Author Topic: SpaceX Starship : Florida Prototype(s) Thread 2 : Discussion  (Read 292146 times)

Offline Rocket Science

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Re: SpaceX Starship : Florida Prototype(s) Thread 2 : Discussion
« Reply #540 on: 11/24/2019 07:54 pm »
Is that evidence that we're seeing the new 30X cold-rolled stainless steel?
I haven't seen anything on 30X.  Perhaps I missed the relevant thread.  Can you give me a link to what you have seen on 30X?

I deleted my post because it was not from Florida activity, but activity in Texas  :o

To answer your question, all I know is from the Cybertruck unveil, where Elon Musk said:

Quote
It is, it is literally bulletproof to a nine millimeter handgun, Musk said onstage during the unveiling. Thats how strong the skin is its ultra-hard, cold-rolled stainless steel alloy that weve developed. Were going to be using the same alloy in the Starship rocket, and in the Cybertruck.

And on the Tesla website for the Cybertruck:

Quote
ULTRA-HARD 30X COLD-ROLLED STAINLESS STEEL
If there was something better, wed use it. Help eliminate dents, damage and long-term corrosion with a smooth monochrome exoskeleton that puts the shell on the outside of the car and provides you and your passengers maximum protection.
They were "super-sure" about the glass strength as well... What did Murphy say? ???
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
~Rob: Physics instructor, Aviator

Offline Eka

Is that evidence that we're seeing the new 30X cold-rolled stainless steel?
I haven't seen anything on 30X.  Perhaps I missed the relevant thread.  Can you give me a link to what you have seen on 30X?

I deleted my post because it was not from Florida activity, but activity in Texas  :o

To answer your question, all I know is from the Cybertruck unveil, where Elon Musk said:

Quote
It is, it is literally bulletproof to a nine millimeter handgun, Musk said onstage during the unveiling. Thats how strong the skin is its ultra-hard, cold-rolled stainless steel alloy that weve developed. Were going to be using the same alloy in the Starship rocket, and in the Cybertruck.

And on the Tesla website for the Cybertruck:

Quote
ULTRA-HARD 30X COLD-ROLLED STAINLESS STEEL
If there was something better, wed use it. Help eliminate dents, damage and long-term corrosion with a smooth monochrome exoskeleton that puts the shell on the outside of the car and provides you and your passengers maximum protection.
EM tweeting about it now.
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1198700591465156608
Quote
Reason Cybertruck is so planar is that you cant stamp ultra-hard 30X steel, because it breaks the stamping press
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1198701215376216064
Quote
Even bending it requires a deep score on inside of bend, which is how the prototype was made
We talk about creating a Star Trek future, but will end up with The Expanse if radical change doesn't happen.

Offline Yazata

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Re: SpaceX Starship : Florida Prototype(s) Thread 2 : Discussion
« Reply #542 on: 11/24/2019 08:38 pm »
If they are preparing to move Mk.2's tank cylinder, which John Winkopp's photos suggest, then presumably they are planning to use it for something. A redo of the pressure test might be the most likely thing, given that they haven't made much effort to install flight hardware on Mk.2 like they did with Mk.1.

We'll know pretty quickly, when we see whether they move the cylinder, where it goes, or whether they start cutting it up for scrap in situ
« Last Edit: 11/24/2019 08:51 pm by Yazata »

Offline Ulysses S

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Re: SpaceX Starship : Florida Prototype(s) Thread 2 : Discussion
« Reply #543 on: 11/24/2019 08:39 pm »
Maybe a pressure check/leak check in the new parking lot at the iron works before the move.  That should appease NASA.   I'll bet we see mk2 fly.   What great PR to watch that big bird fly after the mkI  top off.      Ten to one they put a new top on that mk1 and do some more testing there also                         

Offline fael097

Maybe a pressure check/leak check in the new parking lot at the iron works before the move.  That should appease NASA.   I'll bet we see mk2 fly.   What great PR to watch that big bird fly after the mkI  top off.      Ten to one they put a new top on that mk1 and do some more testing there also                         

don't you needed some level of basic GSE to fill the tanks?
Rafael Adamy

Offline Ulysses S

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Re: SpaceX Starship : Florida Prototype(s) Thread 2 : Discussion
« Reply #545 on: 11/24/2019 08:54 pm »
I think just a liquid and a pump would be sufficient to pressure and leak test.  I used to do it with boilers all the time

Offline Coastal Ron

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Re: SpaceX Starship : Florida Prototype(s) Thread 2 : Discussion
« Reply #546 on: 11/24/2019 08:55 pm »
If they are going to move Mk2, and we've heard that Mk3 will be the first to fly, then maybe Mk2 will be moved to Pad 39A for testing purposes? Like validating the Starship pad is ready for a future rocket launch?

Otherwise moving Mk2 to KSC would be a pretty expensive way to scrap it...
If we don't continuously lower the cost to access space, how are we ever going to afford to expand humanity out into space?

Offline Wargrim

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Re: SpaceX Starship : Florida Prototype(s) Thread 2 : Discussion
« Reply #547 on: 11/24/2019 09:00 pm »
If they are going to move Mk2, and we've heard that Mk3 will be the first to fly, then maybe Mk2 will be moved to Pad 39A for testing purposes? Like validating the Starship pad is ready for a future rocket launch?

Otherwise moving Mk2 to KSC would be a pretty expensive way to scrap it...

If they put MK2 on a barge and ship it down to Boca Chica everyone here will lose the few marbles we still have left...

Offline Johnnyhinbos

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Re: SpaceX Starship : Florida Prototype(s) Thread 2 : Discussion
« Reply #548 on: 11/24/2019 09:29 pm »
If they are going to move Mk2, and we've heard that Mk3 will be the first to fly, then maybe Mk2 will be moved to Pad 39A for testing purposes? Like validating the Starship pad is ready for a future rocket launch?

Otherwise moving Mk2 to KSC would be a pretty expensive way to scrap it...
If it’s for fit checks at 39A, and MK3 is first to fly, then they should cut off the engine section and just send that to the Cape. Again, highly doubt they will pressure check it there until design is verified at Cape.
John Hanzl. Author, action / adventure www.johnhanzl.com

Offline fael097

If they are going to move Mk2, and we've heard that Mk3 will be the first to fly, then maybe Mk2 will be moved to Pad 39A for testing purposes? Like validating the Starship pad is ready for a future rocket launch?

Otherwise moving Mk2 to KSC would be a pretty expensive way to scrap it...

If they put MK2 on a barge and ship it down to Boca Chica everyone here will lose the few marbles we still have left...

ha, wouldn't that be something
Rafael Adamy

Offline Coastal Ron

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Re: SpaceX Starship : Florida Prototype(s) Thread 2 : Discussion
« Reply #550 on: 11/24/2019 09:56 pm »
If its for fit checks at 39A, and MK3 is first to fly, then they should cut off the engine section and just send that to the Cape. Again, highly doubt they will pressure check it there until design is verified at Cape.

Good points, but then we see the fixtures below that look like they are for moving something substantially big - maybe bigger than an engine section?
If we don't continuously lower the cost to access space, how are we ever going to afford to expand humanity out into space?

Offline Johnnyhinbos

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Re: SpaceX Starship : Florida Prototype(s) Thread 2 : Discussion
« Reply #551 on: 11/24/2019 10:03 pm »
If it’s for fit checks at 39A, and MK3 is first to fly, then they should cut off the engine section and just send that to the Cape. Again, highly doubt they will pressure check it there until design is verified at Cape.

Good points, but then we see the fixtures below that look like they are for moving something substantially big - maybe bigger than an engine section?
Agreed - however not to belabor this, but I’m firmly in the camp that SpaceX pivoted around the time of the tank failure, meaning the cradles has already been specified and manufactured.
John Hanzl. Author, action / adventure www.johnhanzl.com

Offline fael097

If its for fit checks at 39A, and MK3 is first to fly, then they should cut off the engine section and just send that to the Cape. Again, highly doubt they will pressure check it there until design is verified at Cape.

Good points, but then we see the fixtures below that look like they are for moving something substantially big - maybe bigger than an engine section?
Agreed - however not to belabor this, but Im firmly in the camp that SpaceX pivoted around the time of the tank failure, meaning the cradles has already been specified and manufactured.

Still, they didn't have to put the cradles out there in the open if they are not going to use it anymore, just scrap them where they built them.
Rafael Adamy

Still, they didn't have to put the cradles out there in the open if they are not going to use it anymore, just scrap them where they built them.

Why would they scrap them? MK4, MK6, Heavy. They'll be needed for future transport.

Offline fael097

Still, they didn't have to put the cradles out there in the open if they are not going to use it anymore, just scrap them where they built them.

Why would they scrap them? MK4, MK6, Heavy. They'll be needed for future transport.

Fair enough, let me rephrase

Why would they put the cradles out there in the open if they are not going to use it any time soon? Just keep them where they built them?
Rafael Adamy

Online sferrin

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Re: SpaceX Starship : Florida Prototype(s) Thread 2 : Discussion
« Reply #555 on: 11/25/2019 01:07 am »
Is that evidence that we're seeing the new 30X cold-rolled stainless steel?
I haven't seen anything on 30X.  Perhaps I missed the relevant thread.  Can you give me a link to what you have seen on 30X?

I deleted my post because it was not from Florida activity, but activity in Texas  :o

To answer your question, all I know is from the Cybertruck unveil, where Elon Musk said:

Quote
It is, it is literally bulletproof to a nine millimeter handgun, Musk said onstage during the unveiling. Thats how strong the skin is its ultra-hard, cold-rolled stainless steel alloy that weve developed. Were going to be using the same alloy in the Starship rocket, and in the Cybertruck.

And on the Tesla website for the Cybertruck:

Quote
ULTRA-HARD 30X COLD-ROLLED STAINLESS STEEL
If there was something better, wed use it. Help eliminate dents, damage and long-term corrosion with a smooth monochrome exoskeleton that puts the shell on the outside of the car and provides you and your passengers maximum protection.
They were "super-sure" about the glass strength as well... What did Murphy say? ???
Bullet proof and scratch proof are not the same thing.
"DARPA Hard"  It ain't what it use to be.

Fair enough, let me rephrase
Why would they put the cradles out there in the open if they are not going to use it any time soon? Just keep them where they built them?

I can think of many reasons. A couple: There were made by a subcontractor on the subcontractor's property and the subcontractor wanted them out when there were finished.
Those things can't be easy to move or cheap so it's possible the transport was already hired and possibly paid or a cancelation fee would have cost more money... So they just moved them and left them there for use later.

I can think of many reasons. I assume that is spaceX property or at least rented and they are out of the way. No place better to dump them till needed.

Offline TorenAltair

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Re: SpaceX Starship : Florida Prototype(s) Thread 2 : Discussion
« Reply #557 on: 11/25/2019 02:45 am »
I agree with Johnnyhinbos that it seems unlikely that they run pressure tests at 39A.
Is there a possibility that they can pressure-test MK2 at Roberts Road? Any current information/images from there? Is it far enough away from any critical or public locations? Is it even reachable by the barge+land route?

Offline Rocket Science

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Re: SpaceX Starship : Florida Prototype(s) Thread 2 : Discussion
« Reply #558 on: 11/25/2019 03:31 am »
Is that evidence that we're seeing the new 30X cold-rolled stainless steel?
I haven't seen anything on 30X.  Perhaps I missed the relevant thread.  Can you give me a link to what you have seen on 30X?

I deleted my post because it was not from Florida activity, but activity in Texas  :o

To answer your question, all I know is from the Cybertruck unveil, where Elon Musk said:

Quote
It is, it is literally bulletproof to a nine millimeter handgun, Musk said onstage during the unveiling. Thats how strong the skin is its ultra-hard, cold-rolled stainless steel alloy that weve developed. Were going to be using the same alloy in the Starship rocket, and in the Cybertruck.

And on the Tesla website for the Cybertruck:

Quote
ULTRA-HARD 30X COLD-ROLLED STAINLESS STEEL
If there was something better, wed use it. Help eliminate dents, damage and long-term corrosion with a smooth monochrome exoskeleton that puts the shell on the outside of the car and provides you and your passengers maximum protection.
They were "super-sure" about the glass strength as well... What did Murphy say? ???
Bullet proof and scratch proof are not the same thing.
They performed the identical impact glass test just before the reveal and it passed. My point is about "reproducibility of results" which is the "standard" for all experiments... That's what my students take with them when they learn experimental design...
« Last Edit: 11/25/2019 01:29 pm by Rocket Science »
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
~Rob: Physics instructor, Aviator

Online AC in NC

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Re: SpaceX Starship : Florida Prototype(s) Thread 2 : Discussion
« Reply #559 on: 11/25/2019 03:41 am »
I agree with Johnnyhinbos that it seems unlikely that they run pressure tests at 39A.
Is there a possibility that they can pressure-test MK2 at Roberts Road? Any current information/images from there? Is it far enough away from any critical or public locations? Is it even reachable by the barge+land route?

If I'm not mistaken, this is Roberts Road to the Turning Basin.

Reachable? Yes 
Pressurization at RR? Not Likely
Pressurization At 39A? Agree Very Unlikely

I do think there is value in shipping the intact Mk2 tank section(vs just engine section) to 39A for fit (and even fill perhaps) but not press.

« Last Edit: 11/25/2019 05:07 am by AC in NC »

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