Author Topic: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION  (Read 219591 times)

Online mn

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #200 on: 04/26/2017 04:17 PM »
NROL-76 heading to the 39A HIF tonight. Roadblocks in force.

Oh man for a second there I thought we moved to Kourou  ;)

Offline Bubbinski

Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #201 on: 04/26/2017 07:31 PM »
And here we have NOTMAR Launch Hazard Areas in Map for Mission1363 with NROL-76 payload.
https://goo.gl/umnY2Q

https://www.navcen.uscg.gov/pdf/lnms/lnm07172017.pdf

Looks like NROL-76 is launching at a high inclination. 57 degrees?
I'll even excitedly look forward to "flags and footprints" and suborbital missions. Just fly...somewhere.

Offline Mike_1179

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #202 on: 04/26/2017 08:12 PM »
And here we have NOTMAR Launch Hazard Areas in Map for Mission1363 with NROL-76 payload.
https://goo.gl/umnY2Q

https://www.navcen.uscg.gov/pdf/lnms/lnm07172017.pdf

Looks like NROL-76 is launching at a high inclination. 57 degrees?

A heading from CCAFS (28.39N 80.61W) to the end-point of that NOTAM (31.26N 77.13W) is about 47 degrees.

A Molniya Orbit has an inclination of 63.4 degrees


Offline Kabloona

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #203 on: 04/26/2017 10:38 PM »
And here we have NOTMAR Launch Hazard Areas in Map for Mission1363 with NROL-76 payload.
https://goo.gl/umnY2Q

https://www.navcen.uscg.gov/pdf/lnms/lnm07172017.pdf

Looks like NROL-76 is launching at a high inclination. 57 degrees?

Reposting Ted Molczan's comments, in which he suggests Molniya is the most likely target orbit:

http://www.satobs.org/seesat/Apr-2017/0155.html

Offline kevin-rf

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #204 on: 04/27/2017 02:32 AM »
Is it me, or does the new second stage NOTAM point to is spending several hours in orbit before coming down?  As in if it came down on the first orbit from LEO it would be somewhere east of Australia?

So it is kicking up to a higher orbit.... Hmm what would that be?
« Last Edit: 04/27/2017 02:34 AM by kevin-rf »
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Offline Lars-J

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #205 on: 04/27/2017 07:05 AM »
Is it me, or does the new second stage NOTAM point to is spending several hours in orbit before coming down?  As in if it came down on the first orbit from LEO it would be somewhere east of Australia?

So it is kicking up to a higher orbit.... Hmm what would that be?

If it is indeed a molnyia orbit, that would explain it. The second stage is presumably being deorbited on the first or second perigee after deployment.

Online William Graham

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #206 on: 04/27/2017 07:26 AM »
Is it me, or does the new second stage NOTAM point to is spending several hours in orbit before coming down?  As in if it came down on the first orbit from LEO it would be somewhere east of Australia?

So it is kicking up to a higher orbit.... Hmm what would that be?

If it is indeed a molnyia orbit, that would explain it. The second stage is presumably being deorbited on the first or second perigee after deployment.

Unless I'm missing something, according to the PDF posted in the update thread both hazard areas are restricted from 10:55 to 13:45 UTC. If the launch window closes at 13:00, that wouldn't give enough time for a Molniya mission launching at the end of the window to get to apogee, deorbit and fall into the hazard area. To deorbit within that time you'd be looking at single burn to LEO, but I'm struggling to see a profile that puts it in that drop zone at that MET.

Offline Ben the Space Brit

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #207 on: 04/27/2017 08:36 AM »
Could the payload include a 'third stage' for later apogee adjustments? I admit that the case for such a configuration is hard to justify (why do it with a third stage when the F9US could do it?) but it is a possibility if NRO want to hide the target orbit from hobbyists and orbital mechanics experts from intelligence agencies.
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Offline douglas100

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #208 on: 04/27/2017 08:40 AM »
If the second stage puts the satellite in an orbit with a lower apogee than a Molniya then it might be possible for it to re-enter within the time frame posted. In that case the satellite would use its own propulsion to raise the apogee to the required 12 hour orbit. And since the satellite is rumored to be based on a commercial Boeing comsat bus, it would certainly have plenty of delta V available. All this assumes it is a Molniya style launch, of course.

But I agree, the timing seems tight if the launch is delayed till the end of the window.

EDIT @ Ben
Yes, the "third stage" would be the satellite itself. Doubt that the launch profile is to hide the satellite itself. If the payload is a comsat, it doesn't matter if its orbit is known or not. Knowing the orbit doesn't tell you what data the satellite is relaying.
« Last Edit: 04/27/2017 08:49 AM by douglas100 »
Douglas Clark

Offline BabaORileyUSA

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #209 on: 04/27/2017 01:16 PM »
And here we have NOTMAR Launch Hazard Areas in Map for Mission1363 with NROL-76 payload.
https://goo.gl/umnY2Q

https://www.navcen.uscg.gov/pdf/lnms/lnm07172017.pdf

Looks like NROL-76 is launching at a high inclination. 57 degrees?

A heading from CCAFS (28.39N 80.61W) to the end-point of that NOTAM (31.26N 77.13W) is about 47 degrees.

A Molniya Orbit has an inclination of 63.4 degrees

Comparing the NOTAM graphic for NROL-76 with that of CRS-10 in February, it appears that the inclination will be very close to, but slightly less than 51.6 degrees (but not as low as 47 degrees).


Offline .Scott

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #210 on: 04/27/2017 02:59 PM »
Comparing the NOTAM graphic for NROL-76 with that of CRS-10 in February, it appears that the inclination will be very close to, but slightly less than 51.6 degrees (but not as low as 47 degrees).
Is 51.6 degrees the bearing at Florida or the orbital path at the equator?

Offline edkyle99

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #211 on: 04/27/2017 03:08 PM »
Comparing the NOTAM graphic for NROL-76 with that of CRS-10 in February, it appears that the inclination will be very close to, but slightly less than 51.6 degrees (but not as low as 47 degrees).
Is 51.6 degrees the bearing at Florida or the orbital path at the equator?
It is the orbit inclination.

I would suggest that these NOTAMs do not cover the possibility of doglegs.

 - Ed Kyle
« Last Edit: 04/27/2017 03:08 PM by edkyle99 »

Online Semmel

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #212 on: 04/27/2017 03:41 PM »
The inclination of the second stage NOTAM should indicate a dogleg during launch. Can someone check that?

Offline spacenut

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #213 on: 04/27/2017 03:44 PM »
Is this going to be live streamed by SpaceX?  If so, when will it come on line?

Offline Jarnis

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #214 on: 04/27/2017 03:46 PM »
Is this going to be live streamed by SpaceX?  If so, when will it come on line?

Yes. Normally about 20 minutes prior to liftoff. http://www.spacex.com/webcast

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #215 on: 04/27/2017 04:03 PM »
I can believe this about the NROL-76 patch but surely not hard to change in the last few months?

Quote
John Kraus‏ @johnkrausphotos 36s37 seconds ago

LC-39A is on KSC property--not CCAFS. I'm guessing this patch was made before SpaceX's CCAFS launchpad became inactive?

https://twitter.com/johnkrausphotos/status/857625442085466112


Offline Ben the Space Brit

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #216 on: 04/27/2017 04:21 PM »
The mission patch suggests a mapping satellite. Maybe some new wavelength has become available to carry out imaging (perhaps of subsurface or camouflaged facilities)?
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Offline ChrisGebhardt

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #217 on: 04/27/2017 04:50 PM »
Is this going to be live streamed by SpaceX?  If so, when will it come on line?

Is this going to be live streamed by SpaceX?  If so, when will it come on line?

Yes. Normally about 20 minutes prior to liftoff. http://www.spacex.com/webcast

...but per NRO request, live commentary and tracking of 2nd stage will cutoff at payload fairing jettison.  Live feed will then transition to discuss only the first stage as it attempts an RTLS landing back at CCAFS.

Offline spacenut

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #218 on: 04/27/2017 05:43 PM »
What time is it about 6am Eastern Saturday Morning?


Offline ChrisGebhardt

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 - NROL-76 - May 1, 2017 - DISCUSSION
« Reply #219 on: 04/27/2017 05:46 PM »
What time is it about 6am Eastern Saturday Morning?



Are you asking when the launch is?  If so, the launch window is Sunday 30 April 2017 from 0700-0900 EDT.
« Last Edit: 04/27/2017 05:47 PM by ChrisGebhardt »

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