks yet?
I linked a quoted answer to you above yours.
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It has been mentioned that mission control moscow only had a short span of time every day to download the telemetry and upload patches etc, are they still unable to utilize those two Luch satellites they have launched last year?
It has been mentioned many times that two Luch-5 satellites are ready for operation, but there is not equipment for communication with them on ISS Russian segment and on any Russian satellites, because it is not ready.
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It has been mentioned that mission control moscow only had a short span of time every day to download the telemetry and upload patches etc, are they still unable to utilize those two Luch satellites they have launched last year?
It has been mentioned many times that two Luch-5 satellites are ready for operation, but there is not equipment for communication with them on ISS Russian segment and on any Russian satellites, because it is not ready.
I think I missed that, but that is just sad! :(
I only hope that the equipment becomes ready and operational before the Luch satellites reach their end of life!
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It has been mentioned that mission control moscow only had a short span of time every day to download the telemetry and upload patches etc, are they still unable to utilize those two Luch satellites they have launched last year?
It has been mentioned many times that two Luch-5 satellites are ready for operation, but there is not equipment for communication with them on ISS Russian segment and on any Russian satellites, because it is not ready.
I don't know much about the Luch satellites so I ask. Can the US side of the ISS use the Luch satellites so information has no dead zones?
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It has been mentioned that mission control moscow only had a short span of time every day to download the telemetry and upload patches etc, are they still unable to utilize those two Luch satellites they have launched last year?
It has been mentioned many times that two Luch-5 satellites are ready for operation, but there is not equipment for communication with them on ISS Russian segment and on any Russian satellites, because it is not ready.
I don't know much about the Luch satellites so I ask. Can the US side of the ISS use the Luch satellites so information has no dead zones?
I think the US section utilizes the TDRS network.
BTW I must say that I'm rather dumbfounded by anik's answer. What were the Russians thinking when they decided to launch couple of satellites which are just going to sit up there idle because absolutely no one can use them? ???
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I don't know much about the Luch satellites so I ask. Can the US side of the ISS use the Luch satellites so information has no dead zones?
Not directly, no.
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Cmdr_Hadfield
https://twitter.com/Cmdr_Hadfield/status/328612968470310913/photo/1
Progress ship, full of resupply gear, with failed antenna still stuck in launch position, on final approach to dock.
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When Progress M-19 departs from ISS, it will use its video system to broadcast images of the Service Module docking collar, so we will see if the docking collar has been damaged.
I would bet there may be scuff marks, but I would not expect any actual bent metal.
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The risk of bending was actually to the ATV retroreflectors outside the docking collar. The antenna itself was very light material, so if it hit the collar, the no damage should have been done.
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The risk of bending was actually to the ATV retroreflectors outside the docking collar. The antenna itself was very light material, so if it hit the collar, the no damage should have been done.
If those retro-reflectors were damaged, we will see as Progress backs away.
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1. Does the guilty antenna become operational only once fully deployed? Or can it switch on and transmit even when it's retracted in the launch config? If the antenna is highly directional - then we can do a transmit/receive sweep (if we have a frequency compatible, highly directional second antenna on the ISS) and check what orientation of this second antenna gives us the maximum power transfer. Some geometry should be then able to tell you the orientation of the Progress KURS antenna.
2. If the primary concern was not the interference with rings and seals, but contact with the ISS antenna and/or ATV retroreflectors : would you simply be able to rotate the progress along the long-axis by x degrees - before close approach, and dock without issue? I assume the latches and the hooks are all radially symmetrical?
3. It's about time they reprogrammed SPHERES to be used outside the station (provided the hardware is compatible), and set them up with tethers and spools on outermost points. Or sent up something similar. Each retrofitted with a Swiss knife, a duct tape dispenser, and space grade WD-40. :P
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1. Does the guilty antenna become operational only once fully deployed? Or can it switch on and transmit even when it's retracted in the launch config? If the antenna is highly directional - then we can do a transmit/receive sweep (if we have a frequency compatible, highly directional second antenna on the ISS) and check what orientation of this second antenna gives us the maximum power transfer. Some geometry should be then able to tell you the orientation of the Progress KURS antenna.
It is pretty sure that the faulty Kurs antenna is still more or less in the undeployed position, although it may have a little range of motion if the pyro bolt blew just before docking.
Either way, that antenna will never be functional again.
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The risk of bending was actually to the ATV retroreflectors outside the docking collar. The antenna itself was very light material, so if it hit the collar, the no damage should have been done.
If those retro-reflectors were damaged, we will see as Progress backs away.
You talking about the work done in the last Russian EVA?
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From @lionelferra via Twitter:
Why recent Progress51 docking might have damaged ATV reflectors? Here a small pictural explanation http://pic.twitter.com/Qjkdjyoo5i
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This is smoking gun?
http://ria.ru/science/20130514/937150181.html
Google Translate
"We took the same stocks with manned spacecraft" Soyuz ", which is supposed to go (ISS) on May 29 and" Progress ", to fly (at the station) at the end of July. Looked and saw that on these (stocks) Glue is hit in the moving parts, "- said the head of the Russian Federal Space Agency.
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Shoot! If that is actually the smoking gun than that would indicate yet another quality control problem for the Russians. :(
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This is smoking gun?
http://ria.ru/science/20130514/937150181.html
Google Translate
(stocks) Glue is hit in the moving parts, "-
I suspect this may be a Googlism... Aren't lubricant or sealant or more likely than glue?
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June 11, Tuesday
9:30 a.m. - ISS Progress 51 Undocking Coverage (Undocking scheduled at 9:50 a.m. ET)
http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/MM_NTV_Breaking.html
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Hmm... no one is concerned that this naughty little Progress has caused damage that may prevent the next ATV from docking there? We will soon know enough when it undocks in less than 2 hours from now....
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Hmm... no one is concerned that this naughty little Progress has caused damage that may prevent the next ATV from docking there? We will soon know enough when it undocks in less than 2 hours from now....
I doubt it's such a big drama. The ATV should be able to be docked manually too? Or am i wrong on this?
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Hmm... no one is concerned that this naughty little Progress has caused damage that may prevent the next ATV from docking there? We will soon know enough when it undocks in less than 2 hours from now....
I doubt it's such a big drama. The ATV should be able to be docked manually too? Or am i wrong on this?
As far as I know, manually docking is not possible.
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Undocking now being covered by NASA TV.
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Separation took place at 1358UTC.
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No issues reported with Progress M-19M antenna...
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Wow! The undeployed Kurs antenna actually DEPLOYED upon undocking!
This imparted a slight rate on the Progress, but attitude has been recovered.
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the stuck antenna deployed at separation causing an attitude disturbance
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Separation initiation burn completed...
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What did they just say about the antenna? I only caught the last bit...did she say it deployed at undocking?
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What did they just say about the antenna? I only caught the last bit...did she say it deployed at undocking?
Yes, the KURS antenna deployed at undocking. It imparted a slight attitude change on the craft, but it quickly recovered control.
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What did they just say about the antenna? I only caught the last bit...did she say it deployed at undocking?
I'm not sure but it looks like it said that...
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addendum to the Kurs antenna failure to deploy checklist
"crush slightly during docking and then reattempt deploy" ;D
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Wow! The undeployed Kurs antenna actually DEPLOYED upon undocking!
This imparted a slight rate on the Progress, but attitude has been recovered.
ohhh I missed it...
only got a few screen grabs from the other site:
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Live coverage ends. Rui and G.Penguin - you guys have been busy today, thanks for all the coverage! Nice to see Anna Fisher on Capcom today.
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Of note, one of the more notable items now leaving the space station with Progress M-19M...
Off and no longer running: Space station's first treadmill jettisoned with trash
http://www.collectspace.com/news/news-061113b.html
A space apparatus that for more than a dozen years enabled both astronauts and cosmonauts to literally run around the Earth bid farewell to its home on orbit Tuesday (June 11). The International Space Station's original treadmill is now on its way to its fiery destruction aboard a spent Russian cargo freighter.
The now-discarded exercise device, called the "Treadmill Vibration Isolation System," or TVIS (pronounced "tee-viss"), was used by the orbiting outpost's first 34 resident crews from November 2000 until March of this year, when it was replaced by a new Russian-built unit. The 12-year-old running machine (and sometimes marathon track) was previously succeeded by a more advanced U.S. treadmill that was famously re-named after the television comedian Stephen Colbert.
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Here's the highest res (~1360 x 900) screenshots I could get at undocking - still not enough detail to discern any damage to the LRR.
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Expedition 36 - Progress M-19M/51 Undocking - June 11
http://www.space-multimedia.nl.eu.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=8316
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I wonder why there is no information about deploying of antenna on NASA website. And nowhere at all. Only on NASA TV.
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I wonder why there is no information about deploying of antenna on NASA website. And nowhere at all. Only on NASA TV
Okay, as per Novosti kosmonavtiki forum, the antenna has been opened.
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Of note, one of the more notable items now leaving the space station with Progress M-19M...
Off and no longer running: Space station's first treadmill jettisoned with trash
The space station's original treadmill has not yet run its course.
The "Treadmill Vibration Isolation System" (TVIS), which was used by both astronauts and cosmonauts to exercise aboard the International Space Station for more than 12 years was not jettisoned on Tuesday (June 11) on board a spent Russian cargo freighter, as earlier reported.
A NASA spokesperson confirmed Tuesday afternoon that the information earlier provided to collectSPACE.com by the space agency was in error.
The device, which is no longer in use, will instead leave the space station and be discarded with the next Russian unmanned resupply vehicle, Progress M-18M (50P), which as of Tuesday was scheduled to undock on July 26. After its departure, the cargo craft and its contents including the TVIS treadmill will be destroyed during its descent back into Earth's atmosphere.
The TVIS was replaced aboard the station by a Russian-built unit that was first put into use recently and by a more advanced U.S. treadmill named after television comedian Stephen Colbert.
The original article, unedited, follows below:
http://www.collectspace.com/news/news-061113c.html
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http://www.nasa.gov/directorates/heo/reports/iss_reports/2013/ISS_Daily_Summary_Report__061113.html
"51 Progress (51P) Undocking: The 51P vehicle successfully undocked from the Russian Segment Service Module (SM) aft docking port at 8:58 am CDT after the command to open the vehicle hooks was issued at 8:56 am CDT. the separation appeared smooth with no vibrations noted. Video from the Progress vehicle showed that the SM docking ring surface appeared nominal and free of debris. Telemetry indicated that the АСФ-02 antenna that had not deployed prior to docking deployed after hook opening. Pre-undocking analysis by NASA ground specialists indicated that should the antenna deploy, a nominal clearance of 2 mm between the antenna and in other SM obstructions should have existed. The first fifteen second burn separation burn was completed at approximately 9:01 am CDT. Following several days of the Russian Radar-Progress experiment, the deorbit of the vehicle is planned for GMT 170 (June 19th, 2013) starting at approximately 7:52 am CDT. Specialists are reviewing data and photography of the Progress taken by the ISS crew"
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Hmm... no one is concerned that this naughty little Progress has caused damage that may prevent the next ATV from docking there? We will soon know enough when it undocks in less than 2 hours from now....
I'm certainly concerned, but there's not a thing I can do about it (unless they approve me for a flight and to go EVA) ;) :)
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http://www.nasa.gov/directorates/heo/reports/iss_reports/2013/ISS_Daily_Summary_Report__061113.html
"51 Progress (51P) Undocking: The 51P vehicle successfully undocked from the Russian Segment Service Module (SM) aft docking port at 8:58 am CDT after the command to open the vehicle hooks was issued at 8:56 am CDT. the separation appeared smooth with no vibrations noted. Video from the Progress vehicle showed that the SM docking ring surface appeared nominal and free of debris. Telemetry indicated that the АСФ-02 antenna that had not deployed prior to docking deployed after hook opening. Pre-undocking analysis by NASA ground specialists indicated that should the antenna deploy, a nominal clearance of 2 mm between the antenna and in other SM obstructions should have existed. The first fifteen second burn separation burn was completed at approximately 9:01 am CDT. Following several days of the Russian Radar-Progress experiment, the deorbit of the vehicle is planned for GMT 170 (June 19th, 2013) starting at approximately 7:52 am CDT. Specialists are reviewing data and photography of the Progress taken by the ISS crew"
wow, 2mm clearance.
That's close!
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Undocking photos.
https://twitter.com/lionelferra/status/345082333885505536/photo/1
http://www.spaceflight.nasa.gov/gallery/images/station/crew-36/inflight/ndxpage7.html
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Reentry occurred today, with unburnt pieces reaching the surface of the Pacific at around 13:39 UTC
http://ria.ru/science/20130619/944429074.html (on Russian)
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There is an interesting comment about this incident in the recently released EVA 23 Mishap Investigation Report (http://"http://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/files/Suit_Water_Intrusion_Mishap_Investigation_Report.pdf").
On page 119, Observation O-9:
The pace and potential hazards associated with EVAs on ISS are similar to other activities that should receive similar scrutiny by the ISS Program.
[...]
To determine other areas which share characteristics with EVAs, per the direction of the Appointing Official, the MIB interviewed several experienced ISS Flight Directors, and used the experience of the MIB members.
One of the areas identified is "Visiting Vehicle operations". The report then states:
Of greater concern, as expressed during interviews, is the operation of Russian vehicles in proximity of ISS. Interviewees mentioned several incidents in the past few years that made them call into question the safety of Russian ground control team philosophy. One incident that was mentioned related to an undeployed antenna on a Progress cargo vehicle which presented a potential risk to the docking interface. Despite protests from the US ground team and management, the Russians proceeded with docking. While docking was successful, damage was done to the Progress vehicle and the risk to ISS was taken unilaterally by an International Partner. Having an established chain of command is critical for safe ISS operations. In addition, its clear that when commercial entities begin providing crew launch services, the level of cooperation between NASA and the commercial companies will need to be very high.
(emphasis mine)