Author Topic: Kunpeng-7, XSLC, May 13th 2013  (Read 45005 times)

Offline input~2

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Re: Sounding rocket (?), XSLC, May 13th 2013
« Reply #60 on: 05/16/2013 06:55 AM »

Here is a sample pseudo-TLE that attempts to capture such a path - very much not a unique solution

1R61335U 13S33    13133.54200000 0.00000000 +00000-0 +00000-0 0    14
2R61335  31.9247  47.1509 8564868  16.7538   7.4862  2.89773317     1

This set would imply an apogee of about 32200 km

Offline jcm

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Re: Sounding rocket (?), XSLC, May 13th 2013
« Reply #61 on: 05/16/2013 12:21 PM »

Here is a sample pseudo-TLE that attempts to capture such a path - very much not a unique solution

1R61335U 13S33    13133.54200000 0.00000000 +00000-0 +00000-0 0    14
2R61335  31.9247  47.1509 8564868  16.7538   7.4862  2.89773317     1

This set would imply an apogee of about 32200 km


Yes, which is a number I pulled out of my...  well, let's just say I made it up entirely as a representation of "nearly geostationary" altitude.

I emphasize it's just meant as an illustration of the sort of path the probe might have taken, it's probably off from reality by thousands of km.
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Offline input~2

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Re: Sounding rocket (?), XSLC, May 13th 2013
« Reply #62 on: 05/17/2013 04:50 PM »
Jonathan: here is a Xin Hua report quoting your views:
http://news.xinhuanet.com/mil/2013-05/17/c_124725806.htm (in Chinese)

Offline Liss

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Re: Sounding rocket (?), XSLC, May 13th 2013
« Reply #63 on: 05/17/2013 05:11 PM »
Jonathan: here is a Xin Hua report quoting your views:
http://news.xinhuanet.com/mil/2013-05/17/c_124725806.htm (in Chinese)
Welcome to the club, Jonathan :-)
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline Star One

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Re: Sounding rocket (?), XSLC, May 13th 2013
« Reply #64 on: 05/17/2013 08:49 PM »
Just one quick question why is this being described as a 'sounding rocket', it's clearly more than that, reading this thread it was clearly a staged vehicle so the use of the term 'sounding rocket' seems wrong to me?

Offline Skyrocket

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Re: Sounding rocket (?), XSLC, May 13th 2013
« Reply #65 on: 05/17/2013 09:51 PM »
Just one quick question why is this being described as a 'sounding rocket', it's clearly more than that, reading this thread it was clearly a staged vehicle so the use of the term 'sounding rocket' seems wrong to me?

Sounding rockets can also be (and are often) multi stage vehicles.

Offline jcm

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Re: Sounding rocket (?), XSLC, May 13th 2013
« Reply #66 on: 05/18/2013 01:57 AM »
Jonathan: here is a Xin Hua report quoting your views:
http://news.xinhuanet.com/mil/2013-05/17/c_124725806.htm (in Chinese)
Welcome to the club, Jonathan :-)

Honored to be in any club that you're a member of, Igor!
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Offline jcm

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Re: Sounding rocket (?), XSLC, May 13th 2013
« Reply #67 on: 05/18/2013 02:14 AM »
Just one quick question why is this being described as a 'sounding rocket', it's clearly more than that, reading this thread it was clearly a staged vehicle so the use of the term 'sounding rocket' seems wrong to me?

Sounding rockets can also be (and are often) multi stage vehicles.

I agree. In general 'sounding rocket' has historically been broadly used for any suborbital vehicle for scientific, technology test or other vaguely research oriented purpose.

Early sounding rockets included four and five stage vehicles like Strongarm. The Oriole XII is a 4 stage rocket.

As often in English we can distinguish multiple meanings of the phrase.
1) Sounding rocket, n. : (type of rocket flight) a rocket launched on a suborbital trajectory with a research payload. Distinguished from a missile test or satellite launch. Sometimes includes meteorological rockets.

2) Sounding rocket, n.: (type of rocket vehicle) - a rocket vehicle used mainly for sounding launches, i.e. suborbital research launches.
Usually composed of smaller diameter stages than a satellite launch vehicle or long range ballistic missile.
 
But there have been satellite launch vehicles like Lambda-4S that were physically like sounding rockets.

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Offline Star One

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Re: Sounding rocket (?), XSLC, May 13th 2013
« Reply #68 on: 05/19/2013 08:05 PM »
Just one quick question why is this being described as a 'sounding rocket', it's clearly more than that, reading this thread it was clearly a staged vehicle so the use of the term 'sounding rocket' seems wrong to me?

Sounding rockets can also be (and are often) multi stage vehicles.

I agree. In general 'sounding rocket' has historically been broadly used for any suborbital vehicle for scientific, technology test or other vaguely research oriented purpose.

Early sounding rockets included four and five stage vehicles like Strongarm. The Oriole XII is a 4 stage rocket.

As often in English we can distinguish multiple meanings of the phrase.
1) Sounding rocket, n. : (type of rocket flight) a rocket launched on a suborbital trajectory with a research payload. Distinguished from a missile test or satellite launch. Sometimes includes meteorological rockets.

2) Sounding rocket, n.: (type of rocket vehicle) - a rocket vehicle used mainly for sounding launches, i.e. suborbital research launches.
Usually composed of smaller diameter stages than a satellite launch vehicle or long range ballistic missile.
 
But there have been satellite launch vehicles like Lambda-4S that were physically like sounding rockets.



Thanks. Just to explain when I imagine a sounding rocket in my head a certain type of vehicle first comes to mind & whatever completed this launch seemed more than that.

Offline limen4

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Re: Kunpeng-7, XSLC, May 13th 2013
« Reply #69 on: 10/19/2013 07:38 PM »
A new launch area at XSLC suitable for mobile launchers is visible south east of launch pad 2 and 3. It seems to be built between 2011 and 2012. The attached image was taken on May 21 2013  and can be seen at Google Earth when activating historical images. Note the vehicle tracks.

Offline weedenbc

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Re: Kunpeng-7, XSLC, May 13th 2013
« Reply #70 on: 10/19/2013 08:03 PM »
Yes, that is very interesting. I've been studying it for a few weeks now and plan to publish something in the near future.
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Offline edkyle99

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Re: Kunpeng-7, XSLC, May 13th 2013
« Reply #71 on: 10/19/2013 08:49 PM »
A new launch area at XSLC suitable for mobile launchers is visible south east of launch pad 2 and 3. It seems to be built between 2011 and 2012. The attached image was taken on May 21 2013  and can be seen at Google Earth when activating historical images. Note the vehicle tracks.
I wonder why they would need to create this when a mobile launcher pad already existed at the north end of the site?  It is interesting that the original mobile pad seems to look somewhat derelict in recent images, with "stuff" kind of piling up there, bone yard fashion. 

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Offline weedenbc

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Re: Kunpeng-7, XSLC, May 13th 2013
« Reply #72 on: 10/19/2013 10:09 PM »
A new launch area at XSLC suitable for mobile launchers is visible south east of launch pad 2 and 3. It seems to be built between 2011 and 2012. The attached image was taken on May 21 2013  and can be seen at Google Earth when activating historical images. Note the vehicle tracks.
I wonder why they would need to create this when a mobile launcher pad already existed at the north end of the site?  It is interesting that the original mobile pad seems to look somewhat derelict in recent images, with "stuff" kind of piling up there, bone yard fashion. 

 - Ed Kyle

That would suggest that the system the NW pad was developed for has reached a level of maturity and is no longer tested on that pad.

Perhaps the new pad is for a rocket that has a different flight profile than the previous one, and thus requires a different pad orientation and layout.
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Offline weedenbc

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Re: Kunpeng-7, XSLC, May 13th 2013
« Reply #73 on: 03/27/2014 12:13 PM »
My analysis of this launch was published last week:

http://swfound.org/media/167224/Through_a_Glass_Darkly_March2014.pdf

My overall conclusion (which should not be all that surprising to followers of this thread):

"While there is no conclusive proof, the available evidence strongly suggests that China’s May 2013 launch was the test of the rocket component of a new direct ascent ASAT weapons system derived from a road-mobile ballistic missile."

In the report I have commercial satellite imagery of Xichang from April 2013 that shows a TEL on that newly constructed mobile pad to the southeast of the main LM pad.
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Brian Weeden

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