NASA Developing Mining Robot for Moon, Mars

[catdlr]

Published on Feb 26, 2013
NASA is developing the RASSOR mining robot to collect soil, or regolith, on the moon or Mars so it can be processed into rocket fuel, breathable air and other commodities. By using materials available at other locations in the solar system, astronauts don't have to carry it all from Earth.

[Lar]

Published on Feb 26, 2013
NASA is developing the RASSOR mining robot to collect soil, or regolith, on the moon or Mars so it can be processed into rocket fuel, breathable air and other commodities. By using materials available at other locations in the solar system, astronauts don't have to carry it all from Earth.

The slotted drums mean that you don't get things "too big" to process, only things that fit within the slots will be collected. That seems a big advantage.

I missed how the drums empty again. That might be a failure point...  Thanks for sharing this vid

[D_Dom]

Near the beginning (0:56) of the video it showed the drums rotating opposite and then reversing to rotate in the "digging" direction. Would tend to empty the drums I think.

[Lar]

Near the beginning (0:58) of the video it showed the drums rotating opposite the "digging" direction. Would tend to empty the drums I think.

Thanks. I did miss that.

Over time there has to be another mechanism though... because it's possible for pieces that can fit IN to not fit OUT (in a reasonable number of rotations...)... visualise a long flat thing that only made it through the rectangular slot due to random chance alignment.  It may not come out again until a very random alignment happens.[1]

Now, I'm expecting that there won't be many of those sorts of things  in the regolith, so maybe the bot just puts up with it and once a month a human cleans it or something.

Still, this is a clever idea!

1 - I sort my LEGO sometimes using sievelike apparatus to do a rough sort. Long beams fit through the holes but then have a hard time coming back out if I just turn the sieve upside down, I have to hand disassemble to get them.

[Robotbeat]

I'm pretty sure the drums are modeled after continuous excavating machines, AKA bucket-wheel excavators.

[Lar]

I'm pretty sure the drums are modeled after continuous excavating machines, AKA bucket-wheel excavators.

The idea of something that takes nibbles of material, yes. Which is clever.

But a bucket wheel excavator doesn't have internal storage for what it removes, it conveyors it away quickly. This does.


(sourced from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bucket-wheel_excavator )

They probably thought of the thing I'm worrying about and I should stop worrying. It seems way more practical (if the material is already loose) than a bobcat style front end loader or the like

[A_M_Swallow]

A couple of dump trucks will be needed to move the regolith from the RASSOR to the processing plant.

[Lar]

A couple of dump trucks will be needed to move the regolith from the RASSOR to the processing plant.

That wasn't my read, at least not initially,, this device could transport material to the plant and then trek back out to where it was excavating. As operations expand trucks might come in handy but for a minimum mass starting point it might have to do all the work itself. I thought the vid mentioned that

[MP99]

"The moon, for example, is full of oxygen and methane in it's soil."

Didn't know that about methane - is it correct?

cheers, Martin

[mikes]

Fegley & Swindle "Lunar volatiles: implications for lunar resource utilization" in "Resources of near-Earth space" 1993 ed Lewis et al
http://www.uapress.arizona.edu/onlinebks/ResourcesNearEarthSpace/resources15.pdf

p381 Apollo mean carbon abundance 124ppm (sigma=45) in bulk soil, max abundance 280ppm.

So, if you select a good site you might get 1 kg of carbon out of 3.5 tonnes of soil.

Methane is 33% hydrogen by mass, so production will be limited by how much hydrogen you can find (bulk abundance 46ppm, p378 ibid).

I wasn't aware that the moon has so much carbon. This has big implications for being able to set up agriculture.

[KelvinZero]

"The moon, for example, is full of oxygen and methane in it's soil."

Didn't know that about methane - is it correct?

cheers, Martin

There has been a big focus on the water detected at the lunar poles, but apparently there are all sorts of hydrocarbons too, and in abundance. I have seen some tables floating around here but dont know what the most robust reference is.

(edit) sorry I didnt chase down the particular quote you were replying too. It seems oddly worded in that the entire moon contains massive amounts of oxygen but the statement that carbon is common could only refer to these very specific places at the poles.

[Robert Thompson]

http://lcross.arc.nasa.gov/observation.htm
"Volatiles are compounds that freeze and are trapped in the cold lunar craters and vaporize when warmed by the sun. The suite of LCROSS and LRO instruments determined as much as 20 percent of the material kicked up by the LCROSS impact was volatiles, including methane, ammonia, hydrogen gas, carbon dioxide and carbon monoxide."

[kkattula]

"The moon, for example, is full of oxygen and methane in it's soil."

Didn't know that about methane - is it correct?

cheers, Martin

There has been a big focus on the water detected at the lunar poles, but apparently there are all sorts of hydrocarbons too, and in abundance. I have seen some tables floating around here but dont know what the most robust reference is.

(edit) sorry I didnt chase down the particular quote you were replying too. It seems oddly worded in that the entire moon contains massive amounts of oxygen but the statement that carbon is common could only refer to these very specific places at the poles.

IIRC, there was more carbon monoxide than water in the LCROSS results. Third most abundant was hydrogen sulphide, then carbon dioxide, sulfur dioxide, methane, formaldehyde, and more.

[Robert Thompson]

http://www.sciencemag.org/content/330/6003.toc

Science 22 October 2010: 463-468. Detection of Water in the LCROSS Ejecta Plume
Table 2:
http://www.sciencemag.org/content/330/6003/463/T2.expansion.html

(Science 22 October 2010: 468-472. The LCROSS Cratering Experiment

Science 22 October 2010: 472-476. LRO-LAMP Observations of the LCROSS Impact Plume
Figure 3: Au!

Science 22 October 2010: 477-479. Diviner Lunar Radiometer Observations of the LCROSS Impact)

[JulesVerneATV]

Modular Robots Could Both Explore Off-World And Build Infrastructure
https://www.universetoday.com/articles/modular-robots-could-both-explore-off-world-and-build-infrastructure

a more recent discussion

'The Case for a Pit-House as the Most Effective Initial Base on Mars'
https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=62631.0

[Blackstar]

Not exactly the same, but adjacent. This is a reasonable discussion of the issue. For the past year I've been involved with a project looking at applied science on the Moon (meaning the science you need to do in order to do practical things, like manufacture using lunar materials). These subjects are complicated, because they really require a systems engineering approach--it's fine to come up with a way to use lunar materials to make a structure, but how much energy does it require? How often will the machine break, and can it be fixed on site? Things like that can wreck a promising idea.

Adam is great in these videos, because he understands construction and he also understands the limitations of materials.

[catdlr]

Not exactly the same, but adjacent. This is a reasonable discussion of the issue. For the past year I've been involved with a project looking at applied science on the Moon (meaning the science you need to do in order to do practical things, like manufacture using lunar materials). These subjects are complicated, because they really require a systems engineering approach--it's fine to come up with a way to use lunar materials to make a structure, but how much energy does it require? How often will the machine break, and can it be fixed on site? Things like that can wreck a promising idea.

Adam is great in these videos, because he understands construction and he also understands the limitations of materials.

I posted that video in the Moon Habitat thread, but I can see robots working the printer and providing the supplies it needs.  Adam was so excited as light bulbs lit up in his head.

[Blackstar]

I posted that video in the Moon Habitat thread, but I can see robots working the printer and providing the supplies it needs.  Adam was so excited as light bulbs lit up in his head.

Most of the process has to be automated. You really cannot have astronauts on the surface for long periods of time. They should only be used for setup and maintenance, not operations.

[DanClemmensen]

I posted that video in the Moon Habitat thread, but I can see robots working the printer and providing the supplies it needs.  Adam was so excited as light bulbs lit up in his head.

Most of the process has to be automated. You really cannot have astronauts on the surface for long periods of time. They should only be used for setup and maintenance, not operations.

There are actually three levels: hands-on, automated, and tele-operated. Don't put humans in suits except when actually needed, but humans can participate if necessary via tele-operation. ISS uses Canadarm. There are lots of possible tele-operated systems, including humanoid robots.

[catdlr]

I posted that video in the Moon Habitat thread, but I can see robots working the printer and providing the supplies it needs.  Adam was so excited as light bulbs lit up in his head.

Most of the process has to be automated. You really cannot have astronauts on the surface for long periods of time. They should only be used for setup and maintenance, not operations.

There are actually three levels: hands-on, automated, and tele-operated. Don't put humans in suits except when actually needed, but humans can participate if necessary via tele-operation. ISS uses Canadarm. There are lots of possible tele-operated systems, including humanoid robots.

I wasn't disagreeing with either of you, in fact, I want Robots to do most of the work on the surface and avoid bringing in regolith dust into the living environment.  The falls and spills the last time out were enough.


https://youtube.com/watch?v=Ke65jU_yYso

[Blackstar]

I posted that video in the Moon Habitat thread, but I can see robots working the printer and providing the supplies it needs.  Adam was so excited as light bulbs lit up in his head.

Most of the process has to be automated. You really cannot have astronauts on the surface for long periods of time. They should only be used for setup and maintenance, not operations.

There are actually three levels: hands-on, automated, and tele-operated. Don't put humans in suits except when actually needed, but humans can participate if necessary via tele-operation. ISS uses Canadarm. There are lots of possible tele-operated systems, including humanoid robots.

I agree. But my point is that it's very difficult to put humans outside for any period of time. That will be very limited.