UK steps up, as ESA commit to ATV Service Module on NASA's Orion

[hektor]

Airbus Defence and Space’s system design of European service module for US MPCV spacecraft Orion approved by ESA

[woods170]

In other words: the PDR was concluded successfully.

[newpylong]

To put things in perspective: in January 2012 it was estimated that PDR for the ESA SM would take place in mid-2013. It has now shifted over 10 months to the right, to May 2014.
Never mind the fluff about the impact of PDR delay being minimised in  the quote above. I have it on good authority that the ESA SM will not be ready to support EM-1 in December 2017.

*gives a heavy groan and shakes head*

I'm feeling bad vibes, but I hope ESA steps up even if it means delaying to 2018.  I suspect politics, now that NASA has confirmed an ESA partnership with the SM, will keep us from pulling out at least for the first few flights beyond EM-1 & 2.  This marriage with Orion between ESA and NASA will certainly have it's rocky moments; we can only hope it smooths out after May...otherwise yeah...

Doesn't matter after first two. NASA owns right to the SM. They can contract out the work (if ESA is willing) or bring it back here.

[hektor]

[woods170]

Source please for that image. Thank you.

[woods170]

To put things in perspective: in January 2012 it was estimated that PDR for the ESA SM would take place in mid-2013. It has now shifted over 10 months to the right, to May 2014.
Never mind the fluff about the impact of PDR delay being minimised in  the quote above. I have it on good authority that the ESA SM will not be ready to support EM-1 in December 2017.

*gives a heavy groan and shakes head*

I'm feeling bad vibes, but I hope ESA steps up even if it means delaying to 2018.  I suspect politics, now that NASA has confirmed an ESA partnership with the SM, will keep us from pulling out at least for the first few flights beyond EM-1 & 2.  This marriage with Orion between ESA and NASA will certainly have it's rocky moments; we can only hope it smooths out after May...otherwise yeah...

Doesn't matter after first two. NASA owns right to the SM. They can contract out the work (if ESA is willing) or bring it back here.

Emphasis mine.
What I hear from my industry sources is that this arrangement was changed after the deal to supply the ESM was inked.

[newpylong]

The question was asked at the initial news conference when the ESA SM was announced and Mark Geyer said they own the rights. Not sure if the deal was inked before or after that.

[woods170]

The question was asked at the initial news conference when the ESA SM was announced and Mark Geyer said they own the rights. Not sure if the deal was inked before or after that.

The deal was inked shortly before that, but it has been changed a number of times already. The IP no longer fully resting with NASA is one of the changes.

[simonbp]

Source please for that image. Thank you.

Google image search is your friend:

http://www.esa.int/About_Us/Exhibitions/ILA_2014/Highlights/ILA_in_images

[PahTo]

The question was asked at the initial news conference when the ESA SM was announced and Mark Geyer said they own the rights. Not sure if the deal was inked before or after that.

The deal was inked shortly before that, but it has been changed a number of times already. The IP no longer fully resting with NASA is one of the changes.

I know a number of contributors to this forum are showing great restraint right now, given the year delay and now this change.  I find it all rather disturbing.  Will we see humans beyond LEO in the next 10 years?  20 years?  *sigh*
It is painful to watch the rise and fall of the US human spaceflight program in one short lifetime.

[newpylong]

The question was asked at the initial news conference when the ESA SM was announced and Mark Geyer said they own the rights. Not sure if the deal was inked before or after that.

The deal was inked shortly before that, but it has been changed a number of times already. The IP no longer fully resting with NASA is one of the changes.

I know a number of contributors to this forum are showing great restraint right now, given the year delay and now this change.  I find it all rather disturbing.  Will we see humans beyond LEO in the next 10 years?  20 years?  *sigh*
It is painful to watch the rise and fall of the US human spaceflight program in one short lifetime.

We're showing great restraint because even how disturbing (stupid?) it might be to have ESA build the SM, it's really the only path forward. There simply is not enough funding to have LM build it in the time frame we're talking about.

If it get's done in time for 2018 and they own the design after that, I don't see the problem.

[psloss]

The question was asked at the initial news conference when the ESA SM was announced and Mark Geyer said they own the rights. Not sure if the deal was inked before or after that.

The deal was inked shortly before that, but it has been changed a number of times already. The IP no longer fully resting with NASA is one of the changes.

I know a number of contributors to this forum are showing great restraint right now, given the year delay and now this change.  I find it all rather disturbing.  Will we see humans beyond LEO in the next 10 years?  20 years?  *sigh*
It is painful to watch the rise and fall of the US human spaceflight program in one short lifetime.

History suggests that for us armchair outsiders, patience is required.  I would have been surprised (pleasantly) if the Q1 FY 2018 target was met.  There's still a lot of work to do, too -- I would also be pleasantly surprised if this is the last significant delay.

[woods170]

Orion’s European Service Module Back on Track

http://www.spacenews.com/article/civil-space/40669orion%E2%80%99s-european-service-module-back-on-track

Europe’s work on the service module for NASA’s Orion crew-transport vehicle has made up most, but not all, of the slip in schedule and is on track for delivery to NASA in time for a late 2017 launch, European government and industry officials said. While the delivery deadline remains challenging, the earlier problem of the module’s excess weight has been resolved and the prime contractor is not having to resort to double- and triple shifts to get the job done, officials said.

[woods170]

Image credit: ESA–M. Pedoussaut, 2014

MPCV mockup, with decent detail, from ILA Berlin.

[bolun]

European Orion milestone leads to detailed design
 
23 May 2014

http://www.esa.int/Our_Activities/Human_Spaceflight/ATV/European_Orion_milestone_leads_to_detailed_design

ESA is a step closer to building the future of human spaceflight and exploration in Europe by completing the preliminary design review of Europe’s Service Module for NASA’s Orion vehicle to send astronauts beyond low orbit.

The Preliminary Design Review concluded with a formal board on 15 May that provided the go-ahead for the next phase.

The next major review milestone is the Critical Design Review at the end of 2015, aiming for Orion’s uncrewed first flight with Europe’s Service Module in 2017.

[Jeffscasa]

I've might have missed something...The ESA is only contracted to build 2 service modules for Orion. What happens after the second flight??

[newpylong]

I've might have missed something...The ESA is only contracted to build 2 service modules for Orion. What happens after the second flight??

Answer at the top of this page.

NASA contracts to build more out in the US or works out an agreement for ESA to (if they are willing).

That mockup is sexy.

[TomH]

Wonder how they were able to reduce the mass so quickly and successfully bring it within requierd parameters. Anybody have info? Hope no corners were cut that could lead to safety issues. I would expect that to be carefully evaluated at CDR.

[OpsAnalyst]

I would expect that to be carefully evaluated at CDR.

No worries on that point.

[floss]

Pardon me but does the thruster arrangement closely resemble the proposed ESA lunar lander .