Author Topic: SpaceX Texas launch site Discussion and Updates - Thread 3 (Read 1459355 times)

Dave G · « **Reply #1820 on:** 04/15/2016 03:06 pm »

Quote from: Okie_Steve on 04/15/2016 02:00 pm

If they have to remove some amount of dirt then it has to go somewhere else, like say landing pads ...

My speculation for landing pads is upthread.

sewebster · « **Reply #1821 on:** 04/15/2016 04:33 pm »

FYI, this could be helpful:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consolidation_(soil)

My guess at why they would focus on one area first is so that they can start building on that area first. However, the time difference may not be that large...

Nomadd · « **Reply #1822 on:** 04/15/2016 06:24 pm »

Have fun speculating. That might be all we have now, since someone has asked the contractors to stop talking with the local riffraff about the project. The last thing I got was that even the guys doing the dirt work didn't know how much they planned on leveling off the site, but they don't expect any rebounding with this type of deposit.
It's possible plans could change a bit as they measure the settling effect of what they've done so far. I don't know if they did any core sampling, so there could be some degree of guesswork.

Kabloona · « **Reply #1823 on:** 04/15/2016 08:52 pm »

Two years of watching dirt get moved around...this is gonna be fun...

sewebster · « **Reply #1824 on:** 04/15/2016 09:05 pm »

Quote from: Kabloona on 04/15/2016 08:52 pm

Two years of watching dirt get moved around...this is gonna be fun...

Perhaps we should look into setting up a webcam...

DAZ · « **Reply #1825 on:** 04/15/2016 09:35 pm »

All the buildings, structures, and concrete slabs subject to heavy loading that cannot be allowed to shift will be supported on deeply driven piles. Because these structures are supported by these deep piles they will be relatively immune to changes in elevation of the surrounding ground. Most of the surrounding ground that is not on piles will be for things like parking lots and to ease access to these structures. With the need to support the structures on these deep piles they will probably start pile driving way in advance of the earth settling to its approximate final height. The earth will probably never settle to a stable height in our lifetimes and will probably continue to slowly sink (although measured in inches per decade) for the entire life of the site. The height of the surrounding ground will be determined by the maximum storm surge to actuary risk/cost that SpaceX is willing to assume.

llanitedave · « **Reply #1826 on:** 04/15/2016 10:35 pm »

Not to mention that the entire delta zone near the mouth of the Rio Grande is slow subsiding due to compaction of the clay and silt brought in over the millenia by the river. It's the same reason New Orleans is now below sea level, just a different river. Dams upstream prevent the arrival of new sediment to layer on top of the settling stuff, and not enough new sand to maintain the dunes, so even without climate change, the coastline is gradually going to be moving inward. The piles of dirt and the pilings will be settling both on the surface and at depth.

JBF · « **Reply #1827 on:** 04/15/2016 11:11 pm »

Quote from: Nomadd on 04/15/2016 06:24 pm

Have fun speculating. That might be all we have now, since someone has asked the contractors to stop talking with the local riffraff about the project. The last thing I got was that even the guys doing the dirt work didn't know how much they planned on leveling off the site, but they don't expect any rebounding with this type of deposit.
It's possible plans could change a bit as they measure the settling effect of what they've done so far. I don't know if they did any core sampling, so there could be some degree of guesswork.

Oh well so much for this thread until the buildings go up. I wonder from how high up that order came.

StuffOfInterest · « **Reply #1828 on:** 04/16/2016 11:21 am »

At least the launch site shouldn't have to deal with as much settling as Kansai Airport in Osaka

From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansai_International_Airport:

Quote

The sink rate fell from 50 cm (20 in) per year during 1994 to 7 cm (2.8 in) per year in 2008.

I saw something years ago where they have crews which use hydraulic jacks to lift support beams and insert spacers at the bottom to keep the above structure level while the ground is settling underneath. Probably not a practical solution with a slap of concrete on top.

I flew through that airport 15 years ago, and I recall it looking quite nice, but I don't remember too much as it was after a 13 hours flight and not many brain cells are firing with that much time in a tube.

Nomadd · « **Reply #1829 on:** 04/16/2016 03:47 pm »

Quote from: StuffOfInterest on 04/16/2016 11:21 am

At least the launch site shouldn't have to deal with as much settling as Kansai Airport in Osaka

From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansai_International_Airport:
Quote
The sink rate fell from 50 cm (20 in) per year during 1994 to 7 cm (2.8 in) per year in 2008.

I saw somethings years ago where they have crews which use hydraulic jacks to lift support beams and insert spacers at the bottom to keep the above structure level while the ground is settling underneath. Probably not a practical solution with a slap of concrete on top.

I flew through that airport 15 years ago, and I recall it looking quite nice, but I don't remember too much as it was after a 13 hours flight and not many brain cells are firing with that much time in a tube.

Kansai was designed with built in jacks. It was obvious early on that the engineers had supplied the estimates regarding island settling their superiors required to get the project going.
One problem none of the houses have here in 50 years is settling. Of course, none of them are built on top of wetlands like the pad warehouse and pad itself, but the land here seems a lot more stable than in some places.
I wouldn't take the "2 years of dirt work" comment as gospel. They plan to launch in 2 years, and there will be a bit of construction before that.

Lar · « **Reply #1830 on:** 04/16/2016 05:12 pm »

Quote from: sewebster on 04/15/2016 09:05 pm

Quote from: Kabloona on 04/15/2016 08:52 pm
Two years of watching dirt get moved around...this is gonna be fun...

Perhaps we should look into setting up a webcam...

Maybe we need to develop a modular, self contained, secured, weatherproof webcam package that we can deploy wherever we need to...

And make it reusable...

We could put the NSF logo on it along with a tagline "Smile, space geeks are watching you" and sell advert space to other outfits...

Johnnyhinbos · « **Reply #1831 on:** 04/16/2016 06:01 pm »

And if it's refuelable and has deployable landing legs and we can fly it from site to site, then I guarantee some other forum will start obsessively watching it with their own web camera, which will then gain the attention of another forum, which will then...

Never mind...

muazcatalyst · « **Reply #1832 on:** 04/16/2016 06:09 pm »

Quote from: Johnnyhinbos on 04/16/2016 06:01 pm

And if it's refuelable and has deployable landing legs and we can fly it from site to site, then I guarantee some other forum will start obsessively watching it with their own web camera, which will then gain the attention of another forum, which will then...

Never mind...

But will the legs be retractable? ; )

Johnnyhinbos · « **Reply #1833 on:** 04/16/2016 06:24 pm »

Quote from: muazcatalyst on 04/16/2016 06:09 pm

Quote from: Johnnyhinbos on 04/16/2016 06:01 pm
And if it's refuelable and has deployable landing legs and we can fly it from site to site, then I guarantee some other forum will start obsessively watching it with their own web camera, which will then gain the attention of another forum, which will then...

Never mind...

But will the legs be retractable? ; )

Only with the assistance of a team of tiny NASASpaceFlighters...

topo334 · « **Reply #1834 on:** 04/16/2016 06:45 pm »

do you mean it's webcams all the way down?

Lar · « **Reply #1835 on:** 04/16/2016 06:47 pm »

Urk, I started a monster.

Dave G · « **Reply #1836 on:** 04/16/2016 08:08 pm »

Maybe Nomadd knows a spot where we can mount a webcam

bocachicagal · « **Reply #1837 on:** 04/16/2016 09:16 pm »

Just buy a vacant lot near the launch site! Put up a tower to mount the webcam to

docmordrid · « **Reply #1838 on:** 04/16/2016 10:46 pm »

Put up a TV antenna tower, with options

russianhalo117 · « **Reply #1839 on:** 04/16/2016 10:56 pm »

Quote from: docmordrid on 04/16/2016 10:46 pm

Put up a TV antenna tower, with options

We can establish the North American NSF Broadcast and L2 Command Centre with annexes at launch sites where we can get access. NSF International HQ is in the UK of course. Then we can get NEC guys merged in for Japan launch coverage and we'll be golden. I don't know who else we have here that can cover the other world launch sites.