Author Topic: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request  (Read 22888 times)

Offline blah

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #20 on: 03/16/2017 04:22 PM »

What's it's secondary objectives & that still doesn't answer why try cutting such a piffling amount, it looks silly or even petty?

Earth viewing.  The primary mission is space weather monitoring and that is still funded.

Thanks for the info. Obviously knew about the space weather part of it but didn't realise that there was a dedicated secondary mission on it.

I believe this secondary mission was Al Gore's contribution  ;)

https://www.algore.com/project/the-deep-space-climate-observatory

Offline Jim

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #21 on: 03/16/2017 04:23 PM »

What's it's secondary objectives & that still doesn't answer why try cutting such a piffling amount, it looks silly or even petty?

Earth viewing.  The primary mission is space weather monitoring and that is still funded.

Thanks for the info. Obviously knew about the space weather part of it but didn't realise that there was a dedicated secondary mission on it.

As Goresat, the two Earth viewing instruments (NISTAR and EPIC) were the primary mission and the three instruments grouped as PlasMag were secondary. The roles are reversed for DSCOVR.
« Last Edit: 03/16/2017 04:24 PM by Jim »

Offline yg1968

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #22 on: 03/16/2017 04:40 PM »
Yep. But I hoped things like this would escape his notice.

Again: forest for the trees.

Or to belabor the point: despite dire predictions that Trump was going to wipe out NASA Earth science, or transfer it all to NOAA, he actually only proposed a 5% cut for NASA Earth science. That's it. 5%. The question that everybody should be asking right now is why was that cut so small?

I already offered you an explanation in the other thread: Republicans aren't against gathering collecting Earth science data, they are against NASA being used as an advocate against climate change.
« Last Edit: 03/16/2017 04:40 PM by yg1968 »

Offline JH

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #23 on: 03/16/2017 05:39 PM »
By specifically removing the $1.2M for DSCOVR's earth viewing instruments, they are hoping to block access to full disk irradiance data (basically, data that shows that the planet is now taking in more energy than it is losing).

Offline Star One

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #24 on: 03/16/2017 05:55 PM »
By specifically removing the $1.2M for DSCOVR's earth viewing instruments, they are hoping to block access to full disk irradiance data (basically, data that shows that the planet is now taking in more energy than it is losing).

Let's see if they can get this cut past the generals as by the sound of it they may face a degree of resistance on this.

Offline RonM

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #25 on: 03/16/2017 07:30 PM »
By specifically removing the $1.2M for DSCOVR's earth viewing instruments, they are hoping to block access to full disk irradiance data (basically, data that shows that the planet is now taking in more energy than it is losing).

Let's see if they can get this cut past the generals as by the sound of it they may face a degree of resistance on this.

Generals? Nope, only members of Congress matter in this discussion. While the USA has the largest military budget in the world by a wide margin, we're still a civilian government.

As I've written before, this Presidential budget for NASA doesn't matter. Congress will stay their course and the Administration won't interfere, especially since the two are almost in complete agreement.

Online Coastal Ron

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #26 on: 03/16/2017 07:39 PM »
I already offered you an explanation in the other thread: Republicans aren't against gathering collecting Earth science data, they are against NASA being used as an advocate against climate change.

NASA doesn't advocate, it only discovers and explains.

Those that advocate against the idea that humans are contributing to climate change don't want any data to be revealed, since others can use that data.  Remove the data, then you remove the ability to point out changes are happening...
If we don't continuously lower the cost to access space, how are we ever going to afford to expand humanity out into space?

Offline Star One

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #27 on: 03/16/2017 08:12 PM »
By specifically removing the $1.2M for DSCOVR's earth viewing instruments, they are hoping to block access to full disk irradiance data (basically, data that shows that the planet is now taking in more energy than it is losing).

Let's see if they can get this cut past the generals as by the sound of it they may face a degree of resistance on this.

Generals? Nope, only members of Congress matter in this discussion. While the USA has the largest military budget in the world by a wide margin, we're still a civilian government.

As I've written before, this Presidential budget for NASA doesn't matter. Congress will stay their course and the Administration won't interfere, especially since the two are almost in complete agreement.

Well not in agreement on everything.

Quote
Jeff Foust‏ @jeff_foust

@ZachInFlight Europa Clipper is not being cut. What’s not being funded is a follow-on lander (and Rep. Culberson will likely rescue it.)

https://mobile.twitter.com/jeff_foust/status/842421466184400896

Offline incoming

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #28 on: 03/16/2017 08:22 PM »
By specifically removing the $1.2M for DSCOVR's earth viewing instruments, they are hoping to block access to full disk irradiance data (basically, data that shows that the planet is now taking in more energy than it is losing).

The DSCOVR thing is just plain weird.  The budget doesn't say anything about cancelling the mission (the spacecraft is already up there and functioning), just the Earth observing part. We have a spacecraft up there with a camera and some other instrumentation pointing at Earth, as well as taking some important space weather measurements.  And they just want to turn off the camera?  What sense does that make?  It'll save almost nothing in the grand scheme of things. It's almost like they really are afraid of what the camera will show.

Also - there's been a bit of confusion on CLAREO, but by my reading of the white house release it's just the pathfinder/tech demo on ISS that's being cancelled, not the actual mission.



Offline yg1968

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #29 on: 03/16/2017 08:45 PM »
Yep. But I hoped things like this would escape his notice.

Again: forest for the trees.

Or to belabor the point: despite dire predictions that Trump was going to wipe out NASA Earth science, or transfer it all to NOAA, he actually only proposed a 5% cut for NASA Earth science. That's it. 5%. The question that everybody should be asking right now is why was that cut so small?

I already offered you an explanation in the other thread: Republicans aren't against gathering collecting Earth science data, they are against NASA being used as an advocate against climate change.

That doesn't explain gutting NOAA, which mostly doesn't do "advocacy against climate change." They do weather satellites.

From what I read, most of the NOAA cuts are also global warming related.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/proposed-budget-for-commerce-would-cut-funds-for-noaa/2017/03/15/6c93d864-09ad-11e7-93dc-00f9bdd74ed1_story.html
« Last Edit: 03/16/2017 08:50 PM by yg1968 »

Offline Danderman

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #30 on: 03/16/2017 09:23 PM »

What's it's secondary objectives & that still doesn't answer why try cutting such a piffling amount, it looks silly or even petty?

Earth viewing.  The primary mission is space weather monitoring and that is still funded.

Apparently, the Earth isn't that important.

Offline JH

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #31 on: 03/16/2017 09:54 PM »
The DSCOVR thing is just plain weird.  The budget doesn't say anything about cancelling the mission (the spacecraft is already up there and functioning), just the Earth observing part. We have a spacecraft up there with a camera and some other instrumentation pointing at Earth, as well as taking some important space weather measurements.  And they just want to turn off the camera?  What sense does that make?  It'll save almost nothing in the grand scheme of things. It's almost like they really are afraid of what the camera will show.

The token monetary savings are a fig leaf. The goal is to hamper the accumulation of evidence of climate change.
« Last Edit: 03/16/2017 09:57 PM by JH »

Offline yg1968

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #32 on: 03/16/2017 11:06 PM »
If you wanted an explanation for the cuts to climate funding, here it is:

White House: Climate funding is ‘a waste of your money’
http://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/324358-white-house-says-climate-funding-is-a-waste-of-your-money

Offline yg1968

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #33 on: 03/17/2017 01:29 AM »
Yes, I saw that. I guess that there is no easy way to cut 17% of NOAA's budget. The budget has already been called DOA by some in Congress. So we'll see what happens.
« Last Edit: 03/17/2017 01:30 AM by yg1968 »

Offline Proponent

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #34 on: 03/17/2017 09:33 AM »
If you wanted an explanation for the cuts to climate funding, here it is:

White House: Climate funding is ‘a waste of your money’
http://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/324358-white-house-says-climate-funding-is-a-waste-of-your-money

It sounds like Trump wants to cut out anything to do in any way with climate change (at least outside of DoD; his own Secretary of Defense has said that DoD needs to prepare for climate change).  That's pretty radical; not only does Trump seek to avoid gathering data, but he may not even want to fund efforts to cope with climate change.  That's a step beyond even his own EPA chief, who does not claim that climate change is not occurring, but only that it is largely a natural phenomenon.

We'll have to see how far other Republicans go along with this.
« Last Edit: 03/17/2017 10:02 AM by Proponent »

Offline Proponent

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #35 on: 03/17/2017 12:45 PM »
The DSCOVR thing is just plain weird.  The budget doesn't say anything about cancelling the mission (the spacecraft is already up there and functioning), just the Earth observing part. We have a spacecraft up there with a camera and some other instrumentation pointing at Earth, as well as taking some important space weather measurements.  And they just want to turn off the camera?  What sense does that make?  It'll save almost nothing in the grand scheme of things. It's almost like they really are afraid of what the camera will show.

The token monetary savings are a fig leaf. The goal is to hamper the accumulation of evidence of climate change.

Though Triana was a NASA project, canceled under Bush II, it was DoD that resurrected it as DSCOVR, was it not?  Didn't DoD have a use for DSCOVR's Earth-viewing instruments?

Offline Jim

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #36 on: 03/17/2017 01:59 PM »

Though Triana was a NASA project, canceled under Bush II, it was DoD that resurrected it as DSCOVR, was it not?  Didn't DoD have a use for DSCOVR's Earth-viewing instruments?

NOAA resurrected it and DOD has no need for earth viewing instruments.

Offline jongoff

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #37 on: 03/17/2017 02:25 PM »
Would very much like to hear more details on the "initiatives that use smaller, less expensive satellites to advance science," and the refueling demo, if folks here are "in the know."  Thanks!

The refueling demo is Goddard's Restore-L mission that was being developed to restore a LandSat Earth Observation spacecraft.

~Jon

Offline cscott

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Re: NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #38 on: 03/17/2017 04:19 PM »


This week's Space to Ground video is all about the cargo, internal and external, Dragon is bringing back:



Does anyone know if these "Space to Ground" videos are part of the "education" budget zeroed out in the budget request?

Offline Star One

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NASA FY 2018 Budget Request
« Reply #39 on: 03/18/2017 09:55 AM »
Trump’s biggest budget cuts to NASA: ranked

Quote
But packed within NASA’s small budget decrease are some pretty sizable cuts. A few major upcoming missions are canceled, and NASA’s entire education program, which is responsible for outreach and grants, is eliminated. The budget request also proposes wasting technologies already in space.

Some of these cuts could have a positive impact on NASA, while others could deprive students and the science community of the space agency’s expertise. Here are the biggest cuts to NASA ranked from “This is good actually” to “What the hell are you doing?”

In regards to cutting the education budget.

Quote
“Aerospace is a growing sector that provides good quality jobs here in the US. We want to get students from all backgrounds trained in these fields,” says Larson. “STEM education is critical to our long-term competitiveness as a country, and it's interesting in a year where a movie like Hidden Figures was on the national stage that the administration would de-emphasize the role NASA plays in getting kids excited about space.”

http://www.theverge.com/2017/3/17/14947444/trump-budget-plan-cuts-nasa-asteroid-mission-europa
« Last Edit: 03/18/2017 10:13 AM by Star One »

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