Author Topic: Starlink : SpaceX FCC filing for a 4425 satellite constellation  (Read 184619 times)

Online Robotbeat

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I believe they said like 800 for initial operation.
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Offline docmordrid

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I believe they said like 800 for initial operation.

Correct.

CNBC....

Quote
SpaceX will begin launching the constellation it dubbed "Starlink" in 2019. The system will be operational once at least 800 satellites are deployed.

FCC said they need to fly 50% of the constellation by 2024, but they could  reconsider later depending on the circumstances.
« Last Edit: 03/31/2018 10:13 pm by docmordrid »
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Offline gongora

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https://www.fcc.gov/ecfs/search/filings?limit=100&proceedings_name=16-408&sort=date_disseminated,DESC
Quote
Dear Ms. Dortch:

This is to inform you that, on April 12, 2018, Patricia Cooper, Bryon Hargis, and
undersigned counsel on behalf of Space Exploration Technologies Corp. (“SpaceX”) met with
Commissioner Clyburn, Louis Peraertz, her Senior Legal Advisory for Wireless, International, and
Public Safety, and law clerk Pooja Tolani; Umair Javed, Legal Advisor to Commissioner
Rosenworcel for Wireless and International; Erin McGrath, Legal Advisor to Commissioner
O’Rielly for Wireless, Public Safety, and International; and Rachael Bender, Wireless and
International Advisor to Chairman Pai. The primary topic of discussion was the operation of two
experimental SpaceX satellites launched on February 22, 2018, including initial results from those
test operations. However, we also discussed a topic relevant to the above referenced proceeding:
potential policies for ensuring the safety of operations in space. That discussion was consistent
with SpaceX’s submissions in this proceeding.

Offline gongora

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SpaceX filed a modification to the license for the TinTin testing.

0153-EX-CM-2018
Quote
In this application, SpaceX seeks to modify the experimental authorization for Microsat-2a and -2b
in order to reflect additional test activities undertaken with the federal government. The tests are
designed to (1) demonstrate the ability to transmit and receive information between two ground
sites (“Ground-to-Ground”) and between the ground and an airborne aircraft (“Ground-to-Air”) using
Microsat-2a and -2b, and (2) communicate using an additional antenna at its Redmond, Washington
test site. Nothing about the operation of and transmissions from the Microsat-2a or -2b satellites
will change under this modification. The only change will be the addition of two new types of earth
stations, one of which will transmit uplink signals to the Microsat satellites first from the ground and
later from a moving aircraft

I guess the satellites must be communicating well if they're adding new types of testing.

Offline AncientU

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US military/DoD appears to be involved(first reference above, page 3):
Quote
SpaceX is working with a manufacturer of conformal antennas for tactical aircraft

Maybe this is related to the DARPA effort previously discussed.
« Last Edit: 08/10/2018 10:47 pm by AncientU »
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Offline docmordrid

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AvWeek article documenting  AFRL (Air Force Research Laboratory) doing research.

AvWeek...

Quote
>
To explore the art of the possible, AFRL is planning to contract with at least one commercial internet provider for a set of antennas that can be mounted onto Air Force test aircraft, Beal says. The team will then fly the aircraft, a Beechcraft C-12J based at Holloman AFB, New Mexico, directly under the associated satellites and establish a communications path.

"AFRL plans to measure the quality of the connection, data latency, throughput and error rate, among other factors, and experiment with sending encrypted messages across the commercial network," Beal says.

"A key piece of the puzzle will be figuring out how to send critical threat information securely over a commercial network. To help ensure cyber resiliency, AFRL will likely contract with companies that have a good history of providing cybersecurity to current terrestrial networks," says Greg Spanjers, chief scientist at the Air Forces Strategic Development Planning Experimentation office.
>

Offline biosehnsucht

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US military/DoD appears to be involved(first reference above, page 3):
Quote
SpaceX is working with a manufacturer of conformal antennas for tactical aircraft

Maybe this is related to the DARPA effort previously discussed.

If we're talking tactical aircraft - they may lose their data link if performing interesting maneuvers, unless they have more than one antenna. Though probably dogfighting is vanishingly rare and even trying to dodge missiles doesn't happen too often, so it may not matter if you lose the connection briefly when rolled over significantly (never mind pretending to be Maverick in an inverted dive with a Mig).

Though it certainly would be an interesting test of the system to just start doing barrel or aileron rolls and see how well the data link does with loss / regaining signal and retransmission, how much bandwidth it can maintain at what roll rates.

Offline ValmirGP

Reading a recent post at Teslarati (https://www.teslarati.com/spacex-starlink-internet-testing-high-performance-govt-aircraft/) I noticed an intriguing passage about it's experimental communication satellites, where it mentions that SpaceX build it's own custom electric propulsion for those Sats.
Quote
Launched roughly six months ago as a copassenger on one of SpaceX’s own Falcon 9 rockets, the satellite duo has been quietly performing a broad range of tests on orbit, particularly focused on general satellite operations, orbital maneuvering with SpaceX’s own custom-built electric propulsion, and – most importantly – the experimental satellites’ cutting-edge communications capabilities.
I made a brief search on the forum and have not found any info about this. Is this new? Does anybody now anything about this electric propulsion system?

Offline docmordrid

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It's known and in the PDF docs in the constellation thread. AIUI, a Hall effect thruster.

https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=41634.0
« Last Edit: 08/16/2018 04:47 pm by docmordrid »
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Offline gongora

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Quote
Re: Space Exploration Holdings, LLC, IBFS File No. SAT-LOA-20170726-00110

Dear Ms. Dortch:

Earlier this year, the Commission authorized Space Exploration Holdings, LLC
(“SpaceX”) to construct, deploy, and operate a non-geostationary orbit satellite system using Kuand
Ka-band spectrum.1 However, the Commission has deferred consideration of SpaceX’s
request with respect to the 29.3-29.5 GHz band. After reviewing this authorization in light of our
evolving constellation deployment plans, SpaceX has concluded that it no longer seeks to pursue
operations in that band at this time. Accordingly, SpaceX hereby withdraws the portion of the
above referenced application that relates to the 29.3-29.5 GHz band

Offline DigitalMan

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Quote
Re: Space Exploration Holdings, LLC, IBFS File No. SAT-LOA-20170726-00110

Dear Ms. Dortch:

Earlier this year, the Commission authorized Space Exploration Holdings, LLC
(“SpaceX”) to construct, deploy, and operate a non-geostationary orbit satellite system using Kuand
Ka-band spectrum.1 However, the Commission has deferred consideration of SpaceX’s
request with respect to the 29.3-29.5 GHz band. After reviewing this authorization in light of our
evolving constellation deployment plans, SpaceX has concluded that it no longer seeks to pursue
operations in that band at this time. Accordingly, SpaceX hereby withdraws the portion of the
above referenced application that relates to the 29.3-29.5 GHz band

There is a list of frequency bands in the attachment to the 1st post, and this range isn't in it.  Closest is 29.5 to 30.0.  I suppose this dropping this one doesn't mean much but I wonder why it was done?

Offline gongora

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For the initial filings in the processing round everyone asked to use the frequency bands that were already allocated for these purposes, and various companies also identified other bits of spectrum that they thought they might be able to get a waiver for.  Then after everyone had a chance to see what the other companies had asked for they filed amendments trying to add some of those other bits of spectrum to their applications too.  I guess SpaceX decided they weren't likely to get access to this piece of extra spectrum, didn't really need it, or both.

Offline Asteroza

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US military/DoD appears to be involved(first reference above, page 3):
Quote
SpaceX is working with a manufacturer of conformal antennas for tactical aircraft

Maybe this is related to the DARPA effort previously discussed.

If we're talking tactical aircraft - they may lose their data link if performing interesting maneuvers, unless they have more than one antenna. Though probably dogfighting is vanishingly rare and even trying to dodge missiles doesn't happen too often, so it may not matter if you lose the connection briefly when rolled over significantly (never mind pretending to be Maverick in an inverted dive with a Mig).

Though it certainly would be an interesting test of the system to just start doing barrel or aileron rolls and see how well the data link does with loss / regaining signal and retransmission, how much bandwidth it can maintain at what roll rates.

Considering this is connecting to a commercial network, less likely for aircraft conformal antennas. Perhaps panel antennas for things like BACN pods? Small tactical aircraft (not even fighters per se) carrying BACN to forward deploy tactical networks would make a lot of sense.

Offline Lar

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AvWeek article documenting  AFRL (Air Force Research Laboratory) doing research.

AvWeek...

Quote
>
...  Air Force test aircraft, Beal says. The team will then fly the aircraft, a Beechcraft C-12J based at Holloman AFB, New Mexico, directly under the associated satellites and establish a communications path. ...
<



Though it certainly would be an interesting test of the system to just start doing barrel or aileron rolls and see how well the data link does with loss / regaining signal and retransmission, how much bandwidth it can maintain at what roll rates.

Can a C12J do barrel rolls, inverted flight or other acrobatics? I don't know the Beechcraft line at all.  This article suggests limited, if any, acrobatics. if so the investigation might also need some other aircraft types eventually.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beechcraft_C-12_Huron
"I think it would be great to be born on Earth and to die on Mars. Just hopefully not at the point of impact." -Elon Musk
"We're a little bit like the dog who caught the bus" - Musk after CRS-8 S1 successfully landed on ASDS OCISLY

Offline vaporcobra


Though it certainly would be an interesting test of the system to just start doing barrel or aileron rolls and see how well the data link does with loss / regaining signal and retransmission, how much bandwidth it can maintain at what roll rates.

Can a C12J do barrel rolls, inverted flight or other acrobatics? I don't know the Beechcraft line at all.  This article suggests limited, if any, acrobatics. if so the investigation might also need some other aircraft types eventually.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beechcraft_C-12_Huron

From SpaceX's STA modification request :)

Quote
SpaceX will perform a series of tests with the integrated airborne prototype terminal that is similar to the tests contemplated with other fixed earth stations under its current authorization. These include antenna static angles from 0 to 40 degrees from boresight, and then varying motion for representative roll and pitch rates of a high performance aircraft.
« Last Edit: 08/20/2018 05:43 pm by vaporcobra »

Offline Lar

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From SpaceX's STA modification request :)

Quote
SpaceX will perform a series of tests with the integrated airborne prototype terminal that is similar to the tests contemplated with other fixed earth stations under its current authorization. These include antenna static angles from 0 to 40 degrees from boresight, and then varying motion for representative roll and pitch rates of a high performance aircraft.
Clever. But not quite as good as testing the antenna on the airframe itself. However I guess that can be done with a different test rig...
 
« Last Edit: 08/20/2018 08:04 pm by Lar »
"I think it would be great to be born on Earth and to die on Mars. Just hopefully not at the point of impact." -Elon Musk
"We're a little bit like the dog who caught the bus" - Musk after CRS-8 S1 successfully landed on ASDS OCISLY

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