Author Topic: Reference Satellite-A Payload Integration Plan  (Read 3691 times)

Offline Jim

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http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/NTRS-PDF/19800071968_1980071968.pdf

Just came across this and don't remember what I was googling.  I wasn't searching NTRS.
Reference Satellite A caught my eye.  Then upon reading, the document used the acronym "RSA", which has many meanings (Russian Space Agency), but again, it struck me as vaguely familiar.  Upon further reading, the figure of spacecraft made everything come together.  It was a Leasat/Syncom IV type spacecraft (with a blank envelope for the satellite payload package) that weighed 25klb.  It was to be launched to 57 degree inclination.
« Last Edit: 06/08/2012 09:07 PM by Jim »

Offline Danderman

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Re: Reference Satellite A PAYLOAD INTEGRATION PLAN
« Reply #1 on: 06/08/2012 06:25 PM »
Well, that's a mystery.

Why would DoD want a GEO comsat in a 57 degree orbit?

Online kevin-rf

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Re: Reference Satellite A PAYLOAD INTEGRATION PLAN
« Reply #2 on: 06/08/2012 06:42 PM »
SDS?

I think Jim is hinting that this provides data on one of the secret DOD missions... My first reaction is SDS?
There are two types of nations, those that use metric and those that have been to the moon.

Offline Jim

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Re: Reference Satellite A PAYLOAD INTEGRATION PLAN
« Reply #3 on: 06/08/2012 06:45 PM »
Well, that's a mystery.

Why would DoD want a GEO comsat in a 57 degree orbit?


Maybe because it is easier to get to 63.4 degrees.

Offline jcm

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Re: Reference Satellite A PAYLOAD INTEGRATION PLAN
« Reply #4 on: 06/08/2012 07:02 PM »
Yes, the second generation SDS satellites included Shuttle launches to 57 degree LEO, boosted to 63 degree Molniya by a perigee motor. STS-28 and STS-53 were the flights in question.
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Offline jcm

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Re: Reference Satellite A PAYLOAD INTEGRATION PLAN
« Reply #5 on: 06/08/2012 07:04 PM »
This is all consistent with the STS-53 payload diagram but gives much more detail - a very nice find, Jim!
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Offline Jim

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Re: Reference Satellite A PAYLOAD INTEGRATION PLAN
« Reply #6 on: 06/08/2012 07:18 PM »
This is all consistent with the STS-53 payload diagram but gives much more detail - a very nice find, Jim!

do you have that?

Offline jcm

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Re: Reference Satellite A PAYLOAD INTEGRATION PLAN
« Reply #7 on: 06/08/2012 07:22 PM »
This is all consistent with the STS-53 payload diagram but gives much more detail - a very nice find, Jim!

do you have that?

I just mean this, which confirmed that it was Leasat-style
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Offline ChileVerde

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"I canít tell you which asteroid, but there will be one in 2025," Bolden asserted.

Online kevin-rf

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Re: Reference Satellite A PAYLOAD INTEGRATION PLAN
« Reply #9 on: 06/08/2012 07:36 PM »

Googling on the Project Engineer, one L. H. Ballinger, leads to

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19800073789_1980073789.pdf

? ? ?
Quote
The P80-1 mission objective is to fly four space experiments:
the Teal Ruby Experiment for assessment/verification of the
multispectral mosaic focal plane telescopes;
? ? ?

I suppose that is the telescope like looking thing in the payload diagram.
There are two types of nations, those that use metric and those that have been to the moon.

Offline Jim

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Re: Reference Satellite A PAYLOAD INTEGRATION PLAN
« Reply #10 on: 06/08/2012 07:38 PM »
I was just going to attach that link for P80-1

Offline jcm

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Re: Reference Satellite A PAYLOAD INTEGRATION PLAN
« Reply #11 on: 06/08/2012 07:44 PM »
Appendix A discusses SD's desire to launch two 25000 lb payloads on one mission and NASA"s position that STS can't do that: "A lower control weight must be specified to satisfy the SD request". It was always a puzzle that the single payloads on these missions were well below the STS capacity - so I guess they wanted to squeeze two in but eventually gave up.

Note that Jim's document is dated 1980 (with parts prepared in 1979) while the
first launch was 1989. So things might have changed a lot. A while ago I tried to reconstruct the missions and here is a comparison with the RS-A values and what I derived (very rough numbers) for the actual missions:

Control weight:   RS-A  11400 kg     STS-28  10421 kg
Size                     RS-A 5.8m long 4.2m dia    cf Leasat 4.0m long 4.3m dia
Solid motor:        RS-A  2950 kg        STS-28   3460 kg prop (TU-882 assumed)
LAE prop:            RS-A 2800 kg         STS-28   1200 kg? (needed for orbit changes)

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Offline jcm

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Re: Reference Satellite A PAYLOAD INTEGRATION PLAN
« Reply #12 on: 06/08/2012 07:45 PM »

Googling on the Project Engineer, one L. H. Ballinger, leads to

http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19800073789_1980073789.pdf

? ? ?
Quote
The P80-1 mission objective is to fly four space experiments:
the Teal Ruby Experiment for assessment/verification of the
multispectral mosaic focal plane telescopes;
? ? ?

I suppose that is the telescope like looking thing in the payload diagram.


Right, P80-1/Teal Ruby was a notorious hangar queen - cost a bunch of money and never flew. It's sort of an ancestor of SBIRS.

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Offline Jim

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Re: Reference Satellite A PAYLOAD INTEGRATION PLAN
« Reply #13 on: 06/08/2012 08:00 PM »

Right, P80-1/Teal Ruby was a notorious hangar queen - cost a bunch of money and never flew. It's sort of an ancestor of SBIRS.


This was back when it was boosted by two SRM's and an east coast mission.  Somewhere at home, I have the PIP where it is renamed to AFP-888, with a monoprop orbital insertion system  and was a VAFB mission (or was the post 51-L east coast mission)
« Last Edit: 06/08/2012 08:00 PM by Jim »

Offline Jim

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Re: Reference Satellite A PAYLOAD INTEGRATION PLAN
« Reply #14 on: 06/08/2012 08:07 PM »

Offline Blackstar

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Re: Reference Satellite-A Payload Integration Plan
« Reply #15 on: 06/08/2012 09:32 PM »
I'm pretty sure that the Block II SDS was derived from Intelsat VI, not Leasat. I suspect that they made a change. I'd have to go back and look at my article, but I think that the block II decision was made after 1980. So maybe this represents an early iteration?

Offline jcm

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Re: Reference Satellite-A Payload Integration Plan
« Reply #16 on: 06/08/2012 09:49 PM »
I'm pretty sure that the Block II SDS was derived from Intelsat VI, not Leasat. I suspect that they made a change. I'd have to go back and look at my article, but I think that the block II decision was made after 1980. So maybe this represents an early iteration?



I'd make a more nuanced distinction: it's pretty clear that the 57-degree SDS-2
launches used an internal perigee motor (probably a solid) and a Frisbee-type launch cradle, giving an overall appearance and mission profile similar to Leasat. I'm happy to believe that the actual spacecraft is derived from Intelsat VI, but they must have modified it to add a separable perigee motor. I don't think the in-series motor used for Intelsat-VI class sats on the Commercial Titan is consistent with the mission profile or the payload bay layout.

Having said that, this 1980-era PIP does show a 4.3m (Leasat) diameter spacecraft, not a 3.6m diameter like Intelsat VI.  I don't know if our data on SDS Block II can distinguish these possibilities but it makes sense that a payload designed for Shuttle would have the 4.3m diameter. So how similar to I-VI it ended up being is unclear to me
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Offline Jim

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Re: Reference Satellite-A Payload Integration Plan
« Reply #17 on: 06/08/2012 10:22 PM »
I might have from something on the IV.  Wait til I get home

Offline Jim

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Re: Reference Satellite-A Payload Integration Plan
« Reply #18 on: 06/09/2012 12:59 PM »
I'm pretty sure that the Block II SDS was derived from Intelsat VI, not Leasat. I suspect that they made a change. I'd have to go back and look at my article, but I think that the block II decision was made after 1980. So maybe this represents an early iteration?


The STS-53 payload bay layout would say Leasat configuration.  The INTELSAT IV would have been held by a cradle on the SRM since its body was too narrow to interface directly with the payload bay

Offline Jester

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Re: Reference Satellite A PAYLOAD INTEGRATION PLAN
« Reply #19 on: 06/18/2012 10:44 AM »

Right, P80-1/Teal Ruby was a notorious hangar queen - cost a bunch of money and never flew. It's sort of an ancestor of SBIRS.


This was back when it was boosted by two SRM's and an east coast mission.  Somewhere at home, I have the PIP where it is renamed to AFP-888, with a monoprop orbital insertion system  and was a VAFB mission (or was the post 51-L east coast mission)

I came across this while searching for P82-1 stuff on STS-4

PIP P80-1 with Teal Ruby
http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19800075769_1980075769.pdf


EDIT: SORRY ! was already posted earlier in the thread (this is just a link to a later revision)
« Last Edit: 06/18/2012 10:59 AM by Jester »

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