Andor **** SPOILER Discussion ****

[Blackstar]

Another in-depth discussion from this guy. Basically, they started out as well-trained, well-disciplined "shock" troops (not special forces). But eventually the Empire drafted so many people to be Stormtroopers that the quality became lousy.

[LaunchedIn68]

https://gizmodo.com/star-wars-andor-mon-mothma-dance-music-official-extended-2000612382

https://youtube.com/watch?v=WxLBOwdTKjI&t=63s

I heard that many DJs are getting requests for this at Weddings now.

The irony is deep with that one.

You ain't wrong.
I wish all the "best" to those couples who chose this tune without realizing its undertones.

You're reading way too much into that piece of (somewhat obnoxious) instrumental music. 

[LaunchedIn68]

And very timely.

Yes, but the Ghormans were just that.  Not invaders waving the flags of another planet.

[Blackstar]

How does the Death Star work?

[Blackstar]

[Blackstar]

[catdlr]

The Gorman incident is taking place in Los Angeles, and when you examine the parallels, it's rather unsettling:

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/eadSFcDuIQ4

[CameronD]

The Gorman incident is taking place in Los Angeles, and when you examine the parallels, it's rather unsettling:

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/eadSFcDuIQ4

20th Century Earth:  Hollywood = American culture
21st Century Earth:  American culture = Hollywood

You guys (especially your President Darth Trump) really have to stop believing your own movie scripts.  The world is watching!

[catdlr]

The Gorman incident is taking place in Los Angeles, and when you examine the parallels, it's rather unsettling:

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/eadSFcDuIQ4

20th Century Earth:  Hollywood = American culture
21st Century Earth:  American culture = Hollywood

You guys (especially your President, Darth Trump) really have to stop believing your own movie scripts.  The world is watching! 

I think you meant Emperor instead of Vader.

I'm still awaiting (each from a disaster movie to come true, ....or maybe not):

1) Volcano to erupt on Wilshire Blvd.
2) Tornadoes on the north side of LAX.
3) The earth ripping apart near the Santa Monica Pier.
4) Pieces of an asteroid making holes in buildings.

[sanman]

The Gorman incident is taking place in Los Angeles, and when you examine the parallels, it's rather unsettling:

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/eadSFcDuIQ4

20th Century Earth:  Hollywood = American culture
21st Century Earth:  American culture = Hollywood

You guys (especially your President, Darth Trump) really have to stop believing your own movie scripts.  The world is watching! 

I think you meant Emperor instead of Vader.

I'm still awaiting (each from a disaster movie to come true, ....or maybe not):

1) Volcano to erupt on Wilshire Blvd.
2) Tornadoes on the north side of LAX.
3) The earth ripping apart near the Santa Monica Pier.
4) Pieces of an asteroid making holes in buildings.

We've all got the Jean LeCarré vibes echoing thru our heads after getting so immersed in Andor and all of its cloak-&-dagger, where no side is perfectly virtuous, and everyone has imperfections and flaws on display.

We can likewise compare Butler-PA a year ago with Dallas 1963 (Those Who Assassinate and Get Away, Live to Assassinate Another Day), while the Coruscant News Network tell me "These are not the droids you are looking for... move along..."

And as I'd mentioned in another thread, I worry that Musk likewise has a target on his back due to his recent association with Trump - and let's not forget his public criticisms of the Hutt family:

https://twitter.com/MLiamMcCollum/status/1628451816647057415
("Jabba no wanga.")

And so I worry something could happen to Elon too (of course it would conveniently get blamed on the ULA Sniper)
This would put Spaceflight at risk, since Musk is its foremost champion.

When everyone is at daggers drawn with each other, then ethics becomes a luxury that nobody can afford.

As the denizens of Coruscant would say, "Cui Bono? Who Profits?"

[CameronD]

I'm still awaiting (each from a disaster movie to come true, ....or maybe not):

1) Volcano to erupt on Wilshire Blvd.
2) Tornadoes on the north side of LAX.
3) The earth ripping apart near the Santa Monica Pier.
4) Pieces of an asteroid making holes in buildings.

That sounds to me like great entertainment (from my safe comfy seat on the other side of the Pacific).. Pass the popcorn. 

[sanman]

Speaking of cloak-&-dagger, Tony Gilroy's recent comments in onscreen interviews have struck a nerve with some fans over his downplaying of the Force and its agents the Jedi. His stance stands in contrast to most other Star Wars series where we've seen Jedi involved in all sorts of major activities, including even while swinging their hallmark light-sabers (they're kind of hard to not notice). In the 2nd Star Wars trilogy of films, which is a prequel trilogy set in the Old Republic (pre-Empire), we even see Jedi serving as law enforcement, like Federal Marshals.

Is the new messaging that the Force and the Jedi aren't (any longer) as big a party of the story universe as shown before in the Star Wars lore? Are we seeing a shift to a new direction in how the Star Wars universe could be portrayed? Is this revisionism? Heresy? Blasphemy? Could this fresh take on the Star Wars universe prolong its life, and even expand its fanbase to those who aren't into the magical fantasy elements of that story?

Or should we instead see the Force as being more cloaked in some storylines compared to others?
"The Force Works in Mysterious Ways" and the Jedi are like a secret society instead of knights operating out in the open?

[jongoff]

And very timely.

Yes, but the Ghormans were just that.  Not invaders waving the flags of another planet.

I was thinking he was more referring to the concept of people that "you can count on to do the wrong thing"... but that's getting into politics, so I'll leave it at that.

~Jon

[catdlr]

Speaking of cloak-&-dagger, Tony Gilroy's recent comments in onscreen interviews have struck a nerve with some fans over his downplaying of the Force and its agents the Jedi.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=5MhwcvKiw6M

The subject matter is undoubtedly sensitive. I support Tony's position. The Jedi have a total membership of approximately 10,000, while the overall population of the galaxy is estimated to be in the tens of trillions. The majority of ordinary citizens would perceive the Jedi in a manner akin to how we view a Tibetan monk; one may have encountered photographs and footage of them, yet never had the opportunity to meet one in person. The order experienced a decline when it was inducted to fight alongside the Clone Army under the auspices of the Republic Senate, and the resultant uprising of discontent during the later phases of the war provided the impetus for Palpatine to enact Order 66, to the admiration of the citizenry.

Unfortunately, this admiration was not shared among Star Wars fans. Even with only a few dozen Jedi remaining, the allure of the Jedi remains a significant aspect of this franchise. It should not be jeopardized, particularly from a merchandise revenue perspective. Nevertheless, I contend that Tony's remark is a mere statistical observation and is not intended to undermine the Jedi's significance throughout the entire history of the universe, but rather to elucidate why he opted to exclude any Jedi in this series, which is set after Order 66, when they were either in hiding or nonexistent in the perception of the broader galactic populace.

However, setting statistics aside, the allure of the Jedi and the standard Star Wars Jedi fan has diminished in light of Tony's comment, which has unleashed a substantial response in the comments reflecting that perspective. Nearly every remark has generated a significant number of responses, both in favor of and against it. I, too, have reviewed and commented on my numerous replies.

[Blackstar]

https://gizmodo.com/star-wars-death-star-construction-explained-andor-rogue-one-2000614587

[sanman]

The subject matter is undoubtedly sensitive. I support Tony's position. The Jedi have a total membership of approximately 10,000, while the overall population of the galaxy is estimated to be in the tens of trillions. The majority of ordinary citizens would perceive the Jedi in a manner akin to how we view a Tibetan monk; one may have encountered photographs and footage of them, yet never had the opportunity to meet one in person. The order experienced a decline when it was inducted to fight alongside the Clone Army under the auspices of the Republic Senate, and the resultant uprising of discontent during the later phases of the war provided the impetus for Palpatine to enact Order 66, to the admiration of the citizenry.

Unfortunately, this admiration was not shared among Star Wars fans. Even with only a few dozen Jedi remaining, the allure of the Jedi remains a significant aspect of this franchise. It should not be jeopardized, particularly from a merchandise revenue perspective. Nevertheless, I contend that Tony's remark is a mere statistical observation and is not intended to undermine the Jedi's significance throughout the entire history of the universe, but rather to elucidate why he opted to exclude any Jedi in this series, which is set after Order 66, when they were either in hiding or nonexistent in the perception of the broader galactic populace.

However, setting statistics aside, the allure of the Jedi and the standard Star Wars Jedi fan has diminished in light of Tony's comment, which has unleashed a substantial response in the comments reflecting that perspective. Nearly every remark has generated a significant number of responses, both in favor of and against it. I, too, have reviewed and commented on my numerous replies.

Also consider from a story franchise marketing viewpoint, then it may be possible to segment the Star Wars universe into these different genre flavors which each appeal to different audiences. You can have the magical fantasy segment of Star Wars that plays up the Force. Then you can have a more hard sci-fi version of Star Wars that caters to the hard sci-fi crowd who don't like the magical/mystical elements of the Force and Jedi so much.
31 flavors of Star Wars? How many flavors can we have? Marketing managers may want to know.

[Joris]

Also consider from a story franchise marketing viewpoint, then it may be possible to segment the Star Wars universe into these different genre flavors which each appeal to different audiences. You can have the magical fantasy segment of Star Wars that plays up the Force. Then you can have a more hard sci-fi version of Star Wars that caters to the hard sci-fi crowd who don't like the magical/mystical elements of the Force and Jedi so much.
31 flavors of Star Wars? How many flavors can we have? Marketing managers may want to know.

The magical person who is important and does lots of close-range combat fits nicely in a movie for the same reason that superhero-action-movies do well.

Magic and other deus-ex-machinas that work well in movies do not often translate to TV shows because they're a huge plothole when they're not used. Everytime the character does not use their telekinesis or mind-control-ability they must have a good reason for it, and you need a lot more reasons in 20 hours of material vs 90 minutes. Making the story instead about regular people with no magic and no critical origin-story instead makes the writers able to come up with something that stays believable throughout the series.

[sanman]

Also consider from a story franchise marketing viewpoint, then it may be possible to segment the Star Wars universe into these different genre flavors which each appeal to different audiences. You can have the magical fantasy segment of Star Wars that plays up the Force. Then you can have a more hard sci-fi version of Star Wars that caters to the hard sci-fi crowd who don't like the magical/mystical elements of the Force and Jedi so much.
31 flavors of Star Wars? How many flavors can we have? Marketing managers may want to know.

The magical person who is important and does lots of close-range combat fits nicely in a movie for the same reason that superhero-action-movies do well.

Magic and other deus-ex-machinas that work well in movies do not often translate to TV shows because they're a huge plothole when they're not used. Everytime the character does not use their telekinesis or mind-control-ability they must have a good reason for it, and you need a lot more reasons in 20 hours of material vs 90 minutes. Making the story instead about regular people with no magic and no critical origin-story instead makes the writers able to come up with something that stays believable throughout the series.

Great points. Hard sci fi, which does not supply the magical macguffins like magical fantasy does, then faces less problems over that, and keeps itself grounded in more rational phenomena, can then provide self-consistency that holds up even down to more detailed  levels of consideration. The appeal of magical fantasy perhaps lies in being simpler and easier to understand, because with such hand-wavery we don't have to worry about the details on how the Force gives you telekinesis or lights up light-sabers, much less what their wattage would be.

I always did wonder when Vader said, "The power to destroy a planet pales in significance compared to the Force" - okay, so why don't you demonstrate that? Why build a giant moon-sized battlestation if you can achieve the same effect effortlessly by using the Force? If there are effectively no limits to the Force's power, then what's to prevent Sith lords from blasting planets and enemies out of existence?

I don't like hand-wavery even in non-magical sci fi, either. For instance, I didn't like the later versions of Iron Man where his suit can just form up around him by being based on nanotechnology. To me, the nanotech macguffin is often just too techno-magical and too convenient. It feels like lazy storywriting/storytelling. And then you'd run into the similar problems you mentioned, about why didn't they use the nanotech for this and not that, etc. Maybe the preference for hard sci fi over magic (even techno-magic) comes down to preferring rationality over hand-wavery (left side of the brain over right side) But perhaps anything can be pulled off if done artfully with the right attention to craftsmanship.

[Blackstar]

https://gizmodo.com/star-wars-andor-season-2-architecture-lucasfilm-2000615608

The Real-World Places Behind ‘Andor’ Season 2’s Architectural Marvels
The future is all around us, it’s just not evenly distributed yet.
Toussaint Egan Published June 13, 2025 | Comments (2)


Andor, the live-action Star Wars prequel series created by Tony Gilroy and starring Diego Luna, concluded its second and final season last month. Spanning the years prior to the events of Rogue One: A Star Wars Story, the series has garnered massive praise from Star Wars fans and critics alike for its deft storytelling, stirring lead performances, and majestic setpieces.

[Blackstar]

https://gizmodo.com/we-may-be-a-step-closer-to-seeing-the-original-star-wars-again-2000615656