Author Topic: 181 Things To Do On The Moon  (Read 6182 times)


Offline lsullivan411

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Re: 181 Things To Do On The Moon
« Reply #1 on: 02/06/2007 04:50 pm »
Interesting - thanks for the links!

Offline simonbp

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Re: 181 Things To Do On The Moon
« Reply #2 on: 02/09/2007 01:14 pm »
This is the kind of document that spacecraft mission proposal writers use as a guidebook for what science to do; a mission that addresses several of the objectives with multiple checks would have much better chance of getting funding...

Simon ;)

Offline texas_space

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RE: 181 Things To Do On The Moon
« Reply #3 on: 02/09/2007 01:39 pm »
Interesting list.  Unfortunately several things cannot be achieved very well if NASA decides to go with its "build a moonbase" strategy.  Geology surveys and some of the material science investigations would probably require sortie missions.  The moon is a big place, its a shame to "camp out" in only one spot.
"We went to the moon nine times. Why fake it nine times, if we faked it?" - Charlie Duke

Offline meiza

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Re: 181 Things To Do On The Moon
« Reply #4 on: 02/09/2007 02:26 pm »
From a very quick scan, I think the geology and lunar resource utilization are the most convincing ones, most of the others have the problem of either
1) you can do as well in orbit (the astronomy missions for example)
or
2) are only stuff that you do to be able to function more on the moon, hence kindof circular logic, they can not be objectives themselves.

Offline Generic Username

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Re: 181 Things To Do On The Moon
« Reply #5 on: 02/09/2007 03:11 pm »
Quote
meiza - 9/2/2007  8:26 AM

1) you can do as well in orbit (the astronomy missions for example)

*very* argueable. Putting a Hubble-class scope next to your moonbase means that peopel will be near Hubble regularly. If some little thing goes wrong, it's a relatively small thing to go fix it. If you need small repair parts, the next logistics flight will only be a few weeks/months away.
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Offline rsp1202

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Re: 181 Things To Do On The Moon
« Reply #6 on: 02/09/2007 04:01 pm »
I can't imagine a moon base without an observatory of some kind. But transporting a Paranal or Hubble-class mirror to the moon? I think the planners would opt for smaller segmented designs, at least at first.

Offline Generic Username

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Re: 181 Things To Do On The Moon
« Reply #7 on: 02/09/2007 04:21 pm »
Quote
rsp1202 - 9/2/2007  10:01 AM
 I think the planners would opt for smaller segmented designs, at least at first.

Sure. But Hubble is Seventies tech. A moon based scope would be Naughties tech, at the earliest, and thus a segmented mirror would be obvious and easy. Heck, maybe astronauts could pack it along a bit at a time, and build a big-ass scope with almost no impact to the launch schedule.
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Offline kevin-rf

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Re: 181 Things To Do On The Moon
« Reply #8 on: 02/09/2007 04:33 pm »
You're assuming you can keep dust off the mirrors. Wasn't there a paper recently that indicated that lunar dust picked up a charge during the day levitating itself off the ground and as it discharged during lunar night dropped back to the ground.

Very, Very, Very dusty enviroment. Even without air...
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Offline simonbp

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Re: 181 Things To Do On The Moon
« Reply #9 on: 02/09/2007 05:04 pm »
There is actually a lot astronomy that can be done much better on the Moon than anywhere else. Radio astronomy, for example, is constantly plagued by terrestrial emissions and can't easily be done in orbit due to the size of the structure required. An arecibo-like dish in a crater on the moon is much more feasible, and would be a genuine boon. Likewise, a neutrino detection facility buried below the Moon would be very nice, as it's good and far away from terrestrial neutrino sources (mainly nuclear reactors). High-energy (X- and gamma-ray) astronomy could also benefit, as their detectors are inherently non-directional, and so a wide array spread across the lunar surface would be very useful in pinpointing sources.

Individual Lunar site inspections are best done with sortie missions, but before you select a site to be of interest, you need a lot of context information, most of which could be provided by orbiters and a global seismometer network. A long-life pressurised rover going on several month-long expeditions from the Shackleton Base might be the best option...

The real problem with this document is that it doesn't really give priorities; something like this would be better: http://mepag.jpl.nasa.gov/reports/MEPAG%20Goals_2-10-2006.pdf

Simon ;)

Offline Generic Username

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Re: 181 Things To Do On The Moon
« Reply #10 on: 02/09/2007 05:15 pm »
Quote
kevin-rf - 9/2/2007  10:33 AM

You're assuming you can keep dust off the mirrors.

I doubt that would be a serious impediment. Much of the "lunar scope" art shows bare naked mirrors, but you'd most likely put 'em in a dust-resistant tube. Even as simple as a framework and mylar or kevlar or some such. Mount the scope atop a large rock, swept dust-free by having a lander hover over it for a few seconds.
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Offline simonbp

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Re: 181 Things To Do On The Moon
« Reply #11 on: 02/09/2007 06:58 pm »
Quote
Generic Username - 9/2/2007  12:15 PM

I doubt that would be a serious impediment. Much of the "lunar scope" art shows bare naked mirrors, but you'd most likely put 'em in a dust-resistant tube. Even as simple as a framework and mylar or kevlar or some such. Mount the scope atop a large rock, swept dust-free by having a lander hover over it for a few seconds.

The problem is more that moon dust is highly charged, which the solar wind will deposit onto the mirrors, and which then gets strongly electrostaticly bound to the mirror (or rover wheel bearing or spacesuit joint). There are several ideas on how to get around this, including putting up a local magnetic field to deflect the solar wind (including hard solar radiation), or to take advantage of the high iron content in lunar soil, and use a microwave beam to melt the top layer of lunar regolith around a base into a dustless glass plain...

Really, though, optical and near Infrared astronomy (what you'd be using a mirror for) isn't really the moon's strong point anyway, as recent advances in interferometry mean that ground-based telescopes can almost totally correct for atmospheric distortion. The larger problem is that the Earth's atmosphere is only really transparent in the visual, radio, and a bit of IR; everything else really needs to be done in space, and the moon offers a world of opportunity.

Besides, most of the really exciting astronomy these days is not visual (kinda old hat), but far-IR, X-Ray, and Gamma Ray. These are the kind of systems that we need on the moon...

Simon ;)

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