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General Discussion => Spaceflight Entertainment and Hobbies => Topic started by: Chris Bergin on 08/04/2018 10:13 pm

Title: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Chris Bergin on 08/04/2018 10:13 pm
Whoa!!!

He's back!

https://twitter.com/SirPatStew/status/1025840545216823296
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Tomness on 08/04/2018 10:17 pm
Awesome,  be nice to have Patrick back.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Nomadd on 08/04/2018 11:09 pm
 Why does nobody ever get that excited about Shatner?
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: TripleSeven on 08/04/2018 11:55 pm
make it so
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Bob Shaw on 08/05/2018 12:25 am
Why does nobody ever get that excited about Shatner?

Because. HE. Can't. ACT!!!
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: jak Kennedy on 08/05/2018 12:32 am
Great. And loved Shatner too. But the episodes with the female captain, and I really have no idea of her name were awful and only saw 1-2 episodes. Not that a female captain would not have worked but sorry not her.

Live long and prosper.  :D
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: docmordrid on 08/05/2018 12:51 am
Great. And loved Shatner too. But the episodes with the female captain, and I really have no idea of her name were awful and only saw 1-2 episodes. Not that a female captain would not have worked but sorry not her.

Live long and prosper.  :D

Capt. Janeway, and you missed some great moments. Her "you're going to die!" looks were  fun.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 08/05/2018 02:41 am
Great. And loved Shatner too. But the episodes with the female captain, and I really have no idea of her name were awful and only saw 1-2 episodes. Not that a female captain would not have worked but sorry not her.

That was Star Trek: Voyager. It seems to take the later Star Trek series several months or more to find its footing (the first season of The Next Generation is pretty bad, remember) and Voyager was no exception. It really didn't hit its stride until Season 3. Still, Voyager was the most uneven of the modern Star Trek shows. It does have episodes that are very, very good. But it also has episodes that are among the all-time Star Trek stinkers.

Star Trek: Voyager and Star Trek: Deep Space Nine were both way ahead of the TV viewing curve. They (especially DS9 from late Season 2 onwards) were the predecessors of today's "binge TV".



Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: WindnWar on 08/05/2018 03:10 am
Great. And loved Shatner too. But the episodes with the female captain, and I really have no idea of her name were awful and only saw 1-2 episodes. Not that a female captain would not have worked but sorry not her.

That was Star Trek: Voyager. It seems to take the later Star Trek series several months or more to find its footing (the first season of The Next Generation is pretty bad, remember) and Voyager was no exception. It really didn't hit its stride until Season 3. Still, Voyager was the most uneven of the modern Star Trek shows. It does have episodes that are very, very good. But it also has episodes that are among the all-time Star Trek stinkers.

Star Trek: Voyager and Star Trek: Deep Space Nine were both way ahead of the TV viewing curve. They (especially DS9 from late Season 2 onwards) were the predecessors of today's "binge TV".

TOS, Next Gen and DS9 I liked, but I could never really get into Voyager, it had the least authentic camaraderie of any of the series.

Enterprise was so so till the last season when they started answering questions people had about Trek history but it's finale was totally lame.

Discovery just doesn't even feel like Trek. Looking forward to seeing Picard again.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: GWH on 08/05/2018 04:01 am
If they have Klingons or a Worf cameo will they look like the new Klingons?  As I have been working my way through all of TNG and following with DS9 I don't think I can handle that.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: GWH on 08/05/2018 04:02 am
Relevant PicardTips tweet:

Picard leadership tip: If your people are in need of a better example to follow, and if you are confident you can be that example, then consider, really consider, postponing your retirement.

https://twitter.com/PicardTips/status/1025940293881741313?s=19
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Oli on 08/05/2018 01:24 pm
Looks like the Discovery showrunners are involved.  :-\
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: eric z on 08/05/2018 01:50 pm
 William Shatner is a great actor- yes, a little corny at times but also capable of drop-dead dramatic situations. I respectfully suggest anyone interested to look his career up on Wiki and not marvel at the sheer depth of it over the years. From the "Outer Limits" and "Twilight Zone"era, and playing twins in a Western thru to the new show with George Foreman and the guys, he has brought an incredibly exuberant and expansive personality.
  I'd love to see him make an appearance on "The Orville" as a retired captain running a fishing boat on a planet somewhere that needs rescuing...
 PS- Been watching a LOT of Westerns lately, since I only have OTA-TV, and it's amazing how many times Kelley and Nimoy show up as cowboys!
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Rocket Science on 08/05/2018 03:03 pm
Why does nobody ever get that excited about Shatner?
"Oh my..."
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: JazzFan on 08/05/2018 03:29 pm
78 years of age (never old) and still finding new adventures.  Simply amazing!
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Steve G on 08/05/2018 03:56 pm
Hopefully, the opening scene will have Picard waking up sweating and panting, and Star Trek Discovery is passed off as a bad dream.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Blackstar on 08/05/2018 05:01 pm
William Shatner is a great actor- yes, a little corny at times but also capable of drop-dead dramatic situations.

Watch this scene again. Watch it from the beginning and pay attention to Shatner's voice and his facial expressions and how he moves. It's an amazing bit of acting, right down to him sinking down to the floor, totally defeated.

It's a great bit of acting by Nimoy too.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Blackstar on 08/05/2018 05:03 pm
You have to love this guy:



Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Zed_Noir on 08/05/2018 05:29 pm
Why does nobody ever get that excited about Shatner?

Shatner will be 88 when they filmed the next follow-on Trek offering for CBS All Access. Don't see him carrying a series anymore.

Also coming up with storylines for Kirk is much harder than for Picard. IMO

Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 08/05/2018 06:18 pm
Looks like the Discovery showrunners are involved.  :-\

But so is Pulitzer, Nebula, and Hugo award-winner Michael Chabon.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: mike robel on 08/05/2018 06:40 pm
I'd be a lot more excited about it if it weren't behind a paywall
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Don S on 08/05/2018 06:58 pm
https://geektyrant.com/news/patrick-stewart-official-set-to-reprise-his-role-of-captain-picard-in-new-star-trek-series

Another source.

The new series is being developed by Star Trek: Discovery co-creator/executive producer Alex Kurtzman...
Kurtzman will be joined by producers James Duff, Akiva Goldsman, Michael Chabon, and Discovery writer Kirsten Beyer.


Life got crazy during Voyager for me and I never really followed the new series.

Still a Old Star Fan I guess I just enjoy campy.
TNG and DS9 were great.
Voyager they lost their way with techno mumbo jumbo etc...  in addition to a war ship that never seemed to show age or battle scars.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 08/05/2018 08:02 pm
Looks like the Discovery showrunners are involved. 

So what. I love the way people rush to judgement on a show where the scripts haven’t  even been written. Plus there are many more producers than that.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: ChrisWilson68 on 08/05/2018 08:09 pm
I'm excited to see Picard coming back!

It doesn't guarantee a good show.  There were plenty of bad Next Generation episodes, especially in the first couple of seasons.  But at least with Picard there is great potential there.

I also liked the tone of Next Generation better than the tone of any more recent Star Trek outings.  Here's hoping they bring back the Next Generation tone along with Patrick Stewart.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 08/05/2018 08:39 pm
I'm excited to see Picard coming back!

It doesn't guarantee a good show.  There were plenty of bad Next Generation episodes, especially in the first couple of seasons.  But at least with Picard there is great potential there.

I also liked the tone of Next Generation better than the tone of any more recent Star Trek outings.  Here's hoping they bring back the Next Generation tone along with Patrick Stewart.

I don’t what people have against Discovery. Yes it has a rocky start but so do many Trek shows. Plus it has a great protagonist in the first season, one of the best in any of Treks.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: mme on 08/05/2018 10:08 pm
I'm excited to see Picard coming back!

It doesn't guarantee a good show.  There were plenty of bad Next Generation episodes, especially in the first couple of seasons.  But at least with Picard there is great potential there.

I also liked the tone of Next Generation better than the tone of any more recent Star Trek outings.  Here's hoping they bring back the Next Generation tone along with Patrick Stewart.

I don’t what people have against Discovery. Yes it has a rocky start but so do many Trek shows. Plus it has a great protagonist in the first season, one of the best in any of Treks.
Agreed. Discovery is great especially considering the turmoil in which it was created. I think it found it's footing way faster than TNG,  DS9 or Voyager. I never got into Enterprise so I can't speak to that.

And I can't wait to see Patrick Steward again. With any luck he'll have input into the new show and help it find it's footing quickly.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: speedevil on 08/06/2018 01:30 am
Can he really at 78 pull off more than a nominal time on screen?
If he can, there is always the risk to the show that he shortly will not be able to.

I don't see a plausible way from an in-char point of view, unless they are simply ignoring the age, to have him as a captain for sixty one or so years. (thirty one after assuming command of Enterprise).

'returning as captain of the Enterprise' doesn't leave much wiggle room though.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Eric Hedman on 08/06/2018 02:56 am
Can he really at 78 pull off more than a nominal time on screen?
If he can, there is always the risk to the show that he shortly will not be able to.

I don't see a plausible way from an in-char point of view, unless they are simply ignoring the age, to have him as a captain for sixty one or so years. (thirty one after assuming command of Enterprise).

'returning as captain of the Enterprise' doesn't leave much wiggle room though.
I doubt he'll be an active captain.  I'm betting there is some story line where he is needed for specific experience like dealing with the Q Continuum or something else from TNG.  I'm guessing a new Enterprise and crew pick him up and take him with them as an advisor for this mission. 
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Zed_Noir on 08/06/2018 03:10 am
Can he really at 78 pull off more than a nominal time on screen?
If he can, there is always the risk to the show that he shortly will not be able to.

I don't see a plausible way from an in-char point of view, unless they are simply ignoring the age, to have him as a captain for sixty one or so years. (thirty one after assuming command of Enterprise).

'returning as captain of the Enterprise' doesn't leave much wiggle room though.

Stewart stated in recent you tube clips from the Star Trek Las Vegas 2018 convention that he might not be a Star Fleet Captain in the upcoming series and about 20 years have pass in the timeline since the last Picard appearance in a Star Trek movie.

Also it is not clear if CBS All Access is doing a 10-ish episode season like most cable shows or the 20 plus episode season like on broadcast television shows. Suspect it is the former.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: QuantumG on 08/06/2018 05:17 am
I never got into Enterprise so I can't speak to that.

Good. We don't speak about that.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: MATTBLAK on 08/06/2018 11:44 am
I thought that 'Enterprise' was pretty good, though it's hurried wrap-up was a let down. 'Voyager' had some good moments and most of the cast were very good - but it never quite nailed it's full potential. I've been rewatching reruns of 'Voyager' lately and it holds up better than I remember. 'DS-9' is probably my favourite TV show, overall as a drama (behind 'Babylon 5') - but my favourite Star Trek show is TNG; starting from season 3 onwards. I have watched every single episode of every single Star Trek show, 'religiously'. They all have good and bad points. But every Trek show has the odd episode that absolutely soars. 'Discovery' hasn't reached that point yet; but at least it's nowhere near as bad as I feared it was going to be.

I console myself with the fact that every Trek show seems to take awhile to find it's feet. 'Discovery' seems to be no exception. Even the original series didn't kick into overdrive until the second season, though the first season had some very good shows and the third season only a handful of truly good episodes.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 08/06/2018 02:25 pm
I doubt he'll be an active captain.  I'm betting there is some story line where he is needed for specific experience like dealing with the Q Continuum or something else from TNG.

If they want to tie it back in with the Abrams movies, they could set this show shortly after the destruction of Romulus (seen in "Star Trek 2009"). The Romulan government needs help from the Federation, and the only one they'll talk to is Jean-Luc Picard, who they trust because he helped them defeat Shinzon in 2002's "Star Trek: Nemesis". So out of retirement comes Picard, as a special adviser on a mission to help the Romulans pick up the pieces. The mission could be on the new USS Enterprise, NCC-1701-F with a new supporting cast, and this could be a 'back door pilot' for a successor show set on the new Enterprise after Patrick Stewart's involvement ends (this show was rumored at first to only be a mini-series, not a full-fledged weekly series.)
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Wicky on 08/06/2018 05:41 pm
Brings to mind an old episode

All Good Things... "twenty-five years into the future, where an aged Picard has retired to the family vineyard in Labarre, France."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_Good_Things..._(Star_Trek:_The_Next_Generation)

Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Blackstar on 08/06/2018 11:46 pm
I doubt he'll be an active captain.  I'm betting there is some story line where he is needed for specific experience like dealing with the Q Continuum or something else from TNG.

If they want to tie it back in with the Abrams movies, they could set this show shortly after the destruction of Romulus (seen in "Star Trek 2009"). The Romulan government needs help from the Federation, and the only one they'll talk to is Jean-Luc Picard, who they trust because he helped them defeat Shinzon in 2002's "Star Trek: Nemesis". So out of retirement comes Picard, as a special adviser on a mission to help the Romulans pick up the pieces. The mission could be on the new USS Enterprise, NCC-1701-F with a new supporting cast, and this could be a 'back door pilot' for a successor show set on the new Enterprise after Patrick Stewart's involvement ends (this show was rumored at first to only be a mini-series, not a full-fledged weekly series.)

Except that the destruction of Romulus occurred a long time before the TNG timeline.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Torbjorn Larsson, OM on 08/07/2018 12:20 am
“Temba, his arms open.”

/Thx, the world of ST!
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: ChrisWilson68 on 08/07/2018 12:50 am
“Temba, his arms open.”

/Thx, the world of ST!

Darmuk and Jalad, at Tanagra.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 08/07/2018 02:19 am
Except that the destruction of Romulus occurred a long time before the TNG timeline.

No, it was post-TNG. Old Spock tells Young Kirk (in the mind-meld scene) that he is from "129 years from now", which puts it around the year 2387 (TNG was 2364-71 or so and "Nemesis" was around eight years later, or 2379.)
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: ChrisWilson68 on 08/08/2018 04:07 am
Except that the destruction of Romulus occurred a long time before the TNG timeline.

No, it was post-TNG. Old Spock tells Young Kirk (in the mind-meld scene) that he is from "129 years from now", which puts it around the year 2387 (TNG was 2364-71 or so and "Nemesis" was around eight years later, or 2379.)

OK, technically in the future of TNG, but so far we've only seen it affect events far in the past of TNG, because it is the excuse for the fork in the timeline that creates the JJ Abrams rebooted Trek continuity.

Considering how disconnected the Abrams continuity is from all other Trek continuities, it's hard to reconcile them.  It's doubtful the destruction of Romulus will actually ever take place in the continuity that TNG and the rest of Trek takes place in.  So, in a weird way, from a causality point of view, it takes place only in the past of the Abrams continuity, which is long before TNG's time.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 08/08/2018 01:25 pm
OK, technically in the future of TNG, but so far we've only seen it affect events far in the past of TNG, because it is the excuse for the fork in the timeline that creates the JJ Abrams rebooted Trek continuity.

I like the Abrams movies, but I wouldn't mind if they remain in their own little universe, unrelated to the TNG era franchise.

Strictly speaking though, the time-fork happened the moment Nero appeared in the 23rd Century and proceeded to blow the USS Kelvin (and Kirk's dad) to smithereens. That started a new timeline, events that didn't originally happen.* The events in the original Star Trek timeline (the late/post-TNG era, including the destruction of Romulus) are still "Prime Universe" events, so they can be explored by a new TNG-era show, if CBS so chooses.

Now if Bad Robot (Abrams & Co.) want to reboot TNG next, they could do so in the Kelvin Universe, a timeline in which Vulcan was destroyed by Nero 75 years (or whatever) earlier.

*One can ask whatever happened to those 29th Century 'Time Cops' (i.e., the USS Relativity on Voyager or Mr. Daniels on Enterprise) who were fixing timeline incursions. How did they miss Vulcan going kablooey?
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Lars-J on 08/11/2018 05:40 pm
I like Picard and TNG, but this seems like a *terrible* idea indicating a real lack of imagination on the creators behalf. Unless this is a very short mini-series.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: speedevil on 08/11/2018 08:07 pm
I like Picard and TNG, but this seems like a *terrible* idea indicating a real lack of imagination on the creators behalf. Unless this is a very short mini-series.
On its face, with the most obvious 'Picard returns to do new episodes of badly written TNG fanfic ignoring his age' presentation, yes.

I am hopeful that this isn't what it is.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: ChrisWilson68 on 08/11/2018 10:00 pm
*One can ask whatever happened to those 29th Century 'Time Cops' (i.e., the USS Relativity on Voyager or Mr. Daniels on Enterprise) who were fixing timeline incursions. How did they miss Vulcan going kablooey?

Maybe the Daleks got them.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Ike17055 on 08/12/2018 12:55 am
William Shatner is a great actor- yes, a little corny at times but also capable of drop-dead dramatic situations.

Watch this scene again. Watch it from the beginning and pay attention to Shatner's voice and his facial expressions and how he moves. It's an amazing bit of acting, right down to him sinking down to the floor, totally defeated.

It's a great bit of acting by Nimoy too.

Lots to choose from: check out the scene in ST 3 when his son, David is killed.  “You Klingon bastards; you‘ve killed my son....”

Also, same film: the mind meld with Sarek, and the realization he must return to return to the Genesis planet, risking all. Really good drama, great emotion. ST 3 highly underated film as well.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Blackstar on 08/12/2018 09:33 pm
Lots to choose from: check out the scene in ST 3 when his son, David is killed.  “You Klingon bastards; you‘ve killed my son....”

You can see it in the original series as well. I'm blanking on which episode it was, but I watched an original series episode a number of months ago and was impressed with Shatner's acting. He's quite good in some episodes. (For instance "City on the Edge of Forever.") I think that too often Shatner has been called a "bad" actor. That's not really accurate. He at times was a hammy actor and chewed scenery when he didn't have to. But in some cases, given the right material, he could be very good. Maybe his range was narrow, or maybe he just wasn't consistently giving good performances, but he certainly had ability.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: TripleSeven on 08/12/2018 09:52 pm
Lots to choose from: check out the scene in ST 3 when his son, David is killed.  “You Klingon bastards; you‘ve killed my son....”

You can see it in the original series as well. I'm blanking on which episode it was, but I watched an original series episode a number of months ago and was impressed with Shatner's acting. He's quite good in some episodes. (For instance "City on the Edge of Forever.") I think that too often Shatner has been called a "bad" actor. That's not really accurate. He at times was a hammy actor and chewed scenery when he didn't have to. But in some cases, given the right material, he could be very good. Maybe his range was narrow, or maybe he just wasn't consistently giving good performances, but he certainly had ability.

 that is in my view a very very good description

Shatner in my view, at least in the STar Trek series...acts the script...he gets "Hammy" as you would put it when the plot is kind of hammy but in KHAN (loud voice) he does in my view an amazing performance...he plays a guy/gal who is rusty, and feeling for skills that he knew he once had but which have gone rusty...he slowly "gets better" until he returns to his old self...and the scene at Spocks death is to me just wonderful acting

A Taste of Armagedon, Doomsday machine, amock time...etc are just in my view amazing performances.

and in none Trek...some of his performance in Boston legal are haunting. 
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: MATTBLAK on 08/12/2018 09:53 pm
There were moments in the original series where he was brilliant. And his best tragi-comic moments on 'Boston Legal' were superb.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: mme on 08/12/2018 10:38 pm
Since everyone is talking about Shatner, his 2004 album "Has Been" made me fan: Pickfork review of Has Been (https://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/7781-has-been/).

You have to listen to the whole album though to feel it's beauty and brilliance. I disagree with the end of the review though. The songs "It Hasn't Happened Yet" and "What Have You Done?" are also awesome.

On topic:

Patrick Stewart is an absolute gift to humanity and I look forward to seeing what Captain Picard gets up to in retirement. 78 Earth years is not that old in 2383. Get with the program folks.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: speedevil on 08/12/2018 11:20 pm
On topic:
Patrick Stewart is an absolute gift to humanity and I look forward to seeing what Captain Picard gets up to in retirement. 78 Earth years is not that old in 2383.
But it is.
In the final of TNG, he is around that stardate - in the 'flash-forward' - and retired and ill.
He does not refer to this state as being surprising - 'why wasn't I healed and still in starfleet' - as he would have if it was routine to be healthy and working at 100.
Also, if this was true, there should have been lots of much older captains met along the way, and there aren't.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Blackstar on 08/13/2018 12:00 am
Since everyone is talking about Shatner, his 2004 album "Has Been" made me fan: Pickfork review of Has Been (https://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/7781-has-been/).

You have to listen to the whole album though to feel it's beauty and brilliance. I disagree with the end of the review though. The songs "It Hasn't Happened Yet" and "What Have You Done?" are also awesome.


Shatner singing "Common People" is hilarious.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ainyK6fXku0

But you wanna know the man, look up Wil Wheaton's essay "William [bleeping] Shatner" (you need to type in the actual word in Google). It is the funniest thing you'll read in a long time. Trust me.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: TripleSeven on 08/13/2018 12:07 am
Since everyone is talking about Shatner, his 2004 album "Has Been" made me fan: Pickfork review of Has Been (https://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/7781-has-been/).

You have to listen to the whole album though to feel it's beauty and brilliance. I disagree with the end of the review though. The songs "It Hasn't Happened Yet" and "What Have You Done?" are also awesome.


Shatner singing "Common People" is hilarious.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ainyK6fXku0

But you wanna know the man, look up Wil Wheaton's essay "William [bleeping] Shatner" (you need to type in the actual word in Google). It is the funniest thing you'll read in a long time. Trust me.


FREE ENTERPRISE :)
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: MATTBLAK on 08/13/2018 12:10 am
Since everyone is talking about Shatner, his 2004 album "Has Been" made me fan: Pickfork review of Has Been (https://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/7781-has-been/).

You have to listen to the whole album though to feel it's beauty and brilliance. I disagree with the end of the review though. The songs "It Hasn't Happened Yet" and "What Have You Done?" are also awesome.

On topic:

Patrick Stewart is an absolute gift to humanity and I look forward to seeing what Captain Picard gets up to in retirement. 78 Earth years is not that old in 2383. Get with the program folks.
I didn't know this till relatively recently, but Picard is supposed to be ten years older than Patrick Stewart who plays him. So he would be pushing 90. I believe the mandatory retirement age for human Starfleet Captains on Starship Command duty is 100. After that; they have to be Starbase-based or they can take retirement.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Blackstar on 08/13/2018 12:11 am
is kind of hammy but in KHAN (loud voice) he does in my view an amazing performance...he plays a guy/gal who is rusty, and feeling for skills that he knew he once had but which have gone rusty...he slowly "gets better" until he returns to his old self...and the scene at Spocks death is to me just wonderful acting

Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan is showing at one of my local theaters August 20. You might check and see if it's showing near you too.

There is a great arc to Kirk's story (just as there was a good arc to Spock's story in the previous film). Kirk spends much of the film fighting against retaking the command chair. He's finding excuses, and he's not seizing the opportunity. It's not just that he's rusty, he is holding back because he somehow thinks it's wrong and that he shouldn't be in command, and then that nearly gets them all killed. He only gets his cockiness back after beaming down to the planetoid (and eating the apple--symbolic?). He doesn't believe in the no-win scenario, right? Then he gets back in the game and he defeats Khan. But he ends up paying a price for his actions, losing his best friend in the process. It's a wonderful story arc. And in some ways it mirrors Spock's story arc in the first film, where Spock reluctantly goes back to the Enterprise, feeling like he has failed in achieving his goal of "total logic." And by the end of the film, Spock realizes that there's much more to the universe than logic and that he belongs on the Enterprise.

I think The Wrath of Khan is a well-done film, although it has some mostly minor problems. Shatner's acting is good for most of it and sometimes outstanding (like the death scene with Spock), but a few of his lines are sub-standard. There's a story about how he delivered the line "Here it comes" just before using the Prefix Code to lower Reliant's shields. He kept delivering the line in a snarky/sarcastic manner that the director thought sounded wrong. It's the kind of thing that probably would have tipped off Khan that something was going on as soon as he heard it. So Nicolas Meyer kept asking Shatner to re-do the shot. But with actors with huge egos (coughShatnercough) you cannot really tell them that they did a line wrong or ask for a different delivery. So Meyer kept blaming the need for a re-shot on a problem with the sound, or a camera glitch or something. Eventually, after a bunch of takes, he simply tired Shatner out, which is how come Kirk almost sounds bored when he delivers that line. It's a poor delivery, but the best one the director could get out of him.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Blackstar on 08/13/2018 12:16 am

I didn't know this till relatively recently, but Picard is supposed to be ten years older than Patrick Stewart who plays him. So he would be pushing 90. I believe the mandatory retirement age for human Starfleet Captains on Starship Command duty is 100. After that; they have to be Starbase-based or they can take retirement.

Star Trek has always had a bit of a problem with this issue. As a franchise, they wanted to keep their stars in the center seat as long as possible. In real life that would not work--you have a few thousand starships, you cannot keep the same people in command of them for a decade or more at a time, you need to rotate them out.

The U.S. Navy is the extreme other end of this--often a captain will be in command of a ship for only one year and then they're out. Maybe they'll get a couple of commands, but that's it. They're constantly rotating new people into command. There are reasons to do this, but I've often thought (without any good inside knowledge) that it's a poor way to get experienced people in command. It takes a long time to get good at what you do, and if somebody is good going into command, why would you only want to get one year out of them? And if they need more than a year in command to get good, you're not giving them that experience.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: TripleSeven on 08/13/2018 12:26 am

I didn't know this till relatively recently, but Picard is supposed to be ten years older than Patrick Stewart who plays him. So he would be pushing 90. I believe the mandatory retirement age for human Starfleet Captains on Starship Command duty is 100. After that; they have to be Starbase-based or they can take retirement.

Star Trek has always had a bit of a problem with this issue. As a franchise, they wanted to keep their stars in the center seat as long as possible. In real life that would not work--you have a few thousand starships, you cannot keep the same people in command of them for a decade or more at a time, you need to rotate them out.

The U.S. Navy is the extreme other end of this--often a captain will be in command of a ship for only one year and then they're out. Maybe they'll get a couple of commands, but that's it. They're constantly rotating new people into command. There are reasons to do this, but I've often thought (without any good inside knowledge) that it's a poor way to get experienced people in command. It takes a long time to get good at what you do, and if somebody is good going into command, why would you only want to get one year out of them? And if they need more than a year in command to get good, you're not giving them that experience.

yes...my late wife's  father, my father in law: he was well unique ...he got four years on Big E with the title Enterprise.  today one is lucky if they get 14 months...when my father in law made flag...he was very happy but one night on the bridge as we sailed with him in command...for the last time into Norfolk we were both standing there in the dark night, I congratulated him on the two stars (lower half0 and his reply was "I have to give her up"

he went on to be CincPac and finally Vice Chairman JCS but everytime he came on Big E...he always looked hard at the bridge...the Captains Bridge.

Both Picard and Kirk were "lucky"   :)
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: TripleSeven on 08/13/2018 12:40 am
is kind of hammy but in KHAN (loud voice) he does in my view an amazing performance...he plays a guy/gal who is rusty, and feeling for skills that he knew he once had but which have gone rusty...he slowly "gets better" until he returns to his old self...and the scene at Spocks death is to me just wonderful acting

Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan is showing at one of my local theaters August 20. You might check and see if it's showing near you too.

There is a great arc to Kirk's story (just as there was a good arc to Spock's story in the previous film). Kirk spends much of the film fighting against retaking the command chair. He's finding excuses, and he's not seizing the opportunity. It's not just that he's rusty, he is holding back because he somehow thinks it's wrong and that he shouldn't be in command, and then that nearly gets them all killed. He only gets his cockiness back after beaming down to the planetoid (and eating the apple--symbolic?). He doesn't believe in the no-win scenario, right? Then he gets back in the game and he defeats Khan. But he ends up paying a price for his actions, losing his best friend in the process. It's a wonderful story arc. And in some ways it mirrors Spock's story arc in the first film, where Spock reluctantly goes back to the Enterprise, feeling like he has failed in achieving his goal of "total logic." And by the end of the film, Spock realizes that there's much more to the universe than logic and that he belongs on the Enterprise.

I think The Wrath of Khan is a well-done film, although it has some mostly minor problems. Shatner's acting is good for most of it and sometimes outstanding (like the death scene with Spock), but a few of his lines are sub-standard. There's a story about how he delivered the line "Here it comes" just before using the Prefix Code to lower Reliant's shields. He kept delivering the line in a snarky/sarcastic manner that the director thought sounded wrong. It's the kind of thing that probably would have tipped off Khan that something was going on as soon as he heard it. So Nicolas Meyer kept asking Shatner to re-do the shot. But with actors with huge egos (coughShatnercough) you cannot really tell them that they did a line wrong or ask for a different delivery. So Meyer kept blaming the need for a re-shot on a problem with the sound, or a camera glitch or something. Eventually, after a bunch of takes, he simply tired Shatner out, which is how come Kirk almost sounds bored when he delivers that line. It's a poor delivery, but the best one the director could get out of him.

I would agree with everything that you said.

actually after I posted what I did, late here in Istanbul like early in the morning but tomorrow is another day off..I got it out and watched some part of it

in addition to what you said

Shatner plays the "aging Hornblower, or John Paul Jones..." well.  the scene where Kirk comes to tell Spock about the issue ...and they talk about command...reminds me a bit of the interplay with Spock in the (sorry its early here and I have had some Jack D) episode where Kirk and SPock have a moment discussing the Pon Farr.  the discussion of living things the intimacy of "Kirk and command"  the discussion of "I am a Vulcan"...logic alone dictating actions... as with all living things according to their own gifts...

to me the entire "show" is well written with "links to the series.

as I grow older (51 headed for 52) an old fighter pilot where today I mostly train very young people in the craft I love so much.  I realize there are more days behind than ahead of doing what I do...

I see more magic in Shatners acting...

interesting about the snarky line.  Snarky is how in combat I would have delivered them... my phrase is either "bite me" or "yeah we will do that just as soon as H freezes over"

again nice comments...and well its been fun watching it
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Blackstar on 08/13/2018 01:33 am
the discussion of living things the intimacy of "Kirk and command"  the discussion of "I am a Vulcan"...logic alone dictating actions... as with all living things according to their own gifts...


That's a scene that fits Kirk's story arc--he is reluctant to take command and Spock tells him not only that it is regulations that he should take command, but that he belongs there.

TNG had some similar moments throughout its run. Picard got annoyed with Riker for turning down command several times. And the series' finale ("All Good Things") had a great final scene with them all playing cards and Picard pausing and wondering why he had not done that with them before. It was a nice way of him acknowledging that he had a close crew but he kept them a bit farther than he should have.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: mme on 08/13/2018 02:05 am
On topic:
Patrick Stewart is an absolute gift to humanity and I look forward to seeing what Captain Picard gets up to in retirement. 78 Earth years is not that old in 2383.
But it is.
In the final of TNG, he is around that stardate - in the 'flash-forward' - and retired and ill.
He does not refer to this state as being surprising - 'why wasn't I healed and still in starfleet' - as he would have if it was routine to be healthy and working at 100.
Also, if this was true, there should have been lots of much older captains met along the way, and there aren't.
Admiral McCoy was 137 in the first episode of TNG and if Patrick Stewart can have an interesting life at 78 in 2018 I think it's possible for someone in 2383 to have an interesting life at the age of 78. This show is not about him being Captain of the Enterprise, it's about what he did after that.

As for "All Good Things...", do they say exactly when it is set?  I thought it was 20 years in the future from the episode which would have put it around 2390 or 2391. After all Geordi  is married and has a son entering Star Fleet.

Plus it's pretty easy to wave away a multiple timeline Q episode as not representing the "real" future, if one is so inclined. Which I am. :)
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 08/13/2018 02:17 am
You can see it in the original series as well. I'm blanking on which episode it was, but I watched an original series episode a number of months ago and was impressed with Shatner's acting.

Perhaps, "The Conscience of the King" (the Kodos the Executioner episode)?
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: MATTBLAK on 08/13/2018 03:00 am
Shatner's pretty good in 'Day Of The Dove' and 'The Ultimate Computer'.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Blackstar on 08/13/2018 03:14 am
You can see it in the original series as well. I'm blanking on which episode it was, but I watched an original series episode a number of months ago and was impressed with Shatner's acting.

Perhaps, "The Conscience of the King" (the Kodos the Executioner episode)?

It would have been one of the episodes on "The Roddenberry Vault" Blu-Ray, which I highly recommend. (I have the full series, but that's the set that I was watching most recently.) So maybe "City on the Edge of Forever."

But I think, upon reflection, that Shatner actually did quite well in the quieter, more nuanced scenes, when he was supposed to be showing empathy or vulnerability. If he was acting with somebody else and he was supposed to tone it down he could do well. It was the scenes where he was being more commanding or daring that he tended to over-do it and give his lines more loudness and emphasis than they deserved. Anytime he was monologuing he could get himself into trouble, and those were the kinds of scenes that critics jumped on and comedians used in their acts. (i.e. "We... the... People...")
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 05/23/2019 06:15 pm
The second new streaming Star Trek series, Star Trek: Picard saw the release of its teaser trailer today, the 25th anniversary of the airing of All Good Things... the final television episode of Star Trek: The Next Generation.

Sir Patrick Stewart reprises his role as Jean-Luc Picard.

https://youtu.be/f3om4V_-Y0Q

Star Trek: Picard will be available only on the CBS All Access streaming service in the United States. Space in Canada, and on Amazon elsewhere. It is expected to debut in late 2019.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Orbiter on 05/23/2019 06:19 pm
"Why did you leave starfleet?"

Ran out of Earl Grey Tea.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 05/23/2019 07:36 pm
This is the U.K. trailer which will hopefully play globally.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUGYXELKPTw

Also first key art for the series: 

[MEDIA=twitter]1131606457504468992[/MEDIA]
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Swedish chef on 05/23/2019 08:18 pm
Nice, hopefully the script writers will stay clear of the midichlorians nonsense that plagues Star Trek Discovery
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Scylla on 07/21/2019 11:39 pm
As far as I can tell, no thread has been created for this new series. We'll just skip the teaser and go to the new trailer.

https://youtu.be/KbXy0f0aCN0
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Zed_Noir on 07/22/2019 12:16 am
The video linked up-thread by the OP is no longer available.

However the Canadian Space channel have a version on you-tube.

https://youtu.be/RZ9lvNHQzLQ (https://youtu.be/RZ9lvNHQzLQ)
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: old_geez on 07/22/2019 06:21 am
Neither version is available downunder
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Swedish chef on 07/22/2019 06:06 pm
Neither version is available downunder

Also forbidden in Sweden. I thought this nonsense from media companies ended years ago.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Zed_Noir on 07/23/2019 02:58 am
Hey folks try this breakdown video of the ST- Picard teaser clip from the Nerdist you-tube channel. Hope it is not Geo-fenced.

Nerdist Picard teaser breakdown video (https://youtu.be/Xba7tYIe9yw?t=28s)
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 10/05/2019 09:26 pm
New trailer:

https://youtu.be/YhBBXHwEsIo
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Swedish chef on 10/05/2019 11:05 pm
New trailer:

-Hmpf.. With that over the top soundtrack to this trailer I suddenly got a bad feeling for this spin off. Pretty please I do not want another Star Trek Discovery with magic mushrooms and space travel. Can I have something simple with an elderly captain Picard exploring the universe thank you so very much.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 10/06/2019 06:32 am
New trailer:

-Hmpf.. With that over the top soundtrack to this trailer I suddenly got a bad feeling for this spin off. Pretty please I do not want another Star Trek Discovery with magic mushrooms and space travel. Can I have something simple with an elderly captain Picard exploring the universe thank you so very much.

I am guessing you didn’t continue watching Discovery as the mushrooms etc were mostly gone in season two.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Swedish chef on 10/07/2019 06:44 pm
New trailer:

-Hmpf.. With that over the top soundtrack to this trailer I suddenly got a bad feeling for this spin off. Pretty please I do not want another Star Trek Discovery with magic mushrooms and space travel. Can I have something simple with an elderly captain Picard exploring the universe thank you so very much.

I am guessing you didn’t continue watching Discovery as the mushrooms etc were mostly gone in season two.

That is correct, I tried to watch some episodes of season two, but I was angered then about the pitfalls the writers had stumbled into. The nicest thing I could say about Star trek Discovery is that every generation has one Sherlock Holmes, I did not understand Star Trek Discovery so I am guessing that series was not for me.

With that said, I shall try to be nicer and more constructive in this thread. This is captain Picard we are talking about. I saw seven of nine and the Borgs in this latest trailer so this should be everything I asked about.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: QuantumG on 10/07/2019 09:27 pm
Neither version is available downunder

Old guy who you know visits other old folks you know, but he's got a new ship and a young crew.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Mr. Scott on 10/08/2019 03:53 am
Neither version is available downunder

Old guy who you know visits other old folks you know, but he's got a new ship and a young crew.

Old captain treks around the galaxy using a space ride sharing service, seeking new civilizations that attack using their own ride sharing service. 

The young enterprising pilots take the old folks passengers around, to seek strange new worlds, to seek new life and new civilizations, and new passengers who also might want space ride sharing services.  If anyone needs to, they pull over and allow them to boldly go where no man has gone before.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Eric Hedman on 10/08/2019 06:27 am
Neither version is available downunder

Old guy who you know visits other old folks you know, but he's got a new ship and a young crew.

Old captain treks around the galaxy using a space ride sharing service, seeking new civilizations that attack using their own ride sharing service. 

The young enterprising pilots take the old folks passengers around, to seek strange new worlds, to seek new life and new civilizations, and new passengers who also might want space ride sharing services.  If anyone needs to, they pull over and allow them to boldly go where no man has gone before.
All aboard the USS Uber the Federations latest and most millenial starship. 8) ;D
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: QuantumG on 10/08/2019 02:47 pm
All aboard the USS Uber the Federations latest and most millenial starship. 8) ;D

No guaranteed mission duration.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Zed_Noir on 10/10/2019 04:46 am
One of the wacky online speculation of the trailer scenes of the Romulan guards over the no assimalation signs in English and Romulan:

hidden speculative spoilers text below

Is that the Romulan Tal Shiar and Section 31 from the Federation have a joint research project studying a capture Borg cube and it's crew. One of the possible result is the girl Dahj who look up Picard for help. Speculation is that she is a Romulan Human hybrid with modified Borg implants. The girl might have Picard's DNA so could take over Patrick Stewart's Picard role in the series later on. Patrick Stewart will be 80 years old after the conclusion of the first series of Star Trek: Picard. It was established in The Star Trek Nemesis movie that the Romulans have access to Picard's DNA to creat the Shinzon clone.

Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: FutureSpaceTourist on 01/22/2020 09:42 pm
https://twitter.com/theview/status/1220072598677151746

Quote
See Whoopi Goldberg's emotional reaction when Patrick Stewart officially invites her to return to #StarTrek for season two of #StarTrekPicard: “It was wonderful having you, and we cannot wait to have you with us again one more time.” abcn.ws/2CcjBVI
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 01/23/2020 10:38 pm
The premiere episode "Remembrance" debuted today (23 January) in the United States on CBS All Access.

Very slow, introspective early scenes set up where Jean-Luc Picard is in his life, 20 years after the events of 2002's "Star Trek: Nemesis" and an unspecified amount of time since the supernova which destroyed the planet Romulus, events seen in 2009's "Star Trek" reboot movie.

This is the same universe of the Federation we're accustomed to, it is not a parallel universe/alternate reality like the recent J.J. Abrams movies. But 20 years on, the Federation has changed due to a disaster and a failed rescue mission to Romulus (shades of the present Syrian Refugee Crisis, no doubt). We first see Picard leading a quiet life at his family vineyard in France. But the arrival of a stranger sets in motion what will be the primary storyline of Season 1, which will be ten episodes long.

Three of the new regular cast members are introduced in the pilot: newcomer Isa Briones, Allison Pill ("The Newsroom") and Harry Treadaway ("Mr. Mercedes"). The remainder of the regular cast as well as returning Next Generation-era characters will arrive in the next few episodes.

Star Trek: Picard has already been renewed for a second season.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Zed_Noir on 01/23/2020 10:44 pm
The Canadian CTV Sci-Fi channel (formerly Space) is broadcasting the first ST: Picard episode  episode today at 9 PM ET along with streaming on the Crave channel later.

Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Swedish chef on 01/24/2020 02:50 am
Staying away from any spoilers I only wish to say that this was an really enjoyable premier, looking forward to the next episode.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Ronpur50 on 01/24/2020 08:31 pm
Staying away from any spoilers I only wish to say that this was an really enjoyable premier, looking forward to the next episode.

I totally agree.  I have never been so excited for a Star Trek series and the next episode in a long time.  It looks to be a great adventure! And a new mystery for Picard to solve.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Hauerg on 01/24/2020 08:54 pm
Spoilerfree:

👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼

Just watched on amazon here in 🇦🇹.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Lars-J on 01/25/2020 03:34 am
I dunno...

If you are desperate to itch that TNG nostalgia, yeah, it will satisfy you ... for a while.

But the producers seem hell bent on remaking Blade Runner or nuBSG in a Star Trek setting instead of actually doing something interesting with Picard.

I actually did like all the Picard parts in the beginning, but as soon as we switched to the other character and the poorly shot fight scenes started with cheap costumes for the bad guys, my hopes got dashed. (yeah, the bad henchmen look like low budget early 90's sci-fi)

I'll keep watching, but I'm not optimistic.

-----

EDIT: Oh and the ship design is very uninspired... All ships are thin like folded paper origami.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 01/25/2020 04:02 am
The "synths gone rogue" storyline is reminiscent of Blade Runner and nuBSG, I agree. But remember nuBSG was the product of Ronald D. Moore, who cut his teeth on Star Trek: The Next Generation. The Cylons of nuBSG actually seem more like evil versions of Data than they do the original Cylons.

I think this storyline actually makes quite a bit of sense, regarding where the Federation would be 20 years later.
 
Much of Star Trek: Picard seems to be a follow-on to the Data story, rather than just "what is Picard up to these days?". There are direct references to the well-regarded episode "The Measure of a Man", when Dr. Jurati mentions she was mentored by Bruce Maddox (the villain at the center of that episode.) In that episode, Picard argued in a court of law for Data's rights, and that argument became protecting the rights of a potential future race of sentient androids. 30 years later, and Picard has seen that hard-won court victory tossed out by the Federation and androids ("Synthetics") are now banned.

We know that Data remained friendly with Maddox in later years (he is writing a letter to him throughout the episode "Data's Day") and Jurati seems to suggest that Maddox had made great progress with his goal of recreating Data until something went disastrously wrong.

The ending of the episode also reveals the Borg ship. We know that the Borg were able to combine android technology with flesh and blood humanoids, we saw this spectacularly with the entrance of the Borg Queen in the movie "First Contact" and she proceeded to offer Data flesh-and-blood in that movie (he considered it for 4.5 milliseconds or something... "an eternity for an android".) The Borg were supposedly wiped-out by Janeway's virus attack in the Voyager finale, "Endgame". "Star Trek 2009" already showed us that ex-Borg technology has proliferated through the galaxy (that's why Nero's ship... a mining vessel... was so powerful it could wipe out Klingon and Federation fleets.)

So we have Maddox continued his work to build more Datas and Borg technology is now loose in the galaxy. Viola! Cylons. Well, flesh-and-blood androids at least two of whom do not know that they are androids.

I think this is a very interesting story.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Oli on 01/25/2020 12:47 pm
Not a fan (yet).

The dialogue is quite bad at times, the acting mediocre, the action scenes lame, the special effects not great.

Also, two things made me scratch my head in this episode:

Quote from: spoilers
Dahj visits Picard, told him she killed 3 people, and he immediately welcomes her. Given she's a complete stranger to him at that point, that seems incredulous.

Picard gets catapulted through the air by the explosion, and wakes up on a couch in his home. Like wtf? Where's the ambulance, hospital, police, investigation?

To be fair, it's already better than Discovery, which was an abomination. The question is, why can't they make a good old Trek show, like Orville but more serious and with somewhat better writing/acting?

Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Draggendrop on 01/25/2020 02:45 pm
As a geriatrek, I am very comfortable with this show. There have been several trailers to give a glimpse of where this season may go and it is enough of a hook for me. Personally, I don't require fancy scenes or impecible dialogue...just give me an old style adventure to enjoy.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: sanman on 01/26/2020 07:35 am
[spoilers]
The storyline of this new series Star Trek Picard is based on 2 major events:

1) The events of the 2009 movie "Star Trek: Nemesis" feature the destruction of Romulus, the homeworld of the Romulan empire, due to its sun going supernova, which prompts an attempt at mass-relocation of a billion Romulan refugees into Federation territory. The android character of Lt Cmdr Data dies at the end of this movie, but seems happily resurrected.

2) The CBS-produced short "Children of Mars" features a terrorist attack carried out by rogue androids against Mars, which causes mass casualties including 3000 dead at the Utopia Planitia shipyards where the Enterprise-D, Defiant, and Voyager starships were constructed. Admiral Picard is shown to be the head of Starfleet at the time of this attack. A comicbook that was also released shows the head of the shipyard at the time the attack was Geordi LeForge, who was overseeing the construction of the Romulan relocation fleet.

This first episode provides some charming scenes of an older, more frail, retired Jean-Luc Picard. However it also at times seems to push its narrative rather abruptly and through rushed dialogue. Picard has a dream where he sees explosions erupting all over Mars after interacting with his dead friend Data. A girl arrives at Picard's home the next day, sobbing about how people were after her, and that she'd come looking for him because she'd seen him in a dream. Picard  then has another dream of his friend Data painting a picture of a girl, and Data tells Picard he must finish the painting. Picard wakes up to find that same painting hanging in front of him. He then goes to visit an old archive of memorabilia from the Enterprise, and finds another almost identical painting which was also painted by Data - but the girl in this painting looks exactly like the girl he met - and he's told the title of the painting is "daughter". immediately decides to abandon his retirement to help out the girl he's met.


The politics in the story is also unsubtle. Picard's interview on FNN (Federation News Network) looked very 20th-century.
The Romulan refugees storyline is being used as an analog to the issue of Mexican and other undocumented migrants in the United States. The retired Picard is shown having a pair of Romulan servants working for him on his vineyard estate in France.
The attack on Mars is being used as an analog to the 9-11 attacks and resultant political fallout in the United States. We're told that in response to the Mars attack, the Federation has banned all androids.

It's not as if Star Trek hasn't done politics before - but shows like the original series (TOS) and The Next Generation (TNG) were episodic in nature, and didn't singularly revolve around a single political theme or issue, instead giving us a variety of issues and viewpoints while jumping to new storylines from one episode to the next. By contrast, Star Trek Picard has a continuous story arc, which will lock it into a particular and persistent political message.

There is a 3rd storyline being pursued - "Star Trek Picard: The Search for Data".
Just as James Cameron's Star Trek II featured a showdown between Captain Kirk and his arch-nemesis Khan, likewise the 2009 movie Star Trek: Nemesis was made to depict a showdown between Captain Picard and a newly-minted nemesis.
Whereas the death of Spock in Star Trek II led to "Star Trek III: The Search for Spock" with Kirk leading his band of renegade officers to resurrect his faithful friend, likewise the death of Data during the climax of Star Trek: Nemesis has been used to create a similar storyline for "Star Trek Picard" with the titular hero leading his own band of renegades (including 7of9) to resurrect his lost friend.
But while Data died in that climactic showdown in Nemesis, he happily seemed to get resurrected at the very end of that movie. Yet the new Picard series goes out of its way to un-resurrect him, so that we can then go on a quest to get him resurrected.

Anyway, I'll keep watching and keep fingers crossed.



It was interesting that Picard told the FNN reporter about Dunkirk - Patrick Stewart's own father was a military veteran who served in that conflict.

[/spoilers]
Title: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 01/26/2020 11:26 am
Seemed perfectly fine to me. The effects and fights seemed OK other than the silly superhero leaping bit. But otherwise I liked it, it’s interesting that the trailers really empathise the action scenes whereas if episode one is anything to go by it’s a much slower more character driven show.

What do you mean James Cameron’s Star Trek 2, to the best of my knowledge he’s never had anything to do with Trek.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Oli on 01/26/2020 01:48 pm
The storyline of this new series Star Trek Picard is based on 2 major events:

1) The events of the 2009 movie "Star Trek: Nemesis" feature the destruction of Romulus, the homeworld of the Romulan empire, due to its sun going supernova, which prompts an attempt at mass-relocation of a billion Romulan refugees into Federation territory.

...

It was interesting that Picard told the FNN reporter about Dunkirk - Patrick Stewart's own father was a military veteran who served in that conflict.


- That would make no sense because the Romulan empire is vast and there would be plenty of space to relocate a billion Romulans to.
- Another wtf moment. Why would anyone expect this particular event from WW2 to be common knowledge in the 24th century? Because Hollywood made a movie about it in the early 21th century?  ;D
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Redclaws on 01/26/2020 02:29 pm
He specifically refers to “books of history people would rather forget”, and is a historian/archaeologist.  I think the idea that these moments of history *are* forgotten by most in his time is half the point, rather than a WTF.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Oli on 01/26/2020 03:15 pm
He specifically refers to “books of history people would rather forget”, and is a historian/archaeologist.  I think the idea that these moments of history *are* forgotten by most in his time is half the point, rather than a WTF.

I suppose that would be an argument if the historical analogy wasn't nonsense. Rescuing an enemy population from a natural disaster is not same as rescuing your own troops from an enemy onslaught. Moreover, this is an interview for the general public, why would Picard mention some obscure event that happened 450+ years ago? Nah, the writers are just unimaginative hacks, they want to tell their present-day story using the Trek-brand.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 01/26/2020 03:46 pm
The storyline of this new series Star Trek Picard is based on 2 major events:

You're confusing two movies.

Data dies at the end of 2002's "Star Trek: Nemesis".
The supernova that destroys Romulus is in 2009's "Star Trek" (the J.J. Abrams reboot movie.)

We previously saw the Federation News Service in 1994's "Star Trek: Generations", interviewing Kirk about the launch of the USS Enterprise, NCC-1701-B. The familiarity may simply be so that contemporary audiences would know what was going on, similar to the famous "salt shaker" incident in the original episode "The Man Trap" (they tried using a futuristic looking salt shaker, but no one watching the scene knew what it was supposed to be, so they just used an ordinary one.)

Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan was by Nicholas Meyer, not James Cameron.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Khadgars on 01/26/2020 04:04 pm
I was really hoping they would to pull heavily from TNG, which is something we could definitely use today.  Instead, they just had to go political.

Its really sad, growing up Picard was almost like a father figure to me hoping this show doesn't ruin that  :-\
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Orbiter on 01/26/2020 04:26 pm
I was really hoping they would to pull heavily from TNG, which is something we could definitely use today.  Instead, they just had to go political.

Its really sad, growing up Picard was almost like a father figure to me hoping this show doesn't ruin that  :-\

TNG was highly political.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 01/26/2020 04:29 pm
Its really sad, growing up Picard was almost like a father figure to me hoping this show doesn't ruin that  :-\

Don't worry too much, I think. The opening sequence shows a bunch of shattered pieces falling from the sky and being put back together  as Jean-Luc Picard, so I think this show is going to be "How Picard Got His Groove Back".
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: sanman on 01/26/2020 09:30 pm
- That would make no sense because the Romulan empire is vast and there would be plenty of space to relocate a billion Romulans to.

This plotline shares a similarity with the 1991 movie Star Trek 6: The Undiscovered Country, where the loss of the Klingon homeworld's ozone layer due to the destruction of its moon Praxis threatens their survival, which creates a window of opportunity for Captain Kirk to pursue peace with one of the Federation's most implacable enemies. Likewise, you'd think that such an event wouldn't be enough to threaten the survival of a vast interstellar empire, but Praxis is referred to as the energy production center for the Klingons, thus framing it as an analog to the 1985 Chernobyl nuclear disaster in the Soviet Union. So life inspires art, and art inspires plagiarism and repetition.

Quote
- Another wtf moment. Why would anyone expect this particular event from WW2 to be common knowledge in the 24th century? Because Hollywood made a movie about it in the early 21th century?  ;D

Movies & TV shows are products of the times they're made in, and the event likely holds special meaning to Patrick Stewart himself due to his own family history, so perhaps that's why it was mentioned.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: sanman on 01/26/2020 09:35 pm
The storyline of this new series Star Trek Picard is based on 2 major events:

You're confusing two movies.

Data dies at the end of 2002's "Star Trek: Nemesis".
The supernova that destroys Romulus is in 2009's "Star Trek" (the J.J. Abrams reboot movie.)

I thought it was Vulcan that was destroyed in the J J Abrams reboot. I remember it as Vulcan, because that's when Spock's parents die.
You're right - Nemesis was 2002 - but its storyplot was about the Romulans.

Quote
We previously saw the Federation News Service in 1994's "Star Trek: Generations", interviewing Kirk about the launch of the USS Enterprise, NCC-1701-B. The familiarity may simply be so that contemporary audiences would know what was going on, similar to the famous "salt shaker" incident in the original episode "The Man Trap" (they tried using a futuristic looking salt shaker, but no one watching the scene knew what it was supposed to be, so they just used an ordinary one.)

Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan was by Nicholas Meyer, not James Cameron.

You're right, I stand corrected again. And all these years, I'd thought it was James Cameron.  :P
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Chris Bergin on 01/27/2020 01:52 am
Got to say, I absolutely loved it. Yes, it's slow paced in parts, but I still loved it.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Dr. Strangelove on 01/27/2020 09:14 am
The dialogue is so sub-par on this show. It seems to be lifted straight from some 13year old's Star Trek fanfic post on $SOCIAL_WEBSITE.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Oli on 01/27/2020 10:47 am
Movies & TV shows are products of the times they're made in

Sure, but I think sci-fi needs to offer more than just present day events in a futuristic setting. At the core of Trek is a utopian society. Present day stuff was usually encountered on alien planets. In this show they destroy that utopian society at the very beginning with that FNN interview. Trek is only used because of the brand. In fact, I would argue Trek, and Picard in particular, is not equipped at all to deal with our (or at least America's) postmodern condition.

Picard seems ouright ridiculous in that context:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QToMdilEFEY
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: apace on 01/27/2020 11:00 am
In the german magazine "heise" Patrick Stewart votes for ending human space exploration and using that money for climate protection: https://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/Klimawandel-the-final-frontier-Enterprise-Captain-will-lieber-die-Erde-retten-4641389.html
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: MATTBLAK on 01/27/2020 11:26 am
I've heard similar sentiments before. But as usual: why pick on Space? We all know that money wasted on gambling, narcotics, wasteful military projects and battling diseases caused by smoking and obesity make Space exploration a drop in the bucket by comparison. I doubt Mr Stewart let alone other famous people could quote a single budget figure for any civilian, taxpayer space venture unless he did research. And many folks don't even realize that space technology has done and will continue to play a crucial role in climate change monitoring. Not so much human spaceflight, sure, but... :(
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 01/27/2020 11:44 am
In the german magazine "heise" Patrick Stewart votes for ending human space exploration and using that money for climate protection: https://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/Klimawandel-the-final-frontier-Enterprise-Captain-will-lieber-die-Erde-retten-4641389.html

Half the time it will turn out the person has been quoted out of context in these interviews.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: HVM on 01/27/2020 11:52 am
Why should we care about actor's opinion on anything, outside theater acting and drama? Maybe screenwriter's but not much more.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: alexterrell on 01/27/2020 12:19 pm

I thought it was Vulcan that was destroyed in the J J Abrams reboot. I remember it as Vulcan, because that's when Spock's parents die.
You're right - Nemesis was 2002 - but its storyplot was about the Romulans.

The older Spock recounts to the younger Kirk how he was travelling with "red matter" (yeah right) to the Romulan system to prevent the super nova, but he arrived too late.

Spock and the evil Romulan ended up going back in time to "reboot" the series, and give a parallel time line.  (And also destroy Vulcan, to explain why there are so few Vulcans in later time lines).

I watched Picard last night and it seemed pretty good. Especially the contrast between an old French château and starfleet, which he pops off to visit for the afternoon (which makes sense, if you have beaming technology). I think part of the story is that Picard has wasted away in retirement (or retirement has made him older), and I suspect as the series progresses he will get faster and stronger - more like the old Picard.   

I would have thought an Android like Data would know she was an android. How was she at school sports? (or explained away by "not yet activated")

I think the series will work out, assuming they don't get sucked into time travel which only ever leads to nonsense or comedy.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 01/27/2020 02:25 pm
I would have thought an Android like Data would know she was an android. How was she at school sports? (or explained away by "not yet activated")

Dahj would not be the first. Data's "mother", Juliana Tainer, did not know she was really an android in the episode "Inheritance".

https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Inheritance_(episode)

As for Dahj (and Soji) I suspect they never went to school and don't really have parents. I think her "mother" that she talked to is just a hologram, you see it briefly glitch when Dahj points out she hadn't mentioned Picard. Commander Maddox and his team built them using ex-Borg technology and implemented false memories of growing up. That's why Picard says "those memories are yours and no one can ever take them away".

Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: MikeAtkinson on 01/27/2020 03:51 pm
[spoiler]
The snatch squad was really incompetent - if you have beaming technology just beam the victim to a holding cell. Preferably when they are alone. If they have to beam in, don't kill anyone or bother with a bag over the head just tag them and beam out. Or beam in some knock-out gas. Or any one of a hundred more sensible tactics.

Again the second time why try and kill someone you just wanted to kidnap the previous day. All the trace evidence would give forensics a field day. Attacking with Picard present would be bound to lead to a major investigation. And can they just beam in to the Starfleet campus with no-one noticing.
[/spoiler]
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Rocket Science on 01/27/2020 05:17 pm
Spoiler Alert
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyA_Etw30mM
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: sanman on 01/28/2020 01:42 am
The older Spock recounts to the younger Kirk how he was travelling with "red matter" (yeah right) to the Romulan system to prevent the super nova, but he arrived too late.

Spock and the evil Romulan ended up going back in time to "reboot" the series, and give a parallel time line.  (And also destroy Vulcan, to explain why there are so few Vulcans in later time lines).

I watched Picard last night and it seemed pretty good. Especially the contrast between an old French château and starfleet, which he pops off to visit for the afternoon (which makes sense, if you have beaming technology). I think part of the story is that Picard has wasted away in retirement (or retirement has made him older), and I suspect as the series progresses he will get faster and stronger - more like the old Picard.   

I would have thought an Android like Data would know she was an android. How was she at school sports? (or explained away by "not yet activated")

I think the series will work out, assuming they don't get sucked into time travel which only ever leads to nonsense or comedy.



See, this is why I hate Time Travel stuff, even though it's well-established in the Star Trek universe, because it creates paradoxes.

If Romulus is destroyed in the JJ Abrams rebooted timeline, then that timeline cannot get to the events of Star Trek Nemesis, where the titular Nemesis is Romulan. And the events of Star Trek Nemesis are what give us the death of Data.

So I don't see how Star Trek Picard can have its cake and eat it too -- ie. how can they have the destruction of Romulus and yet also have the death of Data?
I wonder what the respective stardates are for these 2 events within this timeline, because the destruction of Romulus would have to happen after Data gets killed.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Khadgars on 01/28/2020 01:46 am
Why should we care about actor's opinion on anything, outside theater acting and drama? Maybe screenwriter's but not much more.

I agree, except their voices carry a lot of weight.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: QuantumG on 01/28/2020 01:52 am
See, this is why I hate Time Travel stuff, even though it's well-established in the Star Trek universe, because it creates paradoxes.

The whole Star Trek universe is a Swiss cheese of temporal paradoxes now.

Personally, I love it. It's what humans do with advanced technology - screw everything up.

It fits with the overall arch of Star Trek. Peace is a process of reigning in rogue madmen, or well meaning rule breakers, who are enabled by advanced technology.

Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 01/28/2020 02:58 am
If Romulus is destroyed in the JJ Abrams rebooted timeline, then that timeline cannot get to the events of Star Trek Nemesis, where the titular Nemesis is Romulan. And the events of Star Trek Nemesis are what give us the death of Data.

No, the supernova which destroyed Romulus happened several years after the death of Data. This did not happen in the rebooted timeline, it was the event in the original timeline which sent Spock (and the Romulan bad guy Nero) back in time to the 23rd Century. In an unexpected way, Star Trek: Picard finally gives us motive for Nero wanting to destroy Vulcan and Earth: he was furious that the Federation aborted its "Dunkirk" rescue mission.

At that point back in the 23rd Century, Nero changed history by destroying the USS Kelvin (and killing Kirk's father). This alternate history exists separately from the original timeline and is called the Kelvin Timeline by fans. The original timeline is called the Prime Timeline. Spock explains this to the confused Bridge officers in the 2009 movie "Star Trek".

Prime Timeline:
2233: James T. Kirk born in Iowa
2265-70: Original Five Year Mission of Kirk's Enterprise
2364-71: The events of "Star Trek: The Next Generation" (Data gives the year as 2364 in the first season episode "Neutral Zone")
2379: Data dies saving his Captain ("Star Trek: Nemesis")
2387: Supernova destroys Romulus, Spock and Nero disappear into a black hole created by the supernova (Star Trek: 2009)
2399: The events of "Star Trek: Picard" (it has been 30 years since Data completed the painting "Daughter" in circa 2369)

Kelvin Timeline:
2233: Nero arrives from the year 2387, destroys USS Kelvin while Kirk is born on an escaping Shuttlecraft
2258: Spock arrives from the year 2387. Nero destroys Vulcan





Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 02/01/2020 07:42 am
As regards episode 2 and I don’t know why but I am still shocked to hear swearing in anything Trek related.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Stan Black on 02/01/2020 09:00 am
As regards episode 2 and I don’t know why but I am still shocked to hear swearing in anything Trek related.

Yes that was not quite right hearing swearing in Star Trek… but then again there was plenty of swearing before, just none of it in English.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: catdlr on 02/01/2020 10:39 am
Episode 1 is now available FREE on YouTube:

Star Trek: Picard | Free Series Premiere Episode | CBS All Access

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PPm5l3o2zw
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 02/01/2020 12:56 pm
As regards episode 2 and I don’t know why but I am still shocked to hear swearing in anything Trek related.

Yes that was not quite right… but then again there was plenty of swearing before, just none of it in English.

I imagine if the Borg come back to life we could be in for some body horror if they feel less bound by censorship on their streaming service.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 02/01/2020 02:08 pm
I imagine if the Borg come back to life we could be in for some body horror if they feel less bound by censorship on their streaming service.

TNG already went there in the episode "Conspiracy", where we saw the alien-infested Commander Remmick's head explode. Reportedly, Paramount sternly told Roddenberry and Co. to never do anything like that again after they got a lot of complaints from affiliates and viewers.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 02/01/2020 07:04 pm
I imagine if the Borg come back to life we could be in for some body horror if they feel less bound by censorship on their streaming service.

TNG already went there in the episode "Conspiracy", where we saw the alien-infested Commander Remmick's head explode. Reportedly, Paramount sternly told Roddenberry and Co. to never do anything like that again after they got a lot of complaints from affiliates and viewers.

I doubt there would be the same concern now.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: brahmanknight on 02/02/2020 11:39 pm
I guess this is where I differ. 

I was annoyed with the utopian aspects of TNG ( I did not like the OS ).  And worse than that, those first two seasons of TNG were........to be polite, underwhelming in production quality.  Other than Measure of a Man in season 2, I never rewatch those seasons.  But starting with season 3, it turns awesome. 

DS9 was very average until a few seasons in, too. 

So I wouldn't be too concerned with production after two episodes. 
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: ChrisWilson68 on 02/03/2020 12:57 am
I haven't actually watched Star Trek: Picard yet.  But my understanding is that it's basically one storyline spread across many seasons.

I think that's a shame.  One of the things I liked about TNG was that, with a very few exceptions, every week was a completely new story.  Some were weak, but some were very strong.  I really liked the variety, the ability to explore a whole new story idea in every episode, with the same characters, so each story didn't have to do all its own character development.  The same characters could face new and (mostly) interesting stories all the time.

With just one primary story over the course of a season, it may be a great story, but it's still just one.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: sanman on 02/04/2020 12:07 pm
I'd heard that this series had to be severely re-edited after customer Amazon demanded that the episode count be reduced. I don't see why a streaming service like Amazon Prime would need to be so strict on episode count, as streaming services are supposed to be much more flexible on content than broadcasters saddled with their traditional constraints. Bezos claims to be a Star Trek fan, but he should really kick himself over the effects of this imposition, because it appears to be this re-editing which has so badly damaged the story pacing.

We barely got to meet Dahj before she's killed, and replaced in the storyline by her twin. We barely get to meet the twin, and she barely gets to meet Narek, before they're suddenly in a relationship. That's barely happened when we learn he's spying on her. There's no time to digest things before they're suddenly subjected to radical new changes. Some kind of hack-and-slash story editing has occurred here, so that a lot of intervening events are being dropped out.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Lars-J on 02/04/2020 05:52 pm
I'd heard that this series had to be severely re-edited after customer Amazon demanded that the episode count be reduced. I don't see why a streaming service like Amazon Prime would need to be so strict on episode count, as streaming services are supposed to be much more flexible on content than broadcasters saddled with their traditional constraints. Bezos claims to be a Star Trek fan, but he should really kick himself over the effects of this imposition, because it appears to be this re-editing which has so badly damaged the story pacing.

I think you are confused or misinformed. ST: Picard is a CBS streaming show (CBS All Access), not Amazon Prime. Amazon just allows you to also subscribe to CBS as an add-on. Bezos does not control ST: Picard at all.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 02/04/2020 06:03 pm
I'd heard that this series had to be severely re-edited after customer Amazon demanded that the episode count be reduced.

I haven't heard anything like that and I would be very surprised if the episode count wasn't stipulated in Patrick Stewart's contract. He's not a young man.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: ChrisWilson68 on 02/05/2020 05:55 am
I'd heard that this series had to be severely re-edited after customer Amazon demanded that the episode count be reduced. I don't see why a streaming service like Amazon Prime would need to be so strict on episode count, as streaming services are supposed to be much more flexible on content than broadcasters saddled with their traditional constraints. Bezos claims to be a Star Trek fan, but he should really kick himself over the effects of this imposition, because it appears to be this re-editing which has so badly damaged the story pacing.

I think you are confused or misinformed. ST: Picard is a CBS streaming show (CBS All Access), not Amazon Prime. Amazon just allows you to also subscribe to CBS as an add-on. Bezos does not control ST: Picard at all.

That's not quite true.

In the United States, ST: Picard is only available on CBS All Access, not Amazon.

But in most of the rest of the world, it's distributed by Amazon.

So it's not impossible that Amazon has some say in the production of ST: Picard.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 02/06/2020 06:53 am
Speaking from the U.K. it’s branded as an Amazon product you wouldn’t even know it was a CBS product except obviously looking at the end titles.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: HVM on 02/06/2020 11:48 pm
Berries and peas.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Lars-J on 02/14/2020 06:17 am
I've watched up to episode 3 now.

It is watchable, with some good moments. TNG greatest hits but SO GRITTY and DARK.  ;)

But... It just looks so low budget (compared to my expectations). Every time they are on a non-starship setting it just looks like grabbed whatever furniture and house they could rent and yelled "action". ST:Discovery (love it or hate it) looks so much more high budget. Sets, costumes, makeup, visual effects, everything looks better on Discovery. So far.

And just to be clear, I'm not against a lower budget show. I have enjoyed many low budget Sci-Fi shows in my time. But the contrast with Discovery is interesting, IMO.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 02/14/2020 11:23 pm
I've watched up to episode 3 now.
But... It just looks so low budget (compared to my expectations).

Sometimes it does look a bit low-budget. Other times it is off the charts good. Such as, did you notice they de-aged Patrick Stewart quite a bit for the flashback scene in Episode 3? I didn't, until someone pointed it out to me. They also de-aged him for the flashback in Episode 4. (It seems they've settled on a pattern of opening each episode with a flashback to 14 years before.)

The space battle at the end of Episode 4 is a mediocre at best.

edit: removed possible spoiler
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: MATTBLAK on 02/15/2020 10:10 am
I'm really enjoying this show a lot. It does feel like an exceptionally long buildup to the main 'meat' of the storyline they want to tell. But then it occurs to me - this show is an exercise in world building - literally. This aint your Daddy's 'TNG' and nor could it/should it be. The payoff obviously still has to come - and likely not in this season. I'll bet the Cliff Hanger is a doozy! TNG used to have a few of those...
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 02/16/2020 06:45 am
Odd episode this was just browsing along at a restful pace, and then it suddenly bursts into life at the end

I did laugh at them recreating his study on the holodeck just so they could keep using the set.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: FutureSpaceTourist on 02/16/2020 09:17 am
I did laugh at them recreating his study on the holodeck just so they could keep using the set.

:)

I don’t deny that economics may have played a part, but I also like the idea that an ageing and more vulnerable Picard literally needs the comforts of home.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: QuantumG on 02/16/2020 09:43 pm
They're taking a really long time to assemble the crew... I guess at some point they'll all stand around a holomap and explain the heist to us.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Stan Black on 02/17/2020 09:44 pm
I am enjoying this show, but must admit I find this vision of the future odd because everyone brandishes guns.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: ChrisWilson68 on 02/19/2020 02:25 am
I am enjoying this show, but must admit I find this vision of the future odd because everyone brandishes guns.

Do you find it odd that so many visions of the past and present include people brandishing weapons?
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: litton4 on 02/19/2020 09:30 am
Odd episode this was just browsing along at a restful pace, and then it suddenly bursts into life at the end

I did laugh at them recreating his study on the holodeck just so they could keep using the set.

I laughed, but not at that - when he froze the program, the birds stopped outside, but inside the fire was still burning
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Orbiter on 02/19/2020 07:33 pm
I've been watching TNG and something just seems odd about Picard's personality in this show and I can't seem to put my finger on it...
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: QuantumG on 02/19/2020 09:32 pm
I laughed, but not at that - when he froze the program, the birds stopped outside, but inside the fire was still burning

Probably because it was an actual fire. Now that's hospitality!
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: QuantumG on 02/19/2020 09:36 pm
I've been watching TNG and something just seems odd about Picard's personality in this show and I can't seem to put my finger on it...

Picard's personality has always been a bit - umm, flexible. Nearly as much as Troi's.

That said, I think the effect Stewart is trying to achieve is a post-depression Picard in search of a new guiding star. He has lost the certainty of the Federation and now has to make his own way. Incredibly slowly.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: sanman on 02/20/2020 02:55 pm
The entire series was kicked off by a dream Picard had of Data.

Foreshadowing @2:33 ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pN4Tx0EOz_w


Every card is a Queen...

... a Borg Queen?

Is that what Dahj/Soji is destined/dreaded to become?

(Well, if Rey can be a Palpatine...)
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: QuantumG on 02/20/2020 10:31 pm
Is that what Dahj/Soji is destined/dreaded to become?

I just figured they were gunna become Control.

Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 02/21/2020 02:48 am
A word of warning for anyone who may be watching "Picard" with their kids. This week's episode "Stardust City Rag" opens with the most disturbing gore "Star Trek" has ever presented.

It is a good episode, if a little uneven. It definitely moves the story along after lots of world-building in the first four episodes.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: yg1968 on 02/22/2020 08:44 pm
I will probably keep watching it but I find this series overly emotional and dramatic. I stopped watching Discovery for the same reason (even Spock was overly emotional).
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Rocket Science on 02/22/2020 10:23 pm
Seven keeps aging like a fine wine...
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Oli on 02/25/2020 10:04 am
I will probably keep watching it but I find this series overly emotional and dramatic. I stopped watching Discovery for the same reason (even Spock was overly emotional).

That's Kurtzman Trek for you. Lot's of unearned drama, I hate it.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Hauerg on 02/25/2020 10:47 am
Seven keeps aging like a fine wine...
52. Perfect age.

So far the women are far cooler than then men, including Picard.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: QuantumG on 02/25/2020 10:11 pm
So far the women are far cooler than then men, including Picard.

I kinda like the holographic dissociative identity disorder guy.

Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: sanman on 02/26/2020 12:07 am
I kinda like the holographic dissociative identity disorder guy.

I don't think that's meant to be one guy - these are actually multiple holographic avatars in the image of the Captain, Rios.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: QuantumG on 02/26/2020 02:21 am
I don't think that's meant to be one guy - these are actually multiple holographic avatars in the image of the Captain, Rios.

Whoosh.

Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 02/26/2020 02:29 am
I kinda like the holographic dissociative identity disorder guy.

I don't think that's meant to be one guy - these are actually multiple holographic avatars in the image of the Captain, Rios.

Yes, Rios has created Emergency Holograms for various functions since he became a bit of a loner following whatever happened on the USS ibn Mājid. He uses himself as a template, but with variations in appearance and accents. The Emergency Medical Hologram has a British accent. The Emergency Navigation Hologram has an Irish accent. The Hospitality Hologram has a vaguely North American accent. The Emergency Tactical Hologram has a Spanish/Latin American accent.

This begs the question of whether the eventual Emergency Engineering Hologram will have a Scottish accent.  :-)
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: sanman on 02/29/2020 08:54 pm
Nah, Sir Patrick could best the others on Scottish accents, if needed.

Speaking of which, here's his explanation on why he chose to reprise his role for the new series:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmjM2qut6qM
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 03/01/2020 10:42 am
That last episode was far more dynamic. You have to wonder how much more incredibly advanced technology the Borg have assimilated. Also rather worrying that drone seemed to have woken up when Picard boarded the artefact.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: QuantumG on 03/09/2020 09:28 pm
I’m confused by the last episode scene where the Vulcan Commodore Oh mind melds with Dr. Agnes Jurati.

Dr Agnes thought that synthetic life was good...
But then after one mind meld with a Vulcan, Dr Agnes simply believes all synthetic life is now bad...

Yep, and by the looks of it the Commodore was passing on sincere trauma... without consent. Not the first time we've seen such disgusting behaviour from Vulcans, but still.

So, let's summarize: Picard has put together a crew consisting of a captain who seems to have some personality problems and a technology addiction, a recovering drug addict and deadbeat mother, a self-harming post-traumatic fanatic, a boy raised as a girl who wants to be a man, and an angsty teenager who has just discovered their entire childhood was a lie. I love this show  ;D
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 03/10/2020 02:24 am
I’m confused by the last episode scene where the Vulcan Commodore Oh mind melds with Dr. Agnes Jurati.

Well, we need to consider there is still a possibility that Oh is a Romulan operative, not a Vulcan. Sure, she did the mind-meld thing, but we don't know for certain that Romulans can't mind-meld, too. Regardless, it was pretty clear Commodore Oh knew that Lt. Rizzo was actually the Romulan agent Narissa, so she seems to be a deeply flawed Vulcan if she is indeed Vulcan.

We already saw a high-ranking Vulcan official (Ambassador T'Pel) was really a Romulan spy in "Data's Day", so it is not without precedent.

This last episode was excellent, I thought. The girl playing Kestra was wonderful. Kestra, by the way, is named for Deanna's late sister, who was played by a very young Kirsten Dunst in the TNG episode "Dark Page".
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Jarnis on 03/11/2020 12:33 am
While it has some nice fanservice moments and it is nice to see some old faces back in their roles, I am getting the same feeling that sunk Discovery for me; This is not really Star Trek. It is not quite as bad as some bits of Discovery, but I'm not impressed.

It may be passable scifi and borderline watchable, but unfortunately the production team is somewhat clueless. Start by replacing the writers, thank you. Also I'm frankly disappointed at the production design, considering they seem to have a real budget.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: ccdengr on 03/11/2020 03:32 am
You know, if you don't like it, don't watch it.  For whatever reason, I hated Discovery but I'm really enjoying Picard.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Zed_Noir on 03/11/2020 09:15 am
a self-harming post-traumatic fanatic

Disagree with @QuantumG on that character thumbnail for Agnes. Traumatic brainwashed and suicidal seems more appropriate. She might be a fanatic but didn't show any indication of it prior to the mind meld.

Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: QuantumG on 03/11/2020 09:16 pm
Disagree with @QuantumG on that character thumbnail for Agnes. Traumatic brainwashed and suicidal seems more appropriate. She might be a fanatic but didn't show any indication of it prior to the mind meld.

Yeah, fanatic because of brainwashing, agreed.

I wonder if we'll get to see what she sees and then have to ask ourselves if we'd do the same.


Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 03/13/2020 02:25 am

This begs the question of whether the eventual Emergency Engineering Hologram will have a Scottish accent.  :-)


And sure enough, that's what we get in this week's episode "Broken Pieces"...
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: QuantumG on 03/13/2020 05:39 am
Once you start to see the series as learning about human beings who have experienced great trauma and all the different ways we deal with it...

Well, it's a much better show.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Draggendrop on 03/13/2020 07:05 pm
Just following along and enjoying the adventure...but I have reached a critical junction.
After episode 8, The man child nun who insists on bringing a "knife to a gun fight" needs to be "disrupted".
As Ultron stated to Captain America..."I can't physically throw up in my mouth" would cover the "rescue reaction".
This series needs to start "growing a set".
I will require viewing several old Klingon episodes to cleanse my mind...Then join the Rangers.../s
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: su27k on 03/31/2020 03:42 am
Well, the ending is anti-climatic, also the CGI for the fleets is underwhelming, but overall still better than Discovery.

PS: Allow me to throw up about the stupid notion that you transferred your mind to a robot but you still only want to live for just 10~20 years then die. When will SF TV realize immortality should be the norm, dying is some disease that needs to be conquered? SF novel realized this for a few decades now.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 03/31/2020 07:16 am
I stopped watching this at episode 7 is it worth watching the final 3 episodes?
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: MATTBLAK on 03/31/2020 08:10 am
Yes. They get more right than wrong. The show wasn't perfect, but it was much better than the first season of 'Discovery' for instance. Incidentally; the transference of human consciousness into an Android body has been a plotline used in Star Trek multiple times. In fact; the second season TNG episode 'The Schizoid Man' deals with this very thing: Data's body being hijacked etc. And there were similar themes done in the 1960s original show. So anyone who claims this is not a legitimate use for a 'Picard' plot... I'm sorry, but you're wrong. There were also a series of novels - mostly non-canon - that happened in the early 2010's covering this as well. In those; Dr Noonian-Soong transferred himself into a fresh, Data-like body. He'd also done it earlier to one of his wives, without them knowing in one of the later TNG episodes.
Title: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 07/24/2022 09:18 am
Season 3 teaser trailer:

https://youtu.be/cqApTpJMWOk

Character posters:

https://twitter.com/TrekCore/status/1550935777462337549

https://twitter.com/TrekCore/status/1550934613438119936
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Thorny on 07/24/2022 03:39 pm
Season 3 teaser trailer:

This looks like we might at last be getting the show most fans wanted from the beginning.

Sir Patrick Stewart only agreed to return to Star Trek if it was not "Star Trek: The Next Generation 2.0" with him back in the center seat. As as result, Season 1 was a mish-mash of storylines which never really came together, and which avoided Starfleet as much as possible (and when we did see it Starfleet was portrayed in an extremely unflattering light, especially the notorious "f-ing hubris" Badmiral.) Season 2 started with great promise: all was right in the world again thanks to Picard saving the universe (well, more or less) at the end of Season 1. The opening scenes introducing a new USS Stargazer genuinely wowed fans, the appearance of Q (John DeLancie, not missing a beat since last seen in Voyager) gave fans hope that Picard was going to take off as a series. Unfortunately, it didn't. The show spent the next seven or eight episodes in 2024 Los Angeles (with no Star Trekking to be seen) following a not very compelling story which really could have been finished in two episodes with crisper writing.

Season 3 now looks to be going in a completely different direction. Other than Picard himself, the only returning main character from Season 1 is Michelle Hurd's Raffi (along with Jeri Ryan, who was a guest in Season 1 and a regular in Season 2 as Seven of Nine.) Instead the TNG cast is returning en masse, and we might actually be getting something close to Star Trek: The Next Generation 2.0 fans really wanted and hopefully a strong conclusion for these characters after they were last seen together in 2002's failed movie Star Trek: Nemesis.
Title: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 07/24/2022 03:43 pm
Apparently they have indicated we should treat season 3 as a TNG movie.

If you were wondering about that Sword Worf is carrying on his back.

https://twitter.com/TerryMatalas/status/1551004516094332928
Title: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Lars-J on 07/25/2022 05:44 am
I have found season 1 and 2 to be REALLY… underwhelming, even really bad at times. (Most of season 2’s 2024 scenes)

I’m tired of the Picard character - or how Stewart insists on portraying him - but the other TNG characters intrigue me to at least watch an episode or two. (And it is ironic since I mostly despise this shows fan service)
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: zack on 07/25/2022 08:52 am
I think one of the bigger problems of S2 were that it was released weekly and not in one batch. The show was heavily serialized, without any time passing between episodes. And having to wait a whole week broke the flow of the episodes.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Lars-J on 07/25/2022 03:43 pm
I think one of the bigger problems of S2 were that it was released weekly and not in one batch. The show was heavily serialized, without any time passing between episodes. And having to wait a whole week broke the flow of the episodes.
I’m doubtful it would make a difference. I watched season 2 when all episodes were out, so it was effectively a batch release for me, and it was just tedious to go through. It was just padded into waaaay too much screen time.
Title: Re: Star Trek: Picard
Post by: Star One on 07/25/2022 07:31 pm
I think one of the bigger problems of S2 were that it was released weekly and not in one batch. The show was heavily serialized, without any time passing between episodes. And having to wait a whole week broke the flow of the episodes.
I’m doubtful it would make a difference. I watched season 2 when all episodes were out, so it was effectively a batch release for me, and it was just tedious to go through. It was just padded into waaaay too much screen time.
It was heavily impacted like the last season of Discovery by the pandemic. This effected what they could do and not do. It was very obvious in Discovery hence why the last season was so static with a relatively limited guest cast.