Author Topic: Single Person Spacecraft  (Read 9964 times)

Offline Blackstar

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Single Person Spacecraft
« on: 06/10/2016 09:12 PM »
http://www.leonarddavid.com/inside-looks-at-single-person-spacecraft/

http://genesisesi.com/sps.html

The concept of a Single Person Spacecraft has been around for a long time. It shows up in the Disney short films in the 1950s and the Collier's magazine series. But this particular design has been around awhile too. I think I first saw it in the late 1990s or early 2000s. Does anybody know anything more about it? Anybody have any papers on it, or other artwork?

Online Dalhousie

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #1 on: 06/10/2016 11:05 PM »
Wasn't this considered as an alternative to the Shuttle arm, but lost out?
"There is nobody who is a bigger fan of sending robots to Mars than me... But I believe firmly that the best, the most comprehensive, the most successful exploration will be done by humans" Steve Squyres

Offline Blackstar

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #2 on: 06/10/2016 11:35 PM »
Wasn't this considered as an alternative to the Shuttle arm, but lost out?

I don't think so. This specific design dates from the 1990s.

Offline Glom

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #3 on: 06/10/2016 11:57 PM »
Max payload 50kg? So this is limited to size zero models?

Offline john smith 19

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #4 on: 06/11/2016 12:40 AM »
http://www.leonarddavid.com/inside-looks-at-single-person-spacecraft/

http://genesisesi.com/sps.html

The concept of a Single Person Spacecraft has been around for a long time. It shows up in the Disney short films in the 1950s and the Collier's magazine series. But this particular design has been around awhile too. I think I first saw it in the late 1990s or early 2000s. Does anybody know anything more about it? Anybody have any papers on it, or other artwork?
I'm dimly recalling an old Kenneth Gatland book called "Astronautics in the Sixties" that talked about something called SLOMAR, Space Logistics Maintenance And Rescue.

This looks like an update of that concept, although it's hard to say as the original one was covered in very broad outline.
"Solids are a branch of fireworks, not rocketry. :-) :-) ", Henry Spencer 1/28/11  Averse to bold? You must be in marketing."It's all in the sequencing" K. Mattingly.  STS-Keeping most of the stakeholders happy most of the time.

Offline Coastal Ron

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #5 on: 06/11/2016 02:57 AM »
There is a lot to like with the concept, although I would think the interior volume could be reduced due to the advancement of modern displays, smaller computing platforms (and more powerful), and newer control interfaces.  The only room you need I would think would be enough to do stretching during long shifts, and enough room to use the onboard toilet.

I would also advocate that there should be more arms, since being able to anchor in place while doing detailed work would be beneficial, and that requires more than one arm.  So maybe three anchoring arms arrayed on the back (three points of anchor for stability), and three arms in front for doing the main work?

One other thought is that due to the advances in video camera technology there is less of a requirement for windows, or in this concept the bubble.  I know it looks cool, but from a practical standpoint it may be less expensive and safer to have just a few small windows or portals - just as a backup in case all the sensors die (i.e. worst case situation).
If we don't continuously lower the cost to access space, how are we ever going to afford to expand humanity out into space?

Offline RonM

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #6 on: 06/11/2016 03:09 AM »
While it's an interesting concept, it's only useful if you really need an astronaut's eyes on scene. Teleoperating a robot from the safety of the ship would work just as well, especially with today's high resolution cameras.

Offline A_M_Swallow

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #7 on: 06/11/2016 03:13 AM »
By replacing the rocket engines with wheels and strengthen the arms the spacecraft becomes a single person work pod suitable for outdoor use on the Moon and Mars.

A suitport, as the suit, would permit the vehicle to connect to rovers, habitats and spacestations.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suitport

Offline Blackstar

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #8 on: 06/11/2016 12:16 PM »
There is a lot to like with the concept, although I would think the interior volume could be reduced due to the advancement of modern displays,

The photos above date from a few months ago. Do you know of advances in modern displays since March?

Offline gosnold

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #9 on: 06/11/2016 12:55 PM »
There is a lot to like with the concept, although I would think the interior volume could be reduced due to the advancement of modern displays,

The photos above date from a few months ago. Do you know of advances in modern displays since March?

Wide field of view, low-latency HMDs are now an affordable industrial product:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oculus_Rift#Consumer_version


Offline Archibald

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #10 on: 06/11/2016 06:14 PM »
Looks like R2D2 got a one-off affair with a trash can. Bad, naughty robot !
« Last Edit: 06/11/2016 06:15 PM by Archibald »

Offline Coastal Ron

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #11 on: 06/11/2016 06:19 PM »
There is a lot to like with the concept, although I would think the interior volume could be reduced due to the advancement of modern displays,

The photos above date from a few months ago. Do you know of advances in modern displays since March?

Ah, missed that.  But VR, HUD, etc. would reduce the complexity of the work environment.  Just a thought...
If we don't continuously lower the cost to access space, how are we ever going to afford to expand humanity out into space?

Offline Donosauro

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #12 on: 06/12/2016 02:15 AM »
There are a lot of somewhat similar designs, including SLOMAR, discussed in:
http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/spacesuits.php

Search the page for "Drell" to get to the start of where these are discussed.

Offline jongoff

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #13 on: 06/12/2016 04:32 AM »
Blackstar,

They had a FISO telecon presentation about their work a while back. I can't remember for sure, but it was a contractor at MSFC named Brand Griffin (I think) who was working on this...

<Digs through email>

Yeah, Brand Griffin of Grey Research at MSFC. The concept is called flexcraft, and the FISO telecon presentation woudl've been in August of 2012.

http://spirit.as.utexas.edu/%7Efiso/telecon10-12/Griffin_8-15-12/Griffin_8-15-12.pdf

He's also done a bit of work with deep space habitat concepts and such.

Hope that helps,

~Jon

PS I could also make an introduction if you'd like--we've exchanged a few emails in the past.
« Last Edit: 06/12/2016 04:34 AM by jongoff »

Offline MickQ

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #14 on: 06/12/2016 11:33 AM »
I seem to remember a thread on NSF a while ago about "Flexcraft".  Can't remember how long ago though.

Offline Donosauro

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #15 on: 06/12/2016 01:41 PM »
Blackstar,

They had a FISO telecon presentation about their work a while back. I can't remember for sure, but it was a contractor at MSFC named Brand Griffin (I think) who was working on this...

<Digs through email>

Yeah, Brand Griffin of Grey Research at MSFC. The concept is called flexcraft, and the FISO telecon presentation woudl've been in August of 2012.

http://spirit.as.utexas.edu/%7Efiso/telecon10-12/Griffin_8-15-12/Griffin_8-15-12.pdf

He's also done a bit of work with deep space habitat concepts and such.

Hope that helps,

~Jon

PS I could also make an introduction if you'd like--we've exchanged a few emails in the past.

The page at http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/spacesuits.php has an image of FlexCraft, and gives these figures: 21 m/s of delta-v; gross mass of 452 kg; endurance of 8 hrs; and a pressurized volume of 0.62 cubic meters (the volume is actually given as square meters....). There is a link to a paper, "Low Cost Space Demonstration for a Single-Person Spacecraft", by Brand N. Griffin and Charles Dischinger: http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/20120016580.pdf.
« Last Edit: 06/12/2016 01:43 PM by Donosauro »

Offline Ludus

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #16 on: 06/13/2016 01:14 AM »
But when you say "Open the pod bay doors HAL,..." Maybe ya don't get let back in.

Offline Blackstar

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #17 on: 06/13/2016 01:48 PM »
There are a lot of somewhat similar designs, including SLOMAR, discussed in:
http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/spacesuits.php

Search the page for "Drell" to get to the start of where these are discussed.

Wow. Thanks for that. It is a weird site in terms of layout, but a lot of stuff there. And it provides info on this design. There is also a link to this:

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/20120016580.pdf

I'll post more later.

Offline Blackstar

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #18 on: 06/13/2016 01:54 PM »
Blackstar,

They had a FISO telecon presentation about their work a while back. I can't remember for sure, but it was a contractor at MSFC named Brand Griffin (I think) who was working on this...

<Digs through email>

Yeah, Brand Griffin of Grey Research at MSFC. The concept is called flexcraft, and the FISO telecon presentation woudl've been in August of 2012.

http://spirit.as.utexas.edu/%7Efiso/telecon10-12/Griffin_8-15-12/Griffin_8-15-12.pdf

He's also done a bit of work with deep space habitat concepts and such.

Hope that helps,

~Jon

PS I could also make an introduction if you'd like--we've exchanged a few emails in the past.

Thanks. Yes, there is this paper by him:

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/20120016580.pdf

I've only dipped my toe into this, and will look more later. But I get a sense of the chronology for this specific design:

-created in the late 1990s or early 2000s
-a study done by Brand Griffin ca 2012
-a student design study late 2015 (what started this thread)

The student design study seems to have essentially been a contest where a company said "Here is a spacecraft design, now come up with an interior design for it." That company appears to have a full scale mockup. They're not too far from where I live, so I might contact them.

Thanks for the offer of an introduction, but not necessary. This is idle curiosity for me at this point. Not work-related, and not even one of my hobby research interests. It's just that I saw the images from the recent competition and knew that the design has been around for at least a decade or more and I have artwork of it somewhere. So I'm curious as to its genesis and evolution.

A few years ago while working on our 3D printing in space report I stumbled upon the Grumman Beam Builder and was rather surprised to learn how much work had been done on it. I managed to get some interesting supporting material that I still haven't published. These studies of space construction techniques and equipment are one of my (many) interests.

Offline Blackstar

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Re: Single Person Spacecraft
« Reply #19 on: 06/13/2016 01:56 PM »
In order:

-one of the personal transport ships from the 1950s Disney space short films
-an illustration of the vehicle that was conceived in the late 1990s or early 2000s
-an image from the 2012 study paper

And I know that I have seen artwork of this from the early 2000s or so, not the CGI image above.

So the concept has been around for many decades. This specific design has been around for over a decade.

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