Quote from: vaporcobra on 10/12/2017 07:38 am-larger Raptor currently under constructionIt seems unclear what she meant here. It could either mean a physically larger engine or a engine with upscaled capabilities with the same physical size.
-larger Raptor currently under construction
Quote from: jpo234 on 10/12/2017 08:22 amQuote from: vaporcobra on 10/12/2017 07:38 am-larger Raptor currently under constructionIt seems unclear what she meant here. It could either mean a physically larger engine or a engine with upscaled capabilities with the same physical size.Although the language isn't precise, it must be clear that she's talking about the BFR final scaled engine. This is very good news and where they need to be going. The Mini Raptor was always a step for learning and testing.
If I understand correctly, the Boca Chica site will be BFR only? I guess that means they will be filing a new or amended EIS sometime?Matthew
Quote from: matthewkantar on 10/12/2017 02:10 pmIf I understand correctly, the Boca Chica site will be BFR only? I guess that means they will be filing a new or amended EIS sometime?MatthewAFAIK, Falcon 9 will launch from Boca Chica NET later 2019
Quote from: FutureSpaceTourist on 10/12/2017 06:43 amQuote@SpaceX Prez @GwynneShotwell & @DFJSteve having fun onstage tonight talking all things Mars and #BFR (she clarified the F is for Falcon).https://twitter.com/glydstone/status/918345583097556992Emphasis mine.That has been known since last year, courtesy of the Gallery section of SpaceX.comI've never understood why folks designated some other F-word to the letter 'F'.
Quote@SpaceX Prez @GwynneShotwell & @DFJSteve having fun onstage tonight talking all things Mars and #BFR (she clarified the F is for Falcon).https://twitter.com/glydstone/status/918345583097556992
@SpaceX Prez @GwynneShotwell & @DFJSteve having fun onstage tonight talking all things Mars and #BFR (she clarified the F is for Falcon).
Quote from: woods170 on 10/12/2017 08:17 amI've never understood why folks designated some other F-word to the letter 'F'.Probably because it's more of a "Pterodactyl in size" relative to the Falcon...
I've never understood why folks designated some other F-word to the letter 'F'.
I posted this earlier, but here is a picture showing sizes of the Demonstrator engine, the 2016 engine and the new smaller 2017 engine. The 2017 Raptor appears to be about a 15% scale up of the Demonstrator Raptor. Today I re-estimated the demonstrator engine exit diameter from the best picture we have. I think it is closer to .94 m which would make its expansion ratio closer to 25:1 instead of 26:1. I am also working up a Pc = 3000 psi engine. John
One attendee was absolutely adamant (https://www.reddit.com/r/spacex/comments/75ufq9/interesting_items_from_gwynne_shotwells_talk_at/do94w0z/) that Shotwell mentioned the construction of a larger Raptor, and that only makes sense. Minor upscaling is arguably necessary to reach the final figure of 1.7-1.9kN, can't be accomplished solely through higher chamber pressures. Quote from: livingjw on 10/07/2017 03:02 amI posted this earlier, but here is a picture showing sizes of the Demonstrator engine, the 2016 engine and the new smaller 2017 engine. The 2017 Raptor appears to be about a 15% scale up of the Demonstrator Raptor. Today I re-estimated the demonstrator engine exit diameter from the best picture we have. I think it is closer to .94 m which would make its expansion ratio closer to 25:1 instead of 26:1. I am also working up a Pc = 3000 psi engine. John
Quote from: Rocket Science on 10/12/2017 02:35 pmQuote from: woods170 on 10/12/2017 08:17 amI've never understood why folks designated some other F-word to the letter 'F'.Probably because it's more of a "Pterodactyl in size" relative to the Falcon... I think the joke is that the 'official' name is Big Falcon Rocket, but it can also be taken (by Elon in particular) as standing for Big F*****g Rocket. The ambiguity is purposeful. No big deal.
It also opens up the possibility that the F9 production line will continue to run at least until BFR has entered service.
Quote from: vanoord on 10/12/2017 04:14 pmQuote from: Rocket Science on 10/12/2017 02:35 pmQuote from: woods170 on 10/12/2017 08:17 amI've never understood why folks designated some other F-word to the letter 'F'.Probably because it's more of a "Pterodactyl in size" relative to the Falcon... I think the joke is that the 'official' name is Big Falcon Rocket, but it can also be taken (by Elon in particular) as standing for Big F*****g Rocket. The ambiguity is purposeful. No big deal.In the construction and mechanical trades, sometimes the hammer one has in one's hand isn't producing the desired result, and a bigger hammer is needed. In those trades, the larger hammer is commonly referred to as a "BFH." And the F there does not mean Falcon.So Elon/SpaceX has taken the "BFH" moniker and tongue-in-cheekily applied it to a rocket instead of a hammer, with the convenient happenstance that the "F" in BFR can be more ambiguous in polite company.Just mentioning this for those who have never heard of a BFH.
Quote from: vaporcobra on 10/12/2017 05:24 pmOne attendee was absolutely adamant (https://www.reddit.com/r/spacex/comments/75ufq9/interesting_items_from_gwynne_shotwells_talk_at/do94w0z/) that Shotwell mentioned the construction of a larger Raptor, and that only makes sense. Minor upscaling is arguably necessary to reach the final figure of 1.7-1.9kN, can't be accomplished solely through higher chamber pressures. Quote from: livingjw on 10/07/2017 03:02 amI posted this earlier, but here is a picture showing sizes of the Demonstrator engine, the 2016 engine and the new smaller 2017 engine. The 2017 Raptor appears to be about a 15% scale up of the Demonstrator Raptor. Today I re-estimated the demonstrator engine exit diameter from the best picture we have. I think it is closer to .94 m which would make its expansion ratio closer to 25:1 instead of 26:1. I am also working up a Pc = 3000 psi engine. JohnI agree that's likely, but we can't know for certain without knowing the actual thrust and Pc of the demo Raptor.
In the construction and mechanical trades, sometimes the hammer one has in one's hand isn't producing the desired result, and a bigger hammer is needed. In those trades, the larger hammer is commonly referred to as a "BFH." And the F there does not mean Falcon.
Quote from: envy887 on 10/12/2017 05:31 pmQuote from: vaporcobra on 10/12/2017 05:24 pmOne attendee was absolutely adamant (https://www.reddit.com/r/spacex/comments/75ufq9/interesting_items_from_gwynne_shotwells_talk_at/do94w0z/) that Shotwell mentioned the construction of a larger Raptor, and that only makes sense. Minor upscaling is arguably necessary to reach the final figure of 1.7-1.9kN, can't be accomplished solely through higher chamber pressures. Quote from: livingjw on 10/07/2017 03:02 amI posted this earlier, but here is a picture showing sizes of the Demonstrator engine, the 2016 engine and the new smaller 2017 engine. The 2017 Raptor appears to be about a 15% scale up of the Demonstrator Raptor. Today I re-estimated the demonstrator engine exit diameter from the best picture we have. I think it is closer to .94 m which would make its expansion ratio closer to 25:1 instead of 26:1. I am also working up a Pc = 3000 psi engine. JohnI agree that's likely, but we can't know for certain without knowing the actual thrust and Pc of the demo Raptor.NASASpaceflight publicly quoted it at 1000kN days after the 2016 reveal, and I believe that came from L2 info. There's no reason to doubt that figure, its long been understood that the subscale Raptor is approximately the same size as Merlin 1D.
Reddit to the rescue! Several people took notes, which I compiled here, with some photos too: https://www.flickr.com/photos/jurvetson/37659376821/. Thanks @glydstone!
Entirely possible that you're right, but I'd still suggest checking out the last several pages of this thread. livingjw demonstrates a pretty strong understand of rocket propulsion and backs up those charts and claims with data. http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=41363.msg1733108#msg1733108