Author Topic: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 1  (Read 424518 times)

Offline clongton

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #460 on: 06/05/2012 10:17 am »
I hope that, compared to Vandenberg, Boca Chica has relatively few pinnipeds. 



Uh oh. Texas has sea turtles. Wikipedia says some critically endangered Kemp's Ridleys nest on Padre Island between April and August. Maybe SpaceX could launch all their rockets during the other half of the year?

There are no plans to burn Padre Island. This is a non-issue for all but the most fanatical purest.
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Offline billh

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #461 on: 06/05/2012 01:02 pm »
Uh oh. Texas has sea turtles. Wikipedia says some critically endangered Kemp's Ridleys nest on Padre Island between April and August. Maybe SpaceX could launch all their rockets during the other half of the year?
Padre Island is over 100 miles long and Boca Chica is several miles south of its southern tip. I don't think SpaceX will be crowding them out. Most of the Kemp's Ridleys nest in the Padre Island National Seashore, which is over 30 miles from Boca Chica in the middle part of the island.

Offline baldusi

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #462 on: 06/05/2012 04:08 pm »
No environmentalist I know will let simple facts get into its fanaticism.

Offline Prober

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #463 on: 06/05/2012 07:53 pm »
No environmentalist I know will let simple facts get into its fanaticism.

Never know …….we had a desert tortoise block a high speed rail project for 8-10 years.

http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2011/mar/25/desertxpress-high-speed-rail-project-rolls-forward/

As of this date the project is still in limbo.
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Offline sdsds

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #464 on: 06/08/2012 05:51 am »
Just have to make sure that no endanger critters are in the blast zone

It's totally reasonable to think it's that simple. But if you have the time, read http://www.nmfs.noaa.gov/pr/pdfs/permits/vafb_ea.pdf. To determine the impact their activities were having on wildlife, they needed to measure the hearing ability of sea lions both before and after Delta IV launches.  As Dave Barry would have written, "I am not making this up."
« Last Edit: 06/08/2012 05:51 am by sdsds »
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Offline astrobrian

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #465 on: 06/08/2012 04:11 pm »
People freaking out about this are making a mountain out of a mole hill and (it seems to me) just trying to grind personal axes.

Possibly right, but having lived in Texas all my life I can tell you they have a way around here of creating real havoc when it comes to the forward progress of a great idea. They've done it in the past and will do it again most likely. I am just hoping this is not the next one they cause our state to lose due to their shortsightedness.

Offline Bender

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #466 on: 06/13/2012 11:15 pm »
Musk is meeting with Texas Governor and legislators today to discuss proposed launch site.
http://blog.chron.com/sciguy/2012/06/musk-says-texas-is-leading-candidate-for-spaceport/
Quote from Musk:
“So, right now, Texas, the south coast of Texas is the lead candidate for that third launch site, and I’m actually flying to meet with the Governor later today and a number of people on the Texas legislature side to talk about that as well as any potential questions in the future about flying astronauts if we’re successful in winning future NASA business in that regard.”


Offline Danderman

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #467 on: 06/13/2012 11:24 pm »
Musk is meeting with Texas Governor and legislators today to discuss proposed launch site.
http://blog.chron.com/sciguy/2012/06/musk-says-texas-is-leading-candidate-for-spaceport/
Quote from Musk:
“So, right now, Texas, the south coast of Texas is the lead candidate for that third launch site, and I’m actually flying to meet with the Governor later today and a number of people on the Texas legislature side to talk about that as well as any potential questions in the future about flying astronauts if we’re successful in winning future NASA business in that regard.”

Ooops.





Sorry, I couldn't resist.
« Last Edit: 06/13/2012 11:24 pm by Danderman »

Offline baldusi

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #468 on: 06/13/2012 11:57 pm »
Musk is meeting with Texas Governor and legislators today to discuss proposed launch site.
http://blog.chron.com/sciguy/2012/06/musk-says-texas-is-leading-candidate-for-spaceport/
Quote from Musk:
“So, right now, Texas, the south coast of Texas is the lead candidate for that third launch site, and I’m actually flying to meet with the Governor later today and a number of people on the Texas legislature side to talk about that as well as any potential questions in the future about flying astronauts if we’re successful in winning future NASA business in that regard.”
Jokes aside, can you reach the ISS from there? The speculations of a lofted trajectory are interesting, then. Other question would be about a Heavy to EML1 or 2 (which I understand is a yes).

Offline Danderman

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #469 on: 06/14/2012 12:23 am »

Jokes aside, can you reach the ISS from there? The speculations of a lofted trajectory are interesting, then.

Yes.


Offline sdsds

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #470 on: 06/14/2012 03:03 am »

Jokes aside, can you reach the ISS from there? The speculations of a lofted trajectory are interesting, then.

Yes.


You can launch to ISS inclination, without a dog-leg, from any site between 51.6° N and 51.6° S. The question for SpaceX in Texas is, can you do it while meeting FAA range safety criteria? In particular, can you reach ISS on a trajectory where the expected number of casualties per mission is less than 0.00003 (Ec < 30 X 10-6). To do that, you can't really over-fly much populated land....

See e.g.:
http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/ast/licenses_permits/media/Ac4311fn.pdf
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Offline dcporter

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #471 on: 06/14/2012 11:31 am »
Possibly right, but having lived in Texas all my life I can tell you they have a way around here of creating real havoc when it comes to the forward progress of a great idea. They've done it in the past and will do it again most likely. I am just hoping this is not the next one they cause our state to lose due to their shortsightedness.

Could we ease up on the environmentalist-bashing? We as a society have decided that extinction* is bad, and that the state of the world around us actually does impact us. Sometimes that priority conflicts with economic development – even really job-y economic development, and yes sometimes even your favorite awesome project. Folks are trying against long odds and public opinion to maintain ecosystems whose complexity, and whose impact on us, we frankly don't understand; calling that shortsighted is staggeringly shortsighted.

I hope SpaceX gets its private spaceport, and I hope they (or whoever) do it without deafening sea lions who probably have to be able to hear in order to predate.

* EDIT to note that my use of the word "extinction" wasn't particularly central to my point, but has dominated the responses to it.  The moderate folks who reacted negatively to that word then went on to make the point I was trying to make.
« Last Edit: 06/14/2012 07:11 pm by dcporter »

Offline ChileVerde

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #472 on: 06/14/2012 12:20 pm »

Good news for Brownsville:

Quote
http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/state/article/Texas-rockets-ahead-in-quest-for-launch-site-3632704.php

Texas rockets ahead in quest for launch site
By Eric Berger
Updated 12:12 a.m., Thursday, June 14, 2012

SpaceX now appears to like the Lone Star State.

During a visit to his company's rocket testing facility in MacGregor on Wednesday, SpaceX founder Elon Musk said Brownsville is his preferred site for the construction of a new spaceport.

"Right now, Texas, the south coast of Texas, is the lead candidate," Musk said.

Texas is competing with Florida and Puerto Rico for a launch facility from which there would be as many as 12 rocket launches a year, according to the company.

Musk met with Gov. Rick Perry on Wednesday to discuss the site.

"The governor talked with the company about what the state could do to encourage them to pick Texas as a place for its spaceport," said Perry spokeswoman Catherine Frazier. "The governor's office is going to continue working with SpaceX to try and bring them here."

Musk's comments represent a turnaround since April, when he said the state had made minimal efforts in recruiting his company.

Since then, the Houston Chronicle reported that the state is developing a multimillion-dollar package that could include money from the Texas Enterprise Fund, infrastructure support from the Texas Department of Transportation and assistance from the Texas Workforce Commission, among others, to attract SpaceX.

SpaceX has conducted its third successful rocket launch and concluded a widely celebrated cargo mission to the International Space Station, becoming the first private company to fly a spacecraft to the orbiting laboratory.

An official with the Texas Space Alliance, which promotes commercial space development in the state, welcomed Musk's comments.

"This is outstanding," said Bob Lancaster, the alliance's president. "It's time for us as Texans to take a deep breath, understand what's at stake and the enormous potential if we succeed, and redouble our efforts to help make this happen."

Lancaster sees a spaceport as a critical opening for Texas to remain a major player in human spaceflight during coming decades.

(snip)
"I can’t tell you which asteroid, but there will be one in 2025," Bolden asserted.

Offline simonbp

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #473 on: 06/14/2012 03:19 pm »
Anyone know where the Puerto Rican site is? My guess would be in the Yabucoa area, as they could go due-east and skirt between the Virgin Islands, or go south to ISS inclinations.

Offline jnc

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #474 on: 06/14/2012 03:42 pm »
We as a society have decided that extinction is bad

Which is odd, given that extinction is the natural order of things, and the vast majority of species that have gone extinct did so long before humans appeared on the scene. (Yes, yes, I know, the rate has gone up, but my point is that it's a more nuanced thing than 'all extinctions are bad', which is the position of current Federal legislation in this area.)

I wonder how much having the state government on SX's side (as reported here) will be able to help with the environmental issues? (Bearing especially in mind that delay is often tantamount to killing a project, and the prospect of delay over environmental issues would lead a lot of people to cross that option off the list, and look elsewhere. Who knows how much of that attitude SX will adopt.)

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« Last Edit: 06/14/2012 03:48 pm by jnc »
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Offline mr. mark

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #475 on: 06/14/2012 04:01 pm »
Extinction? Really? Are you really going there? Please, NASA has a long history of rocket launches next to wetlands. They have an excellent track record. I'm sure SpaceX with correct oversight could do much the same. This is too much environmental hype and I'm a big conservationist myself.

Offline JBF

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #476 on: 06/14/2012 04:05 pm »
Extinction? Really? Are you really going there? Please, NASA has a long history of rocket launches next to wetlands. They have an excellent track record. I'm sure SpaceX with correct oversight could do much the same. This is too much environmental hype and I'm a big conservationist myself.

One side goes with kills all jobs the other sides goes with mass extinctions, both are at fault.
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Offline ChileVerde

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #477 on: 06/14/2012 04:26 pm »
Anyone know where the Puerto Rican site is? My guess would be in the Yabucoa area, as they could go due-east and skirt between the Virgin Islands, or go south to ISS inclinations.

My guess is Vieques, as it also has a fairly clear shot to the east and is relatively undeveloped courtesy of the USN, which used a largish part of it for target practice for quite a while.
"I can’t tell you which asteroid, but there will be one in 2025," Bolden asserted.

Offline meekGee

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #478 on: 06/14/2012 04:39 pm »
Extinction? Really? Are you really going there? Please, NASA has a long history of rocket launches next to wetlands. They have an excellent track record. I'm sure SpaceX with correct oversight could do much the same. This is too much environmental hype and I'm a big conservationist myself.

One side goes with kills all jobs the other sides goes with mass extinctions, both are at fault.

It's all been politicized beyond reason.  Environmental concerns are very important, but they are being used as a tool by people with agendas that have nothing to do with the environments.  Exactly the same with jobs, or almost any other flag.

The main fault is with the people really.  Folks don't seem to care about any of these topics one way or the other until they (the topics) get associated with a political camp.  At that point, everyone immediately knows were they stand, and aways we go.

(hehe... am I off-topic here?)

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Offline dcporter

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Re: SpaceX Texas launch site
« Reply #479 on: 06/14/2012 06:58 pm »
Extinction? Really? Are you really going there? Please, NASA has a long history of rocket launches next to wetlands. They have an excellent track record. I'm sure SpaceX with correct oversight could do much the same. This is too much environmental hype and I'm a big conservationist myself.

I went there in broad terms because this board was bashing environmentalism in very broad terms. I assume that a happy middle ground between wild-eyed conservationists and wild-eyed conservationist-bashers can be found, and correct oversight is exactly what I support. But the amount of unanswered snideness about how much trouble "they" always cause "us", and the examples of evil, obnoxious environmentalists getting thrown about, were unacceptable to me. This isn't a pro- or anti-conservation board, so I have no particular problem asking the anti-folks to cool their jets a little. They chill, I chill, and this thread goes back on topic.

EDIT: I actually agree wholeheartedly with Mr. Mark & JBF.  "Extinction" is apparently way more of a buzzword than I realized, so I apologize for effectively derailing my own argument up front.
« Last Edit: 06/14/2012 07:13 pm by dcporter »

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