Quote from: Danderman on 12/14/2012 11:49 pmQuote from: Stan Black on 12/14/2012 07:11 pmQuote from: Danderman on 12/14/2012 05:27 pmQuote from: Stan Black on 12/14/2012 05:11 pm Those banks of six thrusters are for roll control? Are they an existing model?Actually, it's 7 thrusters on each side of the node, and 5 thrusters on each side of the forward body, exactly the same as FGB.It has additional onesWhere? What are the red covered things in a 2x3 clusters?http://www.energia.ru/ru/news/news-2012/im/photo_12-14-07.jpghttp://www.energia.ru/ru/news/news-2012/im/photo_12-14-11.jpg
Quote from: Stan Black on 12/14/2012 07:11 pmQuote from: Danderman on 12/14/2012 05:27 pmQuote from: Stan Black on 12/14/2012 05:11 pm Those banks of six thrusters are for roll control? Are they an existing model?Actually, it's 7 thrusters on each side of the node, and 5 thrusters on each side of the forward body, exactly the same as FGB.It has additional onesWhere?
Quote from: Danderman on 12/14/2012 05:27 pmQuote from: Stan Black on 12/14/2012 05:11 pm Those banks of six thrusters are for roll control? Are they an existing model?Actually, it's 7 thrusters on each side of the node, and 5 thrusters on each side of the forward body, exactly the same as FGB.It has additional ones
Quote from: Stan Black on 12/14/2012 05:11 pm Those banks of six thrusters are for roll control? Are they an existing model?Actually, it's 7 thrusters on each side of the node, and 5 thrusters on each side of the forward body, exactly the same as FGB.
Those banks of six thrusters are for roll control? Are they an existing model?
Quote from: Stan Black on 12/15/2012 07:13 amQuote from: Danderman on 12/14/2012 11:49 pmQuote from: Stan Black on 12/14/2012 07:11 pmQuote from: Danderman on 12/14/2012 05:27 pmQuote from: Stan Black on 12/14/2012 05:11 pmThose banks of six thrusters are for roll control? Are they an existing model?Actually, it's 7 thrusters on each side of the node, and 5 thrusters on each side of the forward body, exactly the same as FGB.It has additional onesWhere? What are the red covered things in a 2x3 clusters?http://www.energia.ru/ru/news/news-2012/im/photo_12-14-07.jpghttp://www.energia.ru/ru/news/news-2012/im/photo_12-14-11.jpgCould be small roll control thrusters.
Quote from: Danderman on 12/14/2012 11:49 pmQuote from: Stan Black on 12/14/2012 07:11 pmQuote from: Danderman on 12/14/2012 05:27 pmQuote from: Stan Black on 12/14/2012 05:11 pmThose banks of six thrusters are for roll control? Are they an existing model?Actually, it's 7 thrusters on each side of the node, and 5 thrusters on each side of the forward body, exactly the same as FGB.It has additional onesWhere? What are the red covered things in a 2x3 clusters?http://www.energia.ru/ru/news/news-2012/im/photo_12-14-07.jpghttp://www.energia.ru/ru/news/news-2012/im/photo_12-14-11.jpg
Quote from: Stan Black on 12/14/2012 07:11 pmQuote from: Danderman on 12/14/2012 05:27 pmQuote from: Stan Black on 12/14/2012 05:11 pmThose banks of six thrusters are for roll control? Are they an existing model?Actually, it's 7 thrusters on each side of the node, and 5 thrusters on each side of the forward body, exactly the same as FGB.It has additional onesWhere?
Quote from: Danderman on 12/14/2012 05:27 pmQuote from: Stan Black on 12/14/2012 05:11 pmThose banks of six thrusters are for roll control? Are they an existing model?Actually, it's 7 thrusters on each side of the node, and 5 thrusters on each side of the forward body, exactly the same as FGB.It has additional ones
Quote from: Stan Black on 12/14/2012 05:11 pmThose banks of six thrusters are for roll control? Are they an existing model?Actually, it's 7 thrusters on each side of the node, and 5 thrusters on each side of the forward body, exactly the same as FGB.
Regarding MLM docking adaptors... - MLM Nadir has Passive Transformed Hybrid adaptor, able to support Active Hybrid & Active Standard Probe spacecraft. It's clear.
Quote from: Raul on 12/15/2012 06:42 pmRegarding MLM docking adaptors... - MLM Nadir has Passive Transformed Hybrid adaptor, able to support Active Hybrid & Active Standard Probe spacecraft. It's clear.Is it? The standard drogue and cone docking system used on current Soyuz and Progress spacecraft (SSVP-G4000) features a docking-ring that is considerably smaller in diameter than the docking-ring on the hybrid system (SSVP-M8000). Also, it only holds eight hook&latch assemblies, as opposed to the twelve carried on APAS and hybrid systems. As far as I know the hybrid system features drogue and cone, but in combination with an APAS-89/95-sized docking ring.So, either - the nadir docking port on MLM features a system that can handle both, different diameter, docking-rings (Soyuz size and APAS-89/95 size)OR- the Soyuz and Progress spacecraft planned to dock with MLM nadir are equipped with hybrid docking ports, in stead of the standard docking ports.With all the images of MLM so far showing the nadir port covered with a red cover plate, I have no clue as to what type of docking port it actually holds. The only thing clear to me is the diameter: that clearly is APAS-89/95 size.
So, either - the nadir docking port on MLM features a system that can handle both, different diameter, docking-rings (Soyuz size and APAS-89/95 size)
OR- the Soyuz and Progress spacecraft planned to dock with MLM nadir are equipped with hybrid docking ports, in stead of the standard docking ports.
Quote from: woods170 on 12/17/2012 09:40 amSo, either - the nadir docking port on MLM features a system that can handle both, different diameter, docking-rings (Soyuz size and APAS-89/95 size)Yes. Nadir MLM port will be able to handle both diameters - standard SSVP and hybrid SSVP-M (APAS ring). It means for Soyuz/Progress spacecraft via standard SSVP and later for Progress M-UM with Nodal Module(UM) via SSVP-M. Same port will have also UM nadir.
OK, thanks Raul. One further question: will changing from standard Drogue&Cone (standard SVPP) to hybrid Drogue&Cone (SSVP-M) require (manual) re-configuration by the ISS crew?
Quote from: Raul on 12/15/2012 06:42 pmRegarding MLM docking adaptors... - MLM Nadir has Passive Transformed Hybrid adaptor, able to support Active Hybrid & Active Standard Probe spacecraft. It's clear.Is it? The standard drogue and cone docking system used on current Soyuz and Progress spacecraft (SSVP-G4000) features a docking-ring that is considerably smaller in diameter than the docking-ring on the hybrid system (SSVP-M8000). Also, it only holds eight hook&latch assemblies, as opposed to the twelve carried on APAS and hybrid systems. As far as I know the hybrid system features drogue and cone, but in combination with an APAS-89/95-sized docking ring.So, either - the nadir docking port on MLM features a system that can handle both, different diameter, docking-rings (Soyuz size and APAS-89/95 size)
It will fly with KURS-NA systems onboard. So we may see different Soyuz/Progress design similar to Mir APAS, but this I have yet to confirm even though I have found animation still of UM with IDSS-APAS Docking systems and New Generation KURS-NA design. I have not seen it recently though.
Quote from: russianhalo117 on 12/14/2012 10:14 pmIt will fly with KURS-NA systems onboard. So we may see different Soyuz/Progress design similar to Mir APAS, but this I have yet to confirm even though I have found animation still of UM with IDSS-APAS Docking systems and New Generation KURS-NA design. I have not seen it recently though.I have not yet seen Kurs-NA antennas on MLM yet. Also, does this mean that the module will fly with a Kurs-NA passive box, or will it also carry an active Kurs-NA box for docking with ISS?I have held one of the planned MLM Kurs-cm active antennas in my hand (a short range antenna), so I would be surprised if there were a change in its active docking system.
With all the images of MLM so far showing the nadir port covered with a red cover plate, I have no clue as to what type of docking port it actually holds. The only thing clear to me is the diameter: that clearly is APAS-89/95 size.
Quote from: woods170 on 12/17/2012 09:40 amWith all the images of MLM so far showing the nadir port covered with a red cover plate, I have no clue as to what type of docking port it actually holds. The only thing clear to me is the diameter: that clearly is APAS-89/95 size. My X-ray generator gave such a picture
I think you've got it, Woods - there is simply a probe/drogue style (SSVP-G4000) ring stacked atop an APAS (SSVP-M8000) ring. So it's basically just an APAS-to-probe/drogue adapter. When the last probe/cone vehicle departs MLM nadir, it will probably take the adapter with it.
However, with the added mass of the adapter the returning vehicle would probably have to use more fuel for the de-orbit burn. Correct?
Much bigger mass has DC-1 Pirs module, which is planned to burn in atmosphere together with Progress M-20M. So such adapter would be not so big problem.But I think that such adapter would be useful to have it later at Nodal Module, so maybe would be better to relocate it by ERA manipulator, than sent it to atmosphere with Progress. Even when UM will have own adapter, one spare adapter would be useful I think.
Well, the adapter is visible from just about every angle in the pictures from the transfer of MLM to Energia. However, no grapple fixture for ERA (or SSRMS for that matter) is visible on the adapter. So, such a suggested re-location is likely not going to happen.