Author Topic: ULA Innovation: Integrated Vehicle Fluids (IVF)  (Read 124213 times)

Offline brickmack

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Re: ULA Innovation: Integrated Vehicle Fluids (IVF)
« Reply #240 on: 08/10/2018 04:45 am »
As long as we talk about the same engine choice a (mostly) common engine section / thrust structure would make sense. There are only so many ways to plumb it after all. Since thrust stays the same "just" add a 8.4m adapter ring...

This was basically what JAXA/MHI proposed. MB-60 engines, common structure and LOX tank between EUS and the H-III upper stage. Then NASA and JAXA would individually handle the hydrogen tanks

Offline Chasm

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Re: ULA Innovation: Integrated Vehicle Fluids (IVF)
« Reply #241 on: 08/10/2018 02:11 pm »
The who gets to be contractor game certainly got messed up by the ULA merger.
With all the STS heritage hubbub Centaur-G Prime should have been the some leverage.
ICPS right now and just modify the tower later was also a great idea.


I think the best part about the IVF flight test contract is the additional leverage.
Should be easier to make one NASA department accept the slightly increased risk if another NASA department pays you to fly the test. Similar argument but more complex for other missions paid with tax money.
So far the argument always was that flying anything new is risk and that customers just won't accept any additional risk no matter now minuscule.

Offline Jim

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Re: ULA Innovation: Integrated Vehicle Fluids (IVF)
« Reply #242 on: 08/10/2018 03:00 pm »
The who gets to be contractor game certainly got messed up by the ULA merger.
With all the STS heritage hubbub Centaur-G Prime should have been the some leverage.
.

Huh?  How would Centaur-G Prime have helped?  And it did fly as the Titan IV Centaur.

Offline Chasm

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Re: ULA Innovation: Integrated Vehicle Fluids (IVF)
« Reply #243 on: 08/10/2018 09:31 pm »
How?
SLS needs an upper stage, so how about a heritage piece like the SSME or solids. Just from a better day, where STS was not plagued with deadly accidents... (Plz ignore the unsafe gorilla behind the curtain.)

Not really important.
I can't be bothered to look up who actually did the contracting in the past (IIRC LM) and who will do for EUS (IIRC Boeing at NASA Michoud). Tax money gets spent where politicians say to. If and when SLS becomes too much of a hot potato they'll find new and less controversial ways to achieve their goal.


The important bit is that IVF is going ahead (finally) and that if it is anywhere near as good as expected it will advance the state of the art in upper stage a lot. No matter if Vulcan turns out to be viable or not.

Offline Jim

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Re: ULA Innovation: Integrated Vehicle Fluids (IVF)
« Reply #244 on: 08/11/2018 03:36 am »
How?
SLS needs an upper stage, so how about a heritage piece like the SSME or solids.


It was nothing of the sort. Heritage is not applicable since it never flew.  It never was heritage man rated hardware.  Besides the existing Centaur is just as large and ICPS is larger and safer

Offline john smith 19

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Re: ULA Innovation: Integrated Vehicle Fluids (IVF)
« Reply #245 on: 11/23/2019 03:57 pm »
Not sure if this has been posted before. It's a Roush presentation regarding the ICE that's at the core of IVF.

https://www.gtisoft.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/Cryogenic_Propulsion_Modeling.pdf#page=12&zoom=auto,-91,540

For me the interesting part was making the pipes in the heat exchangers as spirals to get centrifugal force since they have to operate in zero g.
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