The American flag is all over Mars. It first got to the surface in 1976, so I'd say he's a little late on this one.
Incidentally, one of the things that Vice President Mike Pence mentions in his book released yesterday is that it was Trump's idea to revive the National Space Council. He asked Pence during the 2016 Campaign if Pence would like to lead it. Pence was thrilled at the opportunity of doing so since he was a big fan of Apollo when he was young.
Quote from: laszlo on 11/16/2022 06:08 pmThe American flag is all over Mars. It first got to the surface in 1976, so I'd say he's a little late on this one.The flag didn't get planted on Mars (the key word being planted).
Quote from: yg1968 on 11/16/2022 07:01 pmIncidentally, one of the things that Vice President Mike Pence mentions in his book released yesterday is that it was Trump's idea to revive the National Space Council. He asked Pence during the 2016 Campaign if Pence would like to lead it. Pence was thrilled at the opportunity of doing so since he was a big fan of Apollo when he was young. He does not seem to have been much of a fan of returning to the moon when he was a congressman, though. He was co-chairman of the Republican Study Group in 2005 when that body proposed saving money by cancelling Constellation without replacing it with anything. Does that get a mention in the book?
"But [...] even as a budget hawk, I believe firmly in the US space program. It is an incredible source of pride and progress, a launching pad for industries that have powered America's economy and improved the life over. And it is a frontier that someday may be settled. If and when that happens, it should be settled by free men and women carrying the American flag.
I wanted to encourage our astronauts and engineer to make their next giant leap and return Americans to the moon. I was in Huntsville to chair the fifth meeting of the [space] council in March 2019 not only to name the first commander of the Space Force, General Jay Raymond but also to make it official that we planned the "next man and first woman" to the Moon in five years in American rockets launched from American soil. Not just that, but the astronauts would be landing on the moon's south pole, where no American had ever gone. The United States didn't have a rocket capable of sending astronauts to the moon, but instead of lamenting that and postponing the country's return there, the president and I were encouraging NASA to do what our administration had done elsewhere -with the economy, on foreign policy: shrug off compliancy, cut red tape and unnecessary regulations, and, as I said that day, think better bigger, fail smarter, and work harder. And do it with urgency. [...]Trump liked to quip that "Rich guys love rockets," a reference to the generation of entrepreneurs investing in commercial space flight, including Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos. If their companies' technology could get Americans back to the moon, NASA shouldn't hesitate to work with them. [...] With entrepreneurs such as him [Bezos] and Musk, the US space revival was well under way. And the country had a president who was a builder, who always wanted to go further, faster, and higher in every endeavor.
History may well record Space Force as being one of the most consequential achievements of our administration: providing for the common defense in the boundless reaches of space.
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Quote from: deadman1204 on 11/16/2022 09:09 pm[deleted]Your comments are overly political, even for the policy section. But the Artemis/Moon to Mars program was initiated under the Trump Administration. The Mars portion of the Moon to Mars program is essentially a rebrand of the Journey to Mars but it was there nevertheless under the Trump Administration.
Quote from: yg1968 on 11/16/2022 11:55 pmQuote from: deadman1204 on 11/16/2022 09:09 pm[deleted]Your comments are overly political, even for the policy section. But the Artemis/Moon to Mars program was initiated under the Trump Administration. The Mars portion of the Moon to Mars program is essentially a rebrand of the Journey to Mars but it was there nevertheless under the Trump Administration.Now that we are talking politics: Artemis' Moon to Mars program is nothing but a rebranding of NASA's "Journey to Mars". Which has existed since 2014. In other words: Trump in 2018/2019 merely rebranded a program started under his predecessor Obama. The only thing Trump did was add one element to the program: a crewed lunar landing.That's it. All other aspects, including Lunar Gateway, already were part of "Journey to Mars". Trump claiming "I started it", is just another lie being piled on top of the many thousands of other lies he has made.
(Removed the party political broadcast)I think he could have gotten NASA moving faster, especially with [Bridenstine] in charge, who brought in Starship to help.
I think he could have gotten NASA moving faster, especially with Birkenstein in charge, who brought in Starship to help.
Quote from: spacenut on 11/17/2022 01:18 pmI think he could have gotten NASA moving faster, especially with Birkenstein in charge, who brought in Starship to help. Emphasis mine.This is false. The HLS lander (Lunar Starship) was selected AFTER Bridenstine left NASA. The only thing you can credit Bridenstine for is understanding the fact that without a lander there won't be much of a crewed landing on the Moon. Bridenstine started HLS. But Starship was selected by Kathy Lueders, several months AFTER Bridenstine was gone and (fortunately) a few weeks BEFORE Bill Nelson got into office. NASA management was very clever to select the HLS winner exactly in the period that NASA leadership was in limbo in between two administrators.
Quote from: woods170 on 11/17/2022 09:14 amQuote from: yg1968 on 11/16/2022 11:55 pmQuote from: deadman1204 on 11/16/2022 09:09 pm[deleted]Your comments are overly political, even for the policy section. But the Artemis/Moon to Mars program was initiated under the Trump Administration. The Mars portion of the Moon to Mars program is essentially a rebrand of the Journey to Mars but it was there nevertheless under the Trump Administration.Now that we are talking politics: Artemis' Moon to Mars program is nothing but a rebranding of NASA's "Journey to Mars". Which has existed since 2014. In other words: Trump in 2018/2019 merely rebranded a program started under his predecessor Obama. The only thing Trump did was add one element to the program: a crewed lunar landing.That's it. All other aspects, including Lunar Gateway, already were part of "Journey to Mars". Trump claiming "I started it", is just another lie being piled on top of the many thousands of other lies he has made.I am not sure that the Journey to Mars or Gateway are worth bragging about. The Journey to Mars was a Journey to no where. It didn't include the Moon which made it almost useless. In terms of taking credit for a program, any administration that participated in the program can claim credit for it. If anything it shows that a politician cares enough to even talk about it. In terms of lies or more accurately exaggerations, it's not like other politicians don't bend the truth or exaggerate either. Trump is just more obvious about it.
Quote from: yg1968 on 11/17/2022 01:18 pmQuote from: woods170 on 11/17/2022 09:14 amQuote from: yg1968 on 11/16/2022 11:55 pmQuote from: deadman1204 on 11/16/2022 09:09 pm[deleted]Your comments are overly political, even for the policy section. But the Artemis/Moon to Mars program was initiated under the Trump Administration. The Mars portion of the Moon to Mars program is essentially a rebrand of the Journey to Mars but it was there nevertheless under the Trump Administration.Now that we are talking politics: Artemis' Moon to Mars program is nothing but a rebranding of NASA's "Journey to Mars". Which has existed since 2014. In other words: Trump in 2018/2019 merely rebranded a program started under his predecessor Obama. The only thing Trump did was add one element to the program: a crewed lunar landing.That's it. All other aspects, including Lunar Gateway, already were part of "Journey to Mars". Trump claiming "I started it", is just another lie being piled on top of the many thousands of other lies he has made.I am not sure that the Journey to Mars or Gateway are worth bragging about. The Journey to Mars was a Journey to no where. It didn't include the Moon which made it almost useless. In terms of taking credit for a program, any administration that participated in the program can claim credit for it. If anything it shows that a politician cares enough to even talk about it. In terms of lies or more accurately exaggerations, it's not like other politicians don't bend the truth or exaggerate either. Trump is just more obvious about it. Emphasis mine.Wrong. The Journey to Mars very much included the Moon, just not the lunar surface. But the prototype for the Mars Transfer Vehicle was the Deep Space Habitat (NextSTEP, which later was rebranded Lunar Gateway), which was planned from Day 1 to be tested near the Moon. Just look at NASA's description of the Journey To Mars:https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/atoms/files/journey-to-mars-next-steps-20151008_508.pdf
Quote from: woods170 on 11/17/2022 01:39 pmQuote from: yg1968 on 11/17/2022 01:18 pmI am not sure that the Journey to Mars or Gateway are worth bragging about. The Journey to Mars was a Journey to no where. It didn't include the Moon which made it almost useless. In terms of taking credit for a program, any administration that participated in the program can claim credit for it. If anything it shows that a politician cares enough to even talk about it. In terms of lies or more accurately exaggerations, it's not like other politicians don't bend the truth or exaggerate either. Trump is just more obvious about it. Emphasis mine.Wrong. The Journey to Mars very much included the Moon, just not the lunar surface. But the prototype for the Mars Transfer Vehicle was the Deep Space Habitat (NextSTEP, which later was rebranded Lunar Gateway), which was planned from Day 1 to be tested near the Moon. Just look at NASA's description of the Journey To Mars:https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/atoms/files/journey-to-mars-next-steps-20151008_508.pdfAround the Moon isn't the same as on the surface of the Moon. In any event, I am not sure that I would brag about Gateway. I am somewhat supportive of Gateway because of the international collaboration that it brings but I am glad that Bridenstine decided to minimize it by reducing its scope (e.g., HALO is smaller than what was originally planned).
Quote from: yg1968 on 11/17/2022 01:18 pmI am not sure that the Journey to Mars or Gateway are worth bragging about. The Journey to Mars was a Journey to no where. It didn't include the Moon which made it almost useless. In terms of taking credit for a program, any administration that participated in the program can claim credit for it. If anything it shows that a politician cares enough to even talk about it. In terms of lies or more accurately exaggerations, it's not like other politicians don't bend the truth or exaggerate either. Trump is just more obvious about it. Emphasis mine.Wrong. The Journey to Mars very much included the Moon, just not the lunar surface. But the prototype for the Mars Transfer Vehicle was the Deep Space Habitat (NextSTEP, which later was rebranded Lunar Gateway), which was planned from Day 1 to be tested near the Moon. Just look at NASA's description of the Journey To Mars:https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/atoms/files/journey-to-mars-next-steps-20151008_508.pdf
I am not sure that the Journey to Mars or Gateway are worth bragging about. The Journey to Mars was a Journey to no where. It didn't include the Moon which made it almost useless. In terms of taking credit for a program, any administration that participated in the program can claim credit for it. If anything it shows that a politician cares enough to even talk about it. In terms of lies or more accurately exaggerations, it's not like other politicians don't bend the truth or exaggerate either. Trump is just more obvious about it.