The main reasons I think we need to return to the moon is the need for experience living on another planet. At this point we have exactly two weeks total time on another planetary body and that was about 40 years ago. This no were near enough to go heading off to mars. The Moon provides an opportunity learn what we need to survive on Mars. Living on the Moon is harder than Mars and so if we can have a crew survive there for two yeas without re-supply then Mars will be do able. For example if we can maintain good health in the Moon’s 1/6 g then Mars’ 1/3 will not be a problem.The Moon is a perfect test bed because it is so close. If a massive problem occurs on a moon base requiring evacuation, the crew can return to Earth any time it needs to, On Mars the crew would die. So lets learn to do it on the Moon where the risk to the crew is smaller.
Can we keep focused on "why" not "how"? We have many places on this site on "how".For example, what data do we need to answer which question that we still have about the moon. Danny Deger
Figure out and properly date the Late Heavy Bombardment. Look for traces of aminoacids in impact craters. Figure out at what time the aminoacid bearing impacts were. Statistically sample and date the impact craters to find the probabilty of impact events and if that has changed over time.Lots of fun stuff to do. All this requires sample return, covering large areas and detailed mapping and observation to get the Lunar stratigraphy right. So in the long run cheaper to send people. There's why we should go back.
snipWell operations on the moon can test NTR and NEP propulsion for interplanetary missions as well as ISRU.snip
Quote from: agman25 on 10/19/2009 07:29 pmFigure out and properly date the Late Heavy Bombardment. Look for traces of aminoacids in impact craters. Figure out at what time the aminoacid bearing impacts were. Statistically sample and date the impact craters to find the probabilty of impact events and if that has changed over time.Lots of fun stuff to do. All this requires sample return, covering large areas and detailed mapping and observation to get the Lunar stratigraphy right. So in the long run cheaper to send people. There's why we should go back.Would a core sample help? Congress will throw money at NASA to do this if the Late Heavy Bombardment can be connected to our climate history. I am thinking $30B will appear overnight to look at climate change. I for one do not want to live through another ice age. The last one was pretty bad. I would much rather heat up a bit and have to move to Canada.Danny Deger
snipHard to stretch it to climate history. Origin of Life on Earth and protection of life on Earth will have to do.
snipIt also may be possible to get a record of past solar activity going back millions maybe even even billions of years from studying core samples of lunar regolith.
Quote from: Danny Dot on 10/19/2009 05:49 pmQuote from: veedriver22 on 10/19/2009 05:07 pm There is now a moon version of google eath. Have them search for sites that look interesting or might have resources. Sim's are ok for a while but having them work with something thats real I think would be more exciting. Also have a kids section of NASASPACEFLIGHT.COM where they can post & discuss their findings. You would want teachers & scientists that would review thier topics & give them feedback on what they are seeing and suggestions on what to do next. Even cooler would be for NASA to actually select some of the sites that look promisiing. Maybe a list of the promising sites and the kids that found them. Sounds like we need a Space Act Agreement between NASA and Google. Google can incorporate all the NASA data on the moon into the system.Danny DegerThis is a great idea, something that NASA should do anyway. It'd be great publicity for Google (not like they need it), could be done with their "20% time," and would greatly increase the quality and accessibility of NASA's data. Of course, it must all be open-sourced.
Quote from: veedriver22 on 10/19/2009 05:07 pm There is now a moon version of google eath. Have them search for sites that look interesting or might have resources. Sim's are ok for a while but having them work with something thats real I think would be more exciting. Also have a kids section of NASASPACEFLIGHT.COM where they can post & discuss their findings. You would want teachers & scientists that would review thier topics & give them feedback on what they are seeing and suggestions on what to do next. Even cooler would be for NASA to actually select some of the sites that look promisiing. Maybe a list of the promising sites and the kids that found them. Sounds like we need a Space Act Agreement between NASA and Google. Google can incorporate all the NASA data on the moon into the system.Danny Deger
There is now a moon version of google eath. Have them search for sites that look interesting or might have resources. Sim's are ok for a while but having them work with something thats real I think would be more exciting. Also have a kids section of NASASPACEFLIGHT.COM where they can post & discuss their findings. You would want teachers & scientists that would review thier topics & give them feedback on what they are seeing and suggestions on what to do next. Even cooler would be for NASA to actually select some of the sites that look promisiing. Maybe a list of the promising sites and the kids that found them.
Three Mile Island kind of proved we shouldn't be allowed to play with nuclear reactors. If that is the best we can do, we deserve to die because we have to produce CO2 to make electricity in a manner that we can power our cities. Maybe if we can operate one on the moon without melting it down then pumping the radioactive coolant outside of the containment vessel, the American public will allow us to make more on the Earth and make electricity with producing CO2. Before we do this, we need to get a handle on climate change. If we are headed into another ice age, we need all the CO2 we can produce.What do you think we should make out of lunar material? Oxygen for sure. Mine for water if we find any, then we can make rocket fuel. Have we found any decent metal ores yet? How about a good iron ore you can throw straight into furnace like we used to? Danny Deger
snip Nasa would select the most promising sites and they could be posted to the web site listing the School , the teacher, and the students that had the biggest contribution to the discovery. I have to believe that some of the sites picked out might actually be explored by NASA at some point. Can you image the excitement of knowing that its possible that your site might actually be explored some day (hopefully not too far away).
snipI prefer to note that for about 50 years the US Navy has been training 20 year old kids to run reactors aboard pitching, rolling warships cruising in all weather conditions all around the world in all climates and in all that time they have never had such an incident. My bet is that if NASA operates nuclear power plants on the moon and/or nuclear engines for manned missions they will have an even better safety record than the Navy does; we certainly spend more time and money training those really smart people we call "astronauts".snip
nuclear power, yes. It's asinine that we have shyd away from it for this long here on Earth.I'd rather us build a nuclear powered spaceship than anything else at this point. Anyway, someone mentioned looking up at the moon and knownig we are up there.Imagine being an 8 year old and experiencing the same thing now days. The moon is a visible object to anyone on the planet. being able to look up at night and imagine what someone is doing up there would fill a child, or even an adult! with awe and wonder at what we can achieve.that's an untangible benefit of any exploration program. I think the moon might impact people more though, just because it is visiblehard to sell that aspect to congress though i'd thin. unless you threw in math and science interests as well. But even then.
Quote from: Patchouli on 10/19/2009 07:48 pmsnipWell operations on the moon can test NTR and NEP propulsion for interplanetary missions as well as ISRU.snipThree Mile Island kind of proved we shouldn't be allowed to play with nuclear reactors. If that is the best we can do, we deserve to die because we have to produce CO2 to make electricity in a manner that we can power our cities. Danny Deger
To me, a great idea would be teleoperated robotic rovers on the Moon that kids could run from their classrooms via the internet. Heck, I'd go back to school for a chance to use that!
Quote from: Launchpad911 on 10/19/2009 02:41 pmTo me, a great idea would be teleoperated robotic rovers on the Moon that kids could run from their classrooms via the internet. Heck, I'd go back to school for a chance to use that!Capital idea!One mission, multiplexed solar powered rovers, with a little digging arm and a random assortment of sensors to give schools different & challenging tasks. Maybe even make it a competition.Perhaps to save money, they could piggy-back on a main rover mission, using a common hub for data relay purposes.Let's face it, the educational value would go very far. Winners would get a chance to operate the MSL. Runnres up: Opportunity.
Quote from: robertross on 10/20/2009 12:40 amCapital idea!One mission, multiplexed solar powered rovers, with a little digging arm and a random assortment of sensors to give schools different & challenging tasks. Maybe even make it a competition.Perhaps to save money, they could piggy-back on a main rover mission, using a common hub for data relay purposes.Let's face it, the educational value would go very far. Winners would get a chance to operate the MSL. Runners up: Opportunity. I think we need to keep it to cheaper robots that have already been "retired". Even if NASA collected all the data for the kids, it would still be exciting.
Capital idea!One mission, multiplexed solar powered rovers, with a little digging arm and a random assortment of sensors to give schools different & challenging tasks. Maybe even make it a competition.Perhaps to save money, they could piggy-back on a main rover mission, using a common hub for data relay purposes.Let's face it, the educational value would go very far. Winners would get a chance to operate the MSL. Runners up: Opportunity.