Author Topic: SpaceX Starship IFT-2 : Starbase TX : 18 Nov 2023 DISCUSSION  (Read 457961 times)

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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NSF Livestream:


Starship IFT-2 (Integrated Flight Test 2) Discussion thread

(This will be a heavily viewed thread, so please think before posting and stick to the forum rules.)

Other threads:
   IFT-2 Updates / B9+S25 Updates / B9+S25 Discussion



Really hoping we get to see Starship in powered flight after hot staging.



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« Last Edit: 11/17/2023 03:17 pm by Chris Bergin »

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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https://twitter.com/infographictony/status/1724318877369454644

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INFOGRAPHIC UPDATE: In the coming days the world will get to witness Starship, the largest rocket ever created, liftoff from Boca Chica, Texas. SpaceX plans to launch its Integrated Flight Test-2 mission with hopes of succeeding beyond its predecessor, IFT-1. Here is my (unofficial) interpretation of what is awaiting us & history. Thanks to @LunarCaveman for helping me put this together.

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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twitter.com/csi_starbase/status/1724823676548161623

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I remember all the posts saying that SpaceX was “blatantly violating the clean water act” every time they tested their deluge system. 

Seems like FWS collected data during each of those tests and used it in their analysis.  Can’t gather info without testing. Hopefully @ESGhound and the gang can chill out now. The results speak for themselves.

https://twitter.com/csi_starbase/status/1724824319413436515

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My favorite part is the conclusion.

“the amount of water that is expected to escape the VLA is likely to be less than the amount of water released on this area from an average rainfall event”

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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https://twitter.com/erdayastronaut/status/1724829103512014854

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Our 4K LIVESTREAM for Friday's #Starship launch attempt is UP!!! Bookmark it, turn on notifications, watch the trailer, get hyped up!!! We'll go live at midnight, then get some sleep, leaving you with some amazing views, then wake up and watch HISTORY! -


Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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Thread now unlocked - please stay on-topic. This is for discussion of the IFT-2 launch and launch preparations. There are other threads for approvals process etc.

Offline WannaWalnetto

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https://twitter.com/alexphysics13/status/1724851740447478249

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The FAA has completed the Written Reevaluation of the Programmatic Enviromental Assessment for Starship. This is the very last step before approving the modified launch license ahead of Starship's second test flight.

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WRITTEN RE-EVALUATION OF THE 2022 FINAL PROGRAMMATIC ENVIRONMENTAL ASSESSMENT FOR THE SPACEX STARSHIP/SUPER HEAVY LAUNCH VEHICLE PROGRAM AT THE BOCA CHICA LAUNCH SITE IN CAMERON COUNTY, TEXAS

Deluge System Operation, Addition of a Forward Heat Shield Interstage, and Expansion of the Area of Potential Effects for Cultural Resources

Emphasis mine.

Question about the scope of this WR of the PEA (Written Reevaluation of the Programmatic Environmental Assessment). 

Since it references the “Starship Program,” can we infer that this covers IFT-2 and all subsequent launches from Boca Chica (barring some bad-news event)?
« Last Edit: 11/15/2023 06:28 pm by WannaWalnetto »

Offline Ben Baley

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https://twitter.com/alexphysics13/status/1724851740447478249

Quote
The FAA has completed the Written Reevaluation of the Programmatic Enviromental Assessment for Starship. This is the very last step before approving the modified launch license ahead of Starship's second test flight.

Quote
WRITTEN RE-EVALUATION OF THE 2022 FINAL PROGRAMMATIC ENVIRONMENTAL ASSESSMENT FOR THE SPACEX STARSHIP/SUPER HEAVY LAUNCH VEHICLE PROGRAM AT THE BOCA CHICA LAUNCH SITE IN CAMERON COUNTY, TEXAS

Deluge System Operation, Addition of a Forward Heat Shield Interstage, and Expansion of the Area of Potential Effects for Cultural Resources

Emphasis mine.

Question about the scope of this WR of the PEA (Written Reevaluation of the Programmatic Environmental Assessment). 

Since it references the “Starship Program,” can we infer that this covers IFT-2 and all subsequent launches from Boca Chica (barring some bad-news event)?

Yes it covers subsequent launches just as the PEA prior to the WR covered multiple launches,  however that doesn't mean the launch license  as modified to allow IFT-2 will cover more launches without further modification. The initial launch license issued under the PEA was clear in that it would require modification for further flights beyond IFT-1 even though the PEA covered an expected 5 launches annually.

I expect that will continue to be the case, though hopefully a new WR won't be required between every flight.

Edit: further discussion properly belongs in https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=58853.msg2540356#msg2540356
« Last Edit: 11/15/2023 06:52 pm by Ben Baley »

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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Interesting stat from the FWS report:

twitter.com/drphiltill/status/1724886300304486432

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A lot of the deluge water will vaporize under the plume then be dispersed in the air.

https://twitter.com/csi_starbase/status/1724886489580929297

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Roughly 92% according to the report.
« Last Edit: 11/15/2023 07:30 pm by FutureSpaceTourist »

Online DanClemmensen

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Interesting stat from the FWS report:

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A lot of the deluge water will vaporize under the plume then be dispersed in the air.


Quote
Roughly 92% according to the report.
Well, sort of. It's vaporized and it is blown away from the OLM, but then it condenses, and some percentage will then fall as rain. They do not mention how much or where. then report implicitly accounts for this by calculating the effect as if all of the water just stays liquid. In practice, the rain pattern will vary with the current temperature and humidity. colder or more humid: lots of "rain" near the center. Hotter and dryer: less total "rain", much of it farther away. I thought the video of the cloud moving horizontally away from the OLM during the static fire was really impressive. It moved far and fast. However, if you do the thought experiment, you realize that by the time it gets very far it is probably cooler than the ambient air due to all of that evaporation.

Offline Ben Baley

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FAA license issued for IFT-2, just now.

https://www.faa.gov/media/72856

Ooh baby here we go.

Edit: new link https://www.faa.gov/media/69476
« Last Edit: 11/15/2023 08:09 pm by Ben Baley »

Offline WisRich

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FAA license issued for IFT-2, just now.

https://www.faa.gov/media/72856

Ooh baby here we go.

Pull the FTS Safety Pins and get that thing stacked.

Online Perchlorate

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Great.  Now, let's move from "Wen fly?" to

"SpaceX folks, let's do our best work over the next 60 36 hours, so that this thing hits 70% to 100% of its marks."

Like FAA, FWS, the US Government or not, nothing will smooth out the licensing process more that a mostly successful Flight 2.

Forgive me for stating the obvious, but that's where my head, heart and spirit will be until that big pig crosses the Karman Line.

[ Edit:  36 hours, not 60.  The ability to do simple subtraction has failed me in my seniority/senility. ]
« Last Edit: 11/15/2023 09:27 pm by Perchlorate »
Pete B, a Civil Engineer, in an age of incivility.

Offline Ben Baley

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Great.  Now, let's move from "Wen fly?" to

"SpaceX folks, let's do our best work over the next 60 hours, so that this thing hits 70% to 100% of its marks."

Like FAA, FWS, the US Government or not, nothing will smooth out the licensing process more that a mostly successful Flight 2.

Forgive me for stating the obvious, but that's where my head, heart and spirit will be until that big pig crosses the Karman Line.

Yeah if they can make it past hot-staging without major issues we could see another flight a lot quicker than the 7 months we've waited this time.

Offline wannamoonbase

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Great.  Now, let's move from "Wen fly?" to

"SpaceX folks, let's do our best work over the next 60 hours, so that this thing hits 70% to 100% of its marks."

Like FAA, FWS, the US Government or not, nothing will smooth out the licensing process more that a mostly successful Flight 2.

Forgive me for stating the obvious, but that's where my head, heart and spirit will be until that big pig crosses the Karman Line.

I do not hold any ill feelings to the approving authorities.  Think objectively for a few minutes about the potential chemical energy of a fully fueled Starship stack.

It's a small A-bomb folks, they have to look at everything carefully before saying go!

Now we have that go, so lets get into Flight 2 and hope it is completely successful so a 3rd launch license is quick.
Wildly optimistic prediction, Superheavy recovery on IFT-4 or IFT-5 (Welp a little early on IFT-4, but still have a shot at 5)

Online Perchlorate

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Great.  Now, let's move from "Wen fly?" to

"SpaceX folks, let's do our best work over the next 60 hours, so that this thing hits 70% to 100% of its marks."

Like FAA, FWS, the US Government or not, nothing will smooth out the licensing process more that a mostly successful Flight 2.

Forgive me for stating the obvious, but that's where my head, heart and spirit will be until that big pig crosses the Karman Line.

I do not hold any ill feelings to the approving authorities.  Think objectively for a few minutes about the potential chemical energy of a fully fueled Starship stack.

It's a small A-bomb folks, they have to look at everything carefully before saying go!

Now we have that go, so lets get into Flight 2 and hope it is completely successful so a 3rd launch license is quick.

Exactly my point.
Pete B, a Civil Engineer, in an age of incivility.

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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NSF pulling out all the stops for launch coverage:

https://twitter.com/nasaspaceflight/status/1724918339091255602

Quote
Built from scratch, the successor to Danger Van 🫡
youtube.com/watch?v=DB_Fzn…

It even has Starlink! Only possible of course because of the amazing community that supports NSF. Looking forward to some great launch views.

Online TomH

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Hurrah!

Offline catdlr

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NSF pulling out all the stops for launch coverage:

https://twitter.com/nasaspaceflight/status/1724918339091255602

Quote
Built from scratch, the successor to Danger Van 🫡
youtube.com/watch?v=DB_Fzn…

It even has Starlink! Only possible of course because of the amazing community that supports NSF. Looking forward to some great launch views.

The video stream or feed requires adjustment, as the image is halting and catching up (jumping) with missing frames. This issue is only noticeable when viewing something in motion. It's crucial to rectify this problem before the launch; otherwise, the same issue will persist.
It's Tony De La Rosa, ...and no, I'm not a Feline Dealer!!

Offline Slarty1080

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Yay! I expect this one to be heard loud and clear all the way to Washington.
My optimistic hope is that it will become cool to really think about things... rather than just doing reactive bullsh*t based on no knowledge (Brian Cox)

Online Perchlorate

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NSF pulling out all the stops for launch coverage:

https://twitter.com/nasaspaceflight/status/1724918339091255602

Quote
Built from scratch, the successor to Danger Van 🫡
youtube.com/watch?v=DB_Fzn…

It even has Starlink! Only possible of course because of the amazing community that supports NSF. Looking forward to some great launch views.

The video stream or feed requires adjustment, as the image is halting and catching up (jumping) with missing frames. This issue is only noticeable when viewing something in motion. It's crucial to rectify this problem before the launch; otherwise, the same issue will persist.

I watched this little fun clip on X, and didn't ntoice stream/feed issues.  The camera work was a little goofy, but I think that was intentional informality.  But if there is a real issue with the feed, I hope they'll get on it.
Pete B, a Civil Engineer, in an age of incivility.

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