Author Topic: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!  (Read 35824 times)

Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
« Last Edit: 07/17/2009 05:38 pm by Yegor »


Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites
« Reply #1 on: 07/17/2009 04:32 pm »
Beautiful images! Especially Apollo 14!

Thank you NASA! Thank you LRO team!


Offline Lawntonlookirs

  • Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1419
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites
« Reply #2 on: 07/17/2009 05:11 pm »
Great pictures
Everyman is my superior in that I may learn from him.  Albert Einstein

Online Lee Jay

  • Elite Veteran
  • Global Moderator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8566
  • Liked: 3603
  • Likes Given: 327
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites
« Reply #3 on: 07/17/2009 05:15 pm »
Wow!!!  I've been looking forward to these for a long time!

Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites
« Reply #4 on: 07/17/2009 05:18 pm »
Wow!!!  I've been looking forward to these for a long time!

You and ... everybody else  ;)
« Last Edit: 07/17/2009 05:19 pm by Yegor »


Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites
« Reply #5 on: 07/17/2009 05:23 pm »
Apollo 11 has a long shadow. it is at first very narrow and then wide because stage is standing on legs.

Apollo 14 shadow is short so we do not see that.

Apollo 15, 16, 17 had fabrics hanging from stage to the ground so we do not see this effect:
http://moonpans.com/vr/


Offline Art LeBrun

  • Photo freak
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2128
  • Orange, California
  • Liked: 35
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites
« Reply #6 on: 07/17/2009 05:27 pm »
Next up?.....Apollo 12 with two shadows.
1958 launch vehicle highlights: Vanguard TV-4 and Atlas 12B

Offline stockman

  • Extreme Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6916
  • Southern Ontario - Canada
  • Liked: 4
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites
« Reply #7 on: 07/17/2009 05:35 pm »
Great pictures... of course the Tin Foil Hat crowd will insist the reason these pictures weren't released in real time is because it took Nasa time to photoshop the spacecraft into the pictures... :).... at least that is what I expect to hear..

Great pictures... look forward to more...
« Last Edit: 07/17/2009 05:35 pm by stockman »
One Percent for Space!!!

Offline aquarius

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 425
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #8 on: 07/17/2009 06:03 pm »
Will these photos be enough to silence the conspiracy theorists?

Offline Archibald

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2611
  • Liked: 500
  • Likes Given: 1096
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites
« Reply #9 on: 07/17/2009 06:03 pm »
Great pictures... of course the Tin Foil Hat crowd will insist the reason these pictures weren't released in real time is because it took Nasa time to photoshop the spacecraft into the pictures... :).... at least that is what I expect to hear..


Alas, you're probably right. However, looking at the pictures and reading this
Quote
Future LROC images from these sites will have two to three times greater resolution.
can't help thinking "gotcha, moon hoaxers!! "

Han shot first and Gwynne Shotwell !

Online Lee Jay

  • Elite Veteran
  • Global Moderator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8566
  • Liked: 3603
  • Likes Given: 327
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #10 on: 07/17/2009 06:04 pm »
Will these photos be enough to silence the conspiracy theorists?

Death doesn't even silence conspiracy theorists.

Offline mrbliss

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 172
  • Grand Rapids, MI
  • Liked: 5
  • Likes Given: 175
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites
« Reply #11 on: 07/17/2009 06:08 pm »
Great pictures... of course the Tin Foil Hat crowd will insist the reason these pictures weren't released in real time is because it took Nasa time to photoshop the spacecraft into the pictures... :).... at least that is what I expect to hear..

Alas, you're probably right. However, looking at the pictures and reading this
Quote
Future LROC images from these sites will have two to three times greater resolution.
can't help thinking "gotcha, moon hoaxers!! "

Well, sure.  It takes longer to properly photoshop higher-resolution fakes.

Offline strangeluck

  • Member
  • Posts: 31
  • Liked: 1
  • Likes Given: 105
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #12 on: 07/17/2009 06:23 pm »
Fantastic!!

<..snip>
 these first images came before the spacecraft reached its final mapping orbit. Future LROC images from these sites will have two to three times greater resolution.
</snip>

The pics are gonna get even better... wow...

Offline Art LeBrun

  • Photo freak
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2128
  • Orange, California
  • Liked: 35
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #13 on: 07/17/2009 06:26 pm »
Any chance of oblique imaging from LRO?
1958 launch vehicle highlights: Vanguard TV-4 and Atlas 12B

Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #14 on: 07/17/2009 07:10 pm »
Right now CNN runs an article on the front page "For some, moon landings were all a lie"
http://www.cnn.com/2009/TECH/space/07/17/moon.landing.hoax/index.html

But it does not have links to these wonderful images :(


Offline Gene DiGennaro

  • Armchair Astronaut
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 625
  • Baltimore, Md
    • Glenn L. Martin Maryland Aviation Museum
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 16
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #15 on: 07/17/2009 07:15 pm »
Love the pics! Spy satellite quality imagery of the moon!

Offline psloss

  • Veteran armchair spectator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 17980
  • Liked: 4046
  • Likes Given: 2089
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #16 on: 07/17/2009 07:20 pm »
But it does not have links to these wonderful images :(
Probably for a couple of reasons: first, that conspiracy theory story was released this morning, probably before the LRO pictures were released...and second, the story is more sensational without them.
« Last Edit: 07/17/2009 07:21 pm by psloss »

Offline kfsorensen

  • aerospace and nuclear engineer
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1568
  • Huntsville, AL
    • Flibe Energy
  • Liked: 150
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #17 on: 07/17/2009 07:22 pm »
Oh cmon, those pictures are totally fake!

**adjusting tinfoil hat**

Offline JJ..

  • Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 341
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 1
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #18 on: 07/17/2009 07:29 pm »
Do we see the Rovers shadows as well ?

or is it my wishfull thinking (lol)

JJ..
Earth Explorer

Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #19 on: 07/17/2009 07:44 pm »
Quote
A 1999 Gallup poll found that a scant 6 percent of Americans doubted the Apollo 11 moon landing happened, and there is anecdotal evidence that the ranks of such conspiracy theorists, fueled by innuendo-filled documentaries and the Internet, are growing.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/TECH/space/07/17/moon.landing.hoax/index.html

I did not know that there are so many people who do not believe!  :o


Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #20 on: 07/17/2009 07:45 pm »
Do we see the Rovers shadows as well ?

or is it my wishfull thinking (lol)

JJ..

The rovers are very close to the ground - not much shadow but I think that we will be able to see them when LRO moves closer to the Moon.
« Last Edit: 07/17/2009 07:54 pm by Yegor »


Offline JohnFornaro

  • Not an expert
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10974
  • Delta-t is an important metric.
  • Planet Eaarth
    • Design / Program Associates
  • Liked: 1257
  • Likes Given: 724
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #21 on: 07/17/2009 07:46 pm »
Great Pix.

I had no idea that it took NASA engineers forty years to learn how to use PhotoShop.  Maybe they should look for easier to use software.
Sometimes I just flat out don't get it.

Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #22 on: 07/17/2009 07:53 pm »
Quote
Future LROC images from these sites will have two to three times greater resolution.
http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/LRO/multimedia/lroimages/apollosites.html#

I think that with three times greater resolution we should be able to see LM's octahedron shape and foundations of the legs.
I am looking forward to those pictures.


Offline Art LeBrun

  • Photo freak
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2128
  • Orange, California
  • Liked: 35
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #23 on: 07/17/2009 08:01 pm »
Quote
A 1999 Gallup poll found that a scant 6 percent of Americans doubted the Apollo 11 moon landing happened, and there is anecdotal evidence that the ranks of such conspiracy theorists, fueled by innuendo-filled documentaries and the Internet, are growing.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/TECH/space/07/17/moon.landing.hoax/index.html

I did not know that there are so many people who do not believe!  :o

Actually the percentage of " space disinterested" people is much higher so the 6 % estimate isn't too bad. Also consider the rampant ignorance despite this wonderful age of accessible information.
1958 launch vehicle highlights: Vanguard TV-4 and Atlas 12B

Offline mrbliss

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 172
  • Grand Rapids, MI
  • Liked: 5
  • Likes Given: 175
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #24 on: 07/17/2009 08:02 pm »
Great Pix.

I had no idea that it took NASA engineers forty years to learn how to use PhotoShop.  Maybe they should look for easier to use software.

Things went much faster after they switched from gimp.

Offline kevin-rf

  • Elite Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8823
  • Overlooking the path Mary's little Lamb took..
  • Liked: 1318
  • Likes Given: 306
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #25 on: 07/17/2009 08:40 pm »

Photoshop is for fools, anyone with half a brain can see that LRO uses the same stage they used to fake the moon landings with. It's a very big stage (just 1/4 the size of earth) and they are looking down at the LEM props from the 1960's and 1970's. Nasa also has a really big wharehouse where it keeps all the props. The earth is not 3/4 covered with water, it is 3/4's covered with sound stages for nasa to fake moon shots with :D
If you're happy and you know it,
It's your med's!

Offline ChrisGebhardt

  • Assistant Managing Editor
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7842
  • ad astra scientia
  • ~1 AU
  • Liked: 7877
  • Likes Given: 853
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #26 on: 07/17/2009 08:43 pm »
Can't think of a better way to look back on Apollo 11 than with these images.

Offline GPerks

  • Member
  • Posts: 5
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #27 on: 07/17/2009 08:54 pm »
On the Apollo 17 shot at http://www.nasa.gov/images/content/369444main_lroc_apollo17_lrg.jpg you can see something else tall to the left of the lander, and several other items to the lower-left. I wonder what they are?

Offline soldeed

  • Member
  • Full Member
  • **
  • Posts: 213
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #28 on: 07/17/2009 09:22 pm »
I wish terrain features were annotated such as; "the crater Neil Armstrong had to manually fly over" or "cone crater" Notable landmarks, you know?


EDIT: syntax
« Last Edit: 07/17/2009 09:23 pm by soldeed »
The Exodus is behind schedule

Offline brihath

  • Member
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 891
  • Liked: 53
  • Likes Given: 28
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #29 on: 07/17/2009 09:26 pm »
Quote
A 1999 Gallup poll found that a scant 6 percent of Americans doubted the Apollo 11 moon landing happened, and there is anecdotal evidence that the ranks of such conspiracy theorists, fueled by innuendo-filled documentaries and the Internet, are growing.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/TECH/space/07/17/moon.landing.hoax/index.html

I did not know that there are so many people who do not believe!  :o

Actually the percentage of " space disinterested" people is much higher so the 6 % estimate isn't too bad. Also consider the rampant ignorance despite this wonderful age of accessible information.

They're probably all members of the "Flat Earth Society", too!

Offline CessnaDriver

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 615
  • Liked: 16
  • Likes Given: 2
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #30 on: 07/17/2009 09:28 pm »
Will these photos be enough to silence the conspiracy theorists?

No. But it will push them futher into the fringe kook gallery where they belong as history deniers.... footnotes in psychological history.

LRO will help keep their mind poison away from the young.

Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #31 on: 07/17/2009 09:28 pm »
I wish terrain features were annotated such as; "the crater Neil Armstrong had to manually fly over" or "cone crater" Notable landmarks, you know?


EDIT: syntax

They took pictures just a couple of days ago. It is very fast to release them so soon. Usually it takes much more days. I guess they wanted to release them before Apollo 40th landing anniversary. I am glad they did.
« Last Edit: 07/17/2009 09:28 pm by Yegor »


Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #32 on: 07/17/2009 09:29 pm »
Can LRO take pictures in color?
It would be much more impressive.


Offline Art LeBrun

  • Photo freak
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2128
  • Orange, California
  • Liked: 35
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #33 on: 07/17/2009 09:33 pm »
Can LRO take pictures in color?
It would be much more impressive.

The moon is essentially colorless....possibly the b&w is more detailed for science.
1958 launch vehicle highlights: Vanguard TV-4 and Atlas 12B

Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #34 on: 07/17/2009 09:34 pm »
Will these photos be enough to silence the conspiracy theorists?

No, nothing will be enough.
If you take one of them and bring him to a landing site he will say that all the equipment was brought to the Moon just couple of weeks before his visit.


Offline DirtyDeeds

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 100
  • Wilmington, NC
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #35 on: 07/17/2009 11:06 pm »
Quote
"I do know the moon landings were faked," said crusading filmmaker Bart Sibrel, whose aggressive interview tactics once provoked Aldrin to punch him in the face. "I'd bet my life on it."

Can somebody please take this guy up on his bet, already?

Offline Nick L.

  • Elite Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3857
  • A unique little aerospace company
  • Liked: 6
  • Likes Given: 4
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #36 on: 07/17/2009 11:06 pm »
Cool photos. Can't wait for higher-resolution shots. :)

WRT the "6 percent" figure, look at that and then look at the state of the general population. The population that idolizes the wrong people for the wrong reasons, the population that rewards stupidity and apathy while punishing intelligence and curiosity, the population whose alpha and omega are "what's in it for me?" The population that feeds its narcissism on Twitter, Facebook, YouTube. It explains itself.

/rant
"Now you may leave here for four days in space, but when you return it's the same old place..."

Offline gladiator1332

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2431
  • Fort Myers, FL
  • Liked: 7
  • Likes Given: 6
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #37 on: 07/18/2009 12:43 am »
It angers me that CNN has still not put these images up and still have the Moon Hoax garbage story up there.

This is why I refuse to watch the main networks for space coverage. I stopped watching Fox after they aired that Moon Hoax special, and now CNN drops to the same level of mediocrity...then again, after they dumped Miles O'Brien I was done with them as well. 

Offline dwmzmm

  • Extreme Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 733
  • Far West Houston, TX
    • Challenger 498 NAR Section
  • Liked: 5
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #38 on: 07/18/2009 02:41 am »
I wish terrain features were annotated such as; "the crater Neil Armstrong had to manually fly over" or "cone crater" Notable landmarks, you know?


EDIT: syntax

I can recognize Triplet Craters on the Apollo - 14 landing site.  Alan Shepard & Ed Mitchell flew right over it just before touchdown.  Super photos!!  Can't wait for the next set of pics when LRO settles into the lower orbit!
Dave, NAR # 21853 SR.

Offline Ronsmytheiii

  • Moderator
  • Global Moderator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 23394
  • Liked: 1879
  • Likes Given: 1023
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #39 on: 07/18/2009 03:10 am »
Hope we can get Apollo 12 site soon, should be interesting to see if Surveyor IIi is visible....
« Last Edit: 07/18/2009 03:11 am by Ronsmytheiii »

Online Lee Jay

  • Elite Veteran
  • Global Moderator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8566
  • Liked: 3603
  • Likes Given: 327
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #40 on: 07/18/2009 03:16 am »
Quote
"I do know the moon landings were faked," said crusading filmmaker Bart Sibrel, whose aggressive interview tactics once provoked Aldrin to punch him in the face.

One of the great moments in spaceflight history.  For those who haven't seen it:


Offline rsp1202

  • Elite Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1083
  • 3, 2, 1 . . . Make rocket go now
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #41 on: 07/18/2009 05:11 am »
I think someone mentioned it earlier, but oblique views would be even more spectacular (especially for A15 and A17), though I'd be surprised if those will be available. It would be incredible if the overheads could make out footprints.

I'd also be interested in getting a better look at Neil's crater/West Crater, and Little West, then the one's I've seen previous.
« Last Edit: 07/18/2009 05:56 am by rsp1202 »

Offline Eerie

  • Member
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 858
  • Liked: 208
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #42 on: 07/18/2009 08:33 am »
Quote
"I do know the moon landings were faked," said crusading filmmaker Bart Sibrel, whose aggressive interview tactics once provoked Aldrin to punch him in the face.

One of the great moments in spaceflight history.  For those who haven't seen it:



But obviously, this video is also faked. ;-)

Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #43 on: 07/18/2009 02:36 pm »
It angers me that CNN has still not put these images up and still have the Moon Hoax garbage story up there.

This is why I refuse to watch the main networks for space coverage. I stopped watching Fox after they aired that Moon Hoax special, and now CNN drops to the same level of mediocrity...

I totally agree with you.
CNN still does not have an article about "LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites" almost 24 hour after the release!!! Not even in their Tech section!
I am very frustrated.  ???
A news like this I would expect to be a world front page news. But it seems nobody cares - nor CNN, nor Yahoo, nor FOX  >:(


Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #44 on: 07/18/2009 02:38 pm »
WRT the "6 percent" figure, look at that and then look at the state of the general population. The population that idolizes the wrong people for the wrong reasons, the population that rewards stupidity and apathy while punishing intelligence and curiosity, the population whose alpha and omega are "what's in it for me?" The population that feeds its narcissism on Twitter, Facebook, YouTube. It explains itself.

/rant
You are right  :(


Offline Blackstar

  • Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 15287
  • Liked: 7822
  • Likes Given: 2
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #45 on: 07/18/2009 03:50 pm »
The 6% figure is nothing to get upset about.  Apparently, according to pollsters, you can get at least 6% of people to answer affirmatively to any question, so it's just a fact that there's a segment of the population that's inherently dumb/goofy.

In fact, why should we care about this more than we care about people believing other stupid things?  I bet that more than 6% of the population believes in angels.  Anybody seen an angel around lately?  And what percentage reads their horoscope regularly, or goes to see a psychic?

If there is anything to be concerned about, it is that the number of young people who believe this is growing.  But I think that's something that has to do with personal experience (i.e. they were not around back then).  And it is something that you can teach them out of.  These LRO photos could be useful because if you present enough evidence to young people, while their opinions are still malleable, then you can convince them otherwise.

Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #46 on: 07/18/2009 04:43 pm »


Offline gladiator1332

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2431
  • Fort Myers, FL
  • Liked: 7
  • Likes Given: 6
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #47 on: 07/18/2009 05:55 pm »
It angers me that CNN has still not put these images up and still have the Moon Hoax garbage story up there.

This is why I refuse to watch the main networks for space coverage. I stopped watching Fox after they aired that Moon Hoax special, and now CNN drops to the same level of mediocrity...

I totally agree with you.
CNN still does not have an article about "LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites" almost 24 hour after the release!!! Not even in their Tech section!
I am very frustrated.  ???
A news like this I would expect to be a world front page news. But it seems nobody cares - nor CNN, nor Yahoo, nor FOX  >:(

Only MSNBC has the headline about LOR seeing the sites. It is pathetic what these stations call "news" these days.

Offline Art LeBrun

  • Photo freak
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2128
  • Orange, California
  • Liked: 35
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #48 on: 07/18/2009 06:01 pm »
It angers me that CNN has still not put these images up and still have the Moon Hoax garbage story up there.

This is why I refuse to watch the main networks for space coverage. I stopped watching Fox after they aired that Moon Hoax special, and now CNN drops to the same level of mediocrity...

I totally agree with you.
CNN still does not have an article about "LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites" almost 24 hour after the release!!! Not even in their Tech section!
I am very frustrated.  ???
A news like this I would expect to be a world front page news. But it seems nobody cares - nor CNN, nor Yahoo, nor FOX  >:(

Only MSNBC has the headline about LOR seeing the sites. It is pathetic what these stations call "news" these days.

Maybe on Monday the images will be newsworthy..............
1958 launch vehicle highlights: Vanguard TV-4 and Atlas 12B

Offline floron

  • Member
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 184
  • goodbye Austin, hello Seattle
    • my occasional blog
  • Liked: 85
  • Likes Given: 41
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #49 on: 07/18/2009 06:18 pm »
I'm pleased to say the BBC news report on this doesn't contain a single mention of conspiracy theorists.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/8157368.stm

Offline Hop_David

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1656
  • Ajo, Arizona
    • Hop's Gallery
  • Liked: 147
  • Likes Given: 60
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #50 on: 07/18/2009 06:50 pm »
It angers me that CNN has still not put these images up and still have the Moon Hoax garbage story up there.

This is why I refuse to watch the main networks for space coverage. I stopped watching Fox after they aired that Moon Hoax special, and now CNN drops to the same level of mediocrity...

I totally agree with you.
CNN still does not have an article about "LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites" almost 24 hour after the release!!! Not even in their Tech section!
I am very frustrated.  ???
A news like this I would expect to be a world front page news. But it seems nobody cares - nor CNN, nor Yahoo, nor FOX  >:(

Oh for the days of Cronkite. When the TV talking heads had more grey matter and less hair spray.

Offline Gregster

  • Member
  • Posts: 28
  • Liked: 20
  • Likes Given: 16
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #51 on: 07/18/2009 06:51 pm »
I think I may be confused by the direction of the shadows produced by the LM descent stages.  When the landings happened, the sun was behind the LM and the front was in shadow.  The sun appears to be in an opposite angle in the LRO images with the rear of the LM in shadow.  Have I got that right?  Here is a photograph of Double Crater taken out of the left side window of Eagle before the Apollo 11 EVA.

http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/pao/History/alsj/a11/AS11-40-5848.jpg

Double Crater appears in the LRO image, to the left-front of Eagle, if the sun is indeed at an opposite angle.
 
I'm LOVING these images, BTW!  I feel like I'm 14 again!
« Last Edit: 07/18/2009 07:32 pm by Gregster »

Offline Art LeBrun

  • Photo freak
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2128
  • Orange, California
  • Liked: 35
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #52 on: 07/18/2009 07:33 pm »
I think I may be confused by the direction of the shadows produced by the LM descent stages.  When the landings happened, the sun was behind the LM and the front was in shadow.  The sun appears to be in an opposite angle in the LRO images with the rear of the LM in shadow.  Have I got that right?  I'm LOVING these images, BTW!

The landings were done at sunrise to avoid heat....if the shadows change 180 degrees then the image from orbit was taken in the lunar afternoon or sunset.
Kinda like the craters and other landforms change their lighting effect during the biweekly lunar nearside illumination cycle............
1958 launch vehicle highlights: Vanguard TV-4 and Atlas 12B

Offline Gregster

  • Member
  • Posts: 28
  • Liked: 20
  • Likes Given: 16
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #53 on: 07/18/2009 07:58 pm »
That clears it up.  Thank you, sir!  The LRO images must have been taken later in the lunar day.  The LM was then traveling right-to-left along it's ground track as it appears in the LRO image.  The features match nicely (West Crater and others) with the 16mm DAC footage of the final approach and landing.  Conspiracy theorists will dismiss it, of course.
« Last Edit: 07/18/2009 09:15 pm by Gregster »

Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #54 on: 07/18/2009 08:21 pm »
I'm pleased to say the BBC news report on this doesn't contain a single mention of conspiracy theorists.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/8157368.stm
Good for Britain!
It looks like they are the first from the big news agencies with the news.


Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #55 on: 07/20/2009 05:39 pm »
Today Yahoo Canada runs "As U.S. celebrates 40th anniversary of moon walk, some still believe it was faked" article:
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/090719/science/science_moon_walk_hoax_1

Quote
NASA may soon prove once and for all the moon landing was real - its Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter is now circling the moon with powerful cameras, snapping high-resolution photos that could show the Apollo 11's Eagle lander still perched on the lunar surface.

Do your job guys - it already snapped them!
« Last Edit: 07/20/2009 05:39 pm by Yegor »


Offline Yegor

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 404
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #56 on: 07/20/2009 05:42 pm »
I'm pleased to say the BBC news report on this doesn't contain a single mention of conspiracy theorists.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/8157368.stm
Good for Britain!
It looks like they are the first from the big news agencies with the news.

Still much more Britons (25%) than Americans (6%) do not believe in 1969-1972 Moon landings, Russians 28%:
http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/capress/090719/science/science_moon_walk_hoax_1


Offline dwb0407

  • Member
  • Posts: 36
  • Connecticut, USA
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #57 on: 07/20/2009 06:48 pm »
Excited is an understatement for me.

What kind of camera did we send on LRO? At least as good as the MRO camera? We got decent pics of Spirit and Opportunity from a much higher orbit, did we not? So the coming images should be mark-ably better. Can't Wait.

CNN should be severely thrashed with ______________( fill in the blank with whatever you like) for the titling of their article.

How about covering more of the actual science and missions that are going on, instead of covering rumor and drama.

Maybe the people of the world would know more, and care more if the news outlets did a better job conveying the important stuff.


Online ugordan

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8520
    • My mainly Cassini image gallery
  • Liked: 3543
  • Likes Given: 759
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #58 on: 07/20/2009 06:56 pm »
What kind of camera did we send on LRO? At least as good as the MRO camera?

Not as good as MRO's camera when it comes to angular resolution. They will have comparable effective resolutions (MRO cca 30 cm/pix, LRO 50 cm/pix IIRC) because LRO will be in a 6x lower orbit.

The HiRISE camera on MRO would produce seriously impressive imagery of the landing sites in place of LRO's camera (we'd be talking about something around 5cm/pixel if the instrument could handle it!), but there would be no point in sending such an expensive camera only to be able to look at a few sites in extremely high resolution. It would be overkill for most of the other lunar science mission.
« Last Edit: 07/20/2009 07:01 pm by ugordan »

Offline rdale

  • Assistant to the Chief Meteorologist
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10390
  • Lansing MI
  • Liked: 1415
  • Likes Given: 171
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #59 on: 09/03/2009 09:28 pm »
This image from LRO shows the spacecraft's first look at the Apollo 12 landing site. The Intrepid lunar module descent stage, experiment package (ALSEP) and Surveyor 3 spacecraft are all visible. Astronaut footpaths are marked with unlabeled arrows. This image is 824 meters (about 900 yards) wide. The top of the image faces North. Credit: NASA/Goddard Space Flight Center/Arizona State University

http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/LRO/multimedia/lroimages/lroc_20090903_apollo12.html

Offline rsp1202

  • Elite Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1083
  • 3, 2, 1 . . . Make rocket go now
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #60 on: 09/03/2009 10:07 pm »
Un*****believable. ;D
Thanks.

Offline edkyle99

  • Expert
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 15391
    • Space Launch Report
  • Liked: 8565
  • Likes Given: 1356
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #61 on: 09/03/2009 10:15 pm »
LRO, "NASA's First Step Back to the Moon". 

If only it were true.

 - Ed Kyle

Offline HarryM

  • Member
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 427
  • California
  • Liked: 40
  • Likes Given: 41
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #62 on: 09/03/2009 11:50 pm »
Awesome!

Offline the_other_Doug

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3010
  • Minneapolis, MN
  • Liked: 2191
  • Likes Given: 4620
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #63 on: 09/04/2009 02:58 am »
One really fascinating thing that's being discussed on another forum I habituate is that there appear to be two objects, close together, about 600 to 800 meters north of Surveyor crater that do not appear in the Lunar Orbiter images of the same area taken prior to Surveyor's landing.

There are two interesting theories as to what these are.  One is that they could be big thermal blankets (like the MESA blanket) blown out from the descent stage by the APS firing at ascent.  (Apollo 15's liftoff film documents their MESA blanket narrowly missing the ALSEP central station and flying downrange the better part of a kilometer; it's not unthinkable that these reflective objects could be LM detritus.)

The other interesting theory has to do with the Surveyor itself.  All Surveyors used a large solid rocket motor as their main braking system, reducing the descent rate to a few hundred miles per hour before being jettisoned at about 30,000 feet (from which point vernier engines slowed the craft to a safe landing velocity).  The bright objects seen in the LROC image could possibly be the spent casing of that solid rocket motor.  Whether they are or not, that motor has to be in the area somewhere...

Fun, eh?  :)

-the other Doug
-Doug  (With my shield, not yet upon it)

Offline rsp1202

  • Elite Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1083
  • 3, 2, 1 . . . Make rocket go now
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #64 on: 09/30/2009 07:14 pm »
New images from LRO of the Apollo 11 landing site. Wanna see Neil's footsteps?
http://www.universetoday.com/2009/09/29/lro-takes-second-closer-look-at-apollo-11-landing-site/

Offline renclod

  • Extreme Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1671
  • EU.Ro
  • Liked: 17
  • Likes Given: 2
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #65 on: 09/30/2009 08:02 pm »
That straight line of bootprints is hypnotizing.
 

Offline HarryM

  • Member
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 427
  • California
  • Liked: 40
  • Likes Given: 41
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #66 on: 09/30/2009 09:23 pm »
Fantastic.

Offline kevin-rf

  • Elite Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8823
  • Overlooking the path Mary's little Lamb took..
  • Liked: 1318
  • Likes Given: 306
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #67 on: 10/01/2009 01:07 pm »

Okay, since LRO is a current mission, why is it in historical ;)

(bad attempt at satire, I know)
If you're happy and you know it,
It's your med's!

Offline Gregster

  • Member
  • Posts: 28
  • Liked: 20
  • Likes Given: 16
« Last Edit: 10/01/2009 03:42 pm by Gregster »

Offline rsp1202

  • Elite Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1083
  • 3, 2, 1 . . . Make rocket go now
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #69 on: 10/30/2009 12:34 pm »
http://www.onorbit.com/node/1658
Apollo 17 landing site photos, updated.

Offline Blackstar

  • Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 15287
  • Liked: 7822
  • Likes Given: 2
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #70 on: 10/30/2009 01:21 pm »
I was in a briefing about this stuff a few days ago.

There's actually more to this than public relations.  NASA is actually trying to obtain geologic context of the sites so that the samples collected from them can be better understood.  They can use their various sensors to determine what the minerological context is and things like that.

They are also seeking the Soviet sample return sites.  It turns out that the locations are not well known, so finding them would help determine what kind of terrain the collected material came from.

In short, there's a legitimate scientific goal to looking for the previous landing sites.

Offline HarryM

  • Member
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 427
  • California
  • Liked: 40
  • Likes Given: 41
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #71 on: 10/30/2009 03:44 pm »
Would be interesting to trace the Lunakhods' routes.

Offline hop

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
  • Liked: 553
  • Likes Given: 891
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #72 on: 10/30/2009 08:59 pm »
There's actually more to this than public relations.  NASA is actually trying to obtain geologic context of the sites so that the samples collected from them can be better understood.  They can use their various sensors to determine what the minerological context is and things like that.
From what I understand it's also very useful in the other direction: Observation of a site we have known samples from helps calibrate observations of other places.

HarryM:
Lunokhod 2s position is known very accurately AFAIK, so it should just be a matter of waiting for right orbit. Given the visibility of Apollo footprints and rover tracks, I'd expect Lunokhods to be quite obvious too.

Offline Blackstar

  • Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 15287
  • Liked: 7822
  • Likes Given: 2
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #73 on: 10/31/2009 01:47 am »
From what I understand it's also very useful in the other direction: Observation of a site we have known samples from helps calibrate observations of other places.


That's correct.  I forgot to mention that aspect of this effort.

Offline Proponent

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7277
  • Liked: 2782
  • Likes Given: 1462
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #74 on: 10/31/2009 02:54 am »
Lunokhod 2s position is known very accurately AFAIK

As a result of a laser retroreflector?  If so, why wouldn't Lunokhod 1's position be similarly well known?

Offline gwiz

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 602
  • Cornwall
  • Liked: 143
  • Likes Given: 29
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #75 on: 10/31/2009 09:01 am »
Lunokhod 2s position is known very accurately AFAIK

As a result of a laser retroreflector?  If so, why wouldn't Lunokhod 1's position be similarly well known?
The Lunokhod 1 retroreflector never really worked, possibly failed to open or got covered by dirt.

Offline simonbp

  • Science Guy
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7138
  • Liked: 314
  • Likes Given: 183
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #76 on: 11/01/2009 05:24 pm »
There's actually more to this than public relations.  NASA is actually trying to obtain geologic context of the sites so that the samples collected from them can be better understood.  They can use their various sensors to determine what the minerological context is and things like that.

They are also seeking the Soviet sample return sites.  It turns out that the locations are not well known, so finding them would help determine what kind of terrain the collected material came from.

In short, there's a legitimate scientific goal to looking for the previous landing sites.

Absolutely. This especially true for Ap 15 and 17, as they purposefully landed on a geological boundary zone. The Soviet landers are especially tricky, as they didn't so much "collect" a sample, as much as drill into whatever was directly below the lander. Since age-dates from the Soviet landers are a lynchpin of current lunar chronology, knowing what exactly we a re age dating is crucial.

They've already posted an early image of the Apollo 14 S-IVB impact. Studying these (and Ranger and ascent stage) craters is important, as they are the only craters on the Moon were we actually know the initial conditions (though they were an order of magnitude slower than a typical lunar impactor).
« Last Edit: 11/01/2009 05:25 pm by simonbp »

Offline Art LeBrun

  • Photo freak
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2128
  • Orange, California
  • Liked: 35
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #77 on: 11/01/2009 05:30 pm »
Maybe some Lunar Orbiter impact craters can be found and imaged.........
1958 launch vehicle highlights: Vanguard TV-4 and Atlas 12B

Offline robertross

  • Canadian Member
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 17939
  • Westphal, Nova Scotia
  • Liked: 659
  • Likes Given: 7688
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #78 on: 11/01/2009 05:46 pm »
http://www.onorbit.com/node/1658
Apollo 17 landing site photos, updated.

That's amazing...

Offline Blackstar

  • Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 15287
  • Liked: 7822
  • Likes Given: 2
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #79 on: 11/01/2009 09:47 pm »
Maybe some Lunar Orbiter impact craters can be found and imaged.........

I have my doubts.  They were not controlled to impact, so we probably have no idea where they came down.

Offline Hungry4info3

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 525
  • Liked: 163
  • Likes Given: 81
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #80 on: 11/01/2009 09:55 pm »
Lunokhod 2s position is known very accurately AFAIK

As a result of a laser retroreflector?  If so, why wouldn't Lunokhod 1's position be similarly well known?
The Lunokhod 1 retroreflector never really worked, possibly failed to open or got covered by dirt.


Lunokhod 2 was the one that was covered in dirt, and forced to end its mission prematurely. The location of Lunokhod 1 isn't known to an accuracy better than a few kilometres because the laser reflection experiment failed to locate Lunkhod-1.

Offline Art LeBrun

  • Photo freak
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2128
  • Orange, California
  • Liked: 35
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #81 on: 11/01/2009 10:54 pm »
Maybe some Lunar Orbiter impact craters can be found and imaged.........

I have my doubts.  They were not controlled to impact, so we probably have no idea where they came down.

Even if we knew and they came down in the highlands (ie not on any mare) they would not be found in all the "chaotic" terrain.........
1958 launch vehicle highlights: Vanguard TV-4 and Atlas 12B

Offline hop

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3352
  • Liked: 553
  • Likes Given: 891
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #82 on: 11/01/2009 11:55 pm »
Lunokhod 2 was the one that was covered in dirt, and forced to end its mission prematurely.
AFAIK the Lunokhod 2 reflector is still detectable. The theory for how it was lost is that some regolith got into the lid, and this was transferred to the radiators.

Offline Blackstar

  • Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 15287
  • Liked: 7822
  • Likes Given: 2
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #83 on: 11/10/2009 02:49 am »
Apollo 11 site, complete with the footpads:

http://lroc.sese.asu.edu/news/uploads/lm_westcrater.png

Too bad we're not going back...

Offline Hoonte

  • Regular
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 481
  • Liked: 21
  • Likes Given: 7
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #84 on: 11/10/2009 12:31 pm »
Drogues populaires www.viagrasansordonnancefr.com toxicose du medicament

Offline rsp1202

  • Elite Veteran
  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1083
  • 3, 2, 1 . . . Make rocket go now
  • Liked: 0
  • Likes Given: 0
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #85 on: 11/10/2009 01:32 pm »
Apollo 11 site, complete with the footpads:

http://lroc.sese.asu.edu/news/uploads/lm_westcrater.png
. . .

West crater looks extremely blasted in this perspective. Little wonder the pilot chose to move on. Little West is almost totally washed out, but you can just pick it out by following Armstrong's footpath to the east. Great stuff.

Offline JAFO

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1032
    • My hobby
  • Liked: 875
  • Likes Given: 966
« Last Edit: 07/30/2012 04:24 am by JAFO »
Anyone can do the job when things are going right. In this business we play for keeps.
— Ernest K. Gann

Offline Blackstar

  • Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 15287
  • Liked: 7822
  • Likes Given: 2
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #87 on: 07/30/2012 01:03 pm »
"that our flag was still there..."

http://lroc.sese.asu.edu/news/index.php?/archives/620-Question-Answered!.html

http://featured-sites.lroc.asu.edu/

Unusually, that made it to the national news last night. I couldn't believe it.

I find this also a bit of a surprise. The flags were fabric. Now imagine fabric in vacuum and that harsh thermal environment for decades. I would have expected that the material would have just crumbled. So how can they be intact?

Certainly they would be incredibly faded, because that's what happens to flags when you leave them out in the sun, even with all our atmospheric protection. But it's a real shocker to me that they're intact.

What would be interesting is to hear from a fabric specialist. Are they as surprised by this as I am?

Offline kevin-rf

  • Elite Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8823
  • Overlooking the path Mary's little Lamb took..
  • Liked: 1318
  • Likes Given: 306
Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #88 on: 07/30/2012 02:06 pm »
Maybe it has crumbled, there is just no breeze to knock it off the wire frame.
If you're happy and you know it,
It's your med's!

Offline Chris Bergin

Re: LRO Sees Apollo Landing Sites!
« Reply #89 on: 07/30/2012 02:12 pm »
Support NSF via L2 -- Help improve NSF -- Site Rules/Feedback/Updates
**Not a L2 member? Whitelist this forum in your adblocker to support the site and ensure full functionality.**

Tags:
 

Advertisement NovaTech
Advertisement Northrop Grumman
Advertisement
Advertisement Margaritaville Beach Resort South Padre Island
Advertisement Brady Kenniston
Advertisement NextSpaceflight
Advertisement Nathan Barker Photography
0