Author Topic: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011  (Read 363328 times)

Offline Robotbeat

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #620 on: 09/29/2011 04:17 PM »
Can you believe that at exactly 13:16 GMT (T-0) SpaceX tweeted "Are you excited about the future of spaceflight". Hilariously bad timing ;D
Respectfully disagree. How is that bad timing?

A Chinese space station can only be good for the future of spaceflight.

In the spirit of the world's spaceflight capability, obviously the more the merrier.

In the spirit of American human spaceflight capability, us Yanks never really fund something like human spaceflight unless there's some sort of threat, usually just perceived.

China doing well with their human spaceflight program can only be good for NASA and NASA's human spaceflight program. Though it does seem like a lot in Congress no longer believe in America as a great nation, I think that deep down, they do believe and it just takes some sort of external perceived threat to remind them (no, I don't think Tiangong is any sort of real threat... I'm glad China is doing well with it... though it may be a perceived threat; competition is good, "coopetition" even better).

This launch does, indeed, make me more optimistic for the future of NASA's human spaceflight program.
« Last Edit: 09/29/2011 06:04 PM by Robotbeat »
Chris  Whoever loves correction loves knowledge, but he who hates reproof is stupid.

To the maximum extent practicable, the Federal Government shall plan missions to accommodate the space transportation services capabilities of United States commercial providers. US law http://goo.gl/YZYNt0

Online Phillip Clark

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #621 on: 09/29/2011 04:21 PM »
Congrats China!
ISS will always be my favourite space station, but Tiangong is cool too

I think that Salyut 6 will be my favourite.   With the long flights to the station the Soviets made manned spaceflight routine and for me it was fun to get my mission duration predictions right when it was operating!
I've always been crazy but it's kept me from going insane - WJ.

Online Satori

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #622 on: 09/29/2011 04:44 PM »
More precise orbital parameters:

Perigee: 200.046
Apogee: 346.854
Inclination: 42.757
Orbital period: 89,7 minutes

Offline FabulousNASA

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #623 on: 09/29/2011 05:18 PM »
Shortly after TG-1 seperation, video seemed to indicate the vehicle ignited its own engines. Is that indeed what happened?

Probably reflection.  You could see the reflection "moved" from above.

Offline Liss

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #624 on: 09/29/2011 07:31 PM »
In this image the launch time looks like 1316:03.507UTC... Any help?
Yes there was a screen at 85 seconds into flight or so where 507 ms were clearly seen and 03 sec could be guessed.
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Online Salo

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Online Salo

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Offline Kaputnik

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #627 on: 09/29/2011 08:40 PM »
Is TianGong the smallest space station ever?
(not trying to put it down, just asking out of curiosity)
Waiting for joy and raptor

Offline Stan Black

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #628 on: 09/29/2011 09:08 PM »
Why do they separate the boosters from the first stage if 1-2 sep is at the same time? To make sure there is no thrust imbalance? But then S1 does have 4 engines, too, 4 engines should rather help to level these.

Separation of the boosters takes place at T+155s and first stage separation takes place at T+159s

OK, but why? I mean: it's an additional separation event and I don't think these 4 seconds will make a significant difference in payload/delta-v so there has to be some reason why they add a complex separation mechanism.

 The original CZ-2E featured booster operating time of 127 seconds and 1st stage operating time of 160 seconds. These boosters are supposted to be the same as for the CZ-3B. Length 15,326 metres, propellant 37,700 kg. The 1999 LM-2E Userís Manual published after the last CZ-2E had flown quoted 140 seconds which is the same for the CZ-3BE and CZ-2F. Length 16,094 metres propellant 41,100 kg.

http://www.calt.com/xwzx/ztxw/tgyh/CZZ2fyzhj/201109211106583e49da.html
http://www.space.cetin.net.cn/docs/ht9801/ht980111.htm

Offline JimO

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #629 on: 09/29/2011 09:16 PM »
Mir, ISS, Tiangong: incidentally, how difficult would it be to have three stations at the same inclination ? Would that cause any issues ?

It's not just the inclination, it's the right ascension of the ascending node -- which when different by more than a few tenths of a degree makes interorbit transfers very expensive.

If one starts out in plane, different altitudes or different rates of decay will lead to different rates of orbital precession and you will drift out of plane. 

If you try to maintain the same precession rate but are out of plane you will have orbital crossings twice per orbit with the prospect of repeated collision alerts.

If you try to stay in plane, you interfere with vehicles headed to the other targets in your plane.

I discussed the issue of Mir and ISS, same inclination but different RAANs, in my book 'Star-Crossed Orbits' [I was in charge of the orbital design team] and I think the chapter is on my home page -- let me go look for the URL.

Offline Moe Grills

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #630 on: 09/29/2011 09:49 PM »
More precise orbital parameters:

Perigee: 200.046
Apogee: 346.854
Inclination: 42.757
Orbital period: 89,7 minutes

That perigee (200km/125 miles up) will certainly have to be raised
soon. At that low altitude, drag will make itself manifest far too soon.

Offline jcm

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #631 on: 09/29/2011 10:46 PM »
Still no TLEs...
-----------------------------

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http://planet4589.org

Offline iamlucky13

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #632 on: 09/30/2011 12:16 AM »
I just finished watching the video somebody posted. Much better coverage than I expected. I really liked the second stage engine view and that hot glowing turbopump.

Congratulations China.

By the way, does anyone know of an original file (not a TV-recorded/partially obscured) of the graphic in this post?

http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=14392.msg813120#msg813120

Offline robertross

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #633 on: 09/30/2011 02:06 AM »
Thanks for the great coverage everyone, and klausd on that great YouTube video.

Congrats China.
Remembering those who made the ultimate sacrifice for our rights & freedoms, and for those injured, visible or otherwise, in that fight.

Online Bubbinski

Thank you all for the coverage.  I woke up and followed this thread on my smartphone, laying in bed, just as the bird was launching.  I hope there's similar live coverage on Chinese TV for SZ-8.
I'll even excitedly look forward to "flags and footprints" and suborbital missions. Just fly...somewhere.

Offline jcm

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #635 on: 09/30/2011 04:34 AM »
Finally (0430 GMT) some TLEs:

37820  2011-53A Tiangong 1   197 x 345 km x 42.8 deg
37821  2011-53B  Stage 2?      197 x 327 km x 42.8
37822  2011-53C  Sep motor cover  190 x 474 km x 43.0
37823  2011-53D  Sep motor cover  192 x 522 km x 42.6
37824  2011-53E  Sep motor cover   183 x 544 km x 42.6
(37825  2011-53F) Sep motor cover  - no data yet

 
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Offline lucspace

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #636 on: 09/30/2011 04:50 AM »
Photo suggests there is at least one backup for TG-1... or are these the three labs planned, already integrated?

Online Phillip Clark

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #637 on: 09/30/2011 06:13 AM »
Photo suggests there is at least one backup for TG-1... or are these the three labs planned, already integrated?

This suggests that if Tiangong 1 had failed to reach orbit or fails in orbit then there is a back-up vehicle that can be launched relatively quickly - that is, not having to wait a couple of years.

Assuming that Tiangong 1 goes well, I wonder whether the back-up will be modified to become Tiangong 2?
I've always been crazy but it's kept me from going insane - WJ.

Offline pargoo

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #638 on: 09/30/2011 07:20 AM »
     Optimistic/naive/stupid question I know, but will good launch pictures be released?  I would enjoy watching the Chinese [and Indian and Japanese] space programs MUCH more if hi-res images were available of their various launches - ditto for early Sealaunch ones, too.   Hi-res shots of Shenzhou's 5, 6 & 7 would be highly valued for their historical significance, but for me 500x800's just don't rate a second look :/

Online Satori

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Re: LIVE: TianGong-1 JSLC CZ-2F (T1) launch September 29, 2011
« Reply #639 on: 09/30/2011 08:11 AM »
Some in info (in Chinese) about the CZ-2F/G and CZ-2F/H: http://www.calt.com/xwzx/ztxw/tgyh/CZZ2fyzhj/20110927105412c98744.html

Tags: TianGong-1