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International Space Flight (ESA, Russia, China and others) => Chinese Launchers => Topic started by: Satori on 04/22/2016 11:32 am

Title: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - Wenchang - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Satori on 04/22/2016 11:32 am
The Chinese Mars Mission will be launched on August 2020.

[zubenelgenubi: This is the launch thread.  This is the program thread (https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=35045.0).]
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: rocx on 04/22/2016 01:28 pm
The Chinese Mars Mission will be launched on August 2020.
Source? What payload? How certain?
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: Satori on 04/22/2016 02:21 pm
The Chinese Mars Mission will be launched on August 2020.
Source? What payload? How certain?

http://www.chinaspaceflight.com/satellite/Deepspace/Mars-Exploration/Mars-Probe.html
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: plutogno on 04/22/2016 03:35 pm
China aiming to launch Mars mission around 2020
http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2016-04/22/c_135303964.htm

Quote
Xu revealed that the mission was approved by central authorities in January
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: Star One on 04/22/2016 07:10 pm
China confirms Mars rover mission.

http://www.dailygalaxy.com/my_weblog/2016/04/china-confirms-plans-for-a-mars-rover-mission-follows-a-2018-mission-to-explore-dark-side-of-the-moo.html
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: Dalhousie on 04/23/2016 12:16 am
China confirms Mars rover mission.

http://www.dailygalaxy.com/my_weblog/2016/04/china-confirms-plans-for-a-mars-rover-mission-follows-a-2018-mission-to-explore-dark-side-of-the-moo.html

I wonder how many years it will be before journalists realise that much of China's space activity is under the control of the Chinese academy of science not the military?
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: savuporo on 04/23/2016 01:47 am
I wonder how many years it will be before journalists realise that much of China's space activity is under the control of the Chinese academy of science not the military?
Thats probably one of the smallest offenses, there was some truly awful reporting on this story. But the Mirror takes the cake (http://www.mirror.co.uk/science/china-attempt-giant-leap-ahead-7810201):
Quote
We British have also sent our own probe to Mars: the ill-fated Beagle II.

This plucky rover was conceived at the height of the Cool Britannia era, using a call sign composed by Blur and a calibration "test card" designed by Damien Hurst.

However, the probe went the way of the many forgotten stars of the 1990s, disappearing without trace in 2003.
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: Nordren on 04/23/2016 09:09 am
China confirms Mars rover mission.

http://www.dailygalaxy.com/my_weblog/2016/04/china-confirms-plans-for-a-mars-rover-mission-follows-a-2018-mission-to-explore-dark-side-of-the-moo.html

I wonder how many years it will be before journalists realise that much of China's space activity is under the control of the Chinese academy of science not the military?

The military/just for prestige narrative is entrenched, and fits with the worldview of many. It'll take quite a time for the realisation that CNSA is not analogous to NASA, and that the PLA is not in charge of that and all of the things. When missions, particularly crewed, become more regular, then perhaps there will be enough consistent coverage so that reporters will learn. For now, it's cowboys and indians.
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: quasar on 04/23/2016 09:06 pm
So China's first Mars mission will include an orbiter, a lander and a rover. A very complex mission and tight schedule for that (some 4 years from official approval to launch). It's radically different from China's previous cautious step-by-step approach with Chang'e program. What's the hurry, if there's really no space race at all?
My guess: ExoMars rover, NASA's 2020 Mars rover and ISRO's Mars rover should all be launched by 2020. After that is another Mars rover maybe not so impressive anymore for the public.
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: Dalhousie on 04/24/2016 03:09 am
So China's first Mars mission will include an orbiter, a lander and a rover. A very complex mission and tight schedule for that (some 4 years from official approval to launch). It's radically different from China's previous cautious step-by-step approach with Chang'e program. What's the hurry, if there's really no space race at all?
My guess: ExoMars rover, NASA's 2020 Mars rover and ISRO's Mars rover should all be launched by 2020. After that is another Mars rover maybe not so impressive anymore for the public.

Not really rushed, development has been going for at least seven years (there were presentations showing field trials of rover prototypes in Mongia at LPSC in 2009, if I recall rightly).  Much of the technology will have been tested on lunar and human missions.  A lead time of over a decade seems reasonable to me. 

It's not a question of rover's being "old hat" after 2020 and so they are rushing. it is just that China obviously thinks their technology will be able to do that by then.  It's how they do things, steadily and maturely.  Very little sign of any rushed development.

If you think that this is too big a step, note that their Chang'e program started with two orbiters (the second then carried out a complex mission to L5 before performing an asteroid flyby), followed by a rover, then a highly complex mission involving lunar free return, Earth entry, L2 Halo orbit and then low lunar orbit.  Their next mission is a sample return.  No intermediate steps of flybys, hard landers, and soft landers.  Their first manned spacecraft is equivalent to what were third generation for both the US and USSR.  No Vostok/Voskhod or Mercury/Gemini equivalents
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: Phil Stooke on 04/24/2016 03:37 am
100% agree with you on that!
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: K210 on 04/26/2016 02:30 pm
an engineer saying that he regrets that India went to Mars before China does not make a space race.
it's not as if the  government had invested to make sure that China went there first.

Remember that it was only a Russian launch failure that prevented a Chinese Mars mission getting to Mars before India.

Until China declared its programmes I don't think that India had lunar or Mars exploration programmes.   And their pretend-piloted programme only appeared after Shenzhou.   So, China isn't racing anyone, but India is trying to race China.

Sorry to get off-topic!

Its not that ISRO did not have programs its that they did not execute them. I remember in a presentation from 1995 where ISRO said chandraayan-1 would be launched by 2001 and a mars orbiter later that decade. We all know that plan fell behind and chinese marched ahead with moon missions and manned mission. Still its good that india is trying to compete as competition is very beneficial for space technology and science as a whole.
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: K210 on 04/26/2016 02:31 pm
So China's first Mars mission will include an orbiter, a lander and a rover. A very complex mission and tight schedule for that (some 4 years from official approval to launch). It's radically different from China's previous cautious step-by-step approach with Chang'e program. What's the hurry, if there's really no space race at all?
My guess: ExoMars rover, NASA's 2020 Mars rover and ISRO's Mars rover should all be launched by 2020. After that is another Mars rover maybe not so impressive anymore for the public.

A somewhat risky approach for a first (serious) attempt. Not sure if some political factors are coming into play here.
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: savuporo on 04/26/2016 02:59 pm
Its not that ISRO did not have programs its that they did not execute them. I remember in a presentation from 1995 where ISRO said chandraayan-1 would be launched by 2001 and a mars orbiter later that decade. We all know that plan fell behind and chinese marched ahead with moon missions and manned mission. Still its good that india is trying to compete as competition is very beneficial for space technology and science as a whole.

According to ISRO official history, Indian moon mission was initially suggested only in 1999 and seriously started to be considered by Astronautical Society of India in 2000. It didnt become called Chandrayaan-1 before 2003.
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: Dalhousie on 04/26/2016 10:22 pm
So China's first Mars mission will include an orbiter, a lander and a rover. A very complex mission and tight schedule for that (some 4 years from official approval to launch). It's radically different from China's previous cautious step-by-step approach with Chang'e program. What's the hurry, if there's really no space race at all?
My guess: ExoMars rover, NASA's 2020 Mars rover and ISRO's Mars rover should all be launched by 2020. After that is another Mars rover maybe not so impressive anymore for the public.

A somewhat risky approach for a first (serious) attempt. Not sure if some political factors are coming into play here.

Ying-ho 1 was also a serious attempt.

Why do people always look for political factors?  China has a lot of relevant space experience, by 2020 they will have had at least three more lunar missions on the board.  It's not the 60s anymore.

The only way they could split this up would be to send the orbiter first and then a lander.  But that would reduce overall risk by much, if any.
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: Ohsin on 04/26/2016 11:30 pm
Its not that ISRO did not have programs its that they did not execute them. I remember in a presentation from 1995 where ISRO said chandraayan-1 would be launched by 2001 and a mars orbiter later that decade. We all know that plan fell behind and chinese marched ahead with moon missions and manned mission. Still its good that india is trying to compete as competition is very beneficial for space technology and science as a whole.

According to ISRO official history, Indian moon mission was initially suggested only in 1999 and seriously started to be considered by Astronautical Society of India in 2000. It didnt become called Chandrayaan-1 before 2003.

Yeah Should be 11 May 1999. Also according to that book it was first suggested as 'Somayaan' to Prime Minister who announced it as Chandrayaan after consultations of his own.
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: luhai167 on 05/06/2016 02:43 am
So China's first Mars mission will include an orbiter, a lander and a rover. A very complex mission and tight schedule for that (some 4 years from official approval to launch). It's radically different from China's previous cautious step-by-step approach with Chang'e program. What's the hurry, if there's really no space race at all?
My guess: ExoMars rover, NASA's 2020 Mars rover and ISRO's Mars rover should all be launched by 2020. After that is another Mars rover maybe not so impressive anymore for the public.

A somewhat risky approach for a first (serious) attempt. Not sure if some political factors are coming into play here.

Ying-ho 1 was also a serious attempt.

Why do people always look for political factors?  China has a lot of relevant space experience, by 2020 they will have had at least three more lunar missions on the board.  It's not the 60s anymore.

The only way they could split this up would be to send the orbiter first and then a lander.  But that would reduce overall risk by much, if any.

Remember the very first post of this thread about a proposed 2015 Orbiter/"semi-soft" Lander mission which ultimately did not happen. (Originally link broken, copy attached) So China has being think about Mars mission for quite a while now, however, the value / (cost + risk) for this mission was not enough for to get a green light, but experience gained from various Chang'e missions since 2011 give the Chinese the confidence to skip the orbiter phase and go directly to a lander.

Also in the first post and link broken. A penetrator mission proposed by SAST/8th Division (the orbiter/land is from CAST/5th Division) which also didn't get the go-ahead. That mission also uses CZ-3B, but is based on the Yinghou-1 platform. Also another relatively low risk mission with existing platforms, though the YH-1 platform didn't get a chance to prove itself.

It there is a truly a race for Mars for political reasons, this project would have gotten a go-ahead, as the India MOM project is already known at the time. Since 2015 mission is using platforms already proven in the CE-1/CE-2 program, it would have being relatively low risk. However, if this mission gotten the go ahead, then Mars missions would overlap with CE3-CE6; I don't think China's deep space exploration program has the resources to support both. In the 2020, Chang'e mission will be over with lots of experience gained, China will have be more capable rockets, and more capable tracking network.  It would be rather meek to limit itself to mission scopes defined nearly a decade before.
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: plutogno on 05/26/2016 04:07 pm
wow! a 40-min video on the Chinese Mars Mission! (in Chinese of course)
http://www.chinaspaceflight.com/satellite/Deepspace/Mars-Exploration/Mars-Probe.html
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 05/27/2016 06:05 am
Some screen grabs I thought were interesting. Images 6 and 7 show the Yinghuo 1 Mars probe that was lost with Phobos-Grunt. The second image shows the lander being ejected from a spacecraft. Looks a little small.
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: Dalhousie on 05/27/2016 08:55 am
Some screen grabs I thought were interesting. Images 6 and 7 show the Yinghuo 1 Mars probe that was lost with Phobos-Grunt. The second image shows the lander being ejected from a spacecraft. Looks a little small.

I thought it looked small too.  I wonder if this is an animation of one of the earlier small lander proposals.  Note too that the lander is released before MOI.
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: plutogno on 05/27/2016 01:16 pm
Note too that the lander is released before MOI.

yet in the following sequence you can see it released at apoapsis in Mars orbit (Steven Pietrobon's 3rd screen capture)
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: Dalhousie on 05/29/2016 10:31 pm
Note too that the lander is released before MOI.

yet in the following sequence you can see it released at apoapsis in Mars orbit (Steven Pietrobon's 3rd screen capture)

I guess I read the diagram as show the ultimate orbit, but could have misread it.
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: plutogno on 06/17/2016 09:13 am
this has just appeared on the Journal of Deep Space Exploration:

Analysis of Key Technologies for Unmanned Mars Sample Return Mission
http://jdse.bit.edu.cn/sktcxbcn/ch/reader/view_abstract.aspx?file_no=20160203&flag=1

Quote
Unmanned Mars sample return mission is of great significance to obtain scientific results and improve engineering ability. The mission period is longer and technical risk is higher compared with several foreign Mars landing and roving missions. The top-level system design is determined by the mission flight mode. The rendezvous capture and sample transfer process should be completed near the Mars orbit. Therefore,two probes with different functions are required:one is used to perform Mars capture, sample storage and Mars-Earth transfer,the other to complete EDL process,Mars  surface ascent and sample delivery. Such key issues as EDL mode,Mars ascent vehicle,Mars orbit rendezvous and capture,sample transfer,earth entry vehicle,system scales,rocket selection,etc. are analyzed in this paper. The main technical difficulty and solution approaches are discussed.
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: plutogno on 06/17/2016 09:18 am
actually, there are lots of articles on Mars exploration on the latest issue of the journal: http://jdse.bit.edu.cn/sktcxben/ch/reader/issue_list.aspx?year_id=2016&quarter_id=2
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: Lsquirrel on 08/23/2016 09:03 am
http://news.xinhuanet.com/politics/2016-08/23/c_129249735.htm (http://news.xinhuanet.com/politics/2016-08/23/c_129249735.htm)
china revealed its mars probe pictures for the first time
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 08/23/2016 09:36 am
The Chinese certainly don't mess about! Going straight for an orbiter/lander/rover in their second attempt. If this is a success, I wouldn't be surprised if their next mission is a Mars sample return. The lander capsule is also more head-light shaped, then the more traditional saucer shape used in the past.
Title: Re: Re: Chinese Mars mission
Post by: zubenelgenubi on 07/12/2019 07:25 pm
Cross-post; my bold:
CZ-5 schedule after Y3 from the Liuyi twitter:

2020.04 -- [Correction by GP SST: MDR/WDR of the CZ-5B at the launch pad]
2020.07.23 through 08.05 -- CZ-5 №Y4 with HX-1 (Mars-1) mission
2020.10 -- CZ-5B №Y1 with Chinese Next Gen spacecraft
2020.12.04 through 8 -- CZ-5 №Y5 with CE-5
2021.Q2 -- CZ-5B №Y2 with Tianhe base blok of Tiangong space station

HX-1 space science coverage thread (https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=40999.0)
EDIT 7/24
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Huoxing-1 HX-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: Satori on 01/19/2020 03:23 pm
HX-1 will be launched by the Chang Zheng-5 (Y4).
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Huoxing-1 HX-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: SciNews on 01/23/2020 11:54 am
Long March-5 Y4 rocket engine tested
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUcE98My47w
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Huoxing-1 HX-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: zandr on 01/23/2020 01:52 pm
From Xinhua
China to launch Mars probe in July (http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-01/23/c_138729113.htm)
Quote

The Long March-5 Y4 rocket has recently completed a 100-second test for its high thrust hydrogen-oxygen engine, which is the last engine examination before the final assembly.
...
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Huoxing-1 HX-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 01/24/2020 04:54 am
Here's the engine nozzle, showing the spiral tube wall construction. The video also mentioned they are building a new hydrolox engine with three times the thrust of YF-77.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Huoxing-1 HX-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: GELORD on 01/24/2020 05:56 am
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Huoxing-1 HX-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: Satori on 04/14/2020 09:56 am
HX-1 arrived at Wenchang.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Huoxing-1 HX-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: Closer to Space on 04/24/2020 02:36 am
It seems that Huoxing-1 is renamed Tianwen-1:

https://twitter.com/hanipersian/status/1253509477141225472
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Huoxing-1 HX-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: Phil Stooke on 04/24/2020 02:41 am
From a thread on the 9ifly forum:

http://www.9ifly.cn/thread-93048-6-1.html (http://www.9ifly.cn/thread-93048-6-1.html)

-------------------
China News Network
2 minutes ago from Weibo weibo.com
[Scheduled! # China ’s first Mars exploration mission named Tianwenyihao #] April 24 is the fifth “Chinese Space Day”, the name of China ’s first Mars exploration mission and the mission logo will be launched at the 2020 China Space Day Announced on. The Chinese planetary exploration mission was named "Tianwen" series, the first Mars exploration mission was named "Tianwen-1", and the subsequent planetary missions were numbered sequentially. According to reports, the name is derived from Qu Yuan ’s long poem "Questions of Heaven", which expresses the tenacity and perseverance of the Chinese nation in the pursuit of truth, and embodies the cultural inheritance of the exploration of nature and cosmic space. Endless. The mission logo symbolizing "Lan Xing Jiutian" shows the image of the unique letter "C", which brings together the multiple meanings of China's planetary exploration (China), international cooperation spirit (Cooperation), and the ability of deep space exploration into space (C3). Demonstrated the concept and attitude of China's open space cooperation. (People's Daily Client)
--------------------------

Title: Re: CZ-5 - Huoxing-1 HX-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: Sizzy on 04/24/2020 02:42 am
The LOGO of China Planet exploration mission
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Huoxing-1 HX-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 04/24/2020 02:53 am
It seems that Huoxing-1 is renamed Tianwen-1:

https://twitter.com/hanipersian/status/1253509477141225472

Yup, and the name will be used for future Chinese planetary exploration missions as well.

https://twitter.com/Cosmic_Penguin/status/1253514691365597186

It means "To Ask The Heavens" and is from the name of a long poem dated back to the 3rd Century BC:

https://twitter.com/Cosmic_Penguin/status/1253516203827449856

The Mars rover will get a name later through a separate naming competition.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: SciNews on 04/24/2020 08:34 am
Tianwen-1  - China’s first Mars mission
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PyM68Kie6s8
Short interviews with Ge Xiaochun (chief engineer, CNSA) and Wang Chuang (chief designer of the Mars probe)
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: Liss on 04/24/2020 10:28 am
So the Mars mission is 天问 and the China Space Station Experimental module 1 is 问天. Kind of strange.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 04/24/2020 11:31 am
So the Mars mission is 天问 and the China Space Station Experimental module 1 is 问天. Kind of strange.

Indeed, in Chinese both would have approximately the same meaning....  :-\
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Huoxing-1 HX-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: Dalhousie on 04/24/2020 11:39 pm
Yup, and the name will be used for future Chinese planetary exploration missions as well.

So it will be a generic name like Pioneer,  Mariner, Zond, etc.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 04/25/2020 12:28 am
Insertion orbit looks kind of strange. After the insertion burn, it looks like it performs a 90° turn at apogee to go into a polar orbit.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: Hungry4info3 on 04/25/2020 12:32 am
Mars Express did something similar. Perhaps the approach trajectory is for delivering the lander to the target landing site.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 04/25/2020 12:49 am
Mars Express did something similar. Perhaps the approach trajectory is for delivering the lander to the target landing site.

Here's the story showing the Mars Express trajectory going from an equatorial orbit to a polar orbit.

https://spaceflightnow.com/mars/marsexpress/031230marsexpressorbit.html
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: FutureSpaceTourist on 04/26/2020 08:23 am
https://twitter.com/aj_fi/status/1254311385191907328

Quote
A 70-metre diameter parabolic antenna reflector was hoisted and installed in Tianjin on April 25, to support the Tianwen-1 Mars mission. The GRAS-4 project was carried out by the National Astronomical Observatories of China (NAOC).
https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/gRYtMYPaYTKVCzXeG477uA
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: FutureSpaceTourist on 04/27/2020 11:28 am
https://twitter.com/aj_fi/status/1254731594197340161

Quote
Footage of the hoisting of the 70-metre diameter parabolic antenna in Tianjin to support China's Tianwen-1 Mars mission. Footage: NAOC.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: PM3 on 04/29/2020 07:27 am
"NET July 23" is not a published launch date but just a guess: https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=5060.msg1969450#msg1969450. Should be changed to NET July or July-August 2020 in the thread title. I don't see any more precise published launch window.

The other two 2020 Mars missions have windows from 14 July to 3 August and from 17 July to 5 August.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: FutureSpaceTourist on 05/16/2020 07:25 am
https://twitter.com/aj_fi/status/1261550036107829248

Quote
Tianwen-1 Mars mission update: Cargo ships Yuanwang-21 & 22 have collected the Long March 5 rocket components from Tianjin & today set sail for Hainan. The Mars spacecraft arrived at Wenchang satellite launch centre on April 10.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: eeergo on 05/21/2020 06:18 pm
Sad news of a premature, ill-timed (if there's ever a proper time) death very much related to this mission:

https://twitter.com/AJ_FI/status/1263457389023571968
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: ZachS09 on 05/21/2020 08:27 pm
Does this mean a delay due to Weixing’s death?
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: Phil Stooke on 05/21/2020 08:35 pm
It's very unfortunate, but there is no reason for it to delay anything.  He was a scientist, nothing to do with the preparations for launch.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: baldusi on 05/22/2020 02:09 pm
Besides, this is a planetary mission that must hit the launch window. Delays are either none or 26 months.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: otter on 06/02/2020 01:23 pm
China to launch Mars probe between July, August

http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-06/02/c_139108416.htm
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: spacexplorer on 06/27/2020 10:48 am

The other two 2020 Mars missions have windows from 14 July to 3 August and from 17 July to 5 August.
After reading your message I did some search and I creasted a "Mars 2020 Summary Thread" :-)
https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=51343.msg2101542#msg2101542
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - NET July 23, 2020
Post by: starbase on 07/09/2020 06:24 pm
Liftoff targeted for ~4:00 UTC on July 23.

Quote
Confirmed Tianwen-1 launch date on 23rd July at noon. backup windows on 24th,25th. Now Tianwen-1 and LM-5Y4 status are green and preparation is smoothly.
https://twitter.com/LiuyiYiliu/status/1281271236497215488
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: newfrontiers on 07/10/2020 02:51 am
[zubenelgenubi: Attach files to the post.  Do not embed them.
Also, if you embed an image by linking to it, and the website later removes that image--it's gone.]

[zubenelgenubi: Who are these people?]
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: eeergo on 07/13/2020 11:34 am
https://twitter.com/AJ_FI/status/1282637146436894721
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: eeergo on 07/16/2020 04:38 pm
Excellent thread in Twitter by CosmicPenguin about Tianwen-1's instruments that I'm copying here:

https://twitter.com/Cosmic_Penguin/status/1283801101439873024

Quote
It seems that there hasn’t been any detailed specifications of the scientific instruments of the now-about-to-be-rolled-to-launch-pad of the Chinese Tianwen-1 Mars Orbiter and PRCMarsRover missions in English from anywhere I have seen - at least till now!
Thanks to cathirame I finally get a detailed specifications list that I have crudely translated into English! Bear in mind that my UG physics were bad and the Chinese scientific terms used are a little bit different from my familar translations so the translation is crude.
Source: LI Chunlai, LIU Jianjun, GENG Yan, CAO Jinbin, ZHANG Tielong, FANG Guangyou, YANG Jianfeng, SHU Rong, ZOU Yongliao, LIN Yangting, OUYANG Ziyuan. Scientific Objectives and Payload Configuration of China's First Mars Exploration Mission[J].
Journal of Deep Space Exploration, 2018, 5(5): 406-413. doi: 10.15982/j.issn.2095-7777.2018.05.002

Firstly, here are the specifications of the 7 instruments of the TW-1 Mars Orbiter:
1. Medium Resolution Camera
Imaging wavelength: Visible Light
Color: Standard RGB
Image Resolution: < 100 m at 400 km altitude
Image swath: >= 400 km at 400 km altitude
Pixel Resolution: >= 4096 x 3072

2. High Resolution Camera
Image resolution: < 2.5 m (< 0.5 m in certain regions) multi-color; < 10 m (< 2.0 m in certain regions) panchromatic
Image swath: >= 9 km at 265 km altitude

3. Mars orbiter sub-surface radar
Radar frequency: 10-20 & 30-50 MHz
Transmitter power: >= 100 W
Receiver power: <= -87 dBm
Maximum detection depth: ~100 m for Martian sub-surface soil (εr = 3.0~4.0); ~1000 m for Martian polar ice layers (εr = 3.0)
Depth resolution: ~ 1 m

4. Mars mineralogy spectrometer
Wavelength bands: Visible Light - NIR band 0.45~1.05 μm; NIR-MIR band 1.00~3.40 μm
Spectral resolution: < 10 nm for Visible Light - NIR band; < 12 nm for 1.0~2.0 μm; < 25 nm for 2.0~3.4 μm

5. Mars magnetometer
Measurement range: +- 2000 nT
Noise level <= 0.01 nT/√Hz
Resolution: <= 0.01 nT
Precision: 0.1 nT

6. Mars ions and neutral particles analyser
Limit of Detection of low energy ions:
Energy range: 5 eV ~ 25 keV
delta-E/E: 15%
Mass: 1~ 70 amu
delta-m/m: 25%
POV: 90° x 360°
Angular resolution: 11.2° x 22.5°
Time resolution: 8s
Limit of Detection of low energy neutral particles:
Energy range: 50 eV ~ 3 keV
delta-E/E: 100%
Mass: 1 ~ 32 amu
POV: 15° x 160°
Angular resolution: 10° x 25°
Time resolution: 4s

7. Mars energetic particles analyser
Limit of Detection:
Energy range: 0.1 ~ 12 MeV (Electrons) / 2 ~100 MeV (Protons) / 25 ~ 300 MeV (Alpha Particles/Heavy Ions)
delta-E/E: 15%
Flux: 0 ~ 10^5 cm^-2 s^-1
Atomic Number: 1 <= Z <= 26 (H - Fe)
delta-m/m: <=25% (Z <= 9, 25 ~ 300 MeV & 10 <= Z <= 26, 100 ~ 300 MeV); <=60% (10 <= Z <= 26, 25 ~ 100 MeV)
POV: 60°
Time resolution: 4s (Electrons, Protons, Alpha Particles); 60s (Heavy Ions)

And here comes the 6 instruments on the yet-to-be-named @PRCMarsRover which will get a name via a planned public naming contest:
A. Terrain Camera
Imaging wavelength: Visible Light
Color: Standard RGB
Nominal imaging distance: 0.5 m ~ ∞
Pixel Resolution: 2048 x 2048

B. Multi-spectral camera
Imaging bands (/nm, Full Width At Half Maximum in brackets): 480 (20), 525 (20), 650 (12), 700 (15), 800 (25), 900 (30), 950 (50), 1000 (50)
Color: Multi-spectral
Nominal imaging distance: 1.5 m ~ ∞
Pixel Resolution: 2048 x 2048

C. Rover sub-surface radar
Channel 1:
Median frequency: 55 MHz
Working bandwidth: 40 MHz
Penetrating depth of Martian ice layers: ~1 m
Maximum detection depth: >=10 m for Martian sub-surface soil (εr = 3.0~4.0); >=100 m for Martian polar ice layers (εr = 3.0)
Channel 2:
Median frequency: 1300 MHz
Working bandwidth: 1000 MHz
Precision of layer thickness detection: ~cm
Maximum detection depth: >=3 m for Martian sub-surface soil (εr = 3.0~4.0); >=10 m for Martian polar ice layers (εr = 3.0)

D. Mars surface composition analyser
LIBS measurements: Detects 10+ elements; optimal working distance from sample 2~5 m (max. 10 m); imaging resolution <= 100 μrad (0.2 mm @ 2 m; 0.5 mm @ 5 m)
NIR measurments (850~2400 nm): spectral resolution <=12 nm; 130+ bands; POV >=1 mrad

E. Mars surface magnetometer
Measurement range: +- 2000 nT
Noise level <= 0.01 nT/√Hz
Resolution: <= 0.01 nT
Stability: <= 0.01 nT/°C
Sampling rate: 1/16/32/128 Hz
Range: +- 65000 nT

F. Mars meteorology instrument
Temperature -120~50 °C (precision 0.1 °C); Pressure 1~1500 Pa (precision 0.1 Pa); Windspeed 0~70 m/s (precision 0.1 m/s); Wind Direction 0°~360° (precision 5°); Sound detection 20 Hz~2.5 kHz/2.5~20 kHz (Sensibility >50 mV/Pa; Dynamic Range >=90 dB)
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 07/17/2020 02:19 am
The LM-5 rocket is currently rolling out to the launch pad.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 07/17/2020 03:24 am
Arrival at the launch pad:
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 07/17/2020 04:16 am
Hmm.....does anyone know what kind of collaboration these 4 agencies have with CNSA specifically for this mission?  :-\

https://twitter.com/Cosmic_Penguin/status/1283978465062998016
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: limen4 on 07/17/2020 08:15 am
Hmm.....does anyone know what kind of collaboration these 4 agencies have with CNSA specifically for this mission?  :-\

https://twitter.com/Cosmic_Penguin/status/1283978465062998016

Concerning Austria: https://industriemagazin.at/a/technik-aus-oesterreich-soll-erstmals-auf-den-mars
The article do not refer explicitly to the TW-1 mission. But it is saying that a camera mast built by Ruag Space Austria will land onboard a rover on Mars in 2020. It seems that a similar mast is planned for the ESA ExoMars Rover.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: SciNews on 07/17/2020 09:53 am
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=83X6drywlzY
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Kryten on 07/17/2020 11:22 am
Concerning Austria: https://industriemagazin.at/a/technik-aus-oesterreich-soll-erstmals-auf-den-mars
The article do not refer explicitly to the TW-1 mission. But it is saying that a camera mast built by Ruag Space Austria will land onboard a rover on Mars in 2020. It seems that a similar mast is planned for the ESA ExoMars Rover.
That article is from before the Exomars rover was formally pushed to 2022.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: baldusi on 07/17/2020 04:31 pm
Hmm.....does anyone know what kind of collaboration these 4 agencies have with CNSA specifically for this mission?  :-\
One of China's Deep Space Telemetry Station is in Argentina under a CONAE agreement.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: TorenAltair on 07/18/2020 01:23 am
Regarding Austria: they built at least partially the magnetometer

https://www.iwf.oeaw.ac.at/forschung/weltraummissionen/zukuenftige-missionen/chinese-mars-mission/

English link https://www.iwf.oeaw.ac.at/en/research/space-missions/future-missions/tianwen-1/
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: ncb1397 on 07/18/2020 01:54 am
CNES was involved with the Laser Induced Breakdown Spectroscopy instrument on the rover. ESA's Estrack ground stations will provide telemetry/communications support.

Source:
https://spacenews.com/long-march-5-rolled-out-for-july-23-launch-of-chinas-tianwen-1-mars-mission/

That covers all the logos.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 07/20/2020 02:00 pm
According to one insider source (https://m.weibo.cn/detail/4528661934377588) don't expect any official live coverage of the launch.  :-X

Seeing that it's from Wenchang people will still be there to watch the launch nearby & maybe even stream it like the last few launches, but there's no promise how close people can get to or that streams won't disappear mysteriously.

Expect LM-5B test flight-like coverage in the best case, LM-7A test flight-like coverage in the worst scenario.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: shijiav on 07/20/2020 04:17 pm
Just saying all LM-5 series have live coverage both TV&INTERNET (5B is an internet stream only with the worst live coverage I have seen), 霸男 is unreliable this time around lol. Also, CCTV is broadcasting a lot of initial heating Mars videos all day, it`s really hard to believe no live stream at all...
So I believe the worst case is a 5B style live stream. Best is still a CCTV live stream. If it happens we could see the first 4K launch live stream? maybe.
On the bright side, they are saying 'still better than H2A' on Weibo they are complaining Mitsubishi playing an advertisement for like 40 mins and announcing the launch success.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Lars-J on 07/20/2020 06:23 pm
On the bright side, they are saying 'still better than H2A' on Weibo they are complaining Mitsubishi playing an advertisement for like 40 mins and announcing the launch success.

I guess they missed the H2A public announcement of launch time and actual live-stream of the launch? ???
Title: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Star One on 07/20/2020 06:34 pm
Short documentary from Seeker about what we know about the mission:

https://youtu.be/ArAyrWTivy4
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: zubenelgenubi on 07/20/2020 08:17 pm
Quote
Yuanwang 6 tracking ship left port today. This is expected to be to support the Tianwen-1 launch, though not stated (and interestingly will support missions will in the Pacific, Indian and Atlantic Oceans across one, 100+ day outing).
Where will the ship be located for the Tianwen-1 launch?  Somewhere down-range in the Pacific?
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: shijiav on 07/20/2020 10:44 pm
On the bright side, they are saying 'still better than H2A' on Weibo they are complaining Mitsubishi playing an advertisement for like 40 mins and announcing the launch success.

I guess they missed the H2A public announcement of launch time and actual live-stream of the launch? ???
I dunno, it seems Mitsubishi lived on Bilibli or Douyu but played Mitsubishi advertisement for 40 mins instead of the flight graph showing on youtube stream after lift-off.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: zubenelgenubi on 07/20/2020 11:14 pm
Moderator: Nipping this in the bud.  Not here.

If you want to discuss the quality/quantity of Hope launch coverage, do so in that launch thread--keeping to our forum community discussion standards.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 07/21/2020 08:00 am
Navigation warnings for ships of drop zones seems to have been issued, for 04:00 - 07:00 UTC on the 23rd.
No corresponding air space closure notices yet.

NAVAREA XI
NO.20-0271 Date:2020/07/21 04 UTC

SOUTH CHINA SEA, NORTHERN PART TO NORTH
PACIFIC, WEST CAROLINES.
ROCKET LAUNCHING. 230400Z TO 230700Z
JUL. AREAS BOUNDED BY
A. 15-46-36N 118-45-46E
16-13-20N 117-50-39E
16-37-26N 118-03-17E
16-10-39N 118-58-29E.
B. 10-54-15N 128-01-35E
11-33-41N 126-49-31E
11-57-16N 127-02-54E
11-17-47N 128-15-02E.
C. 01-04-39N 144-36-36E
02-11-51N 142-45-51E
02-34-55N 142-59-51E
01-27-42N 144-50-37E.
CANCEL THIS MSG 230800Z JUL.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 07/22/2020 04:50 am
A2824/20 - THE CHINA NATIONAL SPACE ADMINISTRATION HAS PLANNED A ROCKET
LAUNCH. DEBRIS FROM THIS LAUNCH WILL FALL WI AN AREA DEFINED AS
0104N/14436E TO 0211N/14245E TO 0234N/14259E TO 0127N/14450E TO
POINT OF ORIGIN. IN THE INTEREST OF SAFETY ALL NON-PARTICIPATING AIR
TRAFFIC ARE ADVISED TO AVOID THE NOTAMED AREA.  IFR AIRCRAFT UNDER
ATC JURISDICTION SHOULD ANTICIPATE CLEARANCE AROUND THE NOTAMED
AREA. SFC - UNL, 23 JUL 04:39 2020 UNTIL 23 JUL 05:26 2020. CREATED: 21 JUL
14:23 2020


Core stage drop zone air closure notice near Papua New Guiana - note that the T-0 window might be 10-15 minutes earlier depending on the launch sequence.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: zubenelgenubi on 07/22/2020 05:12 am
NOTMAR NAVAREA XI NO.20-0271, part C matches NOTAM A2824/20.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: newfrontiers on 07/22/2020 12:37 pm
full scale mockup
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: SciNews on 07/22/2020 05:01 pm
Tianwen-1 Rover and Lander
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=epyIMH52wNU
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: otter on 07/22/2020 05:13 pm
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: ChrisGebhardt on 07/22/2020 05:17 pm
https://twitter.com/ChrisG_NSF/status/1285986974365560834
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: zubenelgenubi on 07/22/2020 06:01 pm
Quote
Yuanwang 6 tracking ship left port today. This is expected to be to support the Tianwen-1 launch, though not stated (and interestingly will support missions will in the Pacific, Indian and Atlantic Oceans across one, 100+ day outing).
Where will the ship be located for the Tianwen-1 launch?  Somewhere down-range in the Pacific?
Follow-up: No position updates since leaving port. Destination: OPEN SEA.
https://www.vesselfinder.com/vessels/YUAN-WANG-6-IMO-9439527-MMSI-413326000
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: baldusi on 07/22/2020 06:53 pm
Navigation warnings for ships of drop zones seems to have been issued, for 04:00 - 07:00 UTC on the 23rd.
No corresponding air space closure notices yet.

NAVAREA XI
NO.20-0271 Date:2020/07/21 04 UTC

SOUTH CHINA SEA, NORTHERN PART TO NORTH
PACIFIC, WEST CAROLINES.
ROCKET LAUNCHING. 230400Z TO 230700Z
JUL. AREAS BOUNDED BY
A. 15-46-36N 118-45-46E
16-13-20N 117-50-39E
16-37-26N 118-03-17E
16-10-39N 118-58-29E.
B. 10-54-15N 128-01-35E
11-33-41N 126-49-31E
11-57-16N 127-02-54E
11-17-47N 128-15-02E.
C. 01-04-39N 144-36-36E
02-11-51N 142-45-51E
02-34-55N 142-59-51E
01-27-42N 144-50-37E.
CANCEL THIS MSG 230800Z JUL.

I'm getting a -27 launch azimuth. If I'm not tracing it wrong, they pass over Neuquén's 35m deep space TT&C station. It's interesting because it's on the opposite side of the the orbit.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: newfrontiers on 07/22/2020 10:03 pm
full scale mockup

lander and rover model
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: GELORD on 07/22/2020 10:49 pm
https://www.bilibili.com/blackboard/activity-1_PDJ6EkH.html
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: JimO on 07/22/2020 11:36 pm
Will any propulsive or fuel dump events be occurring over Argentina region? Depending on altitude, some might be sunlit and widely visible from the ground, I'm still checking.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Chris Bergin on 07/23/2020 12:31 am
Any sign of hope for a Chinese webcast with just a few hours to go?
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 07/23/2020 12:40 am
Any sign of hope for a Chinese webcast with just a few hours to go?

It looks likely there won't be an official one. It's still a bit too early in the day for spectators' ones to appear just yet, I'll continue to check.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Chris Bergin on 07/23/2020 01:01 am
Really looking like no webcast! :(


https://twitter.com/LiuyiYiliu/status/1286065074524676096
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 07/23/2020 01:33 am
https://twitter.com/Cosmic_Penguin/status/1286111037150736386

All service platforms at the pad have been rotated to the launch position.

T-0 seems to be 04:40 UTC.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 07/23/2020 02:13 am
https://twitter.com/Cosmic_Penguin/status/1286121831707979776
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: xixinan on 07/23/2020 02:27 am
Reporting live from beach across the launch site. It’s boiling hot. No wind. 33 degrees.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: xixinan on 07/23/2020 02:31 am
And I have no idea why the photo is sideway. Hope everyone have a good neck...
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 03:06 am
SFF page

http://www.spaceflightfans.cn/event/cz-5-yz-2_yh-2?instance_id=3501

9ifly thread.

http://9ifly.spacety.com/thread-93048-62-1.html
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 03:07 am
Link to livestream? Currently says "In line optimization, the live stream will be back immediately."

https://weibo.com/u/7302431001?refer_flag=1005055013_&is_hot=1
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 03:16 am
This livestream is working.

https://www.douyu.com/3106691
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 03:20 am
Here's another one.

https://live.ixigua.com/room/6852164409603656460/
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:00 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 03:21 am
T-1 hour 20 minutes.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 03:30 am
T-1 hour 10 minutes.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 07/23/2020 03:34 am
Looks like CCTV is streaming finally, at here: https://m.yangshipin.cn/video?type=2&vid=2004708501&pid=600042871&ptag=4_1.6.0.21266_wxf (https://m.yangshipin.cn/video?type=2&vid=2004708501&pid=600042871&ptag=4_1.6.0.21266_wxf)

Also this one is relaying a spectators' stream from the beach: https://youtu.be/gZMAj2aH37g
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 03:35 am
T-1 hour 5 minutes.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: airbus797 on 07/23/2020 03:38 am
Someone helped me find an awesome pad camera shot - now mirroring that to YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZMAj2aH37g
Original Source: https://www.douyu.com/9019378
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 03:40 am
T-1 hour. That puts launch at 4:40 UTC.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 03:45 am
T-55 minutes. Bit of venting from base of vehicle.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 03:50 am
T-50 minutes. Unfortunately, the source video stream has frozen.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 03:56 am
T-45 minutes. LC-123 has switched to the hotel room that is full of kids watching the launch. Open sky is the guy moving the camera around.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:00 am
T-40 minutes. LC-123 found another stream!
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:05 am
T-35 minutes. LC-123 has gone back to the original stream.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:10 am
T-30 minutes.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:15 am
T-25 minutes.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:20 am
T-20 minutes.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:25 am
T-15 minutes.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:30 am
T-10 minutes.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Sam Ho on 07/23/2020 04:31 am
From the stream, T-0 is 4:41:14 UTC.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:33 am
T-7 minutes.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:35 am
T-5 minutes.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:36 am
T-4 minutes.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:37 am
T-3 minutes. Only small vent at base now.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:38 am
T-2 minutes. Briefly lost the main streams.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:39 am
T-1 minute. No venting now.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:40 am
Stand by for lift-off!
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: otter on 07/23/2020 04:41 am
Launched
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:42 am
Liftoff!
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:43 am
T+1 minute.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: otter on 07/23/2020 04:43 am
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:44 am
T+2 minutes.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:44 am
T+3 minutes.

https://weibo.com/u/7302431001?refer_flag=1005055013_&is_hot=1
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Chris Bergin on 07/23/2020 04:44 am
https://twitter.com/NASASpaceflight/status/1286160315944783872
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:45 am
T+4 minutes.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:46 am
T+5 minutes.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:48 am
Launch replay.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:52 am
View from the beach. Great audio!
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: otter on 07/23/2020 04:52 am
12:41 local time

http://www.xinhuanet.com/tech/2020-07/23/c_1126275601.htm
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Liss on 07/23/2020 04:52 am
http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-07/23/c_139234251.htm
China launches first Mars mission
Source: Xinhua| 2020-07-23 12:43:56|Editor: huaxia
WENCHANG, Hainan, July 23 (Xinhua) -- China Thursday launched a Mars probe on a Long March-5 rocket from the Wenchang Spacecraft Launch Site on the coast of southern China's island province of Hainan. Enditem
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 04:54 am
Another view from the beach.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 05:03 am
http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-07/23/c_139234266.htm

"Photo taken on July 17, 2020 shows the Long March-5 rocket at the Wenchang Space Launch Center in south China's Hainan Province. The Long March-5 rocket, to be used to launch China's first Mars exploration mission, was vertically transported to the launching area at the Wenchang Space Launch Center in south China's Hainan Province on Friday. (Photo by Zhang Gaoxiang/Xinhua)"
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 07/23/2020 05:07 am
https://twitter.com/Cosmic_Penguin/status/1286164013219377152?s=19

SEI-2 should be about now.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 07/23/2020 05:13 am
https://twitter.com/Cosmic_Penguin/status/1286166899881938944?s=19

The 2nd burn of the second stage should be underway at this moment.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 05:18 am
Separation should be happening about now.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: otter on 07/23/2020 05:22 am
http://slide.tech.sina.com.cn/d/slide_5_453_136028.html
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Liss on 07/23/2020 05:24 am
Separation confirmed unofficially per 9ifly.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 05:29 am
Here's the 9ifly reference.

http://9ifly.spacety.com/forum.php?mod=redirect&goto=findpost&ptid=93048&pid=755228

"The arrow is separated."
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: otter on 07/23/2020 05:32 am
Launch video from CCTV

https://tv.cctv.com/2020/07/23/VIDESz4dkGT7SeXYeFXzrb3g200723.shtml
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 05:34 am
Event times. I've added minutes:seconds in round brackets.

http://9ifly.spacety.com/forum.php?mod=redirect&goto=findpost&ptid=93048&pid=755234

"The flight timing is as follows:
The booster is separated for 175 seconds (2:55).
Throw the rectifier for 362 seconds (6:02).
A second-stage separation of 492 seconds (8:12).
A second shutdown for 702 seconds (11:42).
Second secondary ignition for 1165 seconds (19:25).
Second secondary shutdown 2010 seconds (33:30).
This device propulsion shutdown 2107 (35:07).
The arrow separates 2177 (36:17)."
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Liss on 07/23/2020 05:37 am
http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-07/23/c_139234396.htm

FLASH: CHINA SUCCESSFULLY LAUNCHES FIRST MARS MISSION
Source: Xinhua | 2020-07-23 13:27:24 | Editor: huaxia

FLASH: CHINA SUCCESSFULLY LAUNCHES FIRST MARS MISSION
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: otter on 07/23/2020 05:40 am
http://www.xinhuanet.com/tech/2020-07/23/c_1126275764.htm

Quote
飞行2000多秒后,成功将探测器送入预定轨道,开启火星探测之旅,迈出了我国自主开展行星探测的第一步。

Google translate:
After flying for more than 2,000 seconds, the probe was successfully sent into a predetermined orbit and started a journey to explore Mars, taking the first step in our country's autonomous planetary exploration.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 05:41 am
Grabs from the above video.

Congratulations to China for the successful launch! Two down, one more to go.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: otter on 07/23/2020 05:42 am
China successfully launches first Mars mission

http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-07/23/c_139234449.htm
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 05:43 am
http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-07/23/c_139234449.htm

China successfully launches first Mars mission
Source: Xinhua| 2020-07-23 13:37:04|Editor: huaxia

WENCHANG, Hainan, July 23 (Xinhua) -- China launched a Mars probe on Thursday, aiming to complete orbiting, landing and roving in one mission, and taking the first step in its planetary exploration of the solar system.

A Long March-5 rocket, China's largest launch vehicle, carrying the spacecraft with a mass of about 5 tonnes, soared into the sky from the Wenchang Spacecraft Launch Site on the coast of southern China's island province of Hainan at 12:41 p.m. (Beijing Time).

About 36 minutes later, the spacecraft, including an orbiter and a rover, was sent into the Earth-Mars transfer orbit, embarking on an almost seven-month journey to the red planet, according to the China National Space Administration (CNSA).

China's first Mars mission is named Tianwen-1, which means Questions to Heaven and comes from a poem written by Qu Yuan (about 340-278 BC), one of the greatest poets of ancient China. The name signifies the Chinese nation's perseverance in pursuing truth and science and exploring nature and the universe, said the CNSA. Enditem
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (~04:40 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 05:48 am
http://www.xinhuanet.com/tech/2020-07/23/c_1126275764.htm

" "The scientific objectives of this Mars exploration mission are to achieve research on the appearance and geological structure of Mars, soil features and water ice distributions on the surface of Mars, the composition of material on the surface of Mars, the ionosphere and surface climate and environment characteristics of the Martian atmosphere, and the physical and internal structure of Mars." Liu said.

As an open scientific exploration platform, China's Mars exploration, including universities in Hong Kong and Macao, including the national multi-regional research institutions actively participate in the development process, and ESA, France, Austria, Argentina and other organizations and countries carried out a number of cooperation.

The Mars exploration mission was approved by the CPC Central Committee and the State Council in January 2016 and organized by the National Space Administration, and consists of five systems, including the overall project and the probe, launch vehicle, launch site, measurement and control, and ground applications.

The National Space Administration's Lunar Exploration and Space Engineering Center is the overall unit of the project, the China Launch Vehicle Technology Research Institute, which is part of China Aerospace Science and Technology Group Co., Ltd., has developed the launch vehicle system, and the China Space Technology Research Institute and Shanghai Aerospace Technology Research Institute, which belong to China Aerospace Science and Technology Group Co., Ltd., have taken the overall development of the detector system. The Ministry of Satellite Launch Measurement and Control System satins is responsible for organizing and implementing launch, measurement and control. The National Observatory of the Chinese Academy of Sciences has developed a ground application system, which is responsible for the reception, processing and storage management of scientific data."
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/23/2020 06:03 am
Two other launch photos.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: otter on 07/23/2020 06:29 am
http://www.mod.gov.cn/big5/photos/2020-07/23/content_4868565.htm
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: FutureSpaceTourist on 07/23/2020 06:32 am
https://twitter.com/jimbridenstine/status/1286177196491575297

Quote
With today’s launch, China is on its way to join the community of international scientific explorers at Mars. The United States, Europe, Russia, India, and soon the UAE will welcome you to Mars to embark on an exciting year of scientific discovery. Safe travels Tianwen-1!
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: TorenAltair on 07/23/2020 06:42 am
Bridenstine at least partly forgot Japan (Nozomi flyby). Anyway great that the launch was successful.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Satori on 07/23/2020 07:18 am
Launch time 0441:15.167UTC
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Alter Sachse on 07/23/2020 07:27 am
and here...
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: SciNews on 07/23/2020 07:42 am
Launch and separation
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LC9CDUK660c
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: FutureSpaceTourist on 07/23/2020 09:20 am
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1286209410130485248

Quote
Impressive Tianwen-1 Mars rover mission launched by China today space.com/amp/china-tian…
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Star One on 07/23/2020 02:59 pm
I don’t think this launch picture has been posted in this format in this thread.

https://twitter.com/planet4589/status/1286178109323182080
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: shijiav on 07/23/2020 03:47 pm
korolev cross and
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: otter on 07/23/2020 03:56 pm
https://twitter.com/Dr_ThomasZ/status/1286261118634283008
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: mlindner on 07/23/2020 06:02 pm
Good luck to China, but I hope they're more open than they were with the Moon missions. Those missions were an example of how to be incredibly secretive despite being a science mission. Release the data live, don't filter it through several government agencies (and don't make false absurd claims like finding gelatin/jelly on the moon).
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: shijiav on 07/23/2020 06:26 pm
Good luck to China, but I hope they're more open than they were with the Moon missions. Those missions were an example of how to be incredibly secretive despite being a science mission. Release the data live, don't filter it through several government agencies (and don't make false absurd claims like finding gelatin/jelly on the moon).
That`s their style and I don`t think it would change any time soon. Just adapt to it. Also, they were saying "gelatin/jelly-like soil on the moon" not straight "gelatin/jelly"
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: zubenelgenubi on 07/23/2020 07:33 pm
Good luck to China, but I hope they're more open than they were with the Moon missions. <snip>
Noted.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: luhai167 on 07/23/2020 08:48 pm
Looks like despite the failure of 2011 mission and rejection/cancellation of the 2015 mission, China did kept to the initial 2003 prediction of launching a rover in 2020. The second article on Beidou-1 gyroscopes just shows how far China has come along since then. Let's see how it will turn out as it rolled first two steps together in the usual three step strategy.

(https://i.imgur.com/YVgctF4.jpg)
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Lars-J on 07/23/2020 08:50 pm
A very nice launch, congratulations! :)

I only wish their government had enough faith in their engineers to live-stream the fruits of their labor.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Phil Stooke on 07/23/2020 09:05 pm
"Good luck to China, but I hope they're more open than they were with the Moon missions."

Curious.  I had been saying the opposite elsewhere.  I am impressed with the openness of China, with announcements and a few images every lunar day, as well as a drive diary with interesting additional details every month, and full data release after a year.  I think that's as much as we non-Chinese taxpayers have any right to expect, and I contrast it with, for instance, Chandrayaan 2.  Remember Chandrayaan 2?  We get a data release in the fall, but nothing at all on a regular basis.  And will Russia be any better with Luna 25?  And it really remains to be seen how private entities will behave as CLPS and other programs proceed at the Moon.  Some might be open, others highly secretive.  We are spoiled by NASA but China is doing OK.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: sanman on 07/24/2020 02:03 am
Sure, a lot of the bloom went off the Chandrayaan2 mission because of the landing failure, and that may have resulted in the information outflow becoming more reserved. Perhaps the information flow may pick up again, if a Chandrayaan3 succeeds. I hope that Tianwen-1's very ambitious mission fully meets all its objectives, so that similar curtailment of information isn't seen there. It seems to speak to the confidence of the mission planners, that they're aiming for so many incredible feats on their first Mars outing. If successful, China will have achieved a major leap forward in its Mars capabilities, and nearly closed the gap with the US in one fell swoop. Is there going to be any live telecast of the landing?
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: mlindner on 07/24/2020 04:31 am
"Good luck to China, but I hope they're more open than they were with the Moon missions."

Curious.  I had been saying the opposite elsewhere.  I am impressed with the openness of China, with announcements and a few images every lunar day, as well as a drive diary with interesting additional details every month, and full data release after a year.  I think that's as much as we non-Chinese taxpayers have any right to expect, and I contrast it with, for instance, Chandrayaan 2.  Remember Chandrayaan 2?  We get a data release in the fall, but nothing at all on a regular basis.  And will Russia be any better with Luna 25?  And it really remains to be seen how private entities will behave as CLPS and other programs proceed at the Moon.  Some might be open, others highly secretive.  We are spoiled by NASA but China is doing OK.

That's nothing that I remember. I remember them putting out a press release every few weeks with scant details and a single image. No images every day and no drive log.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Phil Stooke on 07/24/2020 04:51 am
You have missed them.  They are out there.  I usually post on this topic in Unmannedspaceflight rather than here. 
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: plutogno on 07/24/2020 05:36 am
also, while it's true that NASA Mars rovers release their images in real time (and in jpg format, I would hardly call them "data"), other missions don't. see for ex. OSIRIS-REx
Title: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Star One on 07/24/2020 08:32 am
You have missed them.  They are out there.  I usually post on this topic in Unmannedspaceflight rather than here.

Well in that case it is not surprising that the OP drew that conclusion being as that is hardly a mainstream site even amongst spaceflight followers. Nor to my mind is it that user friendly being as it doesn’t even reformat for mobile devices, something most sites manage these days.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Svetoslav on 07/24/2020 09:36 am
also, while it's true that NASA Mars rovers release their images in real time (and in jpg format, I would hardly call them "data"), other missions don't. see for ex. OSIRIS-REx

As a person who actually worked with Osiris-Rex data as part of the Cosmoquest Mapping Project, I tend to disagree slightly. When the citizen science initiative was opened, there was a whole lot of imaging data. You only had to register. I personally mapped more than 250 photos :)

But if you mean photos that get published on the web as soon as they're taken, then yes. Most orbiters don't publish their photos in real time anyway. Surface missions, that's another cup of beer :)
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: tehwkd on 07/24/2020 11:43 am
3 screens from an image i saw on weibo.

1st is Spacecraft's separation point parameters

The best I can make out, these should be the values and h/t to penguin for row name translations

1) Time(s) 2169.956   -8.002   2177.958
2) Longitude -126.493   -0.906   -125.587
3) Latitude -29.617   -0.009   -29.608
4) Altitude(km) 478.986   -21.212   500.198
5) Absolute Velocity (m/s) 11327.320   15.926   11311.394
6) Absolute Velocity Inclination() 12.044   -0.414   12.458

Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: libra on 07/24/2020 04:49 pm
I know Utopia Planitia is a very big place, but I can't resist asking - do we have any clue how far will Tianwen land (or crash) from the long dead Viking 2 ?  ;)
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Phil Stooke on 07/24/2020 05:03 pm
Yes.  About 1000 km south near latitude 25 degrees. 
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: shijiav on 07/24/2020 06:27 pm
"Good luck to China, but I hope they're more open than they were with the Moon missions."

Curious.  I had been saying the opposite elsewhere.  I am impressed with the openness of China, with announcements and a few images every lunar day, as well as a drive diary with interesting additional details every month, and full data release after a year.  I think that's as much as we non-Chinese taxpayers have any right to expect, and I contrast it with, for instance, Chandrayaan 2.  Remember Chandrayaan 2?  We get a data release in the fall, but nothing at all on a regular basis.  And will Russia be any better with Luna 25?  And it really remains to be seen how private entities will behave as CLPS and other programs proceed at the Moon.  Some might be open, others highly secretive.  We are spoiled by NASA but China is doing OK.

That's nothing that I remember. I remember them putting out a press release every few weeks with scant details and a single image. No images every day and no drive log.
http://moon.bao.ac.cn/
All the photos and data from CLEP program can be found here.
I guess all you have to do is learn Chinese better. But most people won`t.
Their (CNSA) main focus is 1.4billion Chinese people who is speaking Chinese mostly. Don`t expect they doing same thing as NASA posting on mostly-English-users-twitter like "whoa our new probe data&photo could be found here, take a look."
No, that`s never gonna happen.
Even tianwen-1 no official live stream is getting a huge amount of complaint in Chinese space fans, they seem not to care about that much. There should be another huge probe CE5 in November, I doubt no live stream for that as well. But who knows...
 
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: newfrontiers on 07/25/2020 12:06 am
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: jcm on 07/25/2020 12:46 am
3 screens from an image i saw on weibo.

1st is Spacecraft's separation point parameters

The best I can make out, these should be the values and h/t to penguin for row name translations

1) Time(s) 2169.956   -8.002   2177.958
2) Longitude -126.493   -0.906   -125.587
3) Latitude -29.617   -0.009   -29.608
4) Altitude(km) 478.986   -21.212   500.198
5) Absolute Velocity (m/s) 11327.320   15.926   11311.394
6) Absolute Velocity Inclination() 12.044   -0.414   12.458



This is fantastic, thanks!
(Too bad they don't include azimuth - one number short of a full state vector...)
Implies C3 = 12.05 km2/s2
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 07/25/2020 01:32 am
3 screens from an image i saw on weibo.

1st is Spacecraft's separation point parameters

The best I can make out, these should be the values and h/t to penguin for row name translations

1) Time(s) 2169.956   -8.002   2177.958
2) Longitude -126.493   -0.906   -125.587
3) Latitude -29.617   -0.009   -29.608
4) Altitude(km) 478.986   -21.212   500.198
5) Absolute Velocity (m/s) 11327.320   15.926   11311.394
6) Absolute Velocity Inclination() 12.044   -0.414   12.458



This is fantastic, thanks!
(Too bad they don't include azimuth - one number short of a full state vector...)
Implies C3 = 12.05 km2/s2

Note that the 3 columns are actual figures, differences and theoretical values.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: thirtyone on 07/25/2020 01:41 am
Yeah, don't ever underestimate how biased most of us are in terms of searching for information because of language and cultural barriers. Even in technical fields it's often the case that if you don't know the correct jargon, you'll often think some information isn't available simply because you're searching for the wrong word. I've run into this problem before looking for things in China - don't forget that there's more native Chinese speakers than any other language in the world, and a lot of Chinese sites just don't bother translating because, well, it's a lot of work to translate everything. I'm pretty sure almost no one has Google as their homepage in China, for example, and I'd bet there are links to articles with oodles of information on half the native Chinese news sites in China.

With that said I still have no idea where to look for some of these press releases on Chinese launches. It'd be a great service if someone could cross-post more of these daily updates. I don't think it's fair to blame anyone for not making it available in English; I mean, really, the target audience is probably the Chinese domestic market anyway.

Just a reminder of how disconnected things are - remember, no one in China really thinks of this launch as "Tianwen-1." That's just the English transliteration of the native name of the launch, and that sequence of characters will never show up on 99.9% of Chinese social media postings, articles, etc. I'd actually suggest copy-pasting the actual Chinese name into first posts for foreign launches, because it helps people search for a lot more results, pictures, videos, and information. In this case it's "天问一号 (https://www.google.com/search?q=%E5%A4%A9%E9%97%AE%E4%B8%80%E5%8F%B7&source=lmns&tbm=vid)" (correct me if I'm wrong, but I saw a lot of results from that). Actually, a recommendation for an article in this forum section - a "glossary" of Chinese technical rocketry terms could help people find more technical information about launchers (e.g. "booster," "engine," "hydrazine," "specific impulse," etc.) My understanding is that the the Chinese government made a push to come up with native Chinese words for many technical concepts to sort of make everything their own, so it's pretty difficult to figure out what all these are.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: jcm on 07/25/2020 01:57 am
Yeah, don't ever underestimate how biased most of us are in terms of searching for information because of language and cultural barriers. Even in technical fields it's often the case that if you don't know the correct jargon, you'll often think some information isn't available simply because you're searching for the wrong word. I've run into this problem before looking for things in China - don't forget that there's more native Chinese speakers than any other language in the world, and a lot of Chinese sites just don't bother translating because, well, it's a lot of work to translate everything. I'm pretty sure almost no one has Google as their homepage in China, for example, and I'd bet there are links to articles with oodles of information on half the native Chinese news sites in China.

With that said I still have no idea where to look for some of these press releases on Chinese launches. It'd be a great service if someone could cross-post more of these daily updates. I don't think it's fair to blame anyone for not making it available in English; I mean, really, the target audience is probably the Chinese domestic market anyway.

Just a reminder of how disconnected things are - remember, no one in China really thinks of this launch as "Tianwen-1." That's just the English transliteration of the native name of the launch, and that sequence of characters will never show up on 99.9% of Chinese social media postings, articles, etc. I'd actually suggest copy-pasting the actual Chinese name into first posts for foreign launches, because it helps people search for a lot more results, pictures, videos, and information. In this case it's "天问一号 (https://www.google.com/search?q=%E5%A4%A9%E9%97%AE%E4%B8%80%E5%8F%B7&source=lmns&tbm=vid)" (correct me if I'm wrong, but I saw a lot of results from that). Actually, a recommendation for an article in this forum section - a "glossary" of Chinese technical rocketry terms could help people find more technical information about launchers (e.g. "booster," "engine," "hydrazine," "specific impulse," etc.) My understanding is that the the Chinese government made a push to come up with native Chinese words for many technical concepts to sort of make everything their own, so it's pretty difficult to figure out what all these are.


Yes, that's one reason I've started including the name in Chinese characters in my twitter posts about space launches.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: shijiav on 07/25/2020 02:23 am
Yeah, don't ever underestimate how biased most of us are in terms of searching for information because of language and cultural barriers. Even in technical fields it's often the case that if you don't know the correct jargon, you'll often think some information isn't available simply because you're searching for the wrong word. I've run into this problem before looking for things in China - don't forget that there's more native Chinese speakers than any other language in the world, and a lot of Chinese sites just don't bother translating because, well, it's a lot of work to translate everything. I'm pretty sure almost no one has Google as their homepage in China, for example, and I'd bet there are links to articles with oodles of information on half the native Chinese news sites in China.

With that said I still have no idea where to look for some of these press releases on Chinese launches. It'd be a great service if someone could cross-post more of these daily updates. I don't think it's fair to blame anyone for not making it available in English; I mean, really, the target audience is probably the Chinese domestic market anyway.

Just a reminder of how disconnected things are - remember, no one in China really thinks of this launch as "Tianwen-1." That's just the English transliteration of the native name of the launch, and that sequence of characters will never show up on 99.9% of Chinese social media postings, articles, etc. I'd actually suggest copy-pasting the actual Chinese name into first posts for foreign launches, because it helps people search for a lot more results, pictures, videos, and information. In this case it's "天问一号 (https://www.google.com/search?q=%E5%A4%A9%E9%97%AE%E4%B8%80%E5%8F%B7&source=lmns&tbm=vid)" (correct me if I'm wrong, but I saw a lot of results from that). Actually, a recommendation for an article in this forum section - a "glossary" of Chinese technical rocketry terms could help people find more technical information about launchers (e.g. "booster," "engine," "hydrazine," "specific impulse," etc.) My understanding is that the the Chinese government made a push to come up with native Chinese words for many technical concepts to sort of make everything their own, so it's pretty difficult to figure out what all these are.
you can just use google translation
go to 9ifly
it should work most of the time
Title: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Lars-J on 07/25/2020 04:08 am
Yeah, don't ever underestimate how biased most of us are in terms of searching for information because of language and cultural barriers. Even in technical fields it's often the case that if you don't know the correct jargon, you'll often think some information isn't available simply because you're searching for the wrong word. I've run into this problem before looking for things in China - don't forget that there's more native Chinese speakers than any other language in the world, and a lot of Chinese sites just don't bother translating because, well, it's a lot of work to translate everything. I'm pretty sure almost no one has Google as their homepage in China, for example, and I'd bet there are links to articles with oodles of information on half the native Chinese news sites in China.

With that said I still have no idea where to look for some of these press releases on Chinese launches. It'd be a great service if someone could cross-post more of these daily updates. I don't think it's fair to blame anyone for not making it available in English; I mean, really, the target audience is probably the Chinese domestic market anyway.

Just a reminder of how disconnected things are - remember, no one in China really thinks of this launch as "Tianwen-1." That's just the English transliteration of the native name of the launch, and that sequence of characters will never show up on 99.9% of Chinese social media postings, articles, etc. I'd actually suggest copy-pasting the actual Chinese name into first posts for foreign launches, because it helps people search for a lot more results, pictures, videos, and information. In this case it's " (https://www.google.com/search?q=%E5%A4%A9%E9%97%AE%E4%B8%80%E5%8F%B7&amp;source=lmns&amp;tbm=vid)" (correct me if I'm wrong, but I saw a lot of results from that). Actually, a recommendation for an article in this forum section - a "glossary" of Chinese technical rocketry terms could help people find more technical information about launchers (e.g. "booster," "engine," "hydrazine," "specific impulse," etc.) My understanding is that the the Chinese government made a push to come up with native Chinese words for many technical concepts to sort of make everything their own, so it's pretty difficult to figure out what all these are.
you can just use google translation
go to 9ifly
it should work most of the time
Right. While there is a language barrier, most of it can be eliminated with Google translate. (I read 9ifly as well)

BUT it still does not mean that any of us should pretend that “the information is out there but it just is in Chinese” (@thirtyone did not say this exactly but essentially argued it) ... that just isn’t true. The Chinese space enthusiasts are just as much in the dark as we are on most things about the Chinese space efforts.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: shijiav on 07/25/2020 05:50 am
Yeah, don't ever underestimate how biased most of us are in terms of searching for information because of language and cultural barriers. Even in technical fields it's often the case that if you don't know the correct jargon, you'll often think some information isn't available simply because you're searching for the wrong word. I've run into this problem before looking for things in China - don't forget that there's more native Chinese speakers than any other language in the world, and a lot of Chinese sites just don't bother translating because, well, it's a lot of work to translate everything. I'm pretty sure almost no one has Google as their homepage in China, for example, and I'd bet there are links to articles with oodles of information on half the native Chinese news sites in China.

With that said I still have no idea where to look for some of these press releases on Chinese launches. It'd be a great service if someone could cross-post more of these daily updates. I don't think it's fair to blame anyone for not making it available in English; I mean, really, the target audience is probably the Chinese domestic market anyway.

Just a reminder of how disconnected things are - remember, no one in China really thinks of this launch as "Tianwen-1." That's just the English transliteration of the native name of the launch, and that sequence of characters will never show up on 99.9% of Chinese social media postings, articles, etc. I'd actually suggest copy-pasting the actual Chinese name into first posts for foreign launches, because it helps people search for a lot more results, pictures, videos, and information. In this case it's "" (correct me if I'm wrong, but I saw a lot of results from that). Actually, a recommendation for an article in this forum section - a "glossary" of Chinese technical rocketry terms could help people find more technical information about launchers (e.g. "booster," "engine," "hydrazine," "specific impulse," etc.) My understanding is that the the Chinese government made a push to come up with native Chinese words for many technical concepts to sort of make everything their own, so it's pretty difficult to figure out what all these are.
you can just use google translation
go to 9ifly
it should work most of the time
Right. While there is a language barrier, most of it can be eliminated with Google translate. (I read 9ifly as well)

BUT it still does not mean that any of us should pretend that “the information is out there but it just is in Chinese” (@thirtyone did not say this exactly but essentially argued it) ... that just isn’t true. The Chinese space enthusiasts are just as much in the dark as we are on most things about the Chinese space efforts.
Ofc they were no way near NASA`s transparency policy. But my point is some of the information is truly there but you will have to dig very deep into it, this needs, of course, fluent Chinese. For example, there was paper in the Chinese paper database talking about how they build YF-220 or other stuff.
If someone really likes to go over all these papers, they truly were real space enthusiasts, but really there were not that many people I believe. There were more threads/replies in 9ifly than NASA spaceflight, but in reality, it`s just because there were 1.4 billion Chinese people.
About launch live stream stuff, as I assume most people in China would just like to hear news about success or fail, most people were not real space enthusiasts, so...they won`t pay much attention to promote those kinds of space stuff. In fact, they do not need to promote because 1.4billion people will have space talents in the end. Also, one other really important thing is they really afraid of failure, you gotta know for Chinese people The face is more important than anything.
The public opinion environment in China is relatively complicated with all kinds of pussy stuff. Take the no live stream tianwen-1 as an example, is like, before the launch, two parties one pro-livestream the other pro-nolivestream fighting each other with words all day long, do remember those were just inside the space enthusiasts. This still goes on after the successful launch and already rise to personal attack all day.
No live stream for tianwen-1 is a pitty, but it`s a bit strange considering there were CCTV 4k live stream vehicles already in wenchang at the beginning of July, after the beidou launch, CCTV also claim tianwen-1 live stream would be as good as beidou`s. But suddenly three days before launch, it seems all the live stream got canceled, during the launch they even block the personal Livestream. Some conjecture it`s related to the south China sea stuff, there might be USA reconnaissance aircraft around Hainan island during the launch. but who knows...Let`s hope all the tension would be gone and we would have a great CE5 live stream(good news is that the launch date is nov.24th).
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: luhai167 on 07/25/2020 07:52 am
You have missed them.  They are out there.  I usually post on this topic in Unmannedspaceflight rather than here.

Well in that case it is not surprising that the OP drew that conclusion being as that is hardly a mainstream site even amongst spaceflight followers. Nor to my mind is it that user friendly being as it doesn’t even reformat for mobile devices, something most sites manage these days.
Most English language outside mainstream media are done by volunteers, as official and unofficial Chinese release are almost always at Chinese sites in the Chinese language. Most of so called secrecy is really just a problem of language barrier. Plus Chinese forums are generally high on the speculation side, if official release is 1 2 3, the online forums will go the extra mile with leaks and rumors about 4 5 6. When in fact 4 is not a sure thing yet, there are multiple proposals on 5 and the nobody actually knows what 6 would look like...

Also while 9ifly is good and professional, it's actually not that active. WeChat and Weibo account generally will give more up to date information, but with that you will get bombarded with much more rumors or just useless information. (For example, most of CALT's official posts are not about space or rocket, but about meeting held, festivals and other new items. Such as recent floods and why satellites are good and helpful)
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: plutogno on 07/25/2020 09:18 am
this remembers me of when I had a personal site in the early 2000s and I decided to go beyond the few information published by press agencies on the just-approved Chang'E lunar exploration program.
what I discovered was that a wealth of information was available in the form of technical papers in English or more often in Chinese. Online translator (anyone remembers Altavista's Babel Fish?) back then gave often unreadable results, but still allowed me to get some ideas (some correct, others not so correct...) of what was cooking in China. apparently my work was even mentioned in a session of the US Congress  ;D
I even found a few papers published in the 1960s. As far as I know no lunar exploration study has ever been acknowledged to have been carried out.
the site is still available on the Internet Archive
https://web.archive.org/web/20090902035119/http://utenti.lycos.it/paoloulivi/chinamoo.html
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: ntk0701 on 07/25/2020 09:22 am
About launch live stream stuff, as I assume most people in China would just like to hear news about success or fail, most people were not real space enthusiasts, so...they won`t pay much attention to promote those kinds of space stuff. In fact, they do not need to promote because 1.4billion people will have space talents in the end. Also, one other really important thing is they really afraid of failure, you gotta know for Chinese people The face is more important than anything.
The problem with live streams, though, is that things really weren't this way a decade or two ago. While regular launches weren't usually live streamed either, all Shenzhou crewed missions were (up to Shenzhou 11 in October 2016), including launches, dockings, a space walk, and reentries. I'd argue that the potential of losing a crewed mission is a far greater risk & loss of face than losing your first Mars probe during launch, and yet the former missions were live streamed while the latter wasn't. This shift occurred rather abruptly following the failure of CZ-5 Y2 in July 2017 (while some later missions, notably CZ-5 Y3, were still live streamed, there have been far fewer), and I wholeheartedly hope that, with CZ-5 finally starting to mature and prove its reliability, we can get more live-streamed missions again in the future. Especially the crewed CSS missions.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: newfrontiers on 07/25/2020 09:41 am
forgive me for the grainy screenshot. But this is what Tianwen-1 rover really looks like.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: newfrontiers on 07/25/2020 11:02 am
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: shijiav on 07/25/2020 06:08 pm
About launch live stream stuff, as I assume most people in China would just like to hear news about success or fail, most people were not real space enthusiasts, so...they won`t pay much attention to promote those kinds of space stuff. In fact, they do not need to promote because 1.4billion people will have space talents in the end. Also, one other really important thing is they really afraid of failure, you gotta know for Chinese people The face is more important than anything.
The problem with live streams, though, is that things really weren't this way a decade or two ago. While regular launches weren't usually live streamed either, all Shenzhou crewed missions were (up to Shenzhou 11 in October 2016), including launches, dockings, a space walk, and reentries. I'd argue that the potential of losing a crewed mission is a far greater risk & loss of face than losing your first Mars probe during launch, and yet the former missions were live streamed while the latter wasn't. This shift occurred rather abruptly following the failure of CZ-5 Y2 in July 2017 (while some later missions, notably CZ-5 Y3, were still live streamed, there have been far fewer), and I wholeheartedly hope that, with CZ-5 finally starting to mature and prove its reliability, we can get more live-streamed missions again in the future. Especially the crewed CSS missions.
maybe it`s just because LM-5 is not that mature, you got the point.
But crewed CSS mission mostly would go on CZ2F, so maybe the live stream would continue as normal I would say..
The strange thing about tianwen-1 launch is pretty obvious since LM5 Y3 is more dangerous than this Y4 mission, and Y3 still got livestreamed, and all the evidence before launch lead us to believe there will be a great livestream for the Y4 launch but it suddenly got canceled 3 days before the launch. Which is super wired and we will not know why it got canceled, all we can do is just hope we have a great CE5 launch livestream.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: ntk0701 on 07/25/2020 09:44 pm
maybe it`s just because LM-5 is not that mature, you got the point.
But crewed CSS mission mostly would go on CZ2F, so maybe the live stream would continue as normal I would say..
The strange thing about tianwen-1 launch is pretty obvious since LM5 Y3 is more dangerous than this Y4 mission, and Y3 still got livestreamed, and all the evidence before launch lead us to believe there will be a great livestream for the Y4 launch but it suddenly got canceled 3 days before the launch. Which is super wired and we will not know why it got canceled, all we can do is just hope we have a great CE5 launch livestream.
Indeed, part of the reason why Shenzhou missions were live-streamed was probably due to CZ-2F's reliability, and it would be a disappointment of tremendous proportions if even they stop being live-streamed in the future. Here's hoping that we'll get as many live streams as possible for future high-profile missions, starting with CE-5 this November of course.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: edkyle99 on 07/25/2020 10:54 pm
Of what are they afraid?  We all know rockets fail, including the most reliable rockets, and from every country.  Show it on a 20 second delay if you are afraid of actually showing a failure.  It's not that hard.  Rocket Lab didn't shirk.  Roskosmos showed a Soyuz launch failure live while a U.S. astronaut was on board.  NASA showed its failures on NASA TV, Arianespace too on its stream.  Kudos to them all. 

 - Ed Kyle
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Zed_Noir on 07/26/2020 01:25 am
Of what are they afraid?  We all know rockets fail, including the most reliable rockets, and from every country.  Show it on a 20 second delay if you are afraid of actually showing a failure.  It's not that hard.  Rocket Lab didn't shirk.  Roskosmos showed a Soyuz launch failure live while a U.S. astronaut was on board.  NASA showed its failures on NASA TV, Arianespace too on its stream.  Kudos to them all. 

 - Ed Kyle

My guess is that someone on the political side, not the launch and mission side. Have some last minute case of the nerves and not a good understanding that once you launch other people will tracked the flight from the pad to orbit. You can't hide a launch failure by not broadcasting.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: shijiav on 07/26/2020 01:46 am
Of what are they afraid?  We all know rockets fail, including the most reliable rockets, and from every country.  Show it on a 20 second delay if you are afraid of actually showing a failure.  It's not that hard.  Rocket Lab didn't shirk.  Roskosmos showed a Soyuz launch failure live while a U.S. astronaut was on board.  NASA showed its failures on NASA TV, Arianespace too on its stream.  Kudos to them all. 

 - Ed Kyle
As I said this tianwen mission might not be the "afraid-of-failure" stuff. You can imagine everything happening towards a great live stream suddenly got everything canceled (even personal live stream got blocked during the launch) 3 days before launch. If it`s really "afraid-of-failure" they won`t even bring those live stream vehicles at the beginning of July. There must something changed. But what is it...we will never know.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: SciNews on 07/27/2020 04:09 pm
Tianwen-1 rover tested in a simulated Martian landscape.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KquNADst7r8
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: luhai167 on 07/27/2020 04:09 pm
Of what are they afraid?  We all know rockets fail, including the most reliable rockets, and from every country.  Show it on a 20 second delay if you are afraid of actually showing a failure.  It's not that hard.  Rocket Lab didn't shirk.  Roskosmos showed a Soyuz launch failure live while a U.S. astronaut was on board.  NASA showed its failures on NASA TV, Arianespace too on its stream.  Kudos to them all. 

 - Ed Kyle

My guess is that someone on the political side, not the launch and mission side. Have some last minute case of the nerves and not a good understanding that once you launch other people will tracked the flight from the pad to orbit. You can't hide a launch failure by not broadcasting.
Not really hiding, since Chinese media tend to report failures rather quickly. The only case I could think of is pictures of exploding rockets could be exploited as propaganda for the otherwise as political critique.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: shijiav on 07/27/2020 09:38 pm
this remembers me of when I had a personal site in the early 2000s and I decided to go beyond the few information published by press agencies on the just-approved Chang'E lunar exploration program.
what I discovered was that a wealth of information was available in the form of technical papers in English or more often in Chinese. Online translator (anyone remembers Altavista's Babel Fish?) back then gave often unreadable results, but still allowed me to get some ideas (some correct, others not so correct...) of what was cooking in China. apparently my work was even mentioned in a session of the US Congress  ;D
I even found a few papers published in the 1960s. As far as I know no lunar exploration study has ever been acknowledged to have been carried out.
the site is still available on the Internet Archive
https://web.archive.org/web/20090902035119/http://utenti.lycos.it/paoloulivi/chinamoo.html
WOW look back at the information from 2003.
That is so-called "all according to plan"...
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: luhai167 on 07/27/2020 10:38 pm
this remembers me of when I had a personal site in the early 2000s and I decided to go beyond the few information published by press agencies on the just-approved Chang'E lunar exploration program.
what I discovered was that a wealth of information was available in the form of technical papers in English or more often in Chinese. Online translator (anyone remembers Altavista's Babel Fish?) back then gave often unreadable results, but still allowed me to get some ideas (some correct, others not so correct...) of what was cooking in China. apparently my work was even mentioned in a session of the US Congress  ;D
I even found a few papers published in the 1960s. As far as I know no lunar exploration study has ever been acknowledged to have been carried out.
the site is still available on the Internet Archive
https://web.archive.org/web/20090902035119/http://utenti.lycos.it/paoloulivi/chinamoo.html
WOW look back at the information from 2003.
That is so-called "all according to plan"...
I actually posed a photocopy of the article on a 2020 rover mission from 2003. Unfortunately no details was given in the article, it would be interesting to see how things morphed from initial studies in 2003 to when a plan was approved in 2016.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Phil Stooke on 07/28/2020 12:02 am
http://9ifly.spacety.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=93048&page=84#pid756198 (http://9ifly.spacety.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=93048&page=84#pid756198)



This post on the Chinese 9ifly forum says (Google translation): 

"The landing site was mentioned in the article "Running the Fire: Flying to "Utopia"" published by the China Aerospace Journal.

The preferred landing site for the "Tianwen-1" Mars exploration mission is located at the southern end of the Martian Utopia Plain, which belongs to the lowland unit of the late Hesperia period (110.318 degrees east longitude, 24.748 degrees north latitude). The alternative location is located in the southeastern part of the Utopia Plain, in the Erythian Volcanic magma flow zone, close to the entrance of the Erythian Volcanic magma into the Utopian Plain."

I have not been able to find the article but if anyone has a source I would like to know about it.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: shijiav on 07/28/2020 05:06 am
http://9ifly.spacety.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=93048&page=84#pid756198 (http://9ifly.spacety.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=93048&page=84#pid756198)



This post on the Chinese 9ifly forum says (Google translation): 

"The landing site was mentioned in the article "Running the Fire: Flying to "Utopia"" published by the China Aerospace Journal.

The preferred landing site for the "Tianwen-1" Mars exploration mission is located at the southern end of the Martian Utopia Plain, which belongs to the lowland unit of the late Hesperia period (110.318 degrees east longitude, 24.748 degrees north latitude). The alternative location is located in the southeastern part of the Utopia Plain, in the Erythian Volcanic magma flow zone, close to the entrance of the Erythian Volcanic magma into the Utopian Plain."

I have not been able to find the article but if anyone has a source I would like to know about it.
there you go
https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s?__biz=MzA5NTgxNTQzMA==&mid=2650566654&idx=1&sn=a5abe98978d0fb3ec5f473a92fbd59ba&chksm=88b15d97bfc6d4819ffe87d8a3af51bd70a9bcdec73fdd5dcec6f7af3705bd45e041e68d036a&scene=4#wechat_redirect
EZ for a person who is fluent in Chinese to find such thing though....
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Steven Pietrobon on 07/28/2020 07:19 am
Landing sequence. Looks like it will go into a polar orbit.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Phil Stooke on 07/28/2020 07:24 am
Thanks!  Incidentally, for 'Erythian' read 'Elysium'.

Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: avollhar on 07/28/2020 02:38 pm
radio amateurs tracking Tianwen-1 to Mars:

https://destevez.net/2020/07/tracking-tianwen-1s-orbit-to-mars/ (https://destevez.net/2020/07/tracking-tianwen-1s-orbit-to-mars/)
https://destevez.net/2020/07/tracking-tianwen-1s-orbit-to-mars-part-ii/ (https://destevez.net/2020/07/tracking-tianwen-1s-orbit-to-mars-part-ii/)
http://www.r00t.cz/Sats/Tianwen1 (http://www.r00t.cz/Sats/Tianwen1)
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: wahaha on 07/29/2020 01:40 am
https://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1195927.shtml

China’s Mars probe Tianwen-1 leaves Earth’s gravitational field, sends back photo of Earth, moon: CNSA
Photo: Courtesy of China National Space Administration

Tianwen-1, China’s first Mars probe, has smoothly flown more than 1.5 million kilometers away from Earth, leaving Earth’s gravitational field, and entering planned interplanetary orbit, the China National Space Administration (CNSA) said on Tuesday.

According to a press release the CNSA provided to the Global Times on Tuesday, the spacecraft is operating properly. Flight control and data communication is underway in an orderly and clear fashion.

The probe also sent a picture featuring the Earth and moon upon looking back from some 1.2 million kilometers away from Earth, after it started its optical navigation instruments on Monday.

The Earth and moon both appear in a crescent shape, as per the picture.

China successfully launched the probe via a Long March-5 carrier rocket from Wenchang Space Launch Center located in South China’s Hainan Province on Thursday.

The probe mission aims to achieve orbiting, landing and roving on the Red Planet all in one go. Tianwen-1 is scheduled to land on Mars around May 2021.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: plutogno on 07/29/2020 06:17 am
the spacecraft has successfully launched, I think it's time we move the discussion to the topic in the Space Science forum https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=35045.0
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: ianvill on 08/07/2020 12:57 pm
In a Local news story...

Quote
IN PHOTOS: Aircraft debris found in Eastern Samar town

CEBU CITY, Philippines – Huge chunks of metal believed to be debris coming from a commercial airplane were found on a beach in Mercedes town in Eastern Samar last Wednesday, August 5.

Netizen Juvimar Lira posted on his Facebook page photos of the debris that were washed ashore at the Anuron beach in Mercedes, Eastern Samar province on Wednesday, August 5.

Lira said the large metal pieces resembled parts of a commercial plane.

He said that authorities have visited the Anuron beach on Thursday, (August 6), to secure and inspect the debris.

...

Source: https://cebudailynews.inquirer.net/331812/in-photos-aircraft-debris-found-in-eastern-samar-town (https://cebudailynews.inquirer.net/331812/in-photos-aircraft-debris-found-in-eastern-samar-town)

I believe these are parts of the Tianwen-1 Fairing Section getting washed ashore.

Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: GELORD on 08/10/2020 09:20 am
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Liss on 08/20/2020 07:31 pm
http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-08/20/c_139305763.htm

Quote
China's Mars probe over 8 mln km away from Earth
Source: Xinhua| 2020-08-20 21:31:17|Editor: huaxia

BEIJING, Aug. 20 (Xinhua) -- China's Mars probe Tianwen-1 has traveled more than 8 million km away from Earth and is functioning normally, according to the Lunar Exploration and Space Program Center of the China National Space Administration Thursday.
As of 11:20 p.m. Wednesday, the Mars probe has traveled 8.23 million km away from Earth. Starting from 10:20 p.m. Wednesday, multiple payloads on the Mars probe, including Mars Magnetometer, Mars Mineralogy Spectrometer and High-resolution Camera, have completed self-check to confirm that they are in normal condition.
Medium and high-resolution cameras will be used for imaging the Mars surface and conducting research on the topography and geological structure of the planet's surface. The Magnetometer will detect the magnetic environment on Mars, and the Mineralogy Spectrometer will be used to analyze the composition and distribution of minerals on Mars.
China launched the Mars probe on July 23, designed to complete orbiting, landing and roving in a single mission, thus taking the first step in its planetary exploration of the solar system.
The Mars probe is expected to reach the red planet around February 2021. After entering the orbit, it will spend another two to three months surveying the candidate landing sites before landing. Enditem
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: eeergo on 09/21/2020 10:08 am
TCM-2 (20 sec) completed.

https://twitter.com/AJ_FI/status/1307969995536769025
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Galactic Penguin SST on 10/01/2020 02:47 am
https://twitter.com/Cosmic_Penguin/status/1311497627641344000

https://twitter.com/Cosmic_Penguin/status/1311497637351231491
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Jrcraft on 10/01/2020 05:45 pm
Some stills of the deployable camera from the video.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Dalhousie on 10/04/2020 09:21 pm
Some stills of the deployable camera from the video.

Looks like it is tumbling at quite a rate.  How were the photos obtained from this?
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Phil Stooke on 10/05/2020 03:28 am
Sounds like they took more pictures and only 2 showed the spacecraft.  They put a camera at each end to double their chances of getting a picture.  A bit awkward but it worked, and no need to use complicated stabilization methods. 
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: wahaha on 10/12/2020 11:38 am
"Hi, Mars" is a short scientific documentary that tracks and records China's first Mars exploration program "Tianwen-1". This series consists of 10 episodes, each 5 minutes, focusing on the launch of the Mars rover. It took 40 days to take in-depth photos of the preparations and daily life of researchers at the Wenchang launch base in Hainan.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLSgkUktCDwqthX7g9HXNBV6lP8YSTdo5A
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: eeergo on 10/28/2020 03:13 pm
TCM-3 successfully completed.

https://twitter.com/LiuyiYiliu/status/1321465573071417349
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - Wenchang - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: GELORD on 12/15/2020 04:03 pm
China's Mars probe over 100 mln km away from Earth

Source: Xinhua | 2020-12-15 09:32:55 | Editor: huaxia
http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-12/15/c_139590242.htm

BEIJING, Dec. 15 (Xinhua) -- China's Mars probe Tianwen-1 is currently more than 100 million km away from Earth and is functioning normally, according to the China National Space Administration on Tuesday.

As of 9 p.m. on Monday (Beijing Time), the Mars probe had flown in space for 144 days and traveled more than 360 million km. It was more than 100 million km away from Earth and about 12 million km away from Mars.

The Mars probe will likely be about 190 million km away from Earth when it reaches the vicinity of Mars.

Since it was launched on July 23, the Mars probe has captured an image of both Earth and the moon and taken selfies. It has carried out three orbital corrections, a deep-space maneuver and self-checks on multiple payloads.

It will conduct several orbital corrections and will likely decelerate to enter the Mars orbit in mid-February next year, according to the administration.
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - Wenchang - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: eeergo on 02/03/2021 11:04 am
Update on Mars arrival in a week's time:

https://twitter.com/ea4gpz/status/1353267324510461953
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - WSLC - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: zubenelgenubi on 02/08/2021 11:40 pm
Updates and discussions for Mars Orbit Insertion, descent, and landing should proceed in the Tianwen-1 thread in the Space Science sub-forum.
https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=35045.0
Title: Re: CZ-5 - Tianwen-1 TW-1 Mars mission - Wenchang - July 23, 2020 (04:41 UTC)
Post by: Rondaz on 01/31/2022 12:29 pm
China's Mars orbiter captures 'selfie' videos & north pole views

https://youtu.be/W7V9GVIFbTE