Author Topic: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration  (Read 8800 times)

Offline edkyle99

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Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« on: 02/26/2022 01:38 pm »
Cold War 1 gave us the Space Race - satellites and men in space and, at vast expense, men on the Moon.  Post Cold War 1 gave us the commercial space era.  What will this new Cold War 2 provide when it comes to space?

 - Ed Kyle
« Last Edit: 02/26/2022 01:39 pm by edkyle99 »

Offline JayWee

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #1 on: 02/26/2022 01:58 pm »
Hold on your horses. Thic could very well turn into Hot War first..

Anyway, Soviet Union was ideologically based on "building communism" (up to a point). That included doing "great things" which showed how great of a nation they are. Current Russia, not so much.
China - always believed they are a great nation and don't really have to prove it to themselves. Could see a Moon base.

Offline laszlo

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #2 on: 02/26/2022 03:13 pm »
It already is a hot war, ask the people in the Ukraine.

Offline Slarty1080

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #3 on: 02/26/2022 03:26 pm »
It already is a hot war, ask the people in the Ukraine.
The cold war was only cold between the USSR and the USA. There were a lot of smaller hot proxy wars
My optimistic hope is that it will become cool to really think about things... rather than just doing reactive bullsh*t based on no knowledge (Brian Cox)

Offline Coastal Ron

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #4 on: 02/26/2022 04:31 pm »
It already is a hot war, ask the people in the Ukraine.

And in case everyone was wondering if Russia will be satisfied with just invading Ukraine, just ask the citizens of Sweden and Finland:

Russia threatens 'military and political consequences' if Finland, Sweden try joining NATO - The Hill
If we don't continuously lower the cost to access space, how are we ever going to afford to expand humanity out into space?

Offline edkyle99

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #5 on: 02/26/2022 05:09 pm »
I suppose a key question is whether the change in geopolitics means more money for NASA or less.  I expect more money for defense, especially for missiles, but I'm not sure NASA will also see more money.  There is a skeleton plan to land on the Moon, but it needs much more funding to finish.  Seems to me that Mars is more symbolic if such symbolism is needed ...

 - Ed Kyle

Offline ZachS09

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #6 on: 02/26/2022 06:40 pm »
I’m not sure if this question has been asked:

Will a side effect of Russia invading Ukraine be no more Russian collaboration with anybody?

This is really worrying me.
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Offline JayWee

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #7 on: 02/26/2022 06:42 pm »
I’m not sure if this question has been asked:

Will a side effect of Russia invading Ukraine be no more Russian collaboration with anybody?

This is really worrying me.
The Chinese will collaborate. Indians seems a bit neutral - don't forget they buy some russian weapons.
« Last Edit: 02/26/2022 06:43 pm by JayWee »

Offline spacenut

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #8 on: 02/26/2022 07:14 pm »
Hopefully it will mean more money for NASA. 

I would hope the AR-1 Aerojet engine is built, and built to be reusable. 

I would like to see ACES developed. 

I would like to also see the engine return off the Vulcan for reusability. 

I wish Boeing and Lockheed, as well as Northrop Grumman would develop reusable rockets. 

Bring down the costs of going into space.  Help with Development of New Glenn and Starship. 

Cheaper access to space will mean more stuff done in Space. 

Offline Jim

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #9 on: 02/26/2022 07:17 pm »
Hopefully it will mean more money for NASA. 

I would hope the AR-1 Aerojet engine is built, and built to be reusable. 


It means none of that. There still is no case for AR-1

Offline robertross

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #10 on: 02/26/2022 07:19 pm »
Hopefully it will mean more money for NASA. 
 
My personal thought is NO, since we will all be too preoccupied in gearing up partner NATO countries to counter a potential invasion from Russia.

The cost will be enormous (and we still have a post-pandemic recovery to think about and paying for everything we put in to battling COVID). Even Canada started 'printing' money.

Space Force will no doubt see a budget increase though.

Offline ZachS09

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #11 on: 02/26/2022 11:04 pm »
I’m not sure if this question has been asked:

Will a side effect of Russia invading Ukraine be no more Russian collaboration with anybody?

This is really worrying me.
The Chinese will collaborate. Indians seems a bit neutral - don't forget they buy some Russian weapons.

India's also using the RD-810 engine as a basis for their first kerolox engine (SCE-200).
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Offline edkyle99

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #12 on: 02/26/2022 11:37 pm »
I suppose that the circumstances that created the first Space Race - a complacent U.S. stunned by Sputnik, embarrassed by Vanguard TV-3, and left chasing as the USSR beat it to the Moon with Luna and then with Vostok 1's man in space, cannot recur. 

 - Ed Kyle     

Offline docmordrid

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #13 on: 02/27/2022 01:02 am »
SpaceX Starlink goes to war...

Can't help but wonder if some of the portable units are going to make their way over there.

https://www.reuters.com/technology/musk-says-starlink-active-ukraine-russian-invasion-disrupts-internet-2022-02-27/

Quote
Musk says Starlink active in Ukraine as Russian invasion disrupts internet

SAN FRANCISCO, Feb 26 (Reuters) - SpaceX billionaire Elon Musk said on Saturday that the company's Starlink satellite broadband service is available in Ukraine and SpaceX is sending more terminals to the country, whose internet has been disrupted due to the Russian invasion.

"Starlink service is now active in Ukraine. More terminals en route," Musk tweeted.
>
While extremely costly to deploy, satellite technology can provide internet for people who live in rural or hard-to-serve places where fiber optic cables and cell towers do not reach. The technology can also be a critical backstop when hurricanes or other natural disasters disrupt communication.
>
« Last Edit: 02/27/2022 01:04 am by docmordrid »
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Offline Lar

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #14 on: 02/27/2022 02:26 am »
Even in the policy section, please keep doing a good job of staying out of general politics, I know it is hard. Thanks, keep up the good work
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Offline Slarty1080

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #15 on: 02/27/2022 09:31 am »
I suppose that the circumstances that created the first Space Race - a complacent U.S. stunned by Sputnik, embarrassed by Vanguard TV-3, and left chasing as the USSR beat it to the Moon with Luna and then with Vostok 1's man in space, cannot recur. 

 - Ed Kyle   
History never repeats itself, although it sometimes rhymes.
My optimistic hope is that it will become cool to really think about things... rather than just doing reactive bullsh*t based on no knowledge (Brian Cox)

Offline edzieba

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #16 on: 02/27/2022 10:27 am »
Have any of Russia's anti-space assets been spotted moving towards Ukraine? Not just hard-kill systems (which appear to all be stationary anyway, and would be a dramatic escalation inviting NATO response) but denial systems like their optical dazzlers and RF jammers.

Offline kdhilliard

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #17 on: 02/27/2022 11:15 am »
Viasat’s Ka-SAT experiencing service interruptions (Seth Miller · 26 February 2022 · PaxEx.Aero)
Quote
Viasat’s European network is experiencing a partial outage. The issue, related to its Ka-SAT satellite, is currently affecting service for multiple fixed broadband customers across the region.
...
The company also calls attention to the suspicious timing of the outage onset, “We don’t have the exact causes yet, but we can tell you that the disturbances began at about the same time as Russia invaded Ukraine.”

Offline Nate_Trost

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #18 on: 02/27/2022 12:33 pm »
Given the cost of a major war, massive economic sanctions, and tech embargos, Russia is going to be doing the opposite of a space race. There were budget cuts even before the Ukraine invasion.

Offline spacenut

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #19 on: 02/27/2022 12:47 pm »
The west now has to forget use of Russia's space assets.  Time to use the west's assets.  I fear Putin's is mad, and may use nukes if his ground forces can't take things fast enough for him.  This would change everything. 

Edit/Lar: This is exactly the sort of discussion we will not have here. Stay out of politics. Stay out of military applications.
« Last Edit: 02/28/2022 05:32 am by Lar »

Offline AndyH

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #20 on: 02/27/2022 12:58 pm »
Have any of Russia's anti-space assets been spotted moving towards Ukraine? Not just hard-kill systems (which appear to all be stationary anyway, and would be a dramatic escalation inviting NATO response) but denial systems like their optical dazzlers and RF jammers.
Haven't seen any open source info on that sort of equipment moving.  It doesn't appear the powers that be in Moscow are thinking far enough ahead to move that sort of equipment as they're pretty fixated on a 4-day victory and upset enough with the poor performance to bring in Chechens and troops from Belarus.  (We'll ignore that part where Belarus changed their constitution yesterday to allow Russia to bring nukes into their country, and that Putin put his nukes on alert...)

Oh, the good news?  Peace talks were just announced between Ukraine and Russia on the Belarus border just north of Chernobyl (Pripyat). 

ETA...and just to be sporting, another pair of short range ballistic missiles were launched from Srn Belarus a bit ago - at least one was shot down near Kharkiv.  It doesn't sound like anyone's standing down in prep for the supposed peace talks.  I hope to heaven it's not a trap...and at this point, I wouldn't rule it out.

https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/02/26/belarus-constitutional-referendum-vote-russia-nato/
https://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/president-vladimir-putin-ordered-russian-nuclear-deterrent-forces-83140871
https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-kyiv-referendums-belarus-alexander-lukashenko-3acd50c10b125bc45515ccc23a0daa4f
https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1497929907195756546


eta...
https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/1497957138647375876
https://twitter.com/MarQs__/status/1497957843441434630
« Last Edit: 02/27/2022 03:13 pm by AndyH »

Offline mrhuggy

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #21 on: 02/27/2022 07:02 pm »
The meeting is tomorrow morning 28th February. There has been a lot of people saying that they broke their word etc when it hasn't even started yet.

Offline AndyH

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #22 on: 02/27/2022 09:23 pm »
The meeting is tomorrow morning 28th February. There has been a lot of people saying that they broke their word etc when it hasn't even started yet.
It was initially scheduled for Sunday afternoon EET 27 Feb, but the scale of the fighting and the continued attacks from Belarus caused a 24 hour push.  Belarus' president Lukashenko assured the participants that no attacks would be launched from Belarus from the time the participants started to travel until they returned home.  That was quickly broken, and it resulted in a delay and in the EU sanctioning Belarus.

There's a possibility that the combination of the continued SLBM launches and that Belarusian troops have joined Russia both on the ground and in the air will put the talks on hold indefinitely.



https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1497930611096363013
https://twitter.com/KyivIndependent/status/1498010244605263878

Offline Lar

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Re: Cold War 2 and Space Exploration
« Reply #23 on: 02/28/2022 05:34 am »
This is not a general "news of the war" site. Thread locked for at least a few hours, maybe indefinitely.
"I think it would be great to be born on Earth and to die on Mars. Just hopefully not at the point of impact." -Elon Musk
"We're a little bit like the dog who caught the bus" - Musk after CRS-8 S1 successfully landed on ASDS OCISLY

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