Author Topic: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013  (Read 222233 times)

Offline Rusty Adding Machine

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #180 on: 07/02/2013 05:44 am »
Anatoly Zak: "A potential toxic cloud reportedly sighted after #Proton #crash. #Baikonur residents told to stay in doors: http://www.russianspaceweb.com/proton_glonass49.html
#GLONASS"

https://twitter.com/RussianSpaceWeb/status/351937846996779008

Online Skyrocket

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #181 on: 07/02/2013 06:28 am »
Reviewed the footage there is definitely some sort of cloud that originates out of view from the reverse side (of the side facing the camera) of the booster just after liftoff.

Looks to me like that may be the origin of this but I couldn't tell you what would have produced it. There are any number of failures that could have created that cloud.

My gut tells me partial engine failure or pressurization system failure in that area and that started the chain.


The brown cloud might have nothing to do with the failure, as Protons are always venting brown Nitrogentetroxide clouds. (e.g. see the launch photo below from the DirectV-10 launch)

 

Offline Artyom.

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #182 on: 07/02/2013 06:39 am »
« Last Edit: 07/02/2013 06:40 am by Artyom. »

Offline Rusty Adding Machine

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Offline osiossim

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« Last Edit: 07/02/2013 06:54 am by osiossim »

Offline Artyom.

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #185 on: 07/02/2013 06:48 am »

That is terrifying! Thanks for sharing! Is that your video?
No, this video is Evgeniya Popova - https://vk.com/vam_vcem_mimo .

Offline Rusty Adding Machine

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #186 on: 07/02/2013 06:49 am »

That is terrifying! Thanks for sharing! Is that your video?
No, this video is Evgeniya Popova - https://vk.com/vam_vcem_mimo .

Ah, okay. Well, I think he's just had the experience of a lifetime.

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #187 on: 07/02/2013 07:11 am »
Looking at the videos of the failure, my thoughts went back to the Mars probe failure in April 1969 - the only other time that an upside-down Proton was seen on film, I think.
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Source information: apparently one of the six 1st stage engines went down in the first seconds of the flight.

This is no Falcon 9....

EDIT: another source saying that this is impossible....  ???
« Last Edit: 07/02/2013 07:36 am by Galactic Penguin SST »
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Offline Ben the Space Brit

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #189 on: 07/02/2013 07:35 am »
Right, I understand from those who know more than me that the brown clouds are normal. Nonetheless, this one does seem to be associated with the failure.  Almost immediately afterwards, the rocket seems to lose pitch and yaw control and begins to spiral around its' nominal flight-path.

Then, as the rocket is directed away from the pad prior to termination, I noticed something else; there are at least two gaps in the rocket plume; this suggests to me that at least one core engine had failed and that another had been shut down to retain stability.  Maybe Proton doesn't have enough margin to sustain a premature engine out so early into the flight? Even if flight control authority had been restored, it was already an LOM so there was nothing to do but instruct the IU to terminate the flight.

As noted up-thread, RT are reporting concerns that vaporised propellent from the rocket itself as well as the upper stage and the RCS propellent on the Glonass satellites are a significant hazard.  An evacuation of the downwind area is being contemplated.

I'm used to Russian U/S failures but this is the first Proton core failure I've seen ever.
« Last Edit: 07/02/2013 07:36 am by Ben the Space Brit »
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Offline osiossim

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #190 on: 07/02/2013 07:51 am »
SATELLITES "GLONASS-M" AND THE ROCKET "PROTON-M", MOST LIKELY ARE NOT INSURED

http://1prime.ru/Insurance/20130702/764581521.html

http://www.gazeta.ru/social/news/2013/07/02/n_3011453.shtml


Offline Ben the Space Brit

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #191 on: 07/02/2013 08:40 am »
@osiossim,

Ouch, if that's true.  On Russia Today, they were talking about $100M for the launcher and $200M for the payload! That's a hefty chunk of change, even for Roscosmos!
« Last Edit: 07/02/2013 08:41 am by Ben the Space Brit »
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Offline ugordan

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #192 on: 07/02/2013 08:43 am »
AIUI, the 6 engines each gimbal in one plane only. Is the engine gimbal freedom tangential to the circumference or radial outward-inward?

I wonder if a gimbal failure in one of them, a hard-over condition, is sufficient to overpower all the others' control authority?

At around T+4 s there is a noticeable engine plume deflection to the "right" apparently in the engine nearest to the camera and the vehicle then starts sliding to the left and pitching clockwise as would be consistent with this TVC kick.


Offline osiossim

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #193 on: 07/02/2013 09:02 am »
@osiossim,

Ouch, if that's true.  On Russia Today, they were talking about $100M for the launcher and $200M for the payload! That's a hefty chunk of change, even for Roscosmos!

I assume there is incosistency on the news information. Prime.Ru's article's machine translation says;

"In February of this year, the government has changed the rules of subsidizing insurance runs and testing of spacecraft. Changes associated with the timing and order of subsidizing organizations engaged in property insurance risks in the spacecraft, the implementation of the Federal Space Program of Russia for 2006-2015.

As the source of virtually all the satellites were divided into two groups - the "serial, which are produced on a regular basis, and the new, high-tech devices."

"According to the government decision, the money to subsidize insurance premiums are allocated only for high-end devices, since they are the most risky," - he added."


Maybe someone can find this law's article and highlight the situation.

Offline darkenfast

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #194 on: 07/02/2013 09:12 am »
The cell-phone video: I can make out what seems to be MChS of Russii on the back of some uniforms. I think it's the Ministry of Emergency Situations.
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Offline terryy

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #195 on: 07/02/2013 09:32 am »
At around T+4 s there is a noticeable engine plume deflection to the "right" apparently in the engine nearest to the camera and the vehicle then starts sliding to the left and pitching clockwise as would be consistent with this TVC kick.

I noticed that too and it was very brown in color.  Made me wonder if there was some sort of fuel leak.  It looked like this even imparted some extra spin on the rocket that went faster and faster.  That probably made it very difficult for the other boosters to compensate.

Offline dedead

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #196 on: 07/02/2013 09:35 am »

That is terrifying! Thanks for sharing! Is that your video?
No, this video is Evgeniya Popova - https://vk.com/vam_vcem_mimo .
Is-it possible to upload the video ? (proxy at work sucks :o)

Too bad for russian space industry :( I saw the lv on May, during its integration in the 92A50/hall 11 building facility

Offline ugordan

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #197 on: 07/02/2013 10:39 am »
At around T+4 s there is a noticeable engine plume deflection to the "right" apparently in the engine nearest to the camera and the vehicle then starts sliding to the left and pitching clockwise as would be consistent with this TVC kick.

I noticed that too and it was very brown in color.

No, I'm not talking about the brown venting, that's normal for a Proton. I'm talking about the engine plume - its shock diamonds, etc.

Offline smoliarm

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #198 on: 07/02/2013 11:03 am »
RIA Novosti reported the location of impact: it is 1.5 south-east km from the launch site (#81).
The impact /explosion was quite close to the LC #200 which is used for commercial launches of Proton.

(see the map attached)

Offline R7

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Re: FAILURE: Proton-M/DM-03 with 3xGlonass-M - July 2, 2013
« Reply #199 on: 07/02/2013 11:48 am »
I'm talking about the engine plume - its shock diamonds, etc.

The plume(s) on the right side look like they are lacking some vitamins.
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