Another Gen2 filing https://licensing.fcc.gov/myibfs/download.do?attachment_key=17429628QuoteSATELLITE DIMENSIONSThe tables below present information for the current form factors of SpaceX Gen2satellites: two of which will be launched initially on Falcon 9 rockets and one that will be launchedon Starship. For convenience, these satellites are labeled satellites F9-1, F9-2, and Starship,respectively.
SATELLITE DIMENSIONSThe tables below present information for the current form factors of SpaceX Gen2satellites: two of which will be launched initially on Falcon 9 rockets and one that will be launchedon Starship. For convenience, these satellites are labeled satellites F9-1, F9-2, and Starship,respectively.
Quote from: Robotbeat on 10/05/2022 01:53 pmQuote from: deadman1204 on 10/05/2022 01:49 pmQuote from: groknull on 10/04/2022 08:37 pmQuote from: deadman1204 on 10/04/2022 02:03 pmI've heard that starlinks are getting brighter again (instead of dimmer).They no longer have visors, because they might interfere with laser links. As a result, all the newer birds will be brighter.Source?https://skyandtelescope.org/astronomy-news/newest-starlink-satellites-have-gotten-brighter-again/0.6 magnitude brighter than visorsats, but still dimmer than original Starlinks.So starlinks are getting brighter again. They will also start getting even brighter with the larger sized ones. This "dimmer than original" covers up the elephant in the room that is always ignored. They are only at the smaller magnitude when they reach final orbit. However, there are always hundreds of satellites on their way up to orbit (which takes several months. Starship is gonna change this to possibly thousands). In a couple years, there will also start to be many hundreds (or thousands) constantly on their way DOWN from orbit to be removed as they hit their 5yr lifespan or whatever and are replaced. So while some starlink satellites are at their minimum magnitude, there will always be a large number of satellites that are much brighter. The constellation will never be finished, there will always be many hundreds on their way up or down.
Quote from: deadman1204 on 10/05/2022 01:49 pmQuote from: groknull on 10/04/2022 08:37 pmQuote from: deadman1204 on 10/04/2022 02:03 pmI've heard that starlinks are getting brighter again (instead of dimmer).They no longer have visors, because they might interfere with laser links. As a result, all the newer birds will be brighter.Source?https://skyandtelescope.org/astronomy-news/newest-starlink-satellites-have-gotten-brighter-again/0.6 magnitude brighter than visorsats, but still dimmer than original Starlinks.
Quote from: groknull on 10/04/2022 08:37 pmQuote from: deadman1204 on 10/04/2022 02:03 pmI've heard that starlinks are getting brighter again (instead of dimmer).They no longer have visors, because they might interfere with laser links. As a result, all the newer birds will be brighter.Source?https://skyandtelescope.org/astronomy-news/newest-starlink-satellites-have-gotten-brighter-again/
Quote from: deadman1204 on 10/04/2022 02:03 pmI've heard that starlinks are getting brighter again (instead of dimmer).They no longer have visors, because they might interfere with laser links. As a result, all the newer birds will be brighter.Source?
I've heard that starlinks are getting brighter again (instead of dimmer).They no longer have visors, because they might interfere with laser links. As a result, all the newer birds will be brighter.
A quick visual aid for the scale of the sat variants.
To scatter sunlight hitting the front side of the solar arrays, the second-generation satellites willpoint the solar arrays away from the Sun when crossing the terminator (the line on Earth'ssurface separating night and day) in a maneuver called "terminator tracking." This maneuverwill point the knife edge of the solar array at the earth limb, which minimizes brightness whenviewed from the ground, as shown in the image below.
So starlinks are getting brighter again. They will also start getting even brighter with the larger sized ones. This "dimmer than original" covers up the elephant in the room that is always ignored. They are only at the smaller magnitude when they reach final orbit. However, there are always hundreds of satellites on their way up to orbit (which takes several months. Starship is gonna change this to possibly thousands). In a couple years, there will also start to be many hundreds (or thousands) constantly on their way DOWN from orbit to be removed as they hit their 5yr lifespan or whatever and are replaced. So while some starlink satellites are at their minimum magnitude, there will always be a large number of satellites that are much brighter. The constellation will never be finished, there will always be many hundreds on their way up or down.
....5. In addition, SpaceX is also refining the attitude control and solar array pointing during these two phases to reduce brightness, they can do this because when raising orbit or deborit, satellite doesn't need to provide service thus doesn't need to keep a fixed orientation wrt ground, and can live with less power.
Starlink view of 2nd stage deorbit burn
Pretty sure this is the first time we’ve ever seen imagery taken by a Starlink satellite
SpaceX had a NOAA license in 2015 for a low-res panchromatic video camera on MicroSat 1A and 1B - two early prototype satellites that ended up never flying to space.
Per the license, they were installed to capture pics and vids of Earth and the satellites themselves, and "potentially be used for general educational purposes, such as through the release of inspiring public Earth images"
twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1578055594573004800QuoteStarlink view of 2nd stage deorbit burn
Expect the eventual fallout from all of SpaceX's experimentation with reflectivity and effects to terrestrial observation assets to result in an eventual US and then later an International set of standards for all new sats in Earth orbit. This will be a big gain for the terrestrial astronomical instruments usage. But for even more advanced observations will likely move out into space beyond most of the objects that are in the way such as placed out at Lagrange Earth-Sun 2 past the Moon's orbit and is permanently facing away from the sun. This is beyond the Lagrange Earth-Moon 2 point.
Quote from: oldAtlas_Eguy on 10/05/2022 09:48 pmExpect the eventual fallout from all of SpaceX's experimentation with reflectivity and effects to terrestrial observation assets to result in an eventual US and then later an International set of standards for all new sats in Earth orbit. This will be a big gain for the terrestrial astronomical instruments usage. But for even more advanced observations will likely move out into space beyond most of the objects that are in the way such as placed out at Lagrange Earth-Sun 2 past the Moon's orbit and is permanently facing away from the sun. This is beyond the Lagrange Earth-Moon 2 point.Most observations can't and won't move out into space. The cost of a space based observatory is HUGE compared to an equivalent ground based one. And just for the record, launch cost has no impact on this. Free launch won't change this.
The type of cameras aboard Starlink satellites are primarily for mission assurance purposes - like to monitor separation events and spacecraft health - and therefore don't require a NOAA license, per an agency spokesman pointing to 15 CFR § 960.2 (b).
Quote from: deadman1204 on 10/06/2022 06:08 pmQuote from: oldAtlas_Eguy on 10/05/2022 09:48 pmExpect the eventual fallout from all of SpaceX's experimentation with reflectivity and effects to terrestrial observation assets to result in an eventual US and then later an International set of standards for all new sats in Earth orbit. This will be a big gain for the terrestrial astronomical instruments usage. But for even more advanced observations will likely move out into space beyond most of the objects that are in the way such as placed out at Lagrange Earth-Sun 2 past the Moon's orbit and is permanently facing away from the sun. This is beyond the Lagrange Earth-Moon 2 point.Most observations can't and won't move out into space. The cost of a space based observatory is HUGE compared to an equivalent ground based one. And just for the record, launch cost has no impact on this. Free launch won't change this.My bold.Do you have links to actual numbers I can do research on? Published reports, etc. Also interested in $/minute of actual observation time for different types and locations of terrestrial observatories. Thx.Since this is not really Starlink specific, a PM is probably more appropriate.
Can anyone interpret this image please?I can't see the burn mentioned by Musk.
Quote from: groknull on 10/06/2022 07:00 pmQuote from: deadman1204 on 10/06/2022 06:08 pmQuote from: oldAtlas_Eguy on 10/05/2022 09:48 pmExpect the eventual fallout from all of SpaceX's experimentation with reflectivity and effects to terrestrial observation assets to result in an eventual US and then later an International set of standards for all new sats in Earth orbit. This will be a big gain for the terrestrial astronomical instruments usage. But for even more advanced observations will likely move out into space beyond most of the objects that are in the way such as placed out at Lagrange Earth-Sun 2 past the Moon's orbit and is permanently facing away from the sun. This is beyond the Lagrange Earth-Moon 2 point.Most observations can't and won't move out into space. The cost of a space based observatory is HUGE compared to an equivalent ground based one. And just for the record, launch cost has no impact on this. Free launch won't change this.My bold.Do you have links to actual numbers I can do research on? Published reports, etc. Also interested in $/minute of actual observation time for different types and locations of terrestrial observatories. Thx.Since this is not really Starlink specific, a PM is probably more appropriate.Look up the price of literally ANY space telescope. Also, the price is as much time as it is money. Look into the years and years of time it takes to build and design one. This is a silly fantasy that free launch matters is the majority of the solution. However, to save you the 3 seconds of google time, the ELT (biggest telescope EVER https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extremely_Large_Telescope) has a price tag of 1.5 billion euros. We literally do not have the technology to build this in space, but if we tried, after the tech dev and decades of work, it would easily be 50billion plus. How does the difference of $30million on the launch price change anything? Even if there was free launch today, it would easily be a decade to fund, design, build, and test something to take advantage of it.
Quote from: su27k on 10/06/2022 01:45 am....5. In addition, SpaceX is also refining the attitude control and solar array pointing during these two phases to reduce brightness, they can do this because when raising orbit or deborit, satellite doesn't need to provide service thus doesn't need to keep a fixed orientation wrt ground, and can live with less power.Curious about the last part.At first glance it makes sense that the power requirement for orbit raising is less than for transmitting data, but did anyone do any math on that, or is it just an assumption?
During orbit raise from the insertion orbit to the operational orbit, thesatellites need to maximize power generation and minimize drag at low altitudes andaren't able to perform solar array off-pointing.Just like during orbit raise, satellites will be brighter at the end of their life whilelowering their orbits until they burn up on reentry.
Quote from: Bob Shaw on 10/06/2022 06:07 pmCan anyone interpret this image please?I can't see the burn mentioned by Musk.You can see it a little better in the video Elon Musk posted. What you see is the stack of Starlinks separating and to the right you see a sudden flare that one would assume is the second stage suddenly moving to the right.