On the idea of "Roombas with welders": Why not little robots with big battery packs that are basically weld-down "shoes" with wheels, they drive themselves over the feet, raise their wheels (so they're sitting on the deck for welding), then dump the rest of their stored battery power into welding themselves to the deck? Rather than robot welders, the robots self-weld to the deck. Would still require some effort to remove them, but they could be "modular" such that all the non-shoe parts can be unbolted after they're in port and attached to a fresh shoe, while regular cutting techniques are used to get the welded shoes off...
Quote from: Req on 02/03/2017 02:10 am I know, not likely.Less than not likely, more like nil of a chance.
I know, not likely.
Quote from: Jim on 02/03/2017 02:56 amQuote from: Req on 02/03/2017 02:10 am I know, not likely.Less than not likely, more like nil of a chance.Don't tell me, I already expressed my doubts. Musk is the one you should be informing, he's the one who has expressed intent to do so, with this ASDS design, with consistency multiple times over multiple years, even again fairly recently.
I suggest you review the source material. He has explicitly said that this design will allow for refuel and hop back, and that these barges will be modified in the future to do so.
Quote from: Req on 02/04/2017 02:40 amI suggest you review the source material. He has explicitly said that this design will allow for refuel and hop back, and that these barges will be modified in the future to do so.Do you have the source? I remember the statement, something along the lines of "in the future, ... will allow fly back", but I think it left a lot of room for "how much improvement is still needed".
Musk had also explicitly said that...
My personal wishful-thinking hope on both the deck plates and the raised container is something to do with refuel and hop back to land. Maybe tanks below, the extra room is for GSE, the deck plates for takeoff impengement and/or holes/ports/etc or something for an at-sea service mast type hookup. I know, not likely.
Yeah, but it'll take more than some room under a container to pull that off. The launch back is more than a gentle GH hop. When you see a barge design that looks like a twin-hull, then we'll know it's getting close...
2. Not to harp, but this whole jag was spawned not by a comment about potential future developments to the ASDS but about specific changes that have been recently/contemporaneously observed. Though I do admit that I either missed, forgot, or ignored your inclusion of "wishful-thinking" in that sentence.
It certainly wasn't a non-sequitur
Paging doctor Goldberg...The legs can't just retract after takeoff and before aero loads get unmanageable? Grasshopper got plenty high with rigid legs.
Quote from: Req on 02/04/2017 05:07 amPaging doctor Goldberg...The legs can't just retract after takeoff and before aero loads get unmanageable? Grasshopper got plenty high with rigid legs.No. The legs lock in the extended position and have no mechanism to retract, nor does the stage carry an inexhaustible supply of helium to extend them a second time. So keep on dreaming about flyback hops but until you see authorization to do so in FAA and FCC paperwork, you'll be dreaming in fantasyland.
Quote from: Herb Schaltegger on 02/04/2017 12:16 pmQuote from: Req on 02/04/2017 05:07 amPaging doctor Goldberg...The legs can't just retract after takeoff and before aero loads get unmanageable? Grasshopper got plenty high with rigid legs.No. The legs lock in the extended position and have no mechanism to retract, nor does the stage carry an inexhaustible supply of helium to extend them a second time. So keep on dreaming about flyback hops but until you see authorization to do so in FAA and FCC paperwork, you'll be dreaming in fantasyland.This is common knowledge. Are you suggesting that making them retract is more complicated and less likely than putting a landing/launching cradle on the ASDS and adding lateral thrusters to the F9 as he was suggesting? Are you suggesting that if you can refuel RP1 and LOX it would be impossible to reload helium and whatever other expendables the vehicle needs such as fluid for the grid fins and maybe tea/teb? The fuel/prop is one thing, but those others, that's just a bridge too far? And again, still wondering why I'm here defending what Musk and SpaceX have repeatedly claimed will happen in no uncertain terms. Fantasy dreamland indeed. How disrespectful to them.
And in the meantime SpaceX obviously just spouts fantasyland dreams off without looking into any of this. Got it. And arguing now = replying to people arguing with me after making a statement that couldn't have been interpreted as contradicting anything anybody was saying.