Author Topic: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request  (Read 27338 times)

Offline Proponent

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #100 on: 04/15/2017 01:34 PM »
May I please ask that any responses to the following be focused and to the point.  If you find fault in my analysis, please point out precisely where and how I am wrong.

I've now read Scott Pace's op-ed in Space News, "Wishful thinking collides with policy economic realities in 'Capitalism in Space'," which appeared in print on 25 March and on line on 4 April.  It is a criticism of Robert Zimmerman's paper "Capitalism in Space,"  discussed (and criticized) upthread (by incoming and by me).

Pace mischaracterizes Zimmerman's argument by claiming
Quote from: Scott Pace in "Wishful thinking collides with policy economic realities in 'Capitalism in Space'," Space News, 25 March
The core problem is that based on this minimal experience the author poses a false binary choice between “government” or “private sector” approaches to space transportation, a choice in which he argues that the government should abandon traditional acquisition practices in favor of relying on “free enterprise.”

In effect, he makes an unsupported claim that commercial markets exist (or should exist) for the public goods of science, exploration, and security.
Although the title "Capitalism in Space" is bombastic and Zimmerman does spew quite a bit of verbiage about free markets, his focus is on the much narrower question of how the costs of NASA-managed vehicles, SLS and Orion, compare with those of commercially managed launch and delivery vehicles, namely those used in the commercial crew and cargo programs*.  Zimmerman does not claim that markets exist for science, exploration and security but merely that the government should buy launch and delivery services from industry rather than creating and managing those capabilities itself.

That there is no commercial market in national security, for example, has not prevented the US Air Force from buying launch services from industry for many years.  The Air Force itself got out of the launch-vehicle business with the retirement of the Titan IV over a decade ago.  In fact, SLS is the sole exception to the rule that the US government has exited the launch-vehicle business and now buys launch services.  That the government buys launch services for military and scientific payloads falsifies Pace's argument.

Pace also attempts to argue that SLS's large size dictates that it be managed by NASA:
Quote
the reported first stage Falcon Heavy thrust is approximately 1.71 million pounds. SLS thrust is 8.87 million pounds of thrust. The SLS is designed to place more than twice as much payload into a low Earth orbit and over three times as much into a trans-Mars injection orbit. Again, these are government requirements, not commercial requirements, and that’s why SLS is a NASA program.
This is just wrong, for two reasons.  First of all, the thrust, if that's a particularly relevant metric, of Falcon Heavy is 5.13 million pounds at sea level, three times what Pace claims**.  If the payload figures are correct, they must apply to SLS Block 2, which is many years and billions of dollars in the future, it it is ever built.  More fundamentally, the fact that SLS's specs are set by government requirements does not mean it must be managed by the government.   The Delta IV, for example, was built to satisfy government requirements and has never flown a commercial payload yet is managed by ULA.  (There is also the larger issue that NASA has never established the need or even desirability of an SLS-like launch vehicle for its purposes; if you think I'm wrong, please post the relevant information in this thread.)

Like Loren Thompson, Pace avoids addressing Zimmerman's argument by creating a strawman.  Neither actually addresses Zimmerman's primary point, which is that NASA could save a great deal of money by contracting with American industry for launch and delivery services instead of building Orion/SLS.


* See p. 4: "The central focus of this paper is a comparison between the two approaches to maintain and expand American access to space that NASA and the federal government have followed since the mid-2000s."
** Somebody has pointed this out before in this forum; unfortunately, I cannot find the post.

EDIT:  "compared" -> "compare" in 3rd paragraph.  "The must" -> "They must" in penultimate paragraph.
« Last Edit: 04/16/2017 08:36 PM by Proponent »

Offline woods170

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #101 on: 04/15/2017 06:07 PM »
May I please ask that any responses to the following be focused and to the point.  If you find fault in my analysis, please point out precisely where and how I am wrong.

<snip>
Excellent analysis. Couldn't agree more.

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #102 on: 05/19/2017 06:17 PM »
FY'18 proposed budget due Tuesday but a possible leaked version gives some details about likely NASA impact:

http://spacenews.com/2018-budget-proposal-to-spread-cuts-across-nasa-programs/

Edit to add attachment from:

Quote
Here are the NASA numbers in raw form.
https://twitter.com/sciguyspace/status/865627780381155329
« Last Edit: 05/19/2017 06:19 PM by FutureSpaceTourist »

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #103 on: 05/22/2017 01:39 PM »
Quote
May 22, 2017
MEDIA ADVISORY M17-056

NASA to Discuss FY2018 Budget Proposal, Provide Virtual Tours of Centers

NASA will hold a series of events Tuesday, May 23, highlighting the agency’s Fiscal Year 2018 budget proposal, including a televised State of NASA address by acting Administrator Robert Lightfoot and Facebook Live virtual tours of NASA’s 10 centers, where innovation is enabling exploration and discovery.

Lightfoot will give a presentation at 12:30 p.m. EDT to NASA employees at the agency’s Headquarters in Washington on FY2018 budget highlights, setting the stage for the coming year at NASA and spotlighting the past work that led to current achievements. This presentation will air live on NASA Television and the agency’s website.

At 1:30 p.m., NASA's social media team will take visitors behind the scenes for a virtual tour of NASA and a look at the cutting-edge work here and on humanity's destiny in deep space. These Facebook Live events will be hosted on each center's Facebook page and will run about 15 minutes each. The following list of virtual tours includes times, centers and highlights of each tour:

1:30 p.m. -- Glenn Research Center, in Cleveland, will host a tour of its Electric Propulsion Lab, where the agency tests solar propulsion technologies that are critical to powering spacecraft for NASA’s deep-space missions.
1:50 p.m. -- Marshall Space Flight Center, in Huntsville, Alabama, will host a tour from a Marshall test stand where structural loads testing is performed on parts of NASA's Space Launch System rocket.
2:10 p.m. -- Stennis Space Center, in Bay St. Louis, Mississippi, will take visitors on a tour of their test stands to learn about rocket engine testing from their Test Control Center.
2:30 p.m. -- Armstrong Flight Research Center, in Edwards, California, will host a tour from their aircraft hangar and Simulator Lab to learn about NASA’s X-Planes program.
2:50 p.m. -- Johnson Space Center in Houston will take viewers on a virtual exploration trip through the mockups of the International Space Station and inside the agency’s deep-space exploration vehicle, the Orion spacecraft.
3:10 p.m. -- Ames Research Center, in California’s Silicon Valley, will bring viewers into its Arc Jet Facility, a plasma wind tunnel used to simulate the extreme heat of spacecraft atmospheric entry.
3:30 p.m. -- Kennedy Space Center, in Florida, will bring visitors inside the Vehicle Assembly Building to learn about how NASA is preparing for the first launch of America's next big rocket, SLS.
3:50 p.m. -- Langley Research Center, in Hampton Virginia, will bring visitors inside its 14-by-22-foot wind tunnel, where aerodynamic projects are tested.
4:10 p.m. -- Goddard Space Flight Center, in Greenbelt, Maryland, will discuss the upcoming United States total solar eclipse and host its tour from the Space Weather Lab, a large multi-screen room where data from the sun is analyzed and studied.
4:30 p.m. -- Jet Propulsion Laboratory, in Pasadena, California, will bring viewers to the Spacecraft Assembly Facility to learn about robotic exploration of the solar system.
Also on Tuesday, at 5 p.m. NASA’s acting Chief Financial Officer Andrew Hunter will brief media on the agency’s 2018 budget proposal. To participate in this briefing, media must contact Karen Northon in the NASA Headquarters newsroom at 202-358-1540 or karen.northon@nasa.gov no later than 4 p.m. Tuesday.

Audio of the media teleconference will be streamed live on NASA's website at:

https://www.nasa.gov/live

NASA budget information will be available online at noon Tuesday at:

https://www.nasa.gov/budget

-end-

https://www.nasa.gov/press-release/nasa-to-discuss-fy2018-budget-proposal-provide-virtual-tours-of-centers

Online Chris Bergin

Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #104 on: 05/22/2017 03:22 PM »
This was forwarded to me (and most of the media), by SLS!

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: "Thomas Culligan" <tom@slsorionsuppliers.com>
Date: May 16, 2017 10:33 AM
Subject: Re: ACTION NEEDED - Senate SLS-Orion-GSDO Appropriations Letter
To: "Thomas Culligan" <tom@slsorionsuppliers.com>
Cc:

    All, I'm pleased to share a final copy of the Senate letter in support of SLS, Orion and GSDO funding for the FH 2018 Commerce-Justice-Science Appropriations bill, which was led by Sens. Hatch (R-UT) and Peters (D-MI).  Thanks to everyone who reached out to their Senate offices to urge them to sign on - we increased the number of signers from 16 last year to 23 this year, which is a significant improvement and represents nearly a quarter of the entire Senate. 

     

    A copy of the final signed letter is attached, and the list of Senators who signed this year is copied below.  Thanks again for all your efforts to support these programs during the FY 2018 Appropriations process. 

     

    Hatch (R-UT)

    Peters (D-MI)

    Feinstein (D-CA)

    Inhofe (R-OK)

    Wyden (D-OR)

    Durbin (D-IL)

    Nelson (D-FL)

    Stabenow (D-MI)

    Menendez (D-NJ)

    Brown (D-OH)

    Gardner (R-CO)

    Bennet (D-CO)

    Blumenthal (D-CA)

    Schatz (D-HI)

    Baldwin (D-WI)

    Kaine (D-VA)

    Markey (D-MA)

    Booker (D-NJ)

    Kennedy (R-LA)

    Cassidy (R-LA)

    Van Hollen (D-MD

    Hassan (D-NH)

    Cortez Masto (D-NV)

     

    On Fri, Apr 28, 2017 at 8:53 AM, Thomas Culligan <tom@slsorionsuppliers.com> wrote:

        All, After our great success last month on the House side with the FY18 Appropriations letter receiving 144 signatures, we now need your help reaching out to your Senators in support of the letter below, which is being circulated by Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-UT) and Sen. Gary Peters (D-MI).   

         

        URGENT REQUEST:  Please forward the letter below to the Senate staff you met with, and urge them to contact Matt Jensen (Matt_Jensen@hatch.senate.gov) in Sen. Hatch's office or Sydney Paul (Sydney_Paul@peters.senate.gov) in Sen. Peters office to sign on by next Thursday, MAY 4.

         

        All of the Senate offices have already received an e-mail from Sen. Hatch's office inviting them to sign the letter, but your outreach, support and reminder will be essential to getting many of these Senators to sign on.  If you have any questions about the contact information for the Senate staff you met with in February, please e-mail your team lead for assistance. 

         

        Thanks again for your continued support for the SLS-Orion-GSDO programs, and please don't hesitate to contact me with any questions.  - Tom

         

         

        April 27, 2017

         

        The Honorable Richard Shelby

        Chairman, Subcommittee on Commerce, Justice, and Science

        Senate Committee on Appropriations

        S-128 The Capitol

        Washington, D.C. 20510

         

        The Honorable Jeanne Shaheen

        Ranking Member, Subcommittee on Commerce, Justice, and Science

        Senate Committee on Appropriations

        S-146 A The Capitol

        Washington, D.C. 20510

         

        Dear Chairman Shelby and Ranking Member Shaheen:

        American-led exploration of deep space is vital to inspiring our future innovators and growing our economy through technological innovation and development.  NASA and its industry partners are currently building the infrastructure today that will extend human presence into deep space:

        ·      the Orion Spacecraft – the only spacecraft capable of taking humans to multiple deep space destinations;

        ·      the Space Launch System (SLS) – the most powerful rocket ever built;

        ·      and the Exploration Ground Systems (EGS) that will support these unique national assets.

        For the first time in nearly 50 years of human space exploration, interplanetary destinations – including the moon, moons of Mars, and Mars itself – are within reach of American astronauts.  We believe SLS, Orion and EGS are the cornerstone of our nation’s human space exploration enterprise and a source of national pride.  We also recognize the critical contributions of the more than ten thousand Americans working at supplier companies in every state building key components for these new systems.  Over the 15th and 16th of February this year, hundreds of these individuals traveled to Washington, DC – as they have every year for the past 5 years – to advocate for the funding levels necessary to ensure America remains the world leader in space exploration.

        We respectfully urge your continued support for the appropriations necessary to meet the EM-1 and EM-2 launch schedules.  The Appropriations Committee has repeatedly worked to ensure that these programs have sufficient funding, and we urge you to continue this commitment in the FY 2018 Commerce-Justice-Science Appropriations bill

        Sincerely,

         

         



     

    --

     

    Tom Culligan

Offline Proponent

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #105 on: 05/22/2017 05:21 PM »

...

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: "Thomas Culligan" <tom@slsorionsuppliers.com>
Date: May 16, 2017 10:33 AM
Subject: Re: ACTION NEEDED - Senate SLS-Orion-GSDO Appropriations Letter

...

    A copy of the final signed letter is attached, and the list of Senators who signed this year is copied below.  Thanks again for all your efforts to support these programs during the FY 2018 Appropriations process....

Why aren't Sens. Cruz and Nelson among the signatories?  They are among SLS's biggest, uh, boosters.

Offline rayleighscatter

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #106 on: 05/22/2017 08:20 PM »

...

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: "Thomas Culligan" <tom@slsorionsuppliers.com>
Date: May 16, 2017 10:33 AM
Subject: Re: ACTION NEEDED - Senate SLS-Orion-GSDO Appropriations Letter

...

    A copy of the final signed letter is attached, and the list of Senators who signed this year is copied below.  Thanks again for all your efforts to support these programs during the FY 2018 Appropriations process....

Why aren't Sens. Cruz and Nelson among the signatories?  They are among SLS's biggest, uh, boosters.

Nelson is on there, 7th down.

Offline yg1968

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #107 on: 05/23/2017 05:43 PM »
FY18 NASA Budget documents are online:

https://www.nasa.gov/news/budget/index.html
« Last Edit: 05/23/2017 05:44 PM by yg1968 »

Offline jacqmans

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #108 on: 05/23/2017 07:09 PM »
May 23, 2017
RELEASE 17-050

NASA Acting Administrator Statement on Fiscal Year 2018 Budget Proposal

The following is a statement from NASA acting Administrator Robert Lightfoot on the Fiscal Year 2018 budget proposal released Tuesday:

“Today, President Trump released his Fiscal Year 2018 budget request for the federal government. At $19.1 billion, we have a very positive budget that retains the same parameters we saw in March, and which reflects the president’s confidence in our direction and the importance of everything we’ve been achieving.

“I want to reiterate how proud I am of the NASA team and its hard work. It’s making a real difference in this country and around the world. NASA missions inspire the next generation, inject innovation into the national economy, provide critical information needed to address national challenges, and support global engagement and international leadership.

“As the President has said, American footprints on distant worlds are not too big a dream. NASA is executing programs, step by step, to make this dream a reality, as well as the broader quest to explore and understand the universe. We’ve had a horizon goal for some time now of reaching Mars, and this budget sustains that work and also provides the resources to keep exploring our solar system and look beyond it. And, it enables us to keep innovating and creating the technologies that will take us to deep space and improve the aeronautics systems on which all of us rely.

“The hard choices are still there, and we can’t do everything. But we can certainly do a lot, and each member of the NASA team, every day, is helping to create the future.

“As NASA approaches its 60th anniversary in 2018, the Fiscal Year 2018 budget request will maintain NASA’s place as the global leader in space. We appreciate the bipartisan commitment to our continuity of purpose. It’s essential that our near term work be stable as we plan for the long term and look toward the next horizons, and this budget helps us do that. The NASA Transition Authorization Act and the Fiscal Year 2017 appropriation we recently received also represent important contributions to that continuity.

“Working with commercial partners, NASA will fly astronauts from American soil on the first new crew transportation systems in a generation in the next couple of years. We are continuing the development of solar electric propulsion for use on future human and robotic missions. NASA is fabricating and assembling the systems to launch humans into lunar orbit by 2023. Our budget request supports progress toward these and many other major milestones as part of the diverse portfolio of work we execute as we explore, discover, and develop on behalf of the American people.

“We are ending formulation of a mission to an asteroid, known as the Asteroid Redirect Mission, but many of the central technologies in development for that mission will continue, as they constitute vital capabilities needed for future human deep space missions.

“While this budget no longer supports the formal Office of Education, NASA will continue to inspire the next generation through its missions and the many ways that our work excites and encourages discovery by learners and educators. We are as committed to inspiring the next generation as ever. We’re going to engage the public in the compelling story of exploration by the successful and safe execution of our missions, which is where our focus has to be.

“At the same time, we’re going to take this opportunity for NASA to revisit the public engagement and outreach activities that take place on the ground at centers every day to ensure that we are leveraging the synergies between education and outreach to facilitate meaningful connections.

“All the details online, but I did want to mention some other specifics about the budget. In Science, for instance, this budget supports about 100 space missions -- 40 missions currently preparing for launch and 60 operating missions. The Solar Probe Plus (SPP), Transiting Exoplanet Survey Satellite (TESS), the InSight Mars lander,   and the James Webb Space Telescope are on track to launch in 2018, and the next Mars rover is on pace for a 2020 launch.

“While we are not proposing to move forward with Orbiting Carbon Observatory-3 (OCO-3), Plankton, Aerosol, Cloud, ocean Ecosystem (PACE), Climate Absolute Radiance and Refractivity Observatory Pathfinder (CLARREO PF), and the Radiation Budget Instrument (RBI), this budget still includes significant Earth Science efforts, including 18 Earth observing missions in space as well as airborne missions.

“The budget keeps us on track for the next selection for the New Frontiers program, and includes formulation of a mission to Jupiter’s moon Europa. It supports research on space weather and upcoming Heliophysics missions, and continues support for the Wide-Field Infrared Survey Telescope, or WFIRST, which will eventually succeed Webb. Our work in science leads the world in its size, scope and output.

“NASA’s Aeronautics research program advances U.S. global leadership by developing and transferring key technologies to make aviation safer, greener, and more efficient. This budget takes the next significant step in the New Aviation Horizons initiative -- the bold series of experimental aircraft known as X-planes -- and systems demonstrations towards revolutionary aircraft and improving the efficiency of the national air transportation system.

“Our Space Technology program enables rapid development and incorporation of transformative space technologies in NASA’s future missions, which increases our nation’s overall capabilities and helps industry, as well. The budget supports our diverse portfolio, which is creating a technology pipeline to solve the most difficult challenges in space, from solar electric propulsion to laser communications and cross-cutting technologies that benefit our work across the board.

“We have a budget that also provides the necessary resources in the coming year to support our plans to send humans to Mars orbit in the 2030s. The European service module will be delivered to the Kennedy Space Center for integration with Orion in 2018.  Prototype ground testing of habitat modules under our broad area announcement activity will happen in 2018.

“The International Space Station, commercial crew and cargo, and the Space Launch System and Orion all continue to advance our future in space with this budget. Having an additional NASA crew member on the space station will greatly enhance the research and advancement towards exploration. The station continues to create new opportunities for collaboration with industry and supports public-private partnerships for exploration systems that will extend human presence into the solar system. So there’s a lot to look forward to.

“The program of exploration and discovery we propose with this budget should be a source of pride for all Americans. The impact of NASA’s work is immense, and we have great momentum and support to keep moving ahead.”

For NASA’s Fiscal Year 2018 budget materials, visit:

https://www.nasa.gov/budget

Offline theonlyspace

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #109 on: 05/23/2017 07:23 PM »
'''Funding for NASA’s education office will be cut from $100 million to $37 million, enough to close down operations across the agency.''''  My querry is the education office  will receive 37 million dollars, why is it going to shut down?  37 million should be plenty for several years to fund NASA public relations  informing the public of their activities. Or do they have such high wages and fancy offices it costs more than   37 million in a year just to keep the lights on and doors unlocked?? That seems unbelievable. What will the 37 million be spent on then ,unemployment checks and locking the offices doors? It just seems so wasteful

Online AncientU

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #110 on: 05/23/2017 09:08 PM »
Quote
NASA is fabricating and assembling the systems to launch humans into lunar orbit by 2023.

First time 2021 was dropped as party line AFAIK, though everyone knew it was coming.
"If we shared everything [we are working on] people would think we are insane!"
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Offline yg1968

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #111 on: 05/23/2017 11:36 PM »
Acting Administrator Robert Lightfoot Discusses NASA’s FY 2018 NASA Budget Request:

« Last Edit: 05/27/2017 01:15 PM by yg1968 »

Offline yg1968

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #112 on: 05/23/2017 11:40 PM »
NASA FY18 Budget Media Teleconference May 23 2017:



Slides are available at this link:
https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/atoms/files/fy_2018_budget_presentation_media_telecon.pdf
« Last Edit: 05/23/2017 11:41 PM by yg1968 »

Offline woods170

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #113 on: 05/24/2017 05:52 AM »
Quote
NASA is fabricating and assembling the systems to launch humans into lunar orbit by 2023.

First time 2021 was dropped as party line AFAIK, though everyone knew it was coming.
The year 2021 for EM-2 was based on getting EM-1 of the ground in early 2018 at the latest. We all know that EM-1 has moved into the latter half of 2019 recently. The gap between EM-1 and EM-2 has been four (4) years for ages now so EM-2 is shifting to the right as much as EM-1 is shifting to the right.

Online AncientU

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #114 on: 05/24/2017 09:48 AM »
Quote
NASA is fabricating and assembling the systems to launch humans into lunar orbit by 2023.

First time 2021 was dropped as party line AFAIK, though everyone knew it was coming.
The year 2021 for EM-2 was based on getting EM-1 of the ground in early 2018 at the latest. We all know that EM-1 has moved into the latter half of 2019 recently. The gap between EM-1 and EM-2 has been four (4) years for ages now so EM-2 is shifting to the right as much as EM-1 is shifting to the right.

Right, we've seen this coming for a long time, but new dates have not been official party line.  Now, '2023 flying humans' is the new party line... maybe.  But 2023 is EM-2 (EUS/Europa Clipper) as you've explained. 
Humans get EM-3.

So, as I said (to howls of protest) a few months ago, crew will fly in 2024-2025.
If EM-1 doesn't slip.  Again.

This really locks them into a three-year or so gap between EM-1 and the subsequent launch.  Can't start modifying the ML until EM-1 flies, no matter how late it slides into 2019 or 2020.  (Once you start the mods, a 'cargo' launch can't fly using a second ICPS -- don't know if that was the plan, though.)  Probably pushes the first manned flight to 2024/2025.  There was talk of compressing the big interval between EM-1 and EM-2 (so that the manned flight -- EM-3 -- wouldn't also slip), but now that seems unlikely.

Thread: Will NASA put crew on EM-1?
I voted no because I don't think SLS will ever fly with crew.

Edit: Added quotes
« Last Edit: 05/24/2017 10:28 AM by AncientU »
"If we shared everything [we are working on] people would think we are insane!"
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Offline Star One

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #115 on: 05/24/2017 10:23 AM »
Quote
NASA is fabricating and assembling the systems to launch humans into lunar orbit by 2023.

First time 2021 was dropped as party line AFAIK, though everyone knew it was coming.
The year 2021 for EM-2 was based on getting EM-1 of the ground in early 2018 at the latest. We all know that EM-1 has moved into the latter half of 2019 recently. The gap between EM-1 and EM-2 has been four (4) years for ages now so EM-2 is shifting to the right as much as EM-1 is shifting to the right.

Right, we've seen this coming for a long time, but new dates have not been official party line.  Now, '2023 flying humans' is the new party line... maybe.  But 2023 is EM-2 (EUS/Europa Clipper) as you've explained. 
Humans get EM-3.

So, as I said (to howls of protest) a few months ago, crew will fly in 2024-2025.
If EM-1 doesn't slip.  Again.

This really locks them into a three-year or so gap between EM-1 and the subsequent launch.  Can't start modifying the ML until EM-1 flies, no matter how late it slides into 2019 or 2020.  (Once you start the mods, a 'cargo' launch can't fly using a second ICPS -- don't know if that was the plan, though.)  Probably pushes the first manned flight to 2024/2025.  There was talk of compressing the big interval between EM-1 and EM-2 (so that the manned flight -- EM-3 -- wouldn't also slip), but now that seems unlikely.

Edit: Added quote

Time not long now I think for Europa Clipper to look for another launcher.

Online AncientU

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #116 on: 05/24/2017 11:09 AM »
Every year it will become increasingly difficult to plan around SLS availability, since every year that passes makes the program less viable.  With others' plans for early 2020s, hard to see the role SLS/Orion will play.
« Last Edit: 05/24/2017 11:09 AM by AncientU »
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Offline yg1968

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #117 on: 05/24/2017 02:04 PM »
During the media teleconference, the NASA CFO said that it will be a challenge for the Europa clipper to meet the 2022 deadline set by Congress (because of its funding).
« Last Edit: 05/24/2017 02:16 PM by yg1968 »

Offline yg1968

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #118 on: 05/24/2017 02:35 PM »
Here is a very good summary by Jeff Foust of the President's detailed FY18 budget:

http://spacenews.com/white-house-proposes-19-1-billion-nasa-budget-cuts-earth-science-and-education/
« Last Edit: 05/24/2017 02:37 PM by yg1968 »

Offline vulture4

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #119 on: 05/29/2017 02:19 AM »
I agree. The cuts to Earth science and observation are substantial. In many cases these are operational programs that are porducing useful data at modest cost. It's just difficult to see any purpose here other than to try to hobble climate science.

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