Author Topic: Ares I Development Thread  (Read 549516 times)

Offline Jim

  • Night Gator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 37439
  • Cape Canaveral Spaceport
  • Liked: 21448
  • Likes Given: 428
Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1320 on: 08/04/2017 01:39 pm »

J-2X is an essential engine for the SLS and manned-exploration programs,

Not true at all.  An assumption not supported by data.  J-2X is not needed for anything.
« Last Edit: 08/04/2017 01:40 pm by Jim »

Offline TrevorMonty

Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1321 on: 08/04/2017 02:45 pm »
OA NGL will use BE3 as its US engine.

Unfortunately for J-2X it is never likely to fly.

Offline Propylox

  • Member
  • Posts: 99
  • Colorado
  • Liked: 15
  • Likes Given: 7
Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1322 on: 08/05/2017 03:40 pm »
Unfortunately for J-2X it is never likely to fly.
I was thinking the same thing about New Glenn, Vulcan and NGL which is why I asked about an Ares1 redux.

Offline Jim

  • Night Gator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 37439
  • Cape Canaveral Spaceport
  • Liked: 21448
  • Likes Given: 428
Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1323 on: 08/05/2017 03:49 pm »
Unfortunately for J-2X it is never likely to fly.
I was thinking the same thing about New Glenn, Vulcan and NGL which is why I asked about an Ares1 redux.

There is nothing that supports such thinking.  NG and Vulcan are flying.  If they don't fly, J-2X is certainly not going to fly.  Actually, there is no scenario where J-2X flies, especially since SLS is not going to last long.  There is even less chance of Ares I redux.  There is no case that supports NASA developing such a vehicle.
« Last Edit: 08/05/2017 03:53 pm by Jim »

Offline Patchouli

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4490
  • Liked: 253
  • Likes Given: 457
Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1324 on: 08/07/2017 09:33 pm »


J-2X is an essential engine for the SLS and manned-exploration programs, thus I'm assuming its production and use as the 2nd-stage engine. I'm also assuming a 5m 2nd-stage based on the Delta IV, or Vulcan, or a redesign of the Delta IV with common bulkhead, or a knockoff from elsewhere ~ whatever.
Lastly, I'm using Antares' upper and orbital placement from prime contractor Orbital/ATK for GTO launches.



I'd say it's more of a nice have engine for some missions mostly ones needing the largest possible LEO payload vs absolutely necessary.
Though for those missions the simpler and cheaper to produce J-2S would be more desirable I'm surprised they didn't go this route with the J-2X after Ares I was canceled.
« Last Edit: 08/07/2017 09:35 pm by Patchouli »

Offline Propylox

  • Member
  • Posts: 99
  • Colorado
  • Liked: 15
  • Likes Given: 7
Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1325 on: 08/08/2017 04:09 am »
I'd say it's more of a nice have engine for some missions mostly ones needing the largest possible LEO payload vs absolutely necessary.
Though for those missions the simpler and cheaper to produce J-2S would be more desirable I'm surprised they didn't go this route with the J-2X after Ares I was canceled.
It's not simply "large-to LEO", but delivers +40mT to the Moon in addition to +130mT to LEO without Advanced Boosters, or RS-25, and uses the same tooling as the core. I'd say that's "nice to have". Here's the +70mT single stage as well as two-stage core configuration. Discuss here;
Rocket https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=38069.msg1705330#msg1705330
Boattail https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=38069.msg1706197#msg1706197
« Last Edit: 08/08/2017 04:10 am by Propylox »

Offline sdsds

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7194
  • “With peace and hope for all mankind.”
  • Seattle
  • Liked: 2039
  • Likes Given: 1962
Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1326 on: 10/20/2017 08:22 am »
October 20, 2009 (Eight years ago today.)
Ares I-X rolls out to launch pad 39B at Kennedy Space Center.
— 𝐬𝐝𝐒𝐝𝐬 —

Offline woods170

  • IRAS fan
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12092
  • IRAS fan
  • The Netherlands
  • Liked: 18181
  • Likes Given: 12139
Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1327 on: 10/20/2017 10:41 am »
October 20, 2009 (Eight years ago today.)
Ares I-X rolls out to launch pad 39B at Kennedy Space Center.
Just when I figured everybody had forgotten about the stick....

Biggest model rocket ever...

Offline sdsds

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7194
  • “With peace and hope for all mankind.”
  • Seattle
  • Liked: 2039
  • Likes Given: 1962
Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1328 on: 10/28/2017 08:10 pm »
And speaking of the big solids, can anyone say whether the swoopy stripes are still the plan of record for the SRB paint job?
— 𝐬𝐝𝐒𝐝𝐬 —

Offline IanThePineapple

Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1329 on: 10/28/2017 08:26 pm »
And speaking of the big solids, can anyone say whether the swoopy stripes are still the plan of record for the SRB paint job?

Nope, they're blank now.

Offline Hog

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2846
  • Woodstock
  • Liked: 1700
  • Likes Given: 6867
Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1330 on: 10/28/2017 10:07 pm »
And speaking of the big solids, can anyone say whether the swoopy stripes are still the plan of record for the SRB paint job?

Nope, they're blank now.
They are?  They repainted the already poured SRB segments?
Paul

Offline IanThePineapple

Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1331 on: 10/28/2017 10:19 pm »
And speaking of the big solids, can anyone say whether the swoopy stripes are still the plan of record for the SRB paint job?

Nope, they're blank now.
They are?  They repainted the already poured SRB segments?

They never were painted, they're plain white. The 'swooshes' were just to spice up the design in animations, similar to how the Falcon Heavy won't have the giant "S P A C E X" lettering going down its side, unlike the animation.

Offline Hog

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2846
  • Woodstock
  • Liked: 1700
  • Likes Given: 6867
Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1332 on: 10/30/2017 04:49 pm »

And speaking of the big solids, can anyone say whether the swoopy stripes are still the plan of record for the SRB paint job?

Nope, they're blank now.

They are?  They repainted the already poured SRB segments?

They never were painted, they're plain white. The 'swooshes' were just to spice up the design in animations, similar to how the Falcon Heavy won't have the giant "S P A C E X" lettering going down its side, unlike the animation.
I wasn't referencing any animations, but a real picture of one of the EM-1 segments.  I finally refound the picture again, and whatever is on the one side of this particular segment I mistook for a painted on graphic, I'm not really sure what is on its side, its not like the rest of the pure white segments
Thanks for the correction.
Paul

Offline whitelancer64

Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1333 on: 10/30/2017 05:00 pm »

And speaking of the big solids, can anyone say whether the swoopy stripes are still the plan of record for the SRB paint job?

Nope, they're blank now.

They are?  They repainted the already poured SRB segments?

They never were painted, they're plain white. The 'swooshes' were just to spice up the design in animations, similar to how the Falcon Heavy won't have the giant "S P A C E X" lettering going down its side, unlike the animation.
I wasn't referencing any animations, but a real picture of one of the EM-1 segments.  I finally refound the picture again, and whatever is on the one side of this particular segment I mistook for a painted on graphic, I'm not really sure what is on its side, its not like the rest of the pure white segments
Thanks for the correction.

The SLS SRBs will have photommetry markings on them.

https://www.nasa.gov/exploration/systems/sls/space-launch-system-solid-rocket-boosters-on-target-for-first-flight.html
"One bit of advice: it is important to view knowledge as sort of a semantic tree -- make sure you understand the fundamental principles, ie the trunk and big branches, before you get into the leaves/details or there is nothing for them to hang on to." - Elon Musk
"There are lies, damned lies, and launch schedules." - Larry J

Offline Hog

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2846
  • Woodstock
  • Liked: 1700
  • Likes Given: 6867
Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1334 on: 12/06/2017 06:39 pm »

And speaking of the big solids, can anyone say whether the swoopy stripes are still the plan of record for the SRB paint job?

Nope, they're blank now.

They are?  They repainted the already poured SRB segments?

They never were painted, they're plain white. The 'swooshes' were just to spice up the design in animations, similar to how the Falcon Heavy won't have the giant "S P A C E X" lettering going down its side, unlike the animation.
I wasn't referencing any animations, but a real picture of one of the EM-1 segments.  I finally refound the picture again, and whatever is on the one side of this particular segment I mistook for a painted on graphic, I'm not really sure what is on its side, its not like the rest of the pure white segments
Thanks for the correction.

The SLS SRBs will have photommetry markings on them.

https://www.nasa.gov/exploration/systems/sls/space-launch-system-solid-rocket-boosters-on-target-for-first-flight.html
Thanks,  and finished segment(s), all 10 ready to ship and stack.  They're due at KSC just under a year from now.
Paul

Offline Hog

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2846
  • Woodstock
  • Liked: 1700
  • Likes Given: 6867
Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1335 on: 06/14/2020 11:44 pm »
The above pictured RSRM-V (Redesigned Solid Rocket Motor-5 comprised of 5 segments) arrived at KSC a few days ago (mid June/2020).  Stacking due this Fall 2020, with a NET launch date of November 2021.(though the RSRMV has a max. stacked duration of 1 year)  Artemis-1 SRB stacking will be an indicator of Artemis-1 launch date confidence.
Paul

Offline woods170

  • IRAS fan
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12092
  • IRAS fan
  • The Netherlands
  • Liked: 18181
  • Likes Given: 12139
Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1336 on: 06/15/2020 12:27 pm »
The above pictured RSRM-V (Redesigned Solid Rocket Motor-5 comprised of 5 segments) arrived at KSC a few days ago (mid June/2020).  Stacking due this Fall 2020, with a NET launch date of November 2021.(though the RSRMV has a max. stacked duration of 1 year)  Artemis-1 SRB stacking will be an indicator of Artemis-1 launch date confidence.

Pardon me for asking but what the h*ll is an Artemis 1 update doing in a long-defunct Ares I development thread?
« Last Edit: 06/15/2020 12:28 pm by woods170 »

Offline Hog

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2846
  • Woodstock
  • Liked: 1700
  • Likes Given: 6867
Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1337 on: 06/15/2020 06:38 pm »
The above pictured RSRM-V (Redesigned Solid Rocket Motor-5 comprised of 5 segments) arrived at KSC a few days ago (mid June/2020).  Stacking due this Fall 2020, with a NET launch date of November 2021.(though the RSRMV has a max. stacked duration of 1 year)  Artemis-1 SRB stacking will be an indicator of Artemis-1 launch date confidence.

Pardon me for asking but what the h*ll is an Artemis 1 update doing in a long-defunct Ares I development thread?
1) As soon as "NASA was told STS was going to work at 51.6º inclinations for ISS (early-mid 90's), options to increase Shuttle payload were investigated. A 5 segment SRM was studied as a method for clawing back and improving Shuttle performance to said orbit. Ares-1 since 2006 was to use a 5 segment solid first stage.  Similar 5 segment SRM development for Ares-1 and Ares-V was carried over for SLS. Yes, the RSRM-V has been contemplated for 4 proposed/operational NASA vehicles.  The words "Shuttle Derived" link STS, CxP and SLS in many ways.

2)  The picture I posted above of the "I'll pull, You push" segment transporter (nicknamed "Shirley") has over 1200 views in the 2-3 years since I posted it. Using that as a gauge of interest, coupled with the fact that in 2017, the delivery of the Shuttle/Constellation/SLS SRM segments was supposed to occur in 2018, I made a short, value added update to that 2017 post. Anyone reading this entire thread about Ares-1 development(like I just did) now knows about RSRMV, its history that precedes AND follows its inclusion in Constellation

3) This entire thread is based on necroposts, over 95% of it is dated 2010. 

4) I apologize for the obvious annoyance that this has caused you.   A friendly PM (minus the cursing-please) could have assuaged your curiosity without compounding the exact issue you speak of. (I hear Chris B. in the background "Replying to a crap post only results in TWO (or 3) crap posts. RTM!)


Attachments
1)Ares-1 and Ares-V.   Two vehicles that were to use 5 segment RSRM-V technology.
Paul

Offline woods170

  • IRAS fan
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 12092
  • IRAS fan
  • The Netherlands
  • Liked: 18181
  • Likes Given: 12139
Re: Ares I Development Thread
« Reply #1338 on: 06/16/2020 09:28 am »
The above pictured RSRM-V (Redesigned Solid Rocket Motor-5 comprised of 5 segments) arrived at KSC a few days ago (mid June/2020).  Stacking due this Fall 2020, with a NET launch date of November 2021.(though the RSRMV has a max. stacked duration of 1 year)  Artemis-1 SRB stacking will be an indicator of Artemis-1 launch date confidence.

Pardon me for asking but what the h*ll is an Artemis 1 update doing in a long-defunct Ares I development thread?
1) As soon as "NASA was told STS was going to work at 51.6º inclinations for ISS (early-mid 90's), options to increase Shuttle payload were investigated. A 5 segment SRM was studied as a method for clawing back and improving Shuttle performance to said orbit. Ares-1 since 2006 was to use a 5 segment solid first stage.  Similar 5 segment SRM development for Ares-1 and Ares-V was carried over for SLS. Yes, the RSRM-V has been contemplated for 4 proposed/operational NASA vehicles.  The words "Shuttle Derived" link STS, CxP and SLS in many ways.

2)  The picture I posted above of the "I'll pull, You push" segment transporter (nicknamed "Shirley") has over 1200 views in the 2-3 years since I posted it. Using that as a gauge of interest, coupled with the fact that in 2017, the delivery of the Shuttle/Constellation/SLS SRM segments was supposed to occur in 2018, I made a short, value added update to that 2017 post. Anyone reading this entire thread about Ares-1 development(like I just did) now knows about RSRMV, its history that precedes AND follows its inclusion in Constellation

3) This entire thread is based on necroposts, over 95% of it is dated 2010. 

4) I apologize for the obvious annoyance that this has caused you.   A friendly PM (minus the cursing-please) could have assuaged your curiosity without compounding the exact issue you speak of. (I hear Chris B. in the background "Replying to a crap post only results in TWO (or 3) crap posts. RTM!)


Attachments
1)Ares-1 and Ares-V.   Two vehicles that were to use 5 segment RSRM-V technology.

Thanks for your elaborate explanation. Fact remains that Ares I is dead and buried and that any news regarding arriving RSRM segments belongs in either an SLS or Artemis thread.
Posting this here just because RSRM was once (a long time ago) supposed to power the Stick is like posting RS-25 updates here because they were to originally drive the Ares I upper stage: it doesn't make any sense IMO.

Tags:
 

Advertisement NovaTech
Advertisement Northrop Grumman
Advertisement
Advertisement Margaritaville Beach Resort South Padre Island
Advertisement Brady Kenniston
Advertisement NextSpaceflight
Advertisement Nathan Barker Photography
0