Author Topic: SpaceX Falcon 9 - CRS-9 Dragon - NET July 18, 2016 - DISCUSSION  (Read 168075 times)

Online russianhalo117

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4299
  • AR USA / Berlin, DE / Moscow, RF
  • Liked: 945
  • Likes Given: 541
Dextre... Here, hang to to this for a bit... :)
It can be temp stowed for only a short period of time on SPDM following the irreversible steps of Dragon Payload Umbilicals (further noted as DPU) demate and release. After those steps the Keep alive and survival clocks kick in as I understand that SPDM cannot provide IDA with keep alive power and data for heaters et cetera. After DPU demate and release its has to get on PMA quickly.

Also a quick reminder as the crew actually performs the installation via manual docking with the PMA's APAS Soft Capture System and hard docking done via ground or IVA Commanding to drive the hooks of the PMA's APAS Hard Capture System. The PMA's APAS HCS also contains a manual drive port to drive or release the hooks manually via a PGT. For the IDA mate and installation all 24 Active hooks (12 on PMA and 12 on IDA) will be engaged with 24 Passive Hooks (12 on PMA and 12 on IDA) with maximum load of 5,000 Newtons on each hook element pair for maximum rigidity and strength.
« Last Edit: 06/04/2016 06:11 PM by russianhalo117 »

Offline Wolfram66

The IDA could be "stored" in extreme emergency on the end of the RMS.  The issue is that you don't want to do that for a long time.  The mating end of the IDA isn't designed for indefinite storage in such a thermal environment, for one thing.  And the RMS isn't designed to hold that amount of mass against a lot of the station maneuvers, for another.

In re EVAs -- some EVAs are designed and practiced as you would choreograph an opera.  Every move is pre-thought-out, every tool identified for use at specific times and in specific ways.  However, many of a given ISS crew have what is called general EVA training; they know how to operate the EVA equipment safely, and how to maneuver around the outside of the station.  They have been given training in many common tasks, including installation of MMOD barriers and replacement of a variety of commonly replaced external modules.

Specific operations, like the installation and emergency troubleshooting of the IDAs, is in the former category, and you'd want the crewmembers specifically trained to these tasks to undertake them.  But if an external power or cooling module or something goes bad, there are always people onboard the station who have been trained in EVA procedures and can make "contingency EVAs" to repair such issues without having been through a training process to choreograph them.

What with the now-extensive ability to send up printed and visual materials to support operations, it's not quite as essential as it used to be to detail-train crews in some operations before they are launched to the station.  But operating something as complex as the ISS is a series of trade-offs and compromises, and if management feels it's far better to have the ground-trained IDA crew on the station before launching the IDA, then that's what will happen...

why not just launch and leave it in the Dragon Trunk until next crew comes up? what is that, a week or two?

Offline mn

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 304
  • United States
  • Liked: 152
  • Likes Given: 56
why not just launch and leave it in the Dragon Trunk until next crew comes up? what is that, a week or two?

Obviously, until they launch there could be further delays, what do you do then? Unless there is a good plan B I'm sure NASA would not just launch and hope they don't get further delayed.

Offline Glom

  • Member
  • Posts: 35
  • England
  • Liked: 9
  • Likes Given: 0
Quote
Jeff Foust‏ @jeff_foust

TASS reports “control system flaws” will delay next Soyuz from Jun 24 to Jul 7: http://bit.ly/1r38UxS
Could delay Cygnus & Dragon

https://twitter.com/jeff_foust/status/738145362284666880

Would the delay be caused by the preferred pattern of visiting vehicles as well as the crew to berth them or are trained to berth them? They've had an interesting traffic pattern of late with up to six spacecraft attached.
Delay is IDA payload and IDA EVA crew related, as the crew meant that was meant to install the destroyed IDA 1 is no longer on orbit and the new crew that is to fly on Soyuz MS(-01) received IDA-2 specific training in NBL for the entire set of planned and contingency EVA's. The current crews onboard due not have the IDA installation and contingency ground training the Next crew received. The onboard crews have a big deficit in IDA training that the next crew doesn't.

Sometimes I think they really make this harder than it needs to be. Yes, the training is important...but is putting the IDA on with a computer-controlled robot arm, especially when simulation (even on orbit) is very advanced, really that hard? Especially when virtually every move is prescripted and monitored fromthe ground? And the IDA 1 crew could sit in mission control and provide verbal "astronaut eyes" assistance to ISS?

NASA will never get to MARS this way.

To reinforce a later answer:

Ask Gene Cernan how "simple" his Gemini 9 EVA turned out to be. Because we were new to the notion of not fighting ourselves in microgravity on a spacewalk, Cernan exhausted himself and nearly caused his ELCSS resources to fail.

Since then, all EVAs are trained in a large water pool to simulate not only the weightlessness but how certain tools and restraints work (or don't) to get a task done. EVA training for even the tiniest action is repeated over and over so not only the work is done, but to ensure the crew never, ever, forget to do something such as connect their safety tethers, which could make a Very Bad Day for that astronaut and the space program if they float away. No one wants the astronauts to have to use their SAFER emergency jet packs.

Just because a crew is "up there" doesn't make them qualified to do all the work that comes out them out of schedule.
I'd imagine the feel would still be quite different. A little push in space will do so much more than in a tank.

Offline wannamoonbase

  • Elite Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2952
  • Denver, CO
    • U.S. Metric Association
  • Liked: 675
  • Likes Given: 1103
why not just launch and leave it in the Dragon Trunk until next crew comes up? what is that, a week or two?

Obviously, until they launch there could be further delays, what do you do then? Unless there is a good plan B I'm sure NASA would not just launch and hope they don't get further delayed.

I'm wondering if this isn't some public negotiation between partners?  NASA trying to keep Russia on point.

SpaceX, just a few things planned for 2018: FH, Starlink Prototypes, Block 5, Dragon 2, Increased launch rate.

Online guckyfan

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6612
  • Germany
  • Liked: 1700
  • Likes Given: 1642
For how long can they keep Dragon up there? I think for quite a while.

Offline wannamoonbase

  • Elite Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2952
  • Denver, CO
    • U.S. Metric Association
  • Liked: 675
  • Likes Given: 1103
For how long can they keep Dragon up there? I think for quite a while.

6 months I think.
SpaceX, just a few things planned for 2018: FH, Starlink Prototypes, Block 5, Dragon 2, Increased launch rate.

Offline joncz

  • Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 365
  • Atlanta, Georgia
  • Liked: 54
  • Likes Given: 147
I would think that NASA would want to use ISS to test some of this, can stuff be done without having exhaustively planned out everything in advance?



Online FutureSpaceTourist

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6005
  • UK
    • Plan 28
  • Liked: 5432
  • Likes Given: 1538
Cross posting update on whether Soyuz delay impacts CRS-9:

Roscosmos confirms Soyuz launch to ISS is postponed to July 7 from June 24. CRS-9 is expected to be delayed as well until after the new crew (with the training to install the IDA) arrives.

A: July 16 is still after July 7, do they need to be on iss for a certain period of adjustment time before they are fully ready to work?

B: http://spacenews.com/russia-delays-next-soyuz-launch-to-space-station/ "...NASA spokesman Dan Huot said June 6 that the Dragon launch remains scheduled for July 16...."

Offline spacepat_o

  • Member
  • Posts: 27
  • Maryland, USA
  • Liked: 18
  • Likes Given: 123
http://www.nasa.gov/social/spacex-crs-9-social
NASA Social posted for CRS 9 on July 15-16

This mission is listed as "the next cargo resupply to the International Space Station."

Online gongora

  • Global Moderator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3154
  • US
  • Liked: 2533
  • Likes Given: 1536
NASA: From Magnetic Levitation to Frozen Wax, Cargo Spacecraft to Carry Wide Range of Investigations

Overview of some experiments going up on CRS-9.  Total cargo "nearly 4900 pounds".  Trying to figure out if the launch date in this article is just a typo (July 18) since everywhere else (including NASA and KSC calendars) says July 16.

Offline NX-0

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 116
  • USA
  • Liked: 115
  • Likes Given: 177
Has Stage 1 arrive at the cape for CRS-9, yet?

What's the milestone that gets us a update thread? :-)

Offline OpelGT

  • Member
  • Posts: 33
  • Minnesota, USA
  • Liked: 14
  • Likes Given: 0
Has Stage 1 arrive at the cape for CRS-9, yet?



The CRS-9 Dragon capsule left the factory 5 weeks ago.
[Source:] https://www.instagram.com/p/BFXcK_Cl8cO/

Anyone have any new info on it's location?

I'm assuming it's at LC-40 in the HIB waiting to be assembled for launch
but I haven't seen any recent pictures inside the HIB.

We need our spies to install GPS trackers on the components or their trailers! ;D

Online Chris Bergin

NET July 18 now.

Will be ISS considerations on the VV schedule per phasing and such with the Soyuz manifest merry-go-round. First stage was seen at McGregor just a few days ago (photo L2 McGregor). All seems fine on their processing flow.
« Last Edit: 06/21/2016 10:08 PM by Chris Bergin »

Online Chris Bergin

June 21, 2016
MEDIA ADVISORY M16-073
Next SpaceX Commercial Cargo Launch Now No Earlier Than July 18, US Media Accreditation Remains Open

The next SpaceX commercial cargo resupply services mission for NASA to the International Space Station now is targeted for launch no earlier than 12:45 a.m. EDT Monday, July 18.

An uncrewed SpaceX Dragon spacecraft, carrying crew supplies and station hardware, will lift off on a Falcon 9 rocket from Space Launch Complex 40 at Cape Canaveral Air Force Station (CCAFS), adjacent to NASA’s Kennedy Space Center in Florida.

This is the ninth mission by SpaceX under NASA’s Commercial Resupply Services contract. Among the almost 4,900 pounds of supplies, equipment and science research Dragon will carry is the first of two international docking adapters, which will allow Boeing's CST-100 Starliner and SpaceX's Crew Dragon spacecraft to dock to the station when transporting astronauts in the near future as part of NASA's Commercial Crew Program.

Offline ZachS09

I have good news and bad news.

The bad news is that I won't be providing play-by-play coverage during the SpX-9 launch.

The good news, however, is that I will record the launch and landing from Port Canaveral as I'm staying at a Daytona Beach condo for two months during my summer school session at Embry-Riddle.

Although I'm not sure whether to post my POV on the update thread or discussion thread when the time comes.
« Last Edit: 07/18/2016 03:21 PM by longdrivechampion102 »
"Liftoff of Falcon 9: the world's first reflight of an orbital-class rocket."

Offline obi-wan

  • Full Member
  • **
  • Posts: 281
  • Liked: 595
  • Likes Given: 6
Has there been a definitive announcement as to whether or not this will be an RTLS mission?

Offline Kabloona

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4257
  • Velocitas Eradico
  • Fortress of Solitude
  • Liked: 2488
  • Likes Given: 514
Has there been a definitive announcement as to whether or not this will be an RTLS mission?

I believe this is SpaceX's FCC transmitter permit application for CRS-9 stage 1 recovery. Note that it lists only a land-based transmitter, probably for remote safing of the stage after landing at the Cape. This is different from transmitter permit applications for ASDS recoveries, which list the at-sea coordinates for the ASDS and support ships. So this application is consistent with RTLS.

https://apps.fcc.gov/oetcf/els/reports/STA_Print.cfm?mode=current&application_seq=71944&RequestTimeout=1000

Also, OCISLY is expected to drydock in the Bahamas next week for a Coast Guard inspection and some refit, so it seems likely that SpaceX chose this window of opportunity based on RTLS for CRS-9, ie not needing OCISLY until August for the next GTO mission.
« Last Edit: 06/25/2016 10:59 AM by Kabloona »

Offline dcporter

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 866
  • Liked: 242
  • Likes Given: 396
Although I'm not sure whether to post my POV on the update thread or discussion thread when the time comes.

My uninformed opinion is that first person accounts count as updates.

Offline The Roadie

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 392
  • San Diego
  • Liked: 2093
  • Likes Given: 92
Just got accepted into my second lifetime NASA Social Media group, for CRS9. (Was also at CRS6.) At 63, I'm pretty sure I'm the oldest Social Media rep they've had. We'll get a couple of days of behind the scenes interviews and tours, and should be at the pre-launch press conference. Last time, somebody on the bus of 50 of us in the group summed it up perfectly: "Best 5th Grade Field Trip EVER!"

I was in a permanent state of awe and amazement, as a space nut for 57 of my years.

Anybody wants to get together for a beer when I'm not in KSC, hit me up. My wife is also going, since it's our 43rd anniversary, even though she can't be in the Social Media group. We have four other days to hang out. But the negotiations for this were.......delicate. :-)
"A human being should be able to...plan an invasion..conn a ship..solve equations, analyze a new problem..program a computer, cook a tasty meal.."-RAH

Tags: