Author Topic: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream  (Read 5741 times)

Offline redliox

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2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« on: 02/08/2017 10:48 PM »
The workshop for discussing 2020's landing site is starting, scheduled for the 8th to 10th this month.  Here's the website related to it: http://marsnext.jpl.nasa.gov/workshops/wkshp_2017_02.cfm
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Offline Blackstar

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Offline Dalhousie

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #2 on: 02/13/2017 07:32 AM »
1 - Jezero

2 - NW Sytris

3 - Gusev Crater
"There is nobody who is a bigger fan of sending robots to Mars than me... But I believe firmly that the best, the most comprehensive, the most successful exploration will be done by humans" Steve Squyres

Offline redliox

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #3 on: 02/13/2017 07:45 AM »
I'm impressed Gusev Crater survived the semi-final cut.  I'm sadded Melas was cut, but as much as I favor Valles Marineris I'm not surprised.  The more I read about Jezero the more intriguing it sounds; considering it was a lake on the edge of what would have been the sea Isidis Planitia with lakes flowing through it was bound to have had a great deal of history happening.
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Online FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #4 on: 02/13/2017 06:23 PM »

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #5 on: 02/13/2017 10:36 PM »

Offline Dalhousie

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #6 on: 02/13/2017 10:55 PM »
I'm impressed Gusev Crater survived the semi-final cut.  I'm sadded Melas was cut, but as much as I favor Valles Marineris I'm not surprised.  The more I read about Jezero the more intriguing it sounds; considering it was a lake on the edge of what would have been the sea Isidis Planitia with lakes flowing through it was bound to have had a great deal of history happening.

Not surprising though. It has the best evidence to date for past life on Mars
"There is nobody who is a bigger fan of sending robots to Mars than me... But I believe firmly that the best, the most comprehensive, the most successful exploration will be done by humans" Steve Squyres

Offline Phil Stooke

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #7 on: 02/14/2017 01:39 AM »
Well, good evidence for hot springs anyway.  So you could say evidence for a habitable environment.  But evidence for life, no.  Nowhere on Mars has that (yet).

Offline Dalhousie

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #8 on: 02/14/2017 04:19 AM »
Well, good evidence for hot springs anyway.  So you could say evidence for a habitable environment.  But evidence for life, no.  Nowhere on Mars has that (yet).

I have worked on quite a few ancient and modern hot spring systems and the structures that Steve Ruff has identified do look very much like geyserites, which are microbial in origin.
"There is nobody who is a bigger fan of sending robots to Mars than me... But I believe firmly that the best, the most comprehensive, the most successful exploration will be done by humans" Steve Squyres

Offline Triptych

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #9 on: 02/26/2017 02:49 PM »
I dont agree with their landing sites. They should have chosen areas in Valles Marineris or Hellas Planitia- those areas have got the thickest atmosphere and possible liquid water / hydro-thermal sites.

Offline Zed_Noir

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #10 on: 02/27/2017 01:28 AM »
I dont agree with their landing sites. They should have chosen areas in Valles Marineris or Hellas Planitia- those areas have got the thickest atmosphere and possible liquid water / hydro-thermal sites.

They will not choose any site with any water presence. Since they might find signs of life. Causing the planetary protection crowd will scream for Mars to be off limits to further "Human contamination".

Offline Dalhousie

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #11 on: 02/28/2017 12:25 AM »
I dont agree with their landing sites. They should have chosen areas in Valles Marineris or Hellas Planitia- those areas have got the thickest atmosphere and possible liquid water / hydro-thermal sites.

They will not choose any site with any water presence. Since they might find signs of life. Causing the planetary protection crowd will scream for Mars to be off limits to further "Human contamination".

One of the mission goals is to find evidence of past life.  That avoids the need to interact with special areas (those with liquid water potential).  If there has every been life on Mars it almost certainly would have been more widespread in the past.  So much easier to find and with fewer hassles.

« Last Edit: 03/29/2017 07:27 PM by Dalhousie »
"There is nobody who is a bigger fan of sending robots to Mars than me... But I believe firmly that the best, the most comprehensive, the most successful exploration will be done by humans" Steve Squyres

Offline Dalhousie

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #12 on: 02/28/2017 12:35 AM »
I dont agree with their landing sites. They should have chosen areas in Valles Marineris or Hellas Planitia- those areas have got the thickest atmosphere and possible liquid water / hydro-thermal sites.

Both parts of Hellas and the Vallis Marineris system have been  considered.  Hellas was ruled out at the second workshop on science grounds and ,  Melas Chasma at the third workshop.

Since the focus is on past life, the present possibility of liquid water was not a factor and, as these would be special regions, would extra complexity and risk to the mission.  The mostly likely places to find liquid water are not the depths of Hellas or Vallis Marineris anyway, but the top of ice table north of about 50 degrees latitude.
"There is nobody who is a bigger fan of sending robots to Mars than me... But I believe firmly that the best, the most comprehensive, the most successful exploration will be done by humans" Steve Squyres

Offline Blackstar

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #13 on: 03/28/2017 03:02 PM »
Currently at Space Science Week. Just heard an interesting presentation on the NASA Mars program. Some discussion of the connection of Mars 2020 to Mars sample return. I'll post the slides later, but the presenter got into things like recent tests for the ascent vehicle from Mars (they are now looking at parafin-based fuels because they have better cold storage handling qualities).

Some neat stuff, and it makes me think that maybe we need a dedicated thread here devoted to the connection between Mars 2020 and sample return.

Offline Dalhousie

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #14 on: 03/29/2017 04:16 AM »
Currently at Space Science Week. Just heard an interesting presentation on the NASA Mars program. Some discussion of the connection of Mars 2020 to Mars sample return. I'll post the slides later, but the presenter got into things like recent tests for the ascent vehicle from Mars (they are now looking at parafin-based fuels because they have better cold storage handling qualities).

Paraffin as in kerosene or paraffin as in paraffin wax? If the later, does this mean a hybrid propulsion system?

Quote
Some neat stuff, and it makes me think that maybe we need a dedicated thread here devoted to the connection between Mars 2020 and sample return.

Great idea.
« Last Edit: 03/29/2017 07:26 PM by Dalhousie »
"There is nobody who is a bigger fan of sending robots to Mars than me... But I believe firmly that the best, the most comprehensive, the most successful exploration will be done by humans" Steve Squyres

Offline Blackstar

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #15 on: 03/29/2017 03:35 PM »

Paraffin as in kerosene or paraffin as in paraffin wax? If the later, does this mean a hybrid propulsion syste,?


Yeah, hybrid.

There's also a very interesting development concerning parachutes. More on that later.

Offline Blackstar

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #16 on: 03/29/2017 09:15 PM »
So here's the interesting thing on parachutes:

Remember the reentry vehicle tests they did off Hawaii? Remember how they did two tests and both times the parachutes failed? It turns out that NASA used the same software to predict what would happen in those tests AND with the parachute used for Curiosity (and planned for Mars 2020). And here's the rub: the software predicted that the test parachutes and the Curiosity parachutes would be successful, but the test parachutes failed.

Which makes people a bit worried that the software is flawed, and that Curiosity may have gotten lucky. So they are going back and reevaluating that stuff.

Interesting, hmmmmm?

Offline Dalhousie

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #17 on: 03/30/2017 11:31 PM »
So here's the interesting thing on parachutes:

Remember the reentry vehicle tests they did off Hawaii? Remember how they did two tests and both times the parachutes failed? It turns out that NASA used the same software to predict what would happen in those tests AND with the parachute used for Curiosity (and planned for Mars 2020). And here's the rub: the software predicted that the test parachutes and the Curiosity parachutes would be successful, but the test parachutes failed.

Which makes people a bit worried that the software is flawed, and that Curiosity may have gotten lucky. So they are going back and reevaluating that stuff.

Interesting, hmmmmm?

Maybe the Hawaii chutes failed because of factors unrelated to the model.  Remember, modelling is not reality.
"There is nobody who is a bigger fan of sending robots to Mars than me... But I believe firmly that the best, the most comprehensive, the most successful exploration will be done by humans" Steve Squyres

Offline Blackstar

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #18 on: 03/31/2017 03:25 AM »
Maybe the Hawaii chutes failed because of factors unrelated to the model.  Remember, modelling is not reality.

The people who are experts in parachutes think they have a problem to solve.

Anybody here an expert on parachutes?

Offline Archibald

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Re: 2020 Landing Site Workshop Livestream
« Reply #19 on: 04/05/2017 03:49 PM »
http://www.4frontiers.us/dev/assets/Braun_Paper_on_Mars_EDL.pdf

Mars is hard, as Shiaparelli learned the hard way.

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