Author Topic: Nuclear Powered  (Read 8042 times)

Offline BWP

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Nuclear Powered
« on: 08/22/2007 08:14 PM »
Nasa should make Orion to have a nuclear reactor.  But much safer, how about it's off during liftoff and seperation, and still uses Orion's rocket motor's.

Orion's crew will only turn on the reactor at a safe distance away from earth.

They only use it in space landing on mar's or the moon they use there regular rocket engine.

Will that ever happen nuclear powered spacecraft with much safer.  SO if a disaster happen's at the pad nothing bad will happen to the reactor.  I don't think it'll ever happen do u?

Offline meiza

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Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #1 on: 08/22/2007 08:15 PM »
Why? For what?

Offline BWP

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Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #2 on: 08/22/2007 08:18 PM »
Quote
meiza - 22/8/2007  3:15 PM

Why? For what?

Nuclear powered space craft do u think it will happen or no.  Nuclear power would make the space craft go faster than conventional engine's

Offline meiza

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Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #3 on: 08/22/2007 08:26 PM »
Not useful in anything CEV sized, you need a nuclear powered STAGE which has lots of fuel.
But I don't think nuclear thermal will be done, it's not good enough for the trouble, and nuclear electric then, well, it's a long way to efficient and light space reactors. It might turn out simpler to go solar electric.

You can search the advanced projects forum on the thing.

Offline kraisee

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Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #4 on: 08/22/2007 08:29 PM »
The technical hurdle is that reliable enough nuclear propulsion technology is going to be at least 10 years away from the day they start funding the development - and right now project Prometheus has no money.

I suspect that nuclear will be the way to go for the Mars program, but NASA's plans aren't expecting that until about 2030 at the very earliest, so they don't feel they need to start developing nuclear *anything* for another dozen years or more.

Ross.
"The meek shall inherit the Earth -- the rest of us will go to the stars"
-Robert A. Heinlein

Offline meiza

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Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #5 on: 08/22/2007 08:30 PM »
Project Prometheus has been handled here and very much deemed unoptimal, with the low temperature reactor the radiators are huge.

Offline BWP

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Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #6 on: 08/22/2007 08:41 PM »
Quote
kraisee - 22/8/2007  3:29 PM

The technical hurdle is that reliable enough nuclear propulsion technology is going to be at least 10 years away from the day they start funding the development - and right now project Prometheus has no money.

I suspect that nuclear will be the way to go for the Mars program, but NASA's plans aren't expecting that until about 2030 at the very earliest, so they don't feel they need to start developing nuclear *anything* for another dozen years or more.

Ross.

Conventional engines will get replaced someday, maybe it will be nuclear in some form fussion or maybe even nuclear electric, or safer form.

Nasa already uses ION powered engine's.  They could go with nuclear electric or even have Orion to have ION engine's instead of conventional.

Maybe nasa already is studying some other advanced engine.  Conventional engine's will get retired.

For mar's nasa need's nuclear to go there and I agree with u on that

Offline lambda0

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Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #7 on: 08/23/2007 03:28 PM »

For electric propulsion, the nuclear reactor SAFE-400 seems to be available, it has already been tested with a ion propulsion, in lab. This reactor produces 100 kW of electric power. Not enough for manned flight, but it could be used for big deep space probes.

However, for manned flights to Mars, I think, as meiza, that there may be a credible solar-electric solution, without all the problems associated to nuclear energy.
The martian project of Energya is based on solar-electric propulsion, and I think that this project can be improved to reduce the trip time, without nuclear energy.







Offline MTKeshe

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Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #8 on: 08/24/2007 08:07 AM »
Low radioactive high power reactors are under test, which radiation can be contained safely for space flight.

These use and are very much as safe as radioactive materials we use for human radiation in hospitals.

These reactors for space testing and use should be in operation within short time before (2009).

 The future of deep space travel, high power energy systems, for long duration with large cargo and multiple crew and passengers is within our grasp and will be supported with safe nuclear reactors.

Offline meiza

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Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #9 on: 08/24/2007 02:23 PM »
lambda0, gotta research that SAFE-400, but I think it's a low temp design requiring huge radiators.

Offline kfsorensen

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Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #10 on: 08/24/2007 03:07 PM »
Quote
lambda0 - 23/8/2007  10:28 AM

For electric propulsion, the nuclear reactor SAFE-400 seems to be available, it has already been tested with a ion propulsion, in lab. This reactor produces 100 kW of electric power.

No, it was tested with electrical heaters simulating fuel elements and a low-efficiency Stirling engine serving as the power conversion.  It is no where nearly ready for flight.

Offline CuddlyRocket

Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #11 on: 08/26/2007 09:21 AM »
If it's possible to go non-nuclear, NASA will go non-nuclear. The PR would be a disaster otherwise, and NASA needs all the friends it can get. (Though other countries might have different attitudes.)

Nuclear will come when we try to do something for which it is the only solution, or it produces vast cost savings. Neither of which are true for any near-time plans.

Offline A_M_Swallow

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RE: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #12 on: 08/26/2007 12:27 PM »
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halkey - 26/8/2007  1:01 PM
It's good Ad Astra has a branch in Central America, hopefully it's immune to ITAR type export regulations.
NATO export rules are NATO wide.

Offline halkey

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RE: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #13 on: 08/26/2007 12:54 PM »
Quote
A_M_Swallow - 26/8/2007  7:27 AM

Quote
halkey - 26/8/2007  1:01 PM
It's good Ad Astra has a branch in Central America, hopefully it's immune to ITAR type export regulations.
NATO export rules are NATO wide.

Figures. :)

Ad Astra Rocket, a private developer of the nuclear VASMIR engine, has just signed it's first commercial contract with a company in the Britain Isles. NASA might not be needed to develop or use nuclear propulsion/power in space. It's good Ad Astra has a branch in Central America, hopefully it's immune to ITAR type export regulations.

http://www.adastrarocket.com/AdAstraPressRelease082107.pdf

Note: This message was originally deleted and then reposted.


Offline A_M_Swallow

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RE: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #14 on: 08/26/2007 01:04 PM »
Quote
halkey - 26/8/2007  1:54 PM

Ad Astra Rocket, a private developer of the nuclear VASMIR engine, has just signed it's first commercial contract with a company in the Britain Isles. NASA might not be needed to develop or use nuclear propulsion/power in space. It's good Ad Astra has a branch in Central America, hopefully it's immune to ITAR type export regulations.

http://www.adastrarocket.com/AdAstraPressRelease082107.pdf

Note: This message was originally deleted and then reposted.

Few honest British companies are set up in the Isle of Man, its tax haven reputation ensures you get extra tax audits.  This company appears to be a subsidiary of Excalibur Almaz which has its offices in Huston and Moscow.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excalibur_Almaz

"private spaceflight company which plans to orbit manned spacecraft, by using modernized TKS space capsules and Almaz space stations, derived from the formerly secret Soviet space program. Missions will support orbital space tourism, and provide test beds for experiments in a microgravity environment.
"

"Company founders include: CEO and space law expert Art Dula, CFO and space commercialization veteran Buckner Hightower, and Sales & Marketing Vice President Chris Stott. Stott is also CEO of ManSat and on the board of the International Space University. The company's COO is U.S. Air Force General (ret.) Dirk Jameson, who once commanded the Air Force's Vandenberg missile launching base. Chief of spacecraft operations is Leroy Chiao, formerly a NASA astronaut and Commander of the International Space Station.
"

Offline meiza

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Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #15 on: 08/26/2007 06:45 PM »
Quote
CuddlyRocket - 26/8/2007  10:21 AM

If it's possible to go non-nuclear, NASA will go non-nuclear. The PR would be a disaster otherwise, and NASA needs all the friends it can get. (Though other countries might have different attitudes.)

Nuclear will come when we try to do something for which it is the only solution, or it produces vast cost savings. Neither of which are true for any near-time plans.

Nuclear can also be a technically worse solution. It's just nonsensical conspiracy mongering saying how the wonderful nukes would solve all the spaceflight problems but the evil hippies are preventing their use.

This is a very very general strand in threads handling anything nuclear in space, and I'm sick of it.

Offline clongton

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Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #16 on: 08/26/2007 06:55 PM »
Quote
meiza - 26/8/2007  2:45 PM

Quote
CuddlyRocket - 26/8/2007  10:21 AM

If it's possible to go non-nuclear, NASA will go non-nuclear. The PR would be a disaster otherwise, and NASA needs all the friends it can get. (Though other countries might have different attitudes.)

Nuclear will come when we try to do something for which it is the only solution, or it produces vast cost savings. Neither of which are true for any near-time plans.

Nuclear can also be a technically worse solution. It's just nonsensical conspiracy mongering saying how the wonderful nukes would solve all the spaceflight problems but the evil hippies are preventing their use.

This is a very very general strand in threads handling anything nuclear in space, and I'm sick of it.

nonsensical conspiracy mongering
evil hippies are preventing their use

hmmm
Those are really generalized statements that don't really contribute much to the conversation. It would be helpful if you could be "reasonably" specific so we could actually address the concerns and their implications.

I, for one, am an advocate for nuclear power in space, but will be the first to admit right up front that there is a long way to go before that is a reasonable alternative.
Chuck - DIRECT co-founder
I started my career on the Saturn-V F-1A engine

Offline meiza

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Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #17 on: 08/26/2007 07:24 PM »
Could you be a bit more specific too? What problems would what kind of nuclear reactors solve? What are the mass to power ratios?  And realistic time tables in the development?

I don't support nukes in space "just because". If they are more useful than other alternatives and safe they should be used, if not, then they should not be used.

Offline MTKeshe

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Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #18 on: 08/26/2007 08:02 PM »
The new type of nuclear reactors for space are not and will not be on the bases of PWR or conventional reactors which has been tested up to now by NASA or other agencies.

It has to understood that the new space technology nuclear reactors do not operate under power ratio and all other parameters which we are used to up now.

In simple word the new space reactors will operate under low radioactive base source and the energy they produce is not and will not be for propulsion.

The space reactors under development, use the nuclear material for creation of magnetic fields and load bearing rotors for perpetual motion, very much like how our planet creates its magnetic field and it rotation .

With these new reactors load ratio is not so important as we notice with our planet that small ratio centre to the volume of the planet , keepís  such large mass in motion for several billions of years on the move in its solar system.

The date of the first trial most probably will be known before the end of this year, due to simplicity of the system and its opration, this date will not be any further than the end of 2008 for the first space tested unit.

Offline MTKeshe

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Re: Nuclear Powered
« Reply #19 on: 08/26/2007 08:02 PM »
The new type of nuclear reactors for space are not and will not be on the bases of PWR or conventional reactors which has been tested up to now by NASA or other agencies.

It has to understood that the new space technology nuclear reactors do not operate under power ratio and all other parameters which we are used to up now.

In simple word the new space reactors will operate under low radioactive base source and the energy they produce is not and will not be for propulsion.

The space reactors under development, use the nuclear material for creation of magnetic fields and load bearing rotors for perpetual motion, very much like how our planet creates its magnetic field and it's rotation .

With these new reactors load ratio is not so important as we notice with our planet that small ratio centre to the volume of the planet , keepís  such large mass in motion for several billions of years on the move in its solar system.

The date of the first trial most probably will be known before the end of this year, but it will not be any further than the end of 2008 for the first space tested unit.

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