Author Topic: SpaceX Starship : First Flight : Starbase, TX : April 2023 - DISCUSSION THREAD 2  (Read 474772 times)

Offline Chris Bergin

Discussion Thread 2 thread for the maiden flight of Starship with Booster 7 and Ship 24.

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Resources follow:

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News Articles:
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https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/?s=Starship

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Major Forum Threads for this test:
Main Booster 7+Ship 24 Updates since assembly

Discussion Thread 25

Starship Test Launch Discussion

SpaceX Boca Chica - Production Updates - MASTER Thread (5) (New/Current):
https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=54984.0

And the entire Starship Forum Section you're currently in.

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« Last Edit: 04/20/2023 03:42 am by zubenelgenubi »
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Offline WannaWalnetto

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Apologies if this has been asked and answered someplace else and I missed it.

For the first attempt on Monday, the tower elevator was said to be not working because of whatever fell down the shaft.  This is probably pretty far down the GSE repair priority list, but is the tower elevator now functional?

Offline TomH

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Discussion Thread 2 thread for the maiden flight of Starship with Booster 7 and Ship 24.

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Remember, updates only.

I am a bit confused. Is this updates or discussion. Can the opening post be edited for clarity, please??

Offline alugobi

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Thread title says "discussion", so I'd go with that

Offline Nomadd

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 We're camped out on a lovely Rio Grand facilty a few miles from the pad with two Great Danes for coyote, badger, bobcat and rattler patrol.
 This is the little one.
« Last Edit: 04/20/2023 05:56 am by Nomadd »
Those who danced were thought to be quite insane by those who couldn't hear the music.

Offline William497

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Interestingly, I noticed there is nothing in NASA's WB-57 calendar for 20-21 April. Does this mean they won't be covering the reentry now, or just haven't got around to updating the calendar?

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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https://twitter.com/thenasaman/status/1648832006980096000

Quote
Shoutout to the team working on the Orbital Launch Mount in Texas for creating a heart during our @nasaspaceflight pre-launch update stream! Sending love and good luck back to them and everyone at Starbase.

Our live coverage starts at 12:30am CDT: youtube.com/live/uouujjgkR…

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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https://twitter.com/InfographicTony/status/1648946691578695680

Quote
Starship OFT-1 mini-infographics: Parts 1 to 4 (14 parts in total).

https://twitter.com/InfographicTony/status/1648946855961829377

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Starship OFT-1 mini-infographics: Parts 5 to 8 (14 parts in total).

https://twitter.com/InfographicTony/status/1648947027642908672

Quote
Starship OFT-1 mini-infographics: Parts 9 to 12 (14 parts in total).

https://twitter.com/InfographicTony/status/1648947201291460614

Quote
Starship OFT-1 mini-infographics: Parts 13 and 14 (14 parts in total).

Offline nzguy

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Something I have been wondering about is why this flight has tiles, but it seems the next two will not. They went to all the effort to stick the tiles on (and fix them up) on this flight when it might fail and they not get any tile data, but then will not try to get backup data on the next two.

Which makes me think: will the next two be orbital flights and they will be more interested in the orbit then the landing?

Online Slothman

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Something I have been wondering about is why this flight has tiles, but it seems the next two will not. They went to all the effort to stick the tiles on (and fix them up) on this flight when it might fail and they not get any tile data, but then will not try to get backup data on the next two.

Which makes me think: will the next two be orbital flights and they will be more interested in the orbit then the landing?
They want to see how the tiles do, before spending a bunch of more money on tiles for vehicles that can give insight on other  things without tiles.

Offline pjm1

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Exactly. If fundamental changes to tiles are needed (hopefully not) they will need time to implement the manufacturing or process changes. The sooner they find out this red/amber/green status of their tile solution, the earlier they can tweak or redesign process as needed.

Offline rfdesigner

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Something I have been wondering about is why this flight has tiles, but it seems the next two will not. They went to all the effort to stick the tiles on (and fix them up) on this flight when it might fail and they not get any tile data, but then will not try to get backup data on the next two.

Which makes me think: will the next two be orbital flights and they will be more interested in the orbit then the landing?

Test 1 for the tiles: will they survive a launch.

Maybe they're fairly confident about re-entry, but much less confident about adhesion. (the shuttle never had a problem with tiles not working on re-entry, except when tiles were missing)

Offline rfdesigner

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Something I have been wondering about is why this flight has tiles, but it seems the next two will not. They went to all the effort to stick the tiles on (and fix them up) on this flight when it might fail and they not get any tile data, but then will not try to get backup data on the next two.

Which makes me think: will the next two be orbital flights and they will be more interested in the orbit then the landing?

Test 1 for the tiles: will they survive a launch.

Maybe they're fairly confident about re-entry, but much less confident about adhesion. (the shuttle never had a problem with tiles not working on re-entry, except when tiles were missing)
I think it's hard to tell in advance whether it will be released or not

I don't follow what you're getting at?..  my point is that the first tile test is launch..   if the tiles stay stuck on that's great, but other problems are likely to mean reentry is unlikely, equally if the tiles don't stay stuck then that demands a tile adhesion design change.

Thinking about it.. the crunch point for the tiles is probably MaxQ

Offline CorvusCorax

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@NASASpaceflight

Who just made that quote in stream?

"This vehicle is this generations Saturn V and Spaceshuttle all into one"

This is super quotable, it totally encompasses what Starship is. Put that quote on the main page in an Article!!!

Offline nzguy

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Something I have been wondering about is why this flight has tiles, but it seems the next two will not. They went to all the effort to stick the tiles on (and fix them up) on this flight when it might fail and they not get any tile data, but then will not try to get backup data on the next two.

Which makes me think: will the next two be orbital flights and they will be more interested in the orbit then the landing?

Test 1 for the tiles: will they survive a launch.

Maybe they're fairly confident about re-entry, but much less confident about adhesion. (the shuttle never had a problem with tiles not working on re-entry, except when tiles were missing)
I think it's hard to tell in advance whether it will be released or not

I don't follow what you're getting at?..  my point is that the first tile test is launch..   if the tiles stay stuck on that's great, but other problems are likely to mean reentry is unlikely, equally if the tiles don't stay stuck then that demands a tile adhesion design change.

Thinking about it.. the crunch point for the tiles is probably MaxQ

Thanks everyone I hadn't thought about the possibility they might have to go back to drawing board or make manufacturing tweaks before they bother making more.

It will be interesting how many go missing since I don't think there has been a static fire where none have fallen off.

Offline clongton

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Re: the tiles
I'm not sure they are testing the tiles for re-entry or adhesion because they are not recovering the vehicle. In other words they won't be able to see how the tiles performed.
So why tiles? IMO, it's because they were already installed before the decision was made to abandon any recovery effort, nothing more.
Chuck - DIRECT co-founder
I started my career on the Saturn-V F-1A engine

Offline JayWee

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Re: the tiles
I'm not sure they are testing the tiles for re-entry or adhesion because they are not recovering the vehicle. In other words they won't be able to see how the tiles performed.
So why tiles? IMO, it's because they were already installed before the decision was made to abandon any recovery effort, nothing more.
Do they have an IR camera inside the tank? That could give some data.

Online Hyperborealis

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They might--iirc, Elon mentioned exactly this during one of the Tim Dodd visits.

Online sdsds

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For those playing along virtually through FlightAware or similar ADS-B tracking of NASA's WB-57 flight,
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N926NA
— 𝐬𝐝𝐒𝐝𝐬 —

Offline rfdesigner

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Re: the tiles
I'm not sure they are testing the tiles for re-entry or adhesion because they are not recovering the vehicle. In other words they won't be able to see how the tiles performed.
So why tiles? IMO, it's because they were already installed before the decision was made to abandon any recovery effort, nothing more.

I recall on at least one of the 10km hops, images from a camera attached to one of the flaps, looking back along the length of the ship.  Assuming it was inside the trailing face of the front flap, there's every reason to assume they'd want a camera in a similar position this time.  Granted it wouldn't image all the tiles, but it would give a near perfect view of many of them

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