Author Topic: 3D Printing: it may change everything, including spacecraft production.  (Read 42967 times)

Offline Downix

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There's not much that's simple about a screw.  An ordinary grade-5 screw you might buy at a hardware store has rolled threads, a broached head, is hardened to a pretty high level, and is likely treated in one way or another to be corrosion resistant.  Making one using 3D printing will require an extreme level of precision, and several operations afterwards.

Um.. I don't doubt it :)

Maybe it would always be worth having a specialized machine just for screws at that. I guess a complex integrated circuit or solar cell might be easier than a screw.
There is also a two-step process.  One of the more successful methods for producing such things with a 3D printer is not to print them directly, but to print a mold with which to cast them.  I know I'm planning on using that method for producing some parts.
chuck - Toilet paper has no real value? Try living with 5 other adults for 6 months in a can with no toilet paper. Man oh man. Toilet paper would be worth it's weight in gold!

Offline Rocket Science

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Paging user SpaceXULA.

Yeah, people are starting to fabricate rocket engines with this technology. Paul Breed has done it successfully, as has the guy on the rocketmoonlighting.blogspot.com blog.

Here's the rocketmoonlighting guy's test of his Direct Metal Laser Sintering regen rocket motor:



Or maybe this run is better, since you can see the cooling channels:


You can see one of his earlier printed rocket motors:
Somewhere in heaven Robert Goddard is smiling, slapping his knee and applauding… :)
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
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Offline Rocket Science

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There's not much that's simple about a screw.  An ordinary grade-5 screw you might buy at a hardware store has rolled threads, a broached head, is hardened to a pretty high level, and is likely treated in one way or another to be corrosion resistant.  Making one using 3D printing will require an extreme level of precision, and several operations afterwards.

Um.. I don't doubt it :)

Maybe it would always be worth having a specialized machine just for screws at that. I guess a complex integrated circuit or solar cell might be easier than a screw.
There is also a two-step process.  One of the more successful methods for producing such things with a 3D printer is not to print them directly, but to print a mold with which to cast them.  I know I'm planning on using that method for producing some parts.
I could see it being all kinds of uses for mock ups or in the production of molds, tool and die making. For strength it’s hard to beat billet or forged parts and then CNC machining where necessary. Rapid prototyping really speeds up development with composite structures.
Robert
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
~Rob: Physics instructor, Aviator

Offline Downix

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There's not much that's simple about a screw.  An ordinary grade-5 screw you might buy at a hardware store has rolled threads, a broached head, is hardened to a pretty high level, and is likely treated in one way or another to be corrosion resistant.  Making one using 3D printing will require an extreme level of precision, and several operations afterwards.

Um.. I don't doubt it :)

Maybe it would always be worth having a specialized machine just for screws at that. I guess a complex integrated circuit or solar cell might be easier than a screw.
There is also a two-step process.  One of the more successful methods for producing such things with a 3D printer is not to print them directly, but to print a mold with which to cast them.  I know I'm planning on using that method for producing some parts.
I could see it being all kinds of uses for mock ups or in the production of molds, tool and die making. For strength it’s hard to beat billet or forged parts and then CNC machining where necessary. Rapid prototyping really speeds up development with composite structures.
Robert

Direct Metal Laser Sintering rivals forging for strength, and is also a 3D printing process.  For parts like screws, it's overkill, but so is forged.  It depends on the demand.

As it is now, 3D printing is gaining cost effectiveness by leaps and bounds.  It is now only a matter of time before the incredible flexibility it offers will have it replace traditional manufacturing methods in low volume manufacturing, which the various space industries are very much part of.
chuck - Toilet paper has no real value? Try living with 5 other adults for 6 months in a can with no toilet paper. Man oh man. Toilet paper would be worth it's weight in gold!

Offline A_M_Swallow

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Direct Metal Laser Sintering rivals forging for strength, and is also a 3D printing process.  For parts like screws, it's overkill, but so is forged.  It depends on the demand.
{snip}

Just a side thought.  On the Moon and Mars there is no local wood so in practice screws means nuts and bolts.

Offline Jim

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Direct Metal Laser Sintering rivals forging for strength, and is also a 3D printing process.  For parts like screws, it's overkill, but so is forged.  It depends on the demand.
{snip}

Just a side thought.  On the Moon and Mars there is no local wood so in practice screws means nuts and bolts.

Just a side thought, another useless and inane post.

Screws are not just for wood

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Screw
« Last Edit: 09/04/2011 01:30 pm by Jim »

Offline Rocket Science

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There's not much that's simple about a screw.  An ordinary grade-5 screw you might buy at a hardware store has rolled threads, a broached head, is hardened to a pretty high level, and is likely treated in one way or another to be corrosion resistant.  Making one using 3D printing will require an extreme level of precision, and several operations afterwards.

Um.. I don't doubt it :)

Maybe it would always be worth having a specialized machine just for screws at that. I guess a complex integrated circuit or solar cell might be easier than a screw.
There is also a two-step process.  One of the more successful methods for producing such things with a 3D printer is not to print them directly, but to print a mold with which to cast them.  I know I'm planning on using that method for producing some parts.
I could see it being all kinds of uses for mock ups or in the production of molds, tool and die making. For strength it’s hard to beat billet or forged parts and then CNC machining where necessary. Rapid prototyping really speeds up development with composite structures.
Robert

Direct Metal Laser Sintering rivals forging for strength, and is also a 3D printing process.  For parts like screws, it's overkill, but so is forged.  It depends on the demand.

As it is now, 3D printing is gaining cost effectiveness by leaps and bounds.  It is now only a matter of time before the incredible flexibility it offers will have it replace traditional manufacturing methods in low volume manufacturing, which the various space industries are very much part of.
One of really truly innovative manufacturing aids to come along in recent times :)
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
~Rob: Physics instructor, Aviator

Offline John-H

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Will it do to metalworking what the laser printer did to writing? We still have printing presses, and pens, but we use them less and less.

Offline Downix

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Just remember folk, something does not need to be better than the existing to win out.  Laser Printers were not better than a printing press, just a lot more convenient.  They were "Good enough" and that is all that is needed.  3D printers are rapidly approaching that "Good Enough" point for small scale work, and once the tipping point happens, it will ratchet upwards quickly.
chuck - Toilet paper has no real value? Try living with 5 other adults for 6 months in a can with no toilet paper. Man oh man. Toilet paper would be worth it's weight in gold!

Offline KelvinZero

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And most people wont pay any attention at all until some kid shoots another at school with a gun they downloaded off the internet...

Offline Andrew_W

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Expecting precision engineering from 3D printers is like expecting photo quality from 2D printers...
I confess that in 1901 I said to my brother Orville that man would not fly for fifty years.
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Offline Warren Platts

Expecting precision engineering from 3D printers is like expecting photo quality from 2D printers...

Um, we've got that...
"When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will always long to return."--Leonardo Da Vinci

Offline Tass

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Expecting precision engineering from 3D printers is like expecting photo quality from 2D printers...

Um, we've got that...

My guess is that was his point.

We didn't in the beginning.

Offline DarkenedOne

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Just remember folk, something does not need to be better than the existing to win out.  Laser Printers were not better than a printing press, just a lot more convenient.  They were "Good enough" and that is all that is needed.  3D printers are rapidly approaching that "Good Enough" point for small scale work, and once the tipping point happens, it will ratchet upwards quickly.

First of all there is a problem with using the word better because what is better is highly subjective. 

Laser printers are able to print practically anything without reconfiguration.  This fact makes them ideal for limited production.  The printing press on the other hand was good for mass production.  For small productions it is cheaper to draw by hand than it is to use a printing press. 

Like laser printers 3D printers are able to make a vast array of parts in an automated fashion without reconfiguration.  3D printers will not replace all manufacturing lines like some have predicted because it cannot produce an item as cheaply in mass as many of our mass production factories.  Like the laser printer, the 3D printer, will have the largest effect on limited productions. 

Since the rocket business does not sell enough rockets to justify the high amount of automation in mass production lines, they will likely benefit  from 3D printing technology to some degree.


Offline Tcommon

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... Like laser printers 3D printers are able to make a vast array of parts in an automated fashion without reconfiguration.  3D printers will not replace all manufacturing lines like some have predicted because it cannot produce an item as cheaply in mass as many of our mass production factories.  Like the laser printer, the 3D printer, will have the largest effect on limited productions.
3D printers have and will have the largest effect on prototyping and development. I can email stl files and get the parts in one or two days. Functional parts. It's immensely valuable in rapid paced new product development. Another area it has value is for injections molded parts; before you cut a check for the $200,000 injection molding tool, it would behoove one to evaluate physical parts first, made off the same computer files the tooling will be made from.

Since the rocket business does not sell enough rockets to justify the high amount of automation in mass production lines, they will likely benefit  from 3D printing technology to some degree.
Valid point.

Rocket engines have thin margins. They use the best materials and the best fabrication techniques to address these margins. With printed metal parts you generally loose strength, accuracy, surface finish, the ability to use certain materials, and various other aspects of quality. Given this, a printed engine would be designed quite differently than current engines - but it's an intriguing idea. Space flight hardware typically pays huge premiums for small increases in performance. I wonder if this could do the opposite.

Offline kevin-rf

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Honestly, the greatest potential I see for 3d printing is in manufacturing that currently use CNC's to carve intricate parts out of solids blocks. While a 3d printer may not be as fast as a fully automated CNC (with 4th and 5th axis's and automated tool and material changers), the material cost savings will win out. You are no longer buying and sending back to the metal recycling yard the majority of the stock as chips. Instead you are only using the material needed to make the part (and maybe supports while the part is formed).

This all requires 3d printers to become cheap enough to operate and robust enough. Remember the CNC revolution did not happen overnight, it took time and in degrees. The CNC has complimented the machinist (not using the word replaced is deliberate), almost no one currently sends a complex design to a shop and has a machinist hand mill it. A CNC today is almost always involved in fabricating, or assisting the machinist in turning the part.

3d printing will be no different.

btw. Here is something to chew on, You may not want to turn bolts and nuts from a 3d printer, but with 3d printing it is possible to build the bolts into the part. For anyone that has had an impossible screw to place in an assembly, well it would be nice. Think about two flanges that go from 24 holes, copper gasket, 12 bolts, 24 washers, 12 nuts to 12 holes, copper gasket, 12 washers, and 12 nuts. Reduced part counts and paperwork!
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Offline Warren Platts

3D printing could be especially helpful in fabricating parts and even entire spacecraft at a place like the Moon. Chunks of nickel-iron meteorites would require minimal refining, and since its on the Moon (1/6 g) mass considerations would be secondary (ie. space craft could be built of steel instead of aluminum or titanium.
"When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will always long to return."--Leonardo Da Vinci

Offline john smith 19

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Laser metal sintering has been used to make the gears for F1 gearboxes with *minimal* finish machining. It's common to fabricate on a tank of metal or plastic flakes whose bottom is *lowered* to give support to the growing structure until complete. The flakes are flushed out and the free standing structure left.

Quite a lot of this sort of thing was looked at by GK O'Neils group at Stanford and NASA in the late 70's and early 80's. The ultimate idea was a "Self replicating factory" which could be landed on a moon or planet and *copy* itself (or switching over to totally automated production of stuff people wanted). See "Code of the Life Maker" for some amusing consequences of this.

How's *that* for ISRU?

I've seen claims that DARPA have run programmes to study this for repairing military hardware in the field. When you run a business as big as the US Army, operating world wide sending all those replacement parts out *really* starts to mount up.

If this sounds like an application of nanotechnology that's because KE Drexler was part of O'Neils group. Look at the group photo in "The High Frontier."

As others have pointed out this technology is *very* unlikely to displace conventional mass production. But being able to make one (or a few) of something from a common store of "stuff" can beat the hell out of a factory made part 180 miles away. Ask the people on ISS for example.

Note that like machining stuff from a solid block ("Hogging out" in aerospace terms) or some of the near net shape technologies like ring forging it scores at *integrating* lots of little subsidiary bits into 1 component. Armadillo Aerospace (for example) tend to machine all mounting flanges for their piping and sensor mounts as part of their tank and combustion chamber ends. Common practice is to weld them on *afterward* adding another process, more inspection and a join that is very *unlikely* to have full metal strength.  Once the CNC coding has been developed you can make as many of them as you like.

However some materials will *never* work using these systems. Making a single crystal will *probably* require the ability precise positioning on an atom by atom basis which is pretty slow with an atomic force microscope (but just *maybe* someone can devise a really neat hack to make multi-atomic blocks and speed up the process  :) )

Likewise materials that need a final stage heat treatment to give them most of their properties cannot be made this way *without* the heat treatment oven/furnace afterward.

However *within* the limitations there is a huge range of stuff that can either be done now or *could* be re-designed to operate *within* the limitations of the methods.

The limits are set by peoples knowledge and imaginations. :)


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Offline kevin-rf

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However some materials will *never* work using these systems. Making a single crystal will *probably* require the ability precise positioning on an atom by atom basis which is pretty slow with an atomic force microscope (but just *maybe* someone can devise a really neat hack to make multi-atomic blocks and speed up the process  :) )
One option would be to print the part (in metal), and at same the time print the mold (in ceramic) around the part, melt the part, and through control of the cooling and insertion of a single seed crystal convert it into a mono-crystal.

Really, other than printers that print both metal and ceramic at the same time do not exist, it is no more complex than how current mono crystal parts are made. Of course saying production of mono crystal parts are simple to make is a bit of a stretch  ::)

*Though I suspect the part surface finish would be a bit of an issue in applications that require mono crystal parts.
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Offline RanulfC

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I think the most interesting "take" on 3D printing is the combination approaches being looked into, such as the "Hydra" here:
http://reprap.org/wiki/Hydra-MMM_Prototype

Such machines combine a 3D-printing function with a CNC-function where the printer does the general "form" and the CNC system then finalizes the detail for the final object.

Randy
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