Author Topic: Boca Chica Resort  (Read 40172 times)

Offline Texsun

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #40 on: 08/12/2020 08:16 pm »

You should try to talk them into contracting with some tunneling company, if one can be found, and giving pad tours that way.

That sounds rather, ahem, Boring, to me.  8)
« Last Edit: 08/12/2020 08:19 pm by Texsun »

Offline Mandella

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #41 on: 08/12/2020 08:42 pm »
If land inland is available, I suspect SpaceX will pull a Disneyworld and set up a resort area well away from the actual operations. They can make it look as futuristic and SpaceX-ey all they want safely back from the dangerzone -- even perhaps relocating Hoppy and other relics too sentimentally evocative to scrap to the resort area.

And they might not be able to stop people from driving down the main road during no launch times, but they certainly can make their own authorized tours much better in comparison. And of course they will have a viewing area closer to the launch site than the resort, and you'll only be able to get into it from the official tour.

And personally, I will be pretty disappointed if Nomadd's roof is not part of the official tour.

;)
« Last Edit: 08/12/2020 08:44 pm by Mandella »

Offline CJ

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #42 on: 08/12/2020 09:57 pm »
At first, I'd assumed that the "resort" was for SpaceX employees only - a resort-style accommodation for them (A great idea when trying to attract workers). Now, I'm wondering if those here have it right; it might be open to the public, at least in part.

I know that (pre-pandemic) I was considering a drive to have a look-see at Boca Chica. This was just after Starhopper's 150M hop, when they relocated it close to the fence. I wanted to see Starhopper (even if all I could do was drive by), and also check out the beach. It's over a thousand-mile drive each way for me, but I like visiting Texas anyway, and I had a condo lined up on South Padre. (I love beaches, and my state, Arizona, is a tad lacking in them). I've driven to Florida to see Kennedy SC (And took the tour), I've visited Houston to see MC and the facilities there (the rocket garden at both is a highlight!), so yep, I'd be very interested in a Space-X resort, or even just a few facilities (like, a tour, and a restaurant with Starship fins). If that restaurant  was open to the public, I'd certainly want to be a customer if I was visiting the area. I haven't even considered actual launches in the above, but those will be a vast draw, whether there is a SpaceX resort or not.

SpaceX would have several motives here. One is boosting public support via engagement. Another is profit to offset costs. I can see big drawbacks too, but, I've guessed wrong about SpaceX too many times to bet against them trying something a bit outlandish (like, a certain Space-X related tunneling company selling not-a-flamethrowers....). True, they are basically just roofer's torches, but still, not exactly conventional marketing. 

Edit to add: it occurs to me that there's another angle - cross-marketing. What if the tours are not trams, but full self-driving Teslas? (The tech to do this is either close or existing; it'd be for a very limited area and a per-programed route, and with speed limits near walking speed, etc.) I realize that this, and much of the above, would require government approval, but given how desirous local governments are of tourism, I suspect that it would not be too difficult. Also, Space-X has done things with Tesla before - such as sending one out past Mars.
« Last Edit: 08/12/2020 10:07 pm by CJ »

Offline Nomadd

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #43 on: 08/13/2020 12:14 am »
 People wanting to see the beach might find it a little disappointing for a while. The hurricane really did a job on it. 7 miles of trash and vegetation covering the sand.
Those who danced were thought to be quite insane by those who couldn't hear the music.

Offline meberbs

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #44 on: 08/13/2020 01:07 am »
For all of the posts in this thread talking about tourists, and such, I feel like most of them are missing the point

My first, and still only, thought on hearing about this is not for tourists stopping by for tours or something, but as an initial stop and preparation spot for tourists whose real destination is at least a few hundred km in the "up" direction. Even if by that point launches are offshore, the will want a place to gather everyone and make sure they are ready to head to LEO, the moon, or Mars.

Maybe there would be accommodations for people staying on the planet too, but that would not be the main purpose.

Offline CJ

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #45 on: 08/13/2020 01:14 am »
People wanting to see the beach might find it a little disappointing for a while. The hurricane really did a job on it. 7 miles of trash and vegetation covering the sand.

I used to live near a beach, so I can well envision that after a major storm (I've seen driftwood and debris 10ft deep), and fully sympathize. I wonder if Padre Island is similar? (Though that's kind of academic for me at the moment, as I won't be traveling anywhere during the pandemic).

One the resort issue though, I wonder if it's occurred to SpaceX that, if public engagement is part of their motive, that a very good way of attaining that in the space fan community (their primary customer base) would be to hire (at a high salary - it'd be worth it) well known Boca Chica content providers as tour guides. I'm serious, I think it'd be a good move on all fronts (assuming the content providers were willing, of course). This dynamic has worked very well in the "influencer" market, where people popular on youtube, instagram, etc, get major $. 

You should also get free passes for the volcano lair roller coaster ride. :)

Offline Dave G

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #46 on: 08/13/2020 10:17 am »
I suggest they will be able to purchase a ticket on some kind of tour to the launch site and to the construction area...

Boca Chica beach is open to the public.
Texas state laws are somewhat particular about limiting access to public beaches.
For every test or launch operation, SpaceX has to get permission to close the beach.
They're also not allowed to close the beach on summer weekends or holidays, except in special cases.
See here for details.

Offline edzieba

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #47 on: 08/13/2020 10:39 am »
Another reason for a 'resort' in the nearer term is accommodation for staff and guests associated with payload launches. Both the technicians handling and prepping payload for Starship, and executives of the company paying for the launch, will need or want access to the launch site and viewing for the launch. Trucking to and from Brownsville is OK, but accommodation on site saves time.

On ecologically low-impact site access for tourism: eschew road access, view and access the site from off-shore via boats chartered from South Padre Island. SPI is an existing resort with infrastructure to handle general public visits and accommodation, access via boat gets a unique view and with a short pier can access and tour the sites directly with minimal impact on the wetlands, in a way driving a car to the perimeter cannot. Saves on infrastructure SpaceX themselves have to build, and SPI would likely welcome additional business so may provide some funding or other incentives themselves.

Offline Eka

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #48 on: 08/13/2020 10:59 am »
I'm pretty sure my credentials as a SpaceX fan are fairly well established. Trouble is, I'm also so a bit of a tree hugger. I'm not too sure about abandoning even the pretense of being a wildlife refuge out here. The factory and the launches aren't the problem. The traffic is. My one hope is that the heavy construction traffic that does most of the killing will taper off eventually. I'd hate to see it replaced by a couple hundred tourists every day.
As stated by EM, Starships will be made a hundred a year for at least a decade plus once production goes into full swing. This is a minimum by his stated goals for colonizing Mars. A sizable facility will be needed for staging people and supplies for that colonization effort. Figure each flight to Mars requires 8 to 10 launches. At peak that is a minimum of 8,000 launches every 26 months. Yes, SpaceX must also use other launch locations, but BC and the Port of Brownsville will become very busy.

Noise alone will cause them to use offshore facilities for most traffic. Hence why I say the Port of Brownsville will get very busy. Near each synod transfer window a minimum of 12 launches and 24 landings a day will happen from each launch pad just for fueling the Mars bound fleet. For each cargo or passenger ship that goes, there is a Superheavy/Starship launch, and Superheavy landing. These will be much harder to do off shore due to the cargo and passenger loading.* The cargo ship launches and some of the fueling flights can be spread out to stage the ships in orbit. Only a final top off and go in the window is needed for them, but the passenger ships must fuel and go.

I haven't even mentioned facilities to support in space training operations, ground crews, etc. Eventually having many thousands of people involved in ground support isn't out of the question. This is all on top of manufacturing personnel.

* Cargo and passenger launches need time for loading that doesn't have launches and landing happening. Refueling launches don't need this.
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Offline Nomadd

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #49 on: 08/13/2020 01:53 pm »
I suggest they will be able to purchase a ticket on some kind of tour to the launch site and to the construction area...

Boca Chica beach is open to the public.
Texas state laws are somewhat particular about limiting access to public beaches.
For every test or launch operation, SpaceX has to get permission to close the beach.
They're also not allowed to close the beach on summer weekends or holidays, except in special cases.
See here for details.

This entire summer is a special case. They don't even fill out that part of the form since the beach is closed anyhow.
Those who danced were thought to be quite insane by those who couldn't hear the music.

Offline kkattula

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #50 on: 08/14/2020 03:22 pm »
For all of the posts in this thread talking about tourists, and such, I feel like most of them are missing the point

My first, and still only, thought on hearing about this is not for tourists stopping by for tours or something, but as an initial stop and preparation spot for tourists whose real destination is at least a few hundred km in the "up" direction. Even if by that point launches are offshore, the will want a place to gather everyone and make sure they are ready to head to LEO, the moon, or Mars.

Maybe there would be accommodations for people staying on the planet too, but that would not be the main purpose.

Exactly. 

Elon wants to send a million people to Mars in the next few decades. Those people are going to need to be gathered together and organized for each launch, even if most training is done elsewhere. And it will be concentrated by the synodic period into a few months every couple of years.

Imagine you're about to leave Earth forever. Wouldn't you want to enjoy some luxury in your last few days, and say your goodbyes to family, who have come to see you off, in pleasant surrounds? They will want somewhere nice to stay too.

There may even be a quarantine period, during which you want to keep the waiting passengers happy and calm.
« Last Edit: 08/14/2020 03:23 pm by kkattula »

Offline Llian Rhydderch

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #51 on: 08/15/2020 10:37 pm »
Found an interesting paragraph about SpaceX building "food services and lodging" in a 2013 public document:

Quote
Some food services and lodging may be built along State Highway 4 to accommodate the increased
demand of laborers, personnel, and spectators for the launches. Although there is no commercial zoning
in this portion of Cameron County, appropriate permitting through Cameron County would be required
prior to the construction or operation of such projects.
  link

This likely covers the airstreams, food trucks, and new flaperon-restaurant near the build site (so maybe fits in another thread???) but also would seem to fit the recent resort plans tweeted last week.
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Offline DistantTemple

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #52 on: 08/15/2020 11:27 pm »
What you quote says "build". Then you mention caravans, and an existing building.....  Build is an expectation of building.... so back along rout 4 some 8 - 10 miles I found this ... it is on Google streetview, so may be a couple of years old! but its an existing site.... away from the environmentally protected wetlands.... not ever so far from where the Port connector is due to be built, so convenient assuming -as i do - that SX will have a site on the BC ship canal! for workers to get therer or to the urrent BC site! And its very convenient for the airport, or going into town!
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Offline Texsun

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Offline Mandella

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #54 on: 08/19/2020 08:03 pm »
According to this tweet, they are planning it to be for the workers first, but are open to expanding it for guests.

Ah well, guess I'll have to wait a bit more for my SpaceX Interplanetary Travel Theme Park.
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1296159417163948033

Musk -- "Mostly for employees, but weíll support public access whenever itís safe & secure. Public support is critical to making life multiplanetary."

Offline meberbs

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #55 on: 08/19/2020 08:39 pm »
For all of the posts in this thread talking about tourists, and such, I feel like most of them are missing the point

My first, and still only, thought on hearing about this is not for tourists stopping by for tours or something, but as an initial stop and preparation spot for tourists whose real destination is at least a few hundred km in the "up" direction. Even if by that point launches are offshore, the will want a place to gather everyone and make sure they are ready to head to LEO, the moon, or Mars.

Maybe there would be accommodations for people staying on the planet too, but that would not be the main purpose.
Guess I was wrong, the position is geared towards accomodations for employees rather than future customers, though the use for future customers is not excluded.

Offline DiskOperatingSystem

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #56 on: 08/20/2020 01:57 am »
As Elon implied in his recent tweet, this facility will be for employees for some much needed R&R and eventually might be open to the public. So, in terms of employee comfort and Elonís implication that it will be ďlots of funĒ, what ideas do you have for how the resort can be fun, relaxing, and a place suited for an actual spaceport?

My ideas:
- Obviously expanding the observation deck at the restaurant. Possibly adding in outdoor screens to display telemetry and camera views.
- A Retro-Futuristic 50ís diner.
- A bar called ďMars BarĒ
- SpaceX store with their premium products and items only available in Boca Chica.
- A drive in movie theatre. This way you donít need to do more to the natural environment and you can double it as a place for camera views of launches. Could allow new feature films out in theatres so employees donít have to drive to Brownsville. Also could have an ice cream place.
- Small pier/boardwalk. Donít want to harm the natural ecosystem more, but itíd be a place to walk out to the beach directly from Highway 4.
- Good, comfortable, scenic, and quiet housing with outdoor decks. This area would also be a place to escape from the publicís eye, so privacy is key.
- Gym and Basketball court.
- Small medical center.
- Barber/Salon.
- Facility for resident services
- Supercharges (canít wait to see Semis and Cybertrucks at Boca Chica. Thatíll go a long way to making it feel futuristic.)
- Solar Power Facility
- Post Office
- Simulated Martian Habitat so you could have a place to get acquainted with where youíre going and have some safe, simulated fun on Earth if you donít feel like going to Mars but still work at the port.
- SpaceX Museum with early parts, Merlin and Raptor engines, spacesuits, concept drawings, etc. on display. Could have a planetarium too.
- Starship and Superheavy storage facility. Could have it attached to museum to show off real fleet of starships so youíd have an exhibit thatís always in motion and changing. Youíre gonna need somewhere to store ships while not in use so...
- Maybe an indoor observation deck as well?
- Show off the nature reserve. Boca Chica should remain beautiful as it is now as much as possible.
- Eventually will need a place for guests and their needs as well as prep area for flights (maybe).

BUT, this all sounds like a small city. This list includes basic things needed for living. It will be a small city, but Iím curious about other peopleís ideas for how to make Boca Chica Resort a FUTURISTIC SPACEPORT. What amenities scream FUTURE and SPACEPORT to you? Again, this is for employees so what ideas do we have for a relaxing and fun place with services for employees?

Offline lykos

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #57 on: 08/20/2020 08:33 am »
-Hotel
-Indoor/outdoor swimming pool
-Park
-Gas-Station
-Garage/car-repair
-Shopping-Center
-Churches
-Rent a car/bike/bicycle
-Bus-Station
-Heli-port
-Visitor-info-center/Travel agency
-Watertower
-Pet shop
-Police-station
-Fire department
........

Offline RedLineTrain

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #58 on: 09/12/2020 10:04 pm »
I've been wondering what they would do with SN5/6 and subsequent Starship discards.  Could add the fairing, cut out windows, and repurpose them as residences.  Would be pretty wild.  And a bit like living on Mars in the early days.
« Last Edit: 09/12/2020 10:09 pm by RedLineTrain »

Offline Tomness

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Re: Boca Chica Resort
« Reply #59 on: 09/12/2020 10:12 pm »
I've been wondering what they would do with SN5/6 and subsequent Starship discards.  Could add the fairing, cut out windows, and repurpose them as residences.  Would be pretty wild.  And a bit like living on Mars in the early days.

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