Author Topic: FAILURE: LauncherOne - Start me up - Cornwall - January 9, 2023 (23:08 UTC)  (Read 51395 times)

Offline zubenelgenubi

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Launch NET December?
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Offline ringsider

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Starting to wonder if Cornwall Spaceport's business model is based on apron parking charges for 747s...

Offline zubenelgenubi

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NextSpaceFlight, updated November 29:
NET December
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Offline satcomopsuk

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Virgin Orbit completed a launch simulation on Friday evening [UK] with Cosmic Girl flying out from Newquay Spaceport
Launch control used satellite voice for the communications link.

Launch track as seen in the attached image
[Data from PlanePlotter]

Launch altitude was reached as CG tracked to the release point.

There are a number of active NOTAMS including this one...


A4772/22 NOTAMN
Q) LPXX/QXXXX/IV/NBO/E /000/999/3411N01604W182
A) LPPC LPPO B) 2212162216 C) 2212170016
E) OPERATORS ARE ADVISED THAT THE AREA BOUNDED BY:
370858N 0163047W - 364510N 0141132W - 312823N 0154638W -
312515N 0160213W - 312356N 0162405W - 312547N 0164415W -
313042N 0170414W - 313856N 0172341W - 313934N 0172452W -
313044N 0173903W - 314608N 0173542W - 370858N 0163047W  MAY BE
AFFECTED BY SPACE DEBRIS, IN THE EVENT OF A SECOND STAGE FAILURE OF
THE VIRGIN ORBIT SPACE VEHICLE DURING LAUNCH.
ATC CLEARANCES MAY BE ISSUED TO ALLOW AIRCRAFT TO DEPART FROM THE
AIRPORTS LOCATED IN MADEIRA ARCHIPELAGO OR TO ENTER/CROSS DANGER
AREA 5 (EUVIRGIN 5), IF REQUIRED BY THE FLIGHT CREW.
IF ATC IS INFORMED BY VIRGIN ORBIT THAT A SECOND STAGE FAILURE HAS
INDEED OCCURRED, REROUTING FOR ALL SUBSEQUENT TRAFFIC INTENDING TO
ENTER THE AREA WILL BE PROVIDED AROUND THE DANGER AREA AND AIRPORT
OPERATIONS IN MADEIRA ARCHIPELAGO WILL BE SUSPENDED UNTIL THE SPACE
DEBRIS HAVE REACHED THE SURFACE.
FOR FULL DETAILS CONCERNING THIS ACTIVITY, SEE AIC Y 95/2022, ISSUED
BY NATS UK.

Launch will take place around midnight GMT  ,  possibly from December 14th onwards.
« Last Edit: 12/05/2022 09:20 pm by zubenelgenubi »

Offline ringsider

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How this is not considered an "Irish" launch, given the location of the racetrack within Ireland's territorial waters?

Presumably the Irish Govt. have to give permission for activities making use of their EEZ?

And doesn't that then make it actually a European Union launch as well, rather than a UK launch?

« Last Edit: 12/05/2022 09:21 pm by zubenelgenubi »

Offline satcomopsuk

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https://i.postimg.cc/LX74kwTg/Calif-Haz-Ops.jpg

Hmmm...but that would make the June launch  Mexican as the release was  within their economic maritime zone....I think  ????

The launch mission commences from UK soil , that's good enough for me.   ;)
« Last Edit: 12/05/2022 09:22 pm by zubenelgenubi »

Offline edzieba

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How this is not considered an "Irish" launch, given the location of the racetrack within Ireland's territorial waters?

Presumably the Irish Govt. have to give permission for activities making use of their EEZ?

And doesn't that then make it actually a European Union launch as well, rather than a UK launch?


EEZ != territorial waters. Plus, as the ICAO will inform you:
Quote
Exclusive Economic Zones (EEZs) only have material effect on maritime resources,
including the sea bed, and do not have any legal consequences for aviation (UNCLOS
Articles 57 and 58).
« Last Edit: 12/05/2022 09:22 pm by zubenelgenubi »

Offline Welsh Dragon

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EEZ != territorial waters. Plus, as the ICAO will inform you:
Quote
Exclusive Economic Zones (EEZs) only have material effect on maritime resources,
including the sea bed, and do not have any legal consequences for aviation (UNCLOS
Articles 57 and 58).
[/quote]True, but that also means it's not a British launch.

Offline RickA

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The proposed definition as Irish would mean that any launch that staged over another countries EEZ would be a launch from that other country. Plenty of US launches would 'be from' various Caribbean states or Mexico I think. They might even count as 'from Britain' if they occurred over the EEZ of a British overseas possession.

Will launches from a site in Scotland that, say, stage over the Norwegian EEZ count as being 'from' Norway?

Also, which stage counts when different stages light over different EEZs?

Launch preparation and 'stage zero' takeoff are from the UK and the rocket portion lights in international airspace. Let's call it a launch from Britain.

Offline eeergo

Quote
EEZ != territorial waters. Plus, as the ICAO will inform you:
Quote
Exclusive Economic Zones (EEZs) only have material effect on maritime resources,
including the sea bed, and do not have any legal consequences for aviation (UNCLOS
Articles 57 and 58).
True, but that also means it's not a British launch.

This launch is very similar in nature to Pegasus' 1997 launch from the Spanish Canary Islands, although that one was actually more "Spanish" than this one is British, because the payload and contract was actually fully coming from that country.

https://digitalcommons.usu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=2322&context=smallsat

An American LV (then Pegasus XL, now LauncherOne) contracted from an American company (then Orbital, now VirginOrbit) to launch from a jointly-modified and collaboratively-managed base (then Gando AFB, now Cornwall Airport) in a European country (then Spain, now UK), through a contract managed by its national government (then more directly contracted by the Spanish gov, now having a more commercial character with a joint effort for some of the payloads, and others just hitching a ride on the flight).

Really not the "first commercial rocket to lift off from Western Europe", unless you go full geographic extremist and consider the Canaries to be Africa.
-DaviD-

Offline daedalus1

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Pedantics.  It's starting It's journey to space from Cornwall so is British.  The launch site is always considered the point of take off from the ground .

Offline eeergo

Pedantics.  It's starting It's journey to space from Cornwall so is British.  The launch site is always considered the point of take off from the ground .

Was the above-quoted launch Spanish instead of US? Were the San Marco launches Kenyan instead of Italian? Were Hummaguir launches Algerian instead of French? Were the Blue Streak/Europa launches from Woomera Australian instead of British?
-DaviD-

Offline daedalus1

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Yes and Electron  (mainly US built) is New Zealand.

Offline Bean Kenobi

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Yes and Electron  (mainly US built) is New Zealand.

In this case, what about Electron when launched from MARS ?  ???
« Last Edit: 12/06/2022 10:59 am by Bean Kenobi »

Offline Bean Kenobi

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Yes and Electron  (mainly US built) is New Zealand.

Really ? ???

Offline eeergo

Yes and Electron  (mainly US built) is New Zealand.

Good that you keep consistency in your definitions, but no analyst considers them this way. Spain, recently-independent Algeria, Kenya and, to some extent, Australia - had close to zero expertise, staff or technology to launch those vehicles. Sea Launch campaigns are not considered Kiribatean launches either.

NZ is a different issue because the design, teams and large part of the manufacturing is based on the country, much unlike the historical examples I pointed out. Still, nowadays their launches are many times binned into US statistics because of the licensing and export-controlled technology without which RL would probably not be able to operate. There are many posts about this, but I believe it can best be classed as a NZ-US partnership, much the same way as SeaLaunch was a Russo-Ukranian-US conglomerate, or ILS Russo-American, or Starsem Russo-European.
« Last Edit: 12/06/2022 12:01 pm by eeergo »
-DaviD-

Offline satcomopsuk

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It seems that launch may be delayed until early 2023 if issues with airspace clearance cannot be resolved.
Ireland still has to agree to use of its airspace.
The simulated run flew through the latter , but release took place further south.

Could the launch run should be started further south , avoiding the Irish zone ?
How would that impact on orbital insertion ?

Offline daedalus1

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eeergo..... I'm talking country of launch site eg this launch is from Britain not the Irish Sea.
Who provides the hardware and launch services is a very complex issue.

Offline eeergo

eeergo..... I'm talking country of launch site eg this launch is from Britain not the Irish Sea.
Who provides the hardware and launch services is a very complex issue.

Fine, but above caveats still apply. Not arguing whether it's Irish vs British, but whether it should be counted as "first British launch" when the company, rocket and "pad" infrastructure are American, taking as precedent historical launches from other countries which were counted as for the country of provenance of the rocket/provider.

First launch based out of Britain, albeit by foreign entities? Sure, just as San Marco's Italian launches were based out of Kenya, or French Diamant launches out of Algeria. First rocket to be launched from Western Europe, as the company is claiming? Not really, see 1997's Pegasus from Spain, which by the way was also pretty commercially contracted. First British or Western European rocket launch? Evidently not, starting by British launches from Australia.
-DaviD-

Offline daedalus1

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eeergo..... I'm talking country of launch site eg this launch is from Britain not the Irish Sea.
Who provides the hardware and launch services is a very complex issue.

Fine, but above caveats still apply. Not arguing whether it's Irish vs British, but whether it should be counted as "first British launch" when the company, rocket and "pad" infrastructure are American, taking as precedent historical launches from other countries which were counted as for the country of provenance of the rocket/provider.

First launch based out of Britain, albeit by foreign entities? Sure, just as San Marco's Italian launches were based out of Kenya, or French Diamant launches out of Algeria. First rocket to be launched from Western Europe, as the company is claiming? Not really, see 1997's Pegasus from Spain, which by the way was also pretty commercially contracted. First British or Western European rocket launch? Evidently not, starting by British launches from Australia.
As I've said already, the hardware etc are complicated.  I just said the launch site is where it originally set of from,  not where an aircraft dropped it.
It was in response to people debating that issue.

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