Author Topic: SpaceX F9 : Crew Dragon In-Flight Abort Test : Jan. 19, 2020 : Discussion  (Read 359439 times)

Offline ace5

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Is there any official Spacex information about the ability of the crew to start the abort sequence? Or it is an all-automated system?

Offline Nehkara

Is there any official Spacex information about the ability of the crew to start the abort sequence? Or it is an all-automated system?

I'm not 100% certain, but I'm guessing that is the red-highlighted handle on the control panel.


Offline Nehkara

I've talked with a lot of folks about IFA today and there seems to be some confusion.

Many articles (including the great one from NASASpaceflight.com today) and the draft environmental assessment from Nov 2018 state that the Crew Dragon will sense the loss of thrust on Falcon 9 and then abort away.

However, during the press conference today Benji Reed from SpaceX said:

"The triggers are set, it's about 84 seconds.  We've pre-set this trigger intentionally because, again, we kinda want to hit the sweet spot of where we get the most effective data out of this test. What'll happen basically is that we'll launch abort - we'll initiate the launch escape and the Falcon engines will shut down, so the thrust on the Falcon will shut down right after that happens.  When that happens, at the same time, Dragon will be getting away.  It takes about 10 seconds for SuperDraco burn on the Dragon.  Dragon will hit about Mach 2.3 as it's getting away.  We expect it to actually be quite far away from Falcon at the speed... at the acceleration it's going, before anything starts to happen on Falcon.  But it's a quick process.

So, fairly quickly as well Falcon will be going through a lot of aerodynamic issues..."

Does this mean that they will directly command Crew Dragon to abort away from the Falcon 9 while it's thrusting OR will they command Falcon 9 to cut thrust and the act of cutting thrust will cause the abort system to be triggered on Crew Dragon?

Offline russianhalo117

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Why would they waste money putting solar arrays on the trunk if it is going to be destroyed in flight without use. Maybe it's because of the aerodynamics that they wish to test?
It doesn't mean that they are functional power producing cells.

Offline Jeff Lerner

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Has there been any list put together of what would constitute mission success ??..I’m asking from the perspective of the recent Starliner flight where there was much discussion on whether a reflight would be necessary...

Online ZachS09

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I’m confused about how they’re gonna time the launch tomorrow.

On the update thread, Chris B. acknowledged Elon’s tweet about the launch “being on Saturday or Sunday depending on weather” with “could be Saturday late in the window or bust”.

I don’t understand what Chris B. means behind that. Is he confirming that weather conditions are NOT favorable for the 8 AM opening?

I thought there was only a 10% violation, which means there’s a high chance of launching at 8 AM.
« Last Edit: 01/17/2020 10:59 pm by ZachS09 »
Liftoff for St. Jude's! Go Dragon, Go Falcon, Godspeed Inspiration4!

Online Coastal Ron

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I’m confused about how they’re gonna time the launch tomorrow.

On the update thread, Chris B. acknowledged Elon’s tweet about the launch “being on Saturday or Sunday depending on weather” with “could be Saturday late in the window or bust”.

I don’t understand what Chris B. means behind that. Is he confirming that weather conditions are NOT favorable for the 8 AM opening?

Yes, there is some part of the weather conditions that may be out of bounds for the test. They likely won't know until tomorrow what the status is.
If we don't continuously lower the cost to access space, how are we ever going to afford to expand humanity out into space?

Offline ThePonjaX

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I’m confused about how they’re gonna time the launch tomorrow.

On the update thread, Chris B. acknowledged Elon’s tweet about the launch “being on Saturday or Sunday depending on weather” with “could be Saturday late in the window or bust”.

I don’t understand what Chris B. means behind that. Is he confirming that weather conditions are NOT favorable for the 8 AM opening?

I thought there was only a 10% violation, which means there’s a high chance of launching at 8 AM.

The condition of the weather on the site for Dragon splashdown is on play too.

Offline AC in NC

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Is there any official Spacex information about the ability of the crew to start the abort sequence? Or it is an all-automated system?

I'm not 100% certain, but I'm guessing that is the red-highlighted handle on the control panel.

My recollection from big zoom on the original hi-res of those input panels were that there were some abort scenarios the crew could activate (water deorbit, deorbit now, and something with the parachutes ... perhaps more).  But I'm not readily thinking of any scenario with crew initiated abort during ascent that makes asense.

Offline OneSpeed

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Does this mean that they will directly command Crew Dragon to abort away from the Falcon 9 while it's thrusting OR will they command Falcon 9 to cut thrust and the act of cutting thrust will cause the abort system to be triggered on Crew Dragon?

If Benji  is correct, Crew Dragon will autonomously trigger an abort while Falcon 9 S1 is still thrusting. Although T+84 is slightly after MaxQ, and drag will be decreasing, S1 will be back at full throttle, and acceleration will be increasing, making it most difficult for Crew Dragon to outrun S1. SpaceX have apparently decided that this scenario will generate the most effective data.

Offline Alexphysics

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Is there any official Spacex information about the ability of the crew to start the abort sequence? Or it is an all-automated system?

I'm not 100% certain, but I'm guessing that is the red-highlighted handle on the control panel.

My recollection from big zoom on the original hi-res of those input panels were that there were some abort scenarios the crew could activate (water deorbit, deorbit now, and something with the parachutes ... perhaps more).  But I'm not readily thinking of any scenario with crew initiated abort during ascent that makes asense.

The handle on the middle of the panel is for the crew to manually trigger the abort system. It was a NASA requirement to have a way for the crew to activate the escape system manually.

Offline Paul451

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Got visually confused by the shadows from the TEL in this tweeted image:

https://twitter.com/spacex/status/1218153687429705730

My brain was seeing the curve as some kind of cover under the trunk, hence the Dragon as somehow suspended, etc etc.

Anyway, when I zoomed in enough to force my brain to accept "cylinder-with-shadows", I noticed something and was curious whether anyone has pointed out that the ends of the support arms make Dragon logo shadows.
« Last Edit: 01/18/2020 10:17 am by zubenelgenubi »

Offline ace5

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Is there any official Spacex information about the ability of the crew to start the abort sequence? Or it is an all-automated system?

I'm not 100% certain, but I'm guessing that is the red-highlighted handle on the control panel.

My recollection from big zoom on the original hi-res of those input panels were that there were some abort scenarios the crew could activate (water deorbit, deorbit now, and something with the parachutes ... perhaps more).  But I'm not readily thinking of any scenario with crew initiated abort during ascent that makes asense.

The handle on the middle of the panel is for the crew to manually trigger the abort system. It was a NASA requirement to have a way for the crew to activate the escape system manually.

can you give a source?

Offline Steven Pietrobon

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from the press kit

The worm is back! Dan Goldin must be having kittens.

https://www.wired.com/2015/09/nasa-graphics-standards-manual/
Akin's Laws of Spacecraft Design #1:  Engineering is done with numbers.  Analysis without numbers is only an opinion.

Offline eric z

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 That's wild, for me, because I just got a "worm"-logo hat at the store this afternoon! I'm actually a vegetarian "meatball"
guy but couldn't resist. 8)
 Go SpaceX !

Offline banjo

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So the abort is triggered when a preprogramed engine shutdown is sensed as a loss of thrust at max q.    does this represent a worst case scenario or just close to it?   the test abort could have been triggered by bombing the core at full thrust, thus sensing a breakup (al a challenger).   Or is this scenario outside the abilities of the abort system to save the crew?

Offline zubenelgenubi

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Is this an accurate statement, as of this post?

LC-39A    Falcon with Dragon atop on the pad.

SLC-41    Atlas V inside its Vertical Integration Facility.  Is the Centaur stacked on it?

SLC-40    Falcon 9 with Starlink payload inside its Horizontal Integration Facility, preparing for Static Fire after IFA launch.

SLC-37B  Delta IV-H inside its Mobile Service Tower on the pad, after the Jan 10 WDR.
« Last Edit: 01/18/2020 11:25 am by zubenelgenubi »
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Offline Scotty

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Just heard on local TV (WESH 2, Orlando FL, that the launch has been called off for today due to high winds.

Offline Rondaz

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SpaceX In-Flight Abort: Launch Date Update

Marie Lewis Posted on January 18, 2020

NASA and SpaceX now are targeting 8 a.m. EST Sunday, Jan. 19, for launch of the company’s In-Flight Abort Test from Launch Complex 39A in Florida, which will demonstrate Crew Dragon’s ability to safely escape the Falcon 9 rocket in the event of a failure during launch. The abort test has a six-hour launch window.

Teams are standing down from today’s launch attempt due to poor splashdown and recovery weather.

For tomorrow’s launch attempt, meteorologists with the U.S. Air Force 45th Space Wing predict a 60% chance of favorable weather toward the opening of the window with a 40% chance toward the end of the window. The primary concerns for launch day being the thick cloud layer and flight through precipitation rule during the launch window.

The test launch will air on NASA Television and the agency’s website. Here’s the upcoming mission coverage:

Sunday, Jan. 19

7:40 a.m. – NASA TV test coverage begins for the 8 a.m. liftoff
9:30 a.m. – Post-test news conference at Kennedy, with the following representatives:
NASA Administrator Jim Bridenstine
SpaceX representative
Kathy Lueders, manager, NASA Commercial Crew Program
Victor Glover, astronaut, NASA Commercial Crew Program
Mike Hopkins, astronaut, NASA Commercial Crew Program

https://blogs.nasa.gov/commercialcrew/2020/01/18/spacex-in-flight-abort-launch-date-update/

Offline Rondaz

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Standing down from today’s in-flight Crew Dragon launch escape test attempt due to sustained winds and rough seas in the recovery area. Now targeting Sunday, January 19, with a six-hour test window opening at 8:00 a.m. EST, 13:00 UTC

https://twitter.com/SpaceX/status/1218473546772430848
« Last Edit: 01/18/2020 11:58 am by Rondaz »

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