As far as I know from Chinese sources, TG-1 and -2 are identical and TG-3 would have two docking ports.
As far as I know from Chinese sources, TG-1 and -2 are identical and TG-3 would have two docking ports.
[size=88%]Tiangong-1[/size]
天宫一号
COSPAR ID (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Designator) 2011-053A (http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/nmc/masterCatalog.do?sc=2011-053A) Crew 3 (expected) Launch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rocket_launch) 29 September 2011[1][2] at 21:16:03.507 CST Launch pad (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Launch_pad) Jiuquan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jiuquan_Satellite_Launch_Center) LA-4/SLS-1 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jiuquan_Launch_Area_4) Mass (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass) 8,506 kg (18,750 lb)[3] Length 10.4 m (34.1 ft) Diameter 3.35 m (11.0 ft) Pressurised volume (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volume) 15 m3 (530 cu ft)[4] Perigee (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apsis) 355 kilometres (221 mi)[5] Apogee (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apsis) 362 kilometres (225 mi)[5] Orbital inclination (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inclination) 42 degrees (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degree_(angle))[6] Days in orbit 146
[size=88%]Tiangong-2[/size]
天宫二号
Crew 3 Launch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rocket_launch) 2013 (planned) Mass (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass) 20,000 kilograms (44,000 lb) Length 14.4 metres (47 ft) Diameter 4.2 metres (14 ft)
[size=88%]Tiangong-3[/size]
天宫三号
Crew 3 Launch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rocket_launch) 2015 (planned) Mass (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass) 22,000 kilograms (49,000 lb) Length 18.1 metres (59 ft) Diameter 4.2 metres (14 ft)
...And that first launch will not be the "heavy" version, so will not be capable of anything close to 25 mT. We do not know when the heavy version will launch.
And the planned first launch of the advanced Chinese booster capable
of putting upto 25 tonnes into LEO is not expected to take place until 2014,
...
The next step could be the launch of Tiangong 4 using CZ-5 in the 2015/2016 time frame.
The next step could be the launch of Tiangong 4 using CZ-5 in the 2015/2016 time frame.
I would be careful speculating on the dates of when the Chinese will do stuff. With a launch rate of 1 human crewed spacecraft every 2 years or so, suggesting a 4th space station within 3 or 4 years is very speculative indeed.
Originally, China planned to simply dock Shenzhou 8 and Shenzhou 9 together to form a simple space laboratory. However, it was decided to abandon that plan and launch a small space laboratory instead. In 2007, plans for a "space laboratory", Tiangong 1 were announced. Subsequent flights (Shenzhou 9 and Shenzhou 10) would dock with the laboratory. Tiangong 1 consisted of a propulsion module, and a pressurized module for experiments, with a docking mechanism at both ends. The docking port of the experiment section supported automated docking. Launched on September 29, 2011, it was intended for short stays of a crew of three.[11][12][13] The second docking port, on the propulsion module, was kept screened from press photography inside and outside the module.
After reading the article about China's large module station (CSS) in Wikipedia, I found this paragraph about Tiangong 1:Tiangong 1 only has one docking port.QuoteOriginally, China planned to simply dock Shenzhou 8 and Shenzhou 9 together to form a simple space laboratory. However, it was decided to abandon that plan and launch a small space laboratory instead. In 2007, plans for a "space laboratory", Tiangong 1 were announced. Subsequent flights (Shenzhou 9 and Shenzhou 10) would dock with the laboratory. Tiangong 1 consisted of a propulsion module, and a pressurized module for experiments, with a docking mechanism at both ends. The docking port of the experiment section supported automated docking. Launched on September 29, 2011, it was intended for short stays of a crew of three.[11][12][13] The second docking port, on the propulsion module, was kept screened from press photography inside and outside the module.
So, I stand corrected. Tiangong 1 does have dual docking ports. I wonder if the cargo variation also will have two ports. This could allow multiple cargo vessels docked without needing the addition of node modules, I would think.
These are very optimistic assumptions. However, between April 1971 and January 1975 the U.S.S.R. managed to launch 4 space stations (DOS 1 & 4; OPS 2 & 3) and eight manned spacecraft (Soyuz 10-17) within 4 years, despite the loss of a crew and two additional launch/space station failures (DOS 2; OPS 1).
Comparing the launch rate of the USSR during the cold war with China's launch rate only instructs us that the Chinese launch rate for crewed spacecraft is painfully slow.
The Tiangong 3 modules are supposed to be 18.1 meters long and 4.2 meters in diameter, weighing 22 tons. Compared to Zvezda, which is 13.1 meters longs and 4.15 meters in diameter, weighing 20 tons. The Chinese core module will be 5 meters longer than the Russian core with roughly the same diameter.
Why would they put two docking ports on TG-2? Would they send two SZs up there simultaneously?
So if Tiangong-2 started as the reserve for Tiangong-1; and Tiangong-3 is different revised design. Will there be a reserve for Tiangong-3?
...
As China's currently largest manned spacecraft, Tiangong 1 has a designed life of 2 years, with 6 dockings planned during its lifetime. Since its launch on September 29, 2011, Tiangong 1 has been in orbit for 272 days, and has docked 4 times with Shenzhou 8 and 9.
"From the current situation, Tiangong 1 will very probably last for more than 2 years." said (CMSE's) Spacecraft System Chief Manager He Yu. He said Tiangong 1's power supply is in good shape, and less than one-fourth of its propellant has been used. All the back-up equipments has yet to be activated. By improving the design of components, careful flight planning and strict quality control, Tiangong 1's flight can be greatly extended.
"It's still in the planning stages," said He Yu, "but we can imagine that if Tiangong 1 is still in good shape, it may fly concurrently in space with the yet-to-fly Tiangong 2."
Comparing the launch rate of the USSR during the cold war with China's launch rate only instructs us that the Chinese launch rate for crewed spacecraft is painfully slow.
So if Tiangong-2 started as the reserve for Tiangong-1; and Tiangong-3 is different revised design. Will there be a reserve for Tiangong-3?
a new space station design, first time seen in HK，aug 2012
a new space station design, first time seen in HK，aug 2012Looks like its basically same design we've seen earlier. The new design for the solar arrays remind me of the ones on the ISS.
a new space station design, first time seen in HK，aug 2012Looks like its basically same design we've seen earlier. The new design for the solar arrays remind me of the ones on the ISS.
a new space station design, first time seen in HK，aug 2012Looks like its basically same design we've seen earlier. The new design for the solar arrays remind me of the ones on the ISS.
Mostly the same. Large arrays on the research modules, but also two Shenzhou are docked in the illustration (one on the nadir port of the core module's node and another on its forward port). The cargo ship is docked on the core module's aft port. I don't think the previous design had a nadir Shenzhou docking port on the core module node.
It did.I don't think the previous design had a nadir Shenzhou docking port on the core module node.a new space station design, first time seen in HK，aug 2012Looks like its basically same design we've seen earlier. The new design for the solar arrays remind me of the ones on the ISS.
I would speculate that the two Shenzhous indicate a short-term arrangement during a crew rotation, with the nadir Shenzhou - the new one - being rotated to the front longitudinal port when the older crew returns to Earth.
On a slightly different angle, has anyone seen an authorative comment from Chinese officials on how many flights are planned to each of TG-2 and TG-3?
As TG-1 will host 3 flights (one unmanned and two manned) it would seem unlikely that it will be less than 3 each?
My interest is mainly driven by a focus on the astronaut team; how many are
likely to fly; what recruitment may be needed to support future plans etc.?
Also, the Chinese launch schedule page shows TG-2 as planned for launch in 2013. Do we know if that is still the plan. The comments above in Message #35 that TG-1 may extend beyond 2 years (which would nominally expire in September 2013) could suggest that TG-2 should be in orbit late next year.
a new space station design, first time seen in HK，aug 2012Looks like its basically same design we've seen earlier. The new design for the solar arrays remind me of the ones on the ISS.
Mostly the same. Large arrays on the research modules, but also two Shenzhou are docked in the illustration (one on the nadir port of the core module's node and another on its forward port). The cargo ship is docked on the core module's aft port. I don't think the previous design had a nadir Shenzhou docking port on the core module node.
I would speculate that the two Shenzhous indicate a short-term arrangement during a crew rotation, with the nadir Shenzhou - the new one - being rotated to the front longitudinal port when the older crew returns to Earth.
On a slightly different angle, has anyone seen an authorative comment from Chinese officials on how many flights are planned to each of TG-2 and TG-3?
As TG-1 will host 3 flights (one unmanned and two manned) it would seem unlikely that it will be less than 3 each?
My interest is mainly driven by a focus on the astronaut team; how many are
likely to fly; what recruitment may be needed to support future plans etc.?
Also, the Chinese launch schedule page shows TG-2 as planned for launch in 2013. Do we know if that is still the plan. The comments above in Message #35 that TG-1 may extend beyond 2 years (which would nominally expire in September 2013) could suggest that TG-2 should be in orbit late next year.
On a slightly different angle, has anyone seen an authorative comment from Chinese officials on how many flights are planned to each of TG-2 and TG-3?
As TG-1 will host 3 flights (one unmanned and two manned) it would seem unlikely that it will be less than 3 each?
My interest is mainly driven by a focus on the astronaut team; how many are
likely to fly; what recruitment may be needed to support future plans etc.?
Also, the Chinese launch schedule page shows TG-2 as planned for launch in 2013. Do we know if that is still the plan. The comments above in Message #35 that TG-1 may extend beyond 2 years (which would nominally expire in September 2013) could suggest that TG-2 should be in orbit late next year.
I cannot immediately recall where this was but I am sure that the Chinese have said that they planned to launch three Shenzhou craft to each of Tiangongs 1 and 2: not sure that anything has been said about Tiangong 3.
As for the Tiangong 1, I think that the Chinese might keep this in orbit simply for longevity testing without any visits beyond Shenzhou 10. On-board systems can be remotely monitored to see how they function once the manned phase as ended. Of course they might decide to emulate the Soviets on Soyuz-T 15 and do a short trip from Tiangong 2 at the end of a residency and travel to Tiangong 1 for a quick visit: that, of course, would depend upon the orbis relative to each other.
On a slightly different angle, has anyone seen an authorative comment from Chinese officials on how many flights are planned to each of TG-2 and TG-3?
As TG-1 will host 3 flights (one unmanned and two manned) it would seem unlikely that it will be less than 3 each?
My interest is mainly driven by a focus on the astronaut team; how many are
likely to fly; what recruitment may be needed to support future plans etc.?
Also, the Chinese launch schedule page shows TG-2 as planned for launch in 2013. Do we know if that is still the plan. The comments above in Message #35 that TG-1 may extend beyond 2 years (which would nominally expire in September 2013) could suggest that TG-2 should be in orbit late next year.
A recent news story said that they are considering docking TG-1 to TG-2, leaving TG-1 in orbit when TG-2 is launched. This is being considered because the health of TG-1 is better than expected.
Interesting. That would imply a 2nd docking port on TG-2. (Or it would imply no SZ dockings to the TG-1/TG-2 complex, which seems unlikely :) )
So, if this is indeed a serious consideration, TG-2 is designed with a 2nd dockingport. I don't think they would, or even could change the design at this stage just to be able to dock with TG-1.
Interesting. That would imply a 2nd docking port on TG-2. (Or it would imply no SZ dockings to the TG-1/TG-2 complex, which seems unlikely :) )It could also be that this is just another docking test, albeit with larger modules. In that case TG-1 would be gone when SZ arrives at TG-2, which eliminates the requirement for a second docking port.
So, if this is indeed a serious consideration, TG-2 is designed with a 2nd dockingport. I don't think they would, or even could change the design at this stage just to be able to dock with TG-1.