Author Topic: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition  (Read 10688 times)

Offline Blackstar

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Re: M5 Competition
« Reply #20 on: 02/04/2017 12:43 PM »
I think this thread should be renamed for clarity. It should be something like "ESA's M5 Space Science Mission Competition" or something. "M5" alone is pretty obscure.

Offline Alpha_Centauri

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Re: M5 Competition
« Reply #21 on: 02/04/2017 01:31 PM »
I have added a new website and doc. for MarcoPolo to my list, they are targeting D-type 1993 HA. Here's a study that was done on it; https://arxiv.org/abs/1610.00896

Offline as58

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Re: M5 Competition
« Reply #22 on: 02/04/2017 02:29 PM »
I think this thread should be renamed for clarity. It should be something like "ESA's M5 Space Science Mission Competition" or something. "M5" alone is pretty obscure.

This isn't about BMWs?

Some slightly more serious content: Call documents etc. are available at https://www.cosmos.esa.int/web/call-for-m5-missions
« Last Edit: 02/04/2017 02:32 PM by as58 »

Offline Blackstar

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Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #23 on: 02/04/2017 07:11 PM »
This isn't about BMWs?

I'm such a Trekkie that the only thing that comes to mind is the M5 computer.

Offline zubenelgenubi

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Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #24 on: 02/04/2017 09:40 PM »
This isn't about BMWs?

I'm such a Trekkie that the only thing that comes to mind is the M5 computer.
Thanks for the thread name clarification.  I agree with Blackstar.

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« Last Edit: 02/04/2017 09:45 PM by zubenelgenubi »
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Offline Blackstar

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Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #25 on: 02/05/2017 03:31 AM »
(For pursuit on another thread here, if any--Is the difference between Trekkie and Trekker still important (to the fan community)?  Or is the distinction passť?)

Geeks rule the culture now, so it doesn't matter.

Offline Alpha_Centauri

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Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #26 on: 02/05/2017 09:29 PM »
Just spotted this, looks like the technical screening (basically "will it blow the budget?") has happened;

https://twitter.com/StephenSerjeant/status/827189117763084288
Quote
Rumoured to have survived @esa M5 cut: AKON ALFVEN CASTALIA E-ASTROGAM ESCAPE GALILEO-GALILEI HEAVY-METAL HERA SELMA SPICA THEIA THESEUS

https://twitter.com/StephenSerjeant/status/827189324856905728
Quote
Also rumoured to have survived @esa M5 cut are a phobos/deimos mission and a Jupiter mission but not sure I have the names right.

Not got anything on the Phobos mission but I assume it is a reboot of Phodex which was proposed for M4, vaguley remember seeing mention of them proposing; http://elib.dlr.de/101388/1/Abstract_Wickhusen_K.pdf (pdf)


P.S.  I wish ESA would formally announce this stuff.
« Last Edit: 02/05/2017 10:32 PM by Alpha_Centauri »

Offline as58

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Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #27 on: 02/05/2017 10:29 PM »
Maybe the reasoning for not revealing unsuccessful proposals is the same as in Discovery: to reduce the possibility of someone else scooping the idea. ESA usually doesn't do a very good job keeping the list secret, though, and in any case most proposers are open about their plans to submit.

I had heard rumours that the technical cut was 'imminent'. A bit surprised about CORE (if it's the CMB mission, not the comet stuff) not making it.

Offline Alpha_Centauri

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Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #28 on: 02/05/2017 10:59 PM »
Yeah wasn't asking for technical details, just any kind of official statement on what has passed selection. They posted which letters of intent had been received for S1; http://sci.esa.int/cosmic-vision/50265-received-letters-of-intent/. As you say it is a bit silly since anyone who is interested will find out from rumour anyway, not least because plenty of the missions present their concepts at conferences.

Also a bit surprised by EnVision.  As for sample return/MarcoPolo it looks like ESA is essentially saying it needs to be an L-class, or at least an optional program like the ESA/Roscosmos Phobos sample return concept.
« Last Edit: 02/05/2017 11:05 PM by Alpha_Centauri »

Offline as58

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Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #29 on: 02/06/2017 11:39 AM »
Also a bit surprised by EnVision.  As for sample return/MarcoPolo it looks like ESA is essentially saying it needs to be an L-class, or at least an optional program like the ESA/Roscosmos Phobos sample return concept.

I think some version of MarcoPolo has been a candidate in all five M-class calls. So yeah, it may be time to try another approach...

Offline ThomEM

Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #30 on: 03/28/2017 02:41 PM »
Yeah wasn't asking for technical details, just any kind of official statement on what has passed selection. They posted which letters of intent had been received for S1; http://sci.esa.int/cosmic-vision/50265-received-letters-of-intent/.

Those are old from 2012.

Offline Alpha_Centauri

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Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #31 on: 03/28/2017 04:16 PM »
And?  Yes the S1 selection was a few years ago now, that does not stop them doing something similar with the M-class selections.

Offline as58

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Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #32 on: 03/28/2017 05:22 PM »
If I remember correctly, the list of proposals/LoIs used to be public for the first calls of CV (at least L1 and M1/M2 I think). Some of the proposed missions were ambitious, to put it mildly.

I've also seen lists of proposed missions for later calls (M4 for example), but it's never been clear to me if they were really supposed to be public...

edit: Related to M5: the proposal for EnVision, which apparently didn't make it through the pre-selection, appeared on arxiv in the latest posting. https://arxiv.org/abs/1703.09010
« Last Edit: 03/28/2017 05:24 PM by as58 »

Offline redliox

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Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #33 on: 03/28/2017 06:41 PM »
edit: Related to M5: the proposal for EnVision, which apparently didn't make it through the pre-selection, appeared on arxiv in the latest posting. https://arxiv.org/abs/1703.09010

I remember seeing that bit of news about it.  Does this mean a Venus mission is among the candidates?
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Offline as58

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Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #34 on: 04/25/2017 06:27 PM »
Oh dear. I just noticed this on twitter (https://twitter.com/LeighFletcher/status/856539079722377216)

Quote
But some painful ESA suggestions of sacrifices to meet budgetary reality in the M class prog. M4&M5 selections pushed into future #EGU17

edit: The presentation from EGU meeting can be seen at (starting around 2:06:00). If I understood correctly, they want get M3 (Plato) formally accepted in June and then continue with M4 selection, which should be done in the autumn. Only after that they're going to proceed with M5, which probably means that the short list won't be selected until next year.

Another thing I learned was that Solar Orbiter launch is now expected in February 2019 (delayed from October 2018).
« Last Edit: 04/25/2017 09:44 PM by as58 »

Offline Alpha_Centauri

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Offline Alpha_Centauri

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Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #36 on: 12/24/2017 02:43 PM »
A little late in updating this as it slipped my mind but I have the full list of 13 semi-finalists in the M5 competition. Turns out the previous rumours were slightly wrong, ENVISION did in fact make it and no Jupiter mission got through;

HEAVY METAL: Exploring a magnetized metallic asteroid
HERA:  Saturn Entry Probe Mission
JANUS. Exploring the asymmetric magnetosphere
DEPHINE: Deimos and Phobos Interior Explorer
SELMA: Surface, Environment and Lunar Magnetic Anomalies
ENVISION: Understanding why our most Earth neighbor is so different
e-ASTROGAM: At the hearth of the extreme Universe
ESCAPE: European SpaceCraft for the study of Atmospheric Particle Escape
GALILEO Galilei (GG): a mission to test the founding pillar of General Relativity to 10-17
CASTALIA: A mission to a Main Belt Comet
THESEUS:  Transient High Energy Sky and Early Universe Surveyor
SPICA: Unveiling the obscured Universe
ALFVEN: A mission to study particle acceleration in strongly magnetized plasmas

Downselect to 3 finalists is I understand now set for February 2018 after a 6-month delay due to the funding issues at the last ministerial conference. It was meant to be December but there were complications with the M4 final selection which was due in November that has also caused delay to M5, so now we have a date I would expect the M4 result any time now.
« Last Edit: 12/24/2017 09:26 PM by Alpha_Centauri »

Offline vjkane

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Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #37 on: 12/24/2017 03:08 PM »
A little late in updating this as it slipped my mind but I have the full list of 13 semi-finalists in the M5 competition. Turns out the previous rumours were slightly wrong, ENVISION did in fact make it and no Jupiter mission got through;

HEAVY METAL: Exploring a magnetized metallic asteroid
HERA:  Saturn Entry Probe Mission
JANUS. Exploring the asymmetric magnetosphere
DEPHINE: Deimos and Phobos Interior Explorer
SELMA: Surface, Environment and Lunar Magnetic Anomalies
ENVISION: Understanding why our most Earth neighbor is so different
e-ASTROGAM: At the hearth of the extreme Universe
ESCAPE: European SpaceCraft for the study of Atmospheric Particle Escape
GALILEO Galilei (GG): a mission to test the founding pillar of General Relativity to 10-17
CASTALIA: A mission to a Main Belt Comet
THESEUS:  Transient High Energy Sky and Early Universe Surveyor
SPICA: Unveiling the obscured Universe
ALFVEN: A mission to study particle acceleration in strongly magnetized plasmas

Downselect to 3 finalists is I understand in February 2018 after a 6-month delay due to the funding issues at the last ministerial conference. There were complications with the M4 final selection which was due in November that has also caused delay, so I would expect that result any time now.
Thank you.  Been wondering when something would happen with this call.  Surprising number of solar system missions (which tend to be more complex than astronomy or astrophysics missions).  I think it would be hard for Heavy Metal or Dephine to be selected given the Psyche and MMX missions.  The proposed M5 missions would do additional science compared to the approved missions, but I doubt it would be enough more to make either selectable.

Offline vjkane

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Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #38 on: 12/24/2017 08:14 PM »
A little late in updating this as it slipped my mind but I have the full list of 13 semi-finalists in the M5 competition. Turns out the previous rumours were slightly wrong, ENVISION did in fact make it and no Jupiter mission got through
Alpha_Centauri, can you tell me where this is posted?

Offline redliox

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Re: ESA M5 Science Mission Competition
« Reply #39 on: 12/24/2017 09:04 PM »
A little late in updating this as it slipped my mind but I have the full list of 13 semi-finalists in the M5 competition. Turns out the previous rumours were slightly wrong, ENVISION did in fact make it and no Jupiter mission got through
Alpha_Centauri, can you tell me where this is posted?

I'm curious too.

Looks like a promising mixup of missions.  Saturn and Deimos/Phobos appear to have made the list amid asteroid, comet, and solar/physics probes.  I definitely want to hear more about them, with of course emphasis on the first 2 I mentioned (HERA and DEPHINE respectively).
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Tags: Phobos Deimos