Author Topic: EM Drive Developments - related to space flight applications - Thread 3  (Read 1798276 times)

Offline Superfastjellyfish

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...
Shows diagram of frustum with forces. Been on NSF a lot.
...

Does this mean that Tajmar's been on NSF a lot, or that the diagram has been shown on NSF a lot?

Offline deltaMass

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"Control produced largest effect"

Aha - the Cannae Effect.
That's not good.

Offline DrBagelBites

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...
Shows diagram of frustum with forces. Been on NSF a lot.
...

Does this mean that Tajmar's been on NSF a lot, or that the diagram has been shown on NSF a lot?

Diagram.

Offline aero

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Attention all meepers - We need for someone to get a loop antenna model working. I found the attached on meep-discuss from way back when. It doesn't work like the questioner wanted, but that's why he/she posted the question, and maybe the loop antenna part worked anyway. Can anyone or everyone test and post a working meep loop antenna model?

aero
Retired, working interesting problems

Offline deltaMass

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Thank you Doctor BB. Nice job!

Offline Star One

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Sounds like those building their own EM drives are following the right lines.:)

Offline andygood

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Neither of the photos (the table top nor the vacuum chamber) seem to indicate an offset, although it is a bit difficult to tell.

Hi all, been lurking for several months now, just dipping a toe in...

If you look at the thermal imaging pictures on page four of the Tajmar paper, the right-most image shows a top-down view. Looks pretty clear that the waveguide is centered on the axis of the frustum...

Party on...

Offline Paul_A

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At least a Master's dissertation time

Have funding ?  Will continue research .... :)

A Master thesis in Germany takes 6 month, owed to the 'old' system of Diplom, that has been replaced by the BSc/MSc system in recent years. Hence, two to four theses within 1-2 years if he can get the students. ;)
« Last Edit: 07/28/2015 09:40 PM by Paul_A »
Dr. A. Paul, Geologist and Space enthusiast

Offline rfmwguy

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Wow, what an exciting day! Live blog from Dr BB, classical theorists slinging "crap" in their not-so-well thought out responses, noobs, posting and departing, and me finishing my assembly so I can celebrate the day with a video of my first thermal test of NSF-1701 under power!

Here it is guys and gals:

Time to savor an adult beverage...been in the shop all day and I have some reading to catch up on ;)

Offline ZuluMoon99

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DrBagelBites,

Thank you for the commentary of the presentation by Prof Tajmar.

A question for others here on the forum is as he has stated he is willing to take ideas from others, I would assume he is willing to take questions as posed by Dr Rodal

Thoughts?

[Edit : Title of person]
« Last Edit: 07/28/2015 09:45 PM by ZuluMoon99 »

Offline deltaMass

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Here are my suggestions to Prof. Tajmar.

Put everything on the thrust measuring apparatus - that's the entire drive with batteries and electronics. Lithium Ion batteries should give you over 30 minutes continuous power. There should be no wires trailing out of the apparatus, because these can cause spurious thrust measurements.

Enclose the apparatus in a hermetically sealed box with stout walls, so that ballooning due to heating is not excessive. It is important to do thorough testing of the seals when operational, at maximum temperature. If this is not done correctly, outgassing can occur in an unpredictable way, which will look like thrust. A 48 hour bake-out at 50 - 65 oC before an experimental run is recommended.

Because accumulation of charge may occur on the outside surface of the enclosure, the outside surface should be conductive to eliminate charge patches, which can cause spurious pseudo-thrusts. It should be grounded through the measurement system. It is prudent to check that the grounding current is small enough that it cannot be expected to generate pseudo-thrust via the Lorentz force. As a precaution here, the ambient DC magnetic field should be checked so as to rule out Lorentz forces due to currents on the outside surfaces.

The apparatus is commanded on and off via a photodiode mounted and sealed into the enclosure wall. This should be mounted orthogonal to the thrust axis so as to minimise the effect of any possible outgassing.

Data recording is best done inside the box and inspected at the end of the experimental run. However, so long as a good antenna seal can be had, WiFi would also work and provide realtime data monitoring and recording.
« Last Edit: 07/28/2015 10:18 PM by deltaMass »

Offline RotoSequence

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Dr. Rodal's force charts predict a gradual increase over time... if this is indicative of power building up inside of the frustrum faster than it can be dissipated, does it follow that the remnant decaying thrust signal is representative of a frustum's energy dissipation rate?

Offline deltaMass

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Dr. Rodal's force charts predict a gradual increase over time... if this is indicative of power building up inside of the frustrum faster than it can be dissipated, does it follow that the remnant decaying thrust signal is representative of a frustum's energy dissipation rate?
Certainly not. The measured decay is on order many seconds. The decay of the field in the cavity is microsecond scale (I'm referring to Tajmar's rig).
« Last Edit: 07/28/2015 10:29 PM by deltaMass »

Offline xanatos

Apologies if this has been done, but just quickly, I have seen people suggesting the thermal curve corelates to the thrust curve.  Has anyone created a frustum with simple resistive heating coils in it to see if that, too, creates thrust?  Bear in mind that I am an idiot, so if my question seems appropriate to that status, I am already so informed, and so silence will bear the message for you.  Thanks.

Offline deltaMass

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It's a good idea and would constitute a valid control experiment.

Offline DrBagelBites

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DrBagelBites,

Thank you for the commentary of the presentation by Prof Tajmar.

A question for others here on the forum is as he has stated he is willing to take ideas from others, I would assume he is willing to take questions as posed by Dr Rodal

Thoughts?

[Edit : Title of person]

He meant it as send him an email with suggestions/questions/etc.

Offline Star One

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DrBagelBites,

Thank you for the commentary of the presentation by Prof Tajmar.

A question for others here on the forum is as he has stated he is willing to take ideas from others, I would assume he is willing to take questions as posed by Dr Rodal

Thoughts?

[Edit : Title of person]

He meant it as send him an email with suggestions/questions/etc.

I hope you didn't mind me posting across your live blog here, just thought it was worth archiving in this thread.

Thanks for your coverage of this.

Offline DrBagelBites

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DrBagelBites,

Thank you for the commentary of the presentation by Prof Tajmar.

A question for others here on the forum is as he has stated he is willing to take ideas from others, I would assume he is willing to take questions as posed by Dr Rodal

Thoughts?

[Edit : Title of person]

He meant it as send him an email with suggestions/questions/etc.

I hope you didn't mind me posting across your live blog here, just thought it was worth archiving in this thread.

Thanks for your coverage of this.

No problem!

Offline rfmwguy

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DrBagelBites,

Thank you for the commentary of the presentation by Prof Tajmar.

A question for others here on the forum is as he has stated he is willing to take ideas from others, I would assume he is willing to take questions as posed by Dr Rodal

Thoughts?

[Edit : Title of person]

He meant it as send him an email with suggestions/questions/etc.

I hope you didn't mind me posting across your live blog here, just thought it was worth archiving in this thread.

Thanks for your coverage of this.

No problem!
Thks dr bb...well, was it worth ur time to scope out the conference? What's ur 40k foot view?

Offline DrBagelBites

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DrBagelBites,

Thank you for the commentary of the presentation by Prof Tajmar.

A question for others here on the forum is as he has stated he is willing to take ideas from others, I would assume he is willing to take questions as posed by Dr Rodal

Thoughts?

[Edit : Title of person]

He meant it as send him an email with suggestions/questions/etc.

I hope you didn't mind me posting across your live blog here, just thought it was worth archiving in this thread.

Thanks for your coverage of this.

No problem!
Thks dr bb...well, was it worth ur time to scope out the conference? What's ur 40k foot view?

It was indeed worth it. Met Steve Cash, a NASA engineer who worked on the shuttle for ~35 years. Amazing speaker.

Also met a professor that is at my uni who I will be meeting with on Friday concerning turbomachinery undergraduate research.

It was also very exciting to have ~150 different people following my live blog during the presentations. Exhilarating.

So, I have to say it is a success.

-I

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