Author Topic: Trump has won. What is known about his views on space and can they change?  (Read 82180 times)

Offline Blackstar

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But the paradigm for earth observation has already started shifting to the private sector. Some imaging is already coming from privately owned satellites and I would frankly be shocked if in 10 years a US government agency (excluding military/intelligence) is still designing or purchasing actual flight hardware for earth observation except in special cases.


There are some huge devils in the details on that topic.

For starters, the U.S. government shares its weather satellite data with other countries, often in return for them sharing their data with the U.S.

If the U.S. buys proprietary data from private companies, the U.S. will not be allowed to share that data with other countries. Do we really want to get in a situation where we don't share weather data with the Europeans and they don't share weather data with us?

Online TrevorMonty

NOAA expertise is analysing climate data, building satellites is just a means to obtain that data. Instead of owning satellite just buy data and have a company own and operate satellite.

Offline Jim

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But the paradigm for earth observation has already started shifting to the private sector. Some imaging is already coming from privately owned satellites and I would frankly be shocked if in 10 years a US government agency (excluding military/intelligenct) is still designing or purchasing actual flight hardware for earth observation except in special cases.

There's no reason for NASA to purchase earth observation data for NOAA.

Not true.  There is little market for the data that NASA is collecting.  Also, the most of the data is of the atmosphere/oceans and not of land (i.e. earth observation).  The only gov't program that looks at earth is Landsat
« Last Edit: 11/18/2016 05:16 pm by Jim »

Offline Jim

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NOAA expertise is analysing climate data, building satellites is just a means to obtain that data. Instead of owning satellite just buy data and have a company own and operate satellite.

There is no point is that since there is no market outside of the govt for the data

Offline Blackstar

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Instead of owning satellite just buy data and have a company own and operate satellite.

Go ask some scientists how well that works. The basic problem is that you cannot treat "data" as if it is a consumer product like paper towels or window cleaner. You have to define it for the company that will produce it. And it is actually rather difficult to precisely define what data you want, and quite often you cannot get what you want, so you collect what you can, and then find a way to analyze it to achieve your research goals. There's also the issues of serendipity and discovery: sometimes the most important discoveries are with things you never think to look for. The risk of defining the data for a commercial company to provide is that they only provide a narrow set of data, and you don't learn about other really interesting stuff.

So in the sciences, you really have to have the user--who may be a government scientist, or a scientist paid with government money via research grant--intimately involved in instrument design and operation. They have to be right in the thick of it.

Offline Blackstar

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Offline muomega0

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NOAA expertise is analysing climate data, building satellites is just a means to obtain that data. Instead of owning satellite just buy data and have a company own and operate satellite.
There is no point is that since there is no market outside of the govt for the data
Exactly.  Its simply a government market, and the data cannot be freely distributed.   A cost will be negotiated for a narrow set of data, and it will cost more to obtain a more robust set....just more 'wraps'  no value added...

Offline philw1776

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Bigelow, a vocal Trump supporter, calls for doubling NASA's budget and a focus on the moon...

http://spacenews.com/bigelow-calls-on-trump-to-sharply-increase-nasa-spending/

I believe he wants NASA to buy his habs for cis lunar use. /personal opinion
FULL SEND!!!!

Offline Rocket Science

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Bigelow, a vocal Trump supporter, calls for doubling NASA's budget and a focus on the moon...

http://spacenews.com/bigelow-calls-on-trump-to-sharply-increase-nasa-spending/

I believe he wants NASA to buy his habs for cis lunar use. /personal opinion
I wonder what he's been smoking to call for a doubling of the budget? :o
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
~Rob: Physics instructor, Aviator

Offline Blackstar

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https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/guest-blog/what-will-trump-s-space-program-look-like/

What Will Trump's Space Program Look Like?

He's made several positive statements about the benefits of commercial space, but nothing about much else

By Lori Garver on November 11, 2016


Offline muomega0

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Big change on the horizon for NASA under Trump

Quote from: GarverOpEd
Here are a few areas of anticipated focus for the Trump administration:

1) NASA’s bureaucracy/infrastructure is much too large and expensive.
2) NASA shouldn’t be spending so much money on Earth sciences.
3) The Moon is a better and more important destination than Mars
4) Entrepreneurial space should play a larger role in all aspects of space.
5) Space activities cut across international, civil, military and commercial arenas and should be run out of the White House, by a National Space Council, reporting to Vice President Pence.

Everyone knew canceling the Constellation human space flight program would be unpopular in the states that had contracts, for example, but felt it was necessary to advance a meaningful and sustainable space program.

NASA issues are more parochial than partisan, but partisanship has crept into Congress’s funding decisions for NASA and the space program over the past few years. The most recent partisan aspect of NASA’s budget has been funding for Earth sciences. Attacks from the right have slowed the government’s overall ability to monitor and understand our changing climate.

The predominant Republican view seems to be that NASA should focus on its more widely known objective of human exploration beyond low Earth orbit, and let NOAA handle weather predictions.

The space community continually clamors for presidential candidates to say something about space during the campaign, only to pick apart and criticize every utterance

If one thinks about 1:  NASA needs more programs operating more efficiently, not less for the same budget
3-4:  If one locks into a solution to lunar only, this stiffles Entrepreneurial innovation (stuck in LEO for decades, 2x/yr 6 day sorties).
5:      as long as flexibility is provided otherwise so much for innovation (i.e. fleet should be allowed to mature)

2:    Simply stated, the earth could not absorb the 500 billion metric tonnes of carbon humans pumped upward in such a short time span and NASA has provided invaluable data on one of its core purposes.  The sun affects the earth's climate, which is studied with Solar Dynamics Observatory for example.  Coordination between agencies has been successful so far.
---
On the critiques:  “For what do we live, but to make sport for our neighbors, and laugh at them in our turn?” Jane Austen  ;)

Offline Rocket Science

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I have found it interesting over the last few years that the entrepreneurial-enterprising so called "new space" find themselves leaning towards the democratic spectrum and the established "old space" find themselves of the opposite end of the political spectrum... As far as the PE is concerned I don't really find the "enemy list" appropriate in a democracy especially before he even takes office... YMMV...
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
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Offline Brovane

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Trent has been proven wrong on several of his predictions in the past. However, Trent may be right on this one. Elon really does not like Trump and has stated so publically. The president-elect has shown to have a highly volatile nature. He has also shown to be very sensitive to public critique to the point that he threatens to retaliate. It's also an established fact that Trump usually likes to fight his fights in court. Lord knows how many folks and companies he has sued in the past 3 decades. So yeah, I'll give Trent the benefit of the doubt on this one. I think that the coming administration will be no friend of SpaceX in general and Elon Musk in particular.

So what has Musk said about Trump?

"I feel a bit stronger that he is not the right guy"
"He doesn't seem to have the sort of character that reflects well on the United States."

Musk's actual statements are fairly mild compared to some of the criticism that Trump has faced from even leadership of the Republican party.  What has been propagated since Trump has won on the Internet is some articles that try to pump up the conflict between Trump and Musk when what has actually been said by Musk is relatively benign.  Really Musk hasn't made it personal.  However it appears that some members of this board have fallen for the stories that somehow their is this big public conflict between them when the actual facts don't support such a conflict. 

If you take a step back and look at the facts about a possible relationship between SpaceX and the Trump Administration.

#1- Trump is big on manufacturing in the US.  Well the Falcon-9 passes this test.  If you look at Musk's other company Tesla, they are also big on manufacturing in the US.  Don't see much of a conflict for SpaceX.

#2- Trump is big on free market solutions.  Well SpaceX is arguably the most free market oriented launch provider in the US selling Orbital and beyond launch services.  The entire SpaceX re-usability development program, cannot get more free market than that.

#3- SpaceX has a very healthy ratio of private commercial launches to government launches.  ULA and OrbitalATK, not so much. 

#4- Peter Thiel, is a member of Trumps transition team and he is advising Trump on technology matters.  Thiel was part of PayPal with Musk and was a early investor in SpaceX.  Thiel has a lot of respect for Musk and he has Trump's ear in technology matters.

I don't see any facts supporting that the Trump Administration is going to attack SpaceX (Musk) simply because Musk has said that Trump is not the right person to lead the US.  Let's not fall for the propaganda pieces attacking Musk based on dubious facts.   
"Look at that! If anybody ever said, "you'll be sitting in a spacecraft naked with a 134-pound backpack on your knees charging it", I'd have said "Aw, get serious". - John Young - Apollo-16


Offline RonM

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Offline high road

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Tesla might be in trouble, granted. But the articles about SpaceX seem to be just opinions riding on the wave of panick. Very little tangible stuff. Might have to dial down their development programmes, but I think that's a good thing. No RTF next year.

Offline Prober

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« Last Edit: 11/25/2016 02:12 pm by Prober »
2017 - Everything Old is New Again.
"I fear all we have done is to awaken a sleeping giant..." --Isoroku Yamamoto

Online Chris Bergin

Probably need a new thread as people seem desperate to drag this off topic for their own dirty political ways ;D

#DirtyPoliticsIsDirty
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