Author Topic: I require help with Russian language in rocket/spacecraft documentation  (Read 3444 times)

Offline Stan Black

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I have been told I am using incorrect translations for some Russian words.

Can anyone help explain what words I should use?

изделие

Example:-
Quote
Доработка СПО АКПУ-П за изделие 14Ф137 № 3 в части введения нового экспериментального режима связи с новыми объектами типа звезда или планета

выпуск

Example:-
Quote
Выпуск 1-го полугодия 1988 г.
« Last Edit: 12/18/2014 03:53 AM by Chris Bergin »

Offline schaban

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Re: I require help with Russian language
« Reply #1 on: 12/17/2014 07:56 PM »
I have been told I am using incorrect translations for some Russian words.

Can anyone help explain what words I should use?

изделие
article
Example:-
Quote
Доработка СПО АКПУ-П за изделие 14Ф137 № 3 в части введения нового экспериментального режима связи с новыми объектами типа звезда или планета

выпуск
Manufactured/Produced/Issued
Example:-
Quote
Выпуск 1-го полугодия 1988 г.

Offline fregate

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Re: I require help with Russian language
« Reply #2 on: 12/18/2014 03:44 AM »

My $AU 0.02 изделие Article (100%)
выпуск - depends if we talking about hardware item produced/manufactured, if we talking about publications Issue (oriiginal word is a noun, not a verb).  Please elaborate more on context - sometimes you could not translate word for word (also could be a production batch or series)


Feel free to ask for translation any time :)
"Selene, the Moon. Selenginsk, an old town in Siberia: moon-rocket  town" Vladimir Nabokov

Offline fregate

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A single version of truth is ESKD edinaya systema konstruktirskoy dokumentatsii. (Unified system of design documentation). Still looking for English translation of ESKD.
"Selene, the Moon. Selenginsk, an old town in Siberia: moon-rocket  town" Vladimir Nabokov

Offline Stan Black

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The current Soyuz rocket has the letters ПВБ stamped on the side. Any suggestions for a suitable definition of пожаровзрывобезопасная.

Offline asmi

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Fire and explosion-proof (that's a literal translation)

Offline Stan Black

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Fire and explosion-proof (that's a literal translation)

That is the problem; how can a rocket be fire and explosion-proof? What was the meaning they were trying to convey? Suggestion is ‘Soyuz-U-not-so-dangerous’?

Offline jcm

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Fire and explosion-proof (that's a literal translation)

That is the problem; how can a rocket be fire and explosion-proof? What was the meaning they were trying to convey? Suggestion is ‘Soyuz-U-not-so-dangerous’?

The 'B" in PVB is the same as in KGB - безопасная there usually translated as 'security'. 'Fireproofed' doesn't mean something can't catch fire, just that it's harder to make it happen - one might say 'Fire/explosion secure version'
or 'Flammability/Explosion Protected' or  'Anti-Flammable/Anti-Explosion'  perhaps?
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Offline schaban

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A bit more context would be helpful.

Most likely it implies that given equipment (either rocket or its part) is in compliance with specific fire/explosion hazard rules to be deemed safe during operations.

According to http://www.opengost.ru/iso/13_gosty_iso/13230_gost_iso/5924-gost-12.1.010-76-ssbt.-vzryvobezopasnost.-obschie-trebovaniya.html, explosion safety mean not only that it won't explode, but also if it explodes, probability to hurt workers/bystanders or destroy equipment is less then predefined value.

Here's in Russian:

Взрывобезопасность

Состояние производственного процесса, при котором исключается возможность взрыва, или в случае его возникновения предотвращается воздействие на людей вызываемых им опасных и вредных факторов и обеспечивается сохранение материальных ценностей

Edit: typo
« Last Edit: 12/26/2014 08:52 PM by schaban »

Offline fregate

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A bit more context would be helpful.

Most likely it implies that given equipment (either rocket or its part) is in compliance with specific fire/explosion hazard rules to be deemed safe during operations.

According to http://www.opengost.ru/iso/13_gosty_iso/13230_gost_iso/5924-gost-12.1.010-76-ssbt.-vzryvobezopasnost.-obschie-trebovaniya.html, explosion safety mean not only that it won't explode, but also if it explodes, probability to hurt workers/bystanders or destroy equipment is less then predefined value.

Here's in Russian:

Взрывобезопасность

Состояние производственного процесса, при котором исключается возможность взрыва, или в случае его возникновения предотвращается воздействие на людей вызываемых им опасных и вредных факторов и обеспечивается сохранение материальных ценностей

Edit: typo
My $AU 0.02 Explosion safety - a state of production process, that either completely eliminates an explosion or alternatively, during explosion propagation allows to prevent influence on humans of hazardous and dangerous substances as well as provides preservation of material assets.   
"Selene, the Moon. Selenginsk, an old town in Siberia: moon-rocket  town" Vladimir Nabokov

Offline Stan Black

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A bit more context would be helpful.

 The original Soyuz-U rocket was article 11А511У. It consisted of a Semyorka derived 1st and 2nd stages stamped with article 11С59 on the side, and the 3rd stage blok-I was article 11С510. Sometime around 1990 new articles were introduced; and the serial numbers started afresh from 001. 11С59-ПВБ replaced 11С59 and 11С510-ПВБ replaced 11С510. It also affected the fairings too. Bion and Foton fairing 11С518 was replaced with 11С518-ПВБ; Resurs-F2 started to use 17С14-ПВБ and Kobalt the 11С529-ПВБ. Molniya-M rockets also became ПВБ with serial numbers starting from 001.
 This appears to be tied in with the explosion on the ground of a Vostok rocket in 1980. But the introduction of new articles took some time; and the phasing out of the old ones even longer.
« Last Edit: 12/27/2014 07:49 AM by Stan Black »

Offline schaban

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are you familiar with

www.samspace.ru/upload/iblock/ed6/samarskie_stupeni.pdf

После катастрофы ракеты 8А92М на космодроме Плесецк 18 марта 1980 г. все РН на базе Р-7А были модифицированы с целью повышения их пожаро-и взрывобезопасности. Модификация коснулась некоторых элементов хвостовых отсеков, но, главным образом, стартового оборудования и правил предстартовой подготовки. Ракеты получили к своему обозначению добавку «ПВБ» (пожаро-взрывобезопасная); например, полное обозначение РН «Союз-У» стало 11А511У-ПВБ. Однако, поскольку к настоящему времени эксплуатируются только ПВБ-модификации, эти буквы в обозначении обычно не пишутся


Basically, what you said  ;)

I would add that changes were mostly on the ground but because rocket tail/ bottom was modified appears all rocket parts (even unmodified ones) got ПВБ suffix. Since, currently, only ПВБ parts are used, suffix could be dropped from the name.

Edit: cut and paste errors
« Last Edit: 12/27/2014 12:48 PM by schaban »

Offline Stan Black

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are you familiar with

www.samspace.ru/upload/iblock/ed6/samarskie_stupeni.pdf

После катастрофы ракеты 8А92М на космодроме Плесецк 18 марта 1980 г. все РН на базе Р-7А были модифицированы с целью повыше- нияихпожаро-и взрывобезопасности.Модификациякоснуласьнеко- торых элементов хвостовых отсеков, но, главным образом, стартового оборудования и правил предстартовой подготовки. Ракеты получили к своему обозначению добавку «ПВБ» (пожаро-взрывобезопасная); например, полное обозначение РН «Союз-У» стало 11А511У-ПВБ. Однако, поскольку к настоящему времени эксплуатируются толь- ко ПВБ-модификации, эти буквы в обозначении обычно не пишутся


Basically, what you said  ;)

I would add that changes were mostly on the ground but because rocket tail/ bottom was modified appears all rocket parts (even unmodified ones) got ПВБ suffix. Since, currently, only ПВБ parts are used, suffix could be dropped from the name.

Problem is that ПВБ was introduced in 1984; but non-ПВБ remained in use until 2004. There was two overlapping sequences of rockets and fairings.
« Last Edit: 07/04/2015 12:41 PM by Stan Black »

Offline Prober

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http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=33141.msg1306498#msg1306498

Could use some help with the translation of this article.....hope to look at it as soon as some free time becomes available.  I can deal with the 3D lingo and do have some Russian 3D printer friends to try and access.  Sadly of late those sources have doors of communication being closed.

 http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=33141.msg1309883#msg1309883


Edit: posted google translation.....needs refinement
« Last Edit: 01/04/2015 08:25 PM by Prober »
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Offline Moskit

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That is the problem; how can a rocket be fire and explosion-proof? What was the meaning they were trying to convey? Suggestion is ‘Soyuz-U-not-so-dangerous’?

Maybe "fail-safe" is closer to the original meaning? It implies that something can fail (as compared to fail-proof), but damage will be limited/enclosed.

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