Author Topic: Current NSF Forum Feedback Thread 2  (Read 177015 times)

Offline Metalskin

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Re: Current NSF Forum Feedback Thread 2
« Reply #480 on: 03/15/2024 01:54 am »
Personally, I get tired of the the update threads that get multiple posts of different tweets that are all basically the same thing.

I also get frustrated by tonnes of updates at a highly minute level of detail, such that there can be pages on just one event.

Oh, I know some people live for that detail, but unfortunately not everyone does. It can get old, really fast.
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Online catdlr

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Re: Current NSF Forum Feedback Thread 2
« Reply #481 on: 03/15/2024 04:31 am »
Personally, I get tired of the the update threads that get multiple posts of different tweets that are all basically the same thing.

I also get frustrated by tonnes of updates at a highly minute level of detail, such that there can be pages on just one event.

Oh, I know some people live for that detail, but unfortunately not everyone does. It can get old, really fast.

Metalskin,

Numerous tweets are posted to celebrate special events and commend vendors and special individuals. In certain cases, the same tweet is shared by multiple users with their own comments. Therefore, all versions of the tweet are included. Further, photographers take their own unique and indelible photos of the same subject. Although it may seem repetitive, we are all simply looking at different perspectives of the same event.

Best,
Tony
« Last Edit: 03/15/2024 04:32 am by catdlr »
It's Tony De La Rosa, ...I don't create this stuff, I just report it.

Offline ELinder

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Re: Current NSF Forum Feedback Thread 2
« Reply #482 on: 03/15/2024 12:42 pm »
I think there just needs to be a stricter interpretation of what really belongs in an update thread. Is it a new piece of information or has it already been covered? Is it yet another link to a tweet covering the same event? Do we really need 5 different people stating the same information?  Is it something that really furthers the goal of the thread title or is it something trivial? Is it a rehash post or video of previously covered information or speculation of what is coming?

Obviously a lot of this is a judgement call and what one person considers important another doesnít. Big events generate big coverage as expected. It just seems like the updates are over saturated with too many people with too many perspectives covering too few events. Updates should be just the highlights. Everything else is examination and discussion.

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: Current NSF Forum Feedback Thread 2
« Reply #483 on: 03/16/2024 11:25 am »
This is a difficult topic simply because people have different preferences. But I do appreciate people raising it and hopefully we can at least recalibrate whatís posted to reduce annoyance.

FWIW my thoughts are:

1. Max 2 threads per launch (Updates and Discussion). Any more threads will just result in even more posts in the wrong threads, resulting in more annoyed readers and more work for mods.

2. Most launches do not need 2 threads, 1 is usually sufficient. For example, the single thread for the Starlink launch from the beginning of this week currently has 63 posts and less than 9k views. Single threads eliminate the Ďposting on wrong threadí issue. If itís a relatively low volume thread I donít see an issue mixing updates and discussion (the latter is usually very limited on low volume threads).

3. Only more Ďsignificantí launches need 2 threads. Yes, itís subjective. I think the balance on the forum currently is good, but please post if you disagree. I know some people posted that they wanted a single thread for the IFT-3 launch. Personally I think thatís a step too far.

4. I agree that update thread posts should include new info, but there are clearly different views of what the threshold is for Ďnewí. For example, you might be surprised to know that I do not post every launch photo tweet I see. I try to post ones that show different angles / perspectives. But I often find that tweets I donít post, usually because I think they are too similar to ones already posted, are subsequently posted by someone else. Also sometimes a later tweet just has a better quality photo (yes, subjective again) and Iíll post it but not go back and remove an earlier similar one in a thread. I also bias towards NSF photographers, not least because there are no copyright issues with attaching the photos to the thread to retain a permanent record.

5. I do delete duplicate posts when I see them (e.g. multiple posts of the same SpaceX tweet).

6. I think screenshots of live streams are generally done well (as led by Steven). I would have an issue if 2 or more people on a thread are posting similar screenshots. But again I think different views / perspectives are fine. For example, Steven posting SpaceX stream shots and me posting some NSF shots from different camera views. Please say if you think thatís too much.

7. I like having - usually tweeted - video clips on a launch thread as well as photos / screenshots. Do you agree?

8. We could post some more guidance at the beginning of launch threads asking people to only post updates with new info. However, Iím not sure this can - in general - be policed. As one personís detailed update is anotherís annoying duplicate or irrelevance.
There may be some more egregious examples (such as, if we have a launch providers tweet with an update then we donít need tweets from any reporters that just repeat the same info) where mods can delete posts not adding anything. However, thereís a limit on the effort mods can spend doing this and donít under-estimate how upset some people can get when their posts are deleted!

Offline Ken the Bin

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Re: Current NSF Forum Feedback Thread 2
« Reply #484 on: 03/16/2024 12:07 pm »
3. Only more Ďsignificantí launches need 2 threads. Yes, itís subjective. I think the balance on the forum currently is good, but please post if you disagree. I know some people posted that they wanted a single thread for the IFT-3 launch. Personally I think thatís a step too far.

6. I think screenshots of live streams are generally done well (as led by Steven). I would have an issue if 2 or more people on a thread are posting similar screenshots. But again I think different views / perspectives are fine. For example, Steven posting SpaceX stream shots and me posting some NSF shots from different camera views. Please say if you think thatís too much.

I'll comment on just these two points.

3. Yes, definitely separate topics for the Starship test flights. It's going to be long time before any Starship missions are routine enough to keep in just one topic.

6. I'm fine with the screenshots by both Steven and you. The thing I find somewhat annoying is multiple posts with photos from photographers on the ground with various views of the same thing. For example, if we have a streak shot from Julia, do we really need any additional streak shots unless they are significantly different in some way? OTOH, there's no good way to stop them from being posted, and I do understand how people feel when their posts are deleted. It's a no-win situation.

Offline Chris Bergin

Re: Current NSF Forum Feedback Thread 2
« Reply #485 on: 03/16/2024 12:27 pm »
Some good discussion here. Reading and watching the notes from our excellent folk such as FST.

Sometime soon the mods will get together (we've got our own area of the NSF discord) and see what refinements we can make. A lot of things on the open forum have become engulfed by social media compared to our early days, but I'll die on the hill that the forum is both a great historical database (I literally still see people occasionally looking back at screenshots from a STS-121 Flight Day update thread) etc) to continued use in this new era.

But refining with the times is also important.

Was overjoyed to see how busy this forum was during IFT-3. So there's clearly a demand for this format alongside all these "discords" and "X threads" the kids use :)
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Offline Crispy

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Re: Current NSF Forum Feedback Thread 2
« Reply #486 on: 03/16/2024 01:54 pm »
I know there's a ton of tech debt, but when you do meet, please give consideration to using more modern forum software. Xenforo at least, or even better Discourse. SMF is so creaky.

Offline Chris Bergin

Re: Current NSF Forum Feedback Thread 2
« Reply #487 on: 03/16/2024 05:29 pm »
I know there's a ton of tech debt, but when you do meet, please give consideration to using more modern forum software. Xenforo at least, or even better Discourse. SMF is so creaky.

For sure! The question is how to port what is a crazy large database over so that the forum is intact and just on newer software.

It will become a question and a crowdsource of people savvy at such things when the time comes. Thankfully we have some super crazy good programmers working on our channel stuff and backend, so that's a good start. It's very much Mark's baby so he will make the calls on this.

But yes.
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Offline Metalskin

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Re: Current NSF Forum Feedback Thread 2
« Reply #488 on: 03/16/2024 08:49 pm »
I would like to add that I think the launch coverage is great. The most recent one was solid gold. I like having the discussion thread and having updates. If anything, it's a shame that the thread cannot be updated closer to real time. Maybe a slack channel would be useful with authorized posts only, and a discussion one (though I think there is a discord channel? I've never gone to look to be honest).

I get most value from updates prior to launch. Being the other side of the world, it's hard to get a sense of potential delays, so getting updates about weather (e.g. wind sheer concerns) and other potential delays is critical to knowing if I will be able to watch a launch live or should give up and go to bed :-)

I also love the multiple posts of different views post launch. It's great to see the crowd reaction, to see the different angles, even to see cameras that inadvertently become tracking cameras.

I think people's use of forums such as this have changed and how they like to interact, partially due to social media and partially due to different generations of people. This is most prob. causing strain on the BBS style forum approach which cannot handle these different types of things.

Despite all the criticism and comments (some of it from me), generally speaking I love this place and think the mods and so on do a fantastic job in a difficult environment.
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Offline Hobbes-22

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Re: Current NSF Forum Feedback Thread 2
« Reply #489 on: 05/20/2024 01:45 pm »
As discussed in this thread, currently the forum doesn't have a good place for European commercial space projects.

I think it makes sense to rename the forum section "ESA Launchers - Ariane, Soyuz at CSG, Vega" to "European Launchers" so we can discuss all European projects in this section.

Offline dglow

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Re: Current NSF Forum Feedback Thread 2
« Reply #490 on: 05/20/2024 03:19 pm »
I know there's a ton of tech debt, but when you do meet, please give consideration to using more modern forum software. Xenforo at least, or even better Discourse. SMF is so creaky.

For sure! The question is how to port what is a crazy large database over so that the forum is intact and just on newer software.

It will become a question and a crowdsource of people savvy at such things when the time comes. Thankfully we have some super crazy good programmers working on our channel stuff and backend, so that's a good start. It's very much Mark's baby so he will make the calls on this.

But yes.

Chris, as you probably know ArsTechnica runs a large and very long-lived online forum. In the past few years they completed a long-planned migration off their legacy system and onto XenForo Ė with the explicit goal of carrying forward the full and complete history of the forums.

Noting this as an example to reference when considering NSFís own plans. And Iíd be more than happy to make an intro to their admin team if youíd like.

Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Current NSF Forum Feedback Thread 2
« Reply #491 on: 05/20/2024 04:42 pm »
I know there's a ton of tech debt, but when you do meet, please give consideration to using more modern forum software. Xenforo at least, or even better Discourse. SMF is so creaky.

For sure! The question is how to port what is a crazy large database over so that the forum is intact and just on newer software.

It will become a question and a crowdsource of people savvy at such things when the time comes. Thankfully we have some super crazy good programmers working on our channel stuff and backend, so that's a good start. It's very much Mark's baby so he will make the calls on this.

But yes.

Chris, as you probably know ArsTechnica runs a large and very long-lived online forum. In the past few years they completed a long-planned migration off their legacy system and onto XenForo Ė with the explicit goal of carrying forward the full and complete history of the forums.

Noting this as an example to reference when considering NSFís own plans. And Iíd be more than happy to make an intro to their admin team if youíd like.
And we have long time NSF members on here whom work/volunteer for Simple Machines (SMF).

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