Author Topic: Evolved DC-X (Read 34884 times)

Danderman · « **Reply #20 on:** 01/23/2016 03:38 pm »

New Shepard is almost precisely the kind of "evolved" DC-X vehicle that we should have been flying 20 years ago.

Antilope7724 · « **Reply #21 on:** 01/28/2016 08:15 am »

Single Stage Rocket Technology (SSRT) DC-X Test Program Environmental Assessment
June 1992, 147 pg
http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a265940.pdf

AlexA · « **Reply #22 on:** 03/02/2016 01:22 pm »

Some relevent reading:
Jerry Pournelle (SF author & member of the "Citizens Advisory Council on National Space Policy") on the origins of DC-X:
http://www.jerrypournelle.com/slowchange/SSX.html
Recomendations for follow-on programme:
http://www.jerrypournelle.com/slowchange/SSX2.html

AlexA · « **Reply #23 on:** 03/02/2016 04:10 pm »

The book "Single Stage to Orbit: Politics, Space Technology, and the Quest for Reusable Rocketry" Andrew J. Butrica which covers DC-X and related projects is currently on sale for $9.99 on JHU (publishers) site:
https://jhupbooks.press.jhu.edu/content/single-stage-orbit

You can preview it on Google Books:
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=v6eTVBEDA54C&lpg=PA1938&dq=single%20stage%20to%20orbit&pg=PA1938#v=onepage&q=single%20stage%20to%20orbit&f=false

Chris_petty · « **Reply #24 on:** 03/10/2016 01:06 pm »

Currently reading this book and it's excellent so far - plenty of time spent setting the historical context which I feel is vital to understanding what happened and why with the SSTO projects of the 1980s/1990s

Brovane · « **Reply #25 on:** 03/10/2016 04:11 pm »

Quote from: AlexA on 03/02/2016 04:10 pm

The book "Single Stage to Orbit: Politics, Space Technology, and the Quest for Reusable Rocketry" Andrew J. Butrica which covers DC-X and related projects is currently on sale for $9.99 on JHU (publishers) site:
https://jhupbooks.press.jhu.edu/content/single-stage-orbit

You can preview it on Google Books:
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=v6eTVBEDA54C&lpg=PA1938&dq=single%20stage%20to%20orbit&pg=PA1938#v=onepage&q=single%20stage%20to%20orbit&f=false

Looks like a great book at a great price, just ordered it. Thank you for pointing it out.

AlexA · « **Reply #26 on:** 03/10/2016 05:15 pm »

Quote from: Brovane on 03/10/2016 04:11 pm

Looks like a great book at a great price, just ordered it. Thank you for pointing it out.

You're welcome.

I ordered it too - even with $10 shipping to UK it seems worth it.

Chris_petty · « **Reply #27 on:** 03/21/2016 11:40 am »

Possibly of interest to some on this thread, I'm currently writing a history of various vertical takeoff/landing space vehicles from the designs of Philip Bono, through SERV/MURP and on to DC-X.

Part 1 is here: https://thehighfrontier.wordpress.com/2016/03/20/straight-back-down-to-earth-a-history-of-the-vertical-takeoffvertical-landing-rocket-part-1/

As always comments and (polite) corrections welcomed

Antilope7724 · « **Reply #28 on:** 03/21/2016 11:56 am »

In light of the recent Falcon 9 1st stage recovery, I started to wonder what device made the first rocket powered vertical landing on landing legs?

I was thinking maybe the DC-X, but then I thought about the Apollo Lunar Module and the lunar landing Surveyor spacecraft that both landed vertically with rockets on landing legs.

Is there any earlier craft that landed vertically with rockets on landing legs? Seems like the Surveyor 1 was the first.

There was also the LLRV (Lunar Landing Research Vehicle) from around the same time, but it used rockets and a jet engine, so it wasn't a pure rocket landing.

JasonAW3 · « **Reply #29 on:** 03/21/2016 01:25 pm »

Quote from: Antilope7724 on 03/21/2016 11:56 am

In light of the recent Falcon 9 1st stage recovery, I started to wonder what device made the first rocket powered vertical landing on landing legs?

I was thinking maybe the DC-X, but then I thought about the Apollo Lunar Module and the lunar landing Surveyor spacecraft that both landed vertically with rockets on landing legs.

Is there any earlier craft that landed vertically with rockets on landing legs? Seems like the Surveyor 1 was the first.

There was also the LLRV (Lunar Landing Research Vehicle) from around the same time, but it used rockets and a jet engine, so it wasn't a pure rocket landing.

Surveyor weould be my guess.

kato · « **Reply #30 on:** 03/21/2016 04:45 pm »

Bell Rocket Belt? With biological landing legs that is...

whitelancer64 · « **Reply #31 on:** 03/21/2016 05:03 pm »

Quote from: Antilope7724 on 03/21/2016 11:56 am

In light of the recent Falcon 9 1st stage recovery, I started to wonder what device made the first rocket powered vertical landing on landing legs?

I was thinking maybe the DC-X, but then I thought about the Apollo Lunar Module and the lunar landing Surveyor spacecraft that both landed vertically with rockets on landing legs.

Is there any earlier craft that landed vertically with rockets on landing legs? Seems like the Surveyor 1 was the first.

There was also the LLRV (Lunar Landing Research Vehicle) from around the same time, but it used rockets and a jet engine, so it wasn't a pure rocket landing.

Luna 9, which landed on the Moon February 3, 1966, used an airbag to cushion its landing, so yes, the first landing on legs was by the second probe to successfully soft-land on the Moon: Surveyor 1 on June 2, 1966.

Antilope7724 · « **Reply #32 on:** 03/21/2016 08:19 pm »

Quote from: kato on 03/21/2016 04:45 pm

Bell Rocket Belt? With biological landing legs that is...

I believe you are correct. There was a 2 man version that did have short landing legs. So that may have been earlier than Surveyor 1.

Chris_petty · « **Reply #33 on:** 04/08/2016 08:30 am »

for those interested in the story leading up to the DC-X, here's Part 2 of a series I'm writing on VTOL Rockets which deals with developments in the 80's which directly led to the programme:

https://thehighfrontier.wordpress.com/2016/04/07/taking-star-wars-to-the-stars-a-history-of-the-vtol-rocket-part-2/

TrevorMonty · « **Reply #34 on:** 04/08/2016 09:09 am »

Nice article.

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Elmar Moelzer · « **Reply #35 on:** 04/16/2016 10:22 pm »

I was very sour about the cancellation of the DC-X (and follow ups). NASA never treated that program well and were probably happy to cancel it. They wanted something with wings for some reason.
If they had chosen Boeings proposal for the X-33, we would have seen something very close to a DC-X follow up vehicle. But they wanted to not only have horizontal landing but at the same time test all sorts of risky new technologies in one X- vehicle like composite tanks, lifting bodies and aerospike engines.
All of that completely underperformed.
The X-33 was a total disaster that went nowhere. But hey, at least Lockheed got a lot of money for it. LOL

My favorite VTOL SSTO is still the Phoenix designed by Gary Hudson (who frequents this forum as well). I was always hoping that someone would give him the funding to at least develop a small prototype.
Regarding the DC-Y. It was already meant to be manned and the payload was not that small for a first generation SSTO RLV. It could have increased with maturing technology (just look at the huge leaps the F9 has taken since the first version).

Chris_petty · « **Reply #36 on:** 04/17/2016 10:47 am »

Currently, I think it's really interesting to look at what Masten Space Systems are proposing for the DARPA XS-1. From what I've seen, there are real echoes of the DC-X/DC-Y there. The fact that Jess Sponable is running the programme for DARPA and the goals are very much in line with what he was aiming for with those earlier programmes really makes this look very familiar. Of course this is proposed as a TSTO vehicle and we will see winged proposals from other players, but the phase 2 goal of hardware flying 10 times in 10 days seems a real extension of Max Hunter's original SSX concept.

Masten did show some concept art at Space Access in Phoenix this year - attached is an image they posted on Instagram

Archibald · « **Reply #37 on:** 04/17/2016 03:48 pm »

It looks a bit like McDonnell Douglas entry in the X-33 program

TrevorMonty · « **Reply #38 on:** 04/17/2016 04:04 pm »

Could these XS-1 vehicle be used as basis for a reusable US. The heatshield would need to handle higher temperatures, so some extra weight there. Engine count could be reduce as they don't need >1:1 thrust to weight ratio.

This maybe what Blue has in mind for the Boeing entry.

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Chris_petty · « **Reply #39 on:** 04/17/2016 05:12 pm »

Re. Similarities to the McDonnell Douglas X-33, another image that has been doing the rounds recently for a Masten XS-1 looks even more like that, but I have no idea as to the provenance of this concept - it doesn't appear on Masten's site so may have no link to the company or their actual plans.

Does anyone know more? Also does anyone know if there are videos of the Masten or DARPA (XS-1) presentations from this year's Space Access available anywhere online?