Author Topic: JP Aerospace updates  (Read 11591 times)

Online savuporo

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JP Aerospace updates
« on: 10/24/2011 08:12 PM »
Do not know if this really belongs there, but they are somewhat regularly flying to the edge of space.

They just posted this
Quote
Saturday Tandem soared to 95,085 feet.  She flew perfect. We fired up the propellers and drove her around then softly touched down three hours later.

Gorgeous pics !
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Online savuporo

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #1 on: 10/24/2011 08:32 PM »
Oh, and this is definitely "Commercial", as shown by the spectacular Samsung Mobile space balloon project they did.
See
http://www.adverblog.com/2011/07/15/samsung-spaceballoon/
http://space-balloon.net/index.html
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Offline QuantumG

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #2 on: 01/04/2012 02:58 AM »
John Powell will be on The Space Show, Feb. 28, 2012 at 7-8:30 PM PST.

http://www.thespaceshow.com/

Call in with your questions.
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Offline QuantumG

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #3 on: 02/28/2012 04:41 AM »
That's tomorrow. I expect a good review of what they've been up to in the last 2 years and some hints of what's next.
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Offline jpowell

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #4 on: 02/29/2012 12:56 AM »
It's an hour before the interview. Any questions anyone has before it starts?

JP

Online savuporo

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #5 on: 02/29/2012 01:25 AM »
I'd love to hear how the Samsung Galaxy project came about.
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Offline jpowell

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #6 on: 02/29/2012 01:31 AM »
Samsung has seen our work on the Toshiba Chair project. We got the call and pretty intensely worked for it.  It just won the Media Arts Festival's Grand prize in Tokyo. I just got back yesterday and am still a little jet lagged.

JP

Offline jpowell

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #7 on: 02/29/2012 02:01 AM »
Show Time!

JP

Offline QuantumG

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #8 on: 02/29/2012 03:38 AM »
Great show. People living in the sky is a concept that really sizzles.



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Offline jpowell

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #9 on: 02/29/2012 03:40 AM »
Thanks for calling in Trent!

Offline QuantumG

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #10 on: 10/03/2012 02:00 AM »
John Powell is on The Space Show again today, starting now.

Listen live: http://www.live365.com/stations/dlivingston?site=pro
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Offline StephenB

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #12 on: 12/12/2012 07:46 PM »
I've always thought that the idea was very cool. Balloon to the top of the atmosphere. Transfer to another craft that would use an ion drive to orbit. That could be a crazy reduction in surface to LEO costs.

I don't know how close we are to materials that would support large, long-lived balloon structures in space and near space.

Offline Moe Grills

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #13 on: 12/13/2012 11:41 PM »
95,000 feet?
That can be considered the boundary region near space.
Air density and pressure at those altitudes are comparable to a
good highschool vacuum belljar.

Offline Prober

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #14 on: 12/15/2012 01:25 PM »
3D printable files and more details are available.

http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=29378.msg992210#msg992210

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #15 on: 06/19/2015 09:17 AM »
JP Aerospace reached a significant milestone on Sunday:

Quote
Ascender 26 Flies!

Sunday June 14th our 26 foot Ascender airship took to the sky in Northern Nevada. This vehicle is smaller than some of our other vehicles, but it is extremely important. It is a test bed for an entire new internal structure and new internal helium cell interface.  It was intended to be a short hop to 1000 feet above the ground. However everything was going so well we let her run and flew to 2585 feet above the ground (6,708 feet above sea level). We had the combination inner cell fill volumes and balance off by about six ounces and we floated tail up about twenty degrees most of the way. It slowed the climb rate a bit but didn’t detract from an excellent flight.

The Ascender is a pretty complex system with four helium inner cells, servo control vents, an outer envelope pressurization system, a carbon truss internal structure, full unlink command and tracking system and independent backup gas release systems.  The real value of this test flight was learning to deploy this complex of a system in the field. We still have goose bumps on how great the flight went. This is the vehicle that paves the way for the next generation of Ascenders to come.

http://jpaerospace.com/blog/?p=6279

I believe they are now past the half-way point in their airship to orbit programme. It may not seem like it because so much of what they are doing is technology development (eg MHD generators) but with Ascender 26 now flying things feel a bit more concrete now.

Offline ChrisWilson68

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #16 on: 06/24/2015 05:51 AM »
I believe they are now past the half-way point in their airship to orbit programme. It may not seem like it because so much of what they are doing is technology development (eg MHD generators) but with Ascender 26 now flying things feel a bit more concrete now.

There's no way they're past the halfway point to orbit.  They don't even have a credible plan to get to orbit.

They've only done things so far that everyone always believed were doable.  They've never shown the slightest bit of evidence, or theory, for how they can do the part that most people who understand basic physics think they can't do: accelerating to orbital speed with a low-thrust engine.

Lift and drag scale together.  If they are in a part of the atmosphere where they are getting enough lift to significantly offset gravity, they will have significant drag.  And drag scales horribly with speed.  To get to orbital speed, they would need lift-to-drag that is orders of magnitude better than anything anyone knows.

Offline QuantumG

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #17 on: 06/24/2015 05:55 AM »
I'd say it a different way: if JP knows how to get this thing to orbit, he's not telling us :)

Last time I heard anyone ask (The Space Show, last year) he was saying he had ideas how to do it, but figured they were probably wrong, but was going to try anyway. i.e., it's a science project, not an engineering project.
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Offline R7

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #18 on: 06/24/2015 07:49 AM »
I'd say it a different way: if JP knows how to get this thing to orbit, he's not telling us :)

Last time I heard anyone ask (The Space Show, last year) he was saying he had ideas how to do it, but figured they were probably wrong, but was going to try anyway. i.e., it's a science project, not an engineering project.

Even rudimentary analysis is telling that the thing isn't going anywhere near orbit.

The science here is determining if valiant effort warms the hearts of well known physical laws making them look the other way just this one time.

Having said that the PongSat program for kids is great stuff.
AD·ASTRA·ASTRORVM·GRATIA

Offline QuantumG

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #19 on: 06/24/2015 11:33 AM »
Yes. Absolutely. Still, if he wants to try something new and it:s self-funding. Who cares?
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Offline R7

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #20 on: 06/24/2015 12:17 PM »
Yes. Absolutely. Still, if he wants to try something new and it:s self-funding. Who cares?

Having a bit too high hopes for atmospheric boyancy is not exactly a new thing (Francesco Lana de Terzi and his copper spheres with vacuum inside creating flying boats comes to mind). But you're right, if the money keeps coming then go for it. The Dark Sky Station could actually happen and be useful, this ascender ship is needed to get to it.

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Online FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #21 on: 09/13/2016 06:11 AM »
Quote
Ascender 36 flew to 13,512 feet on her 1st shakedown flight.

https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/775507858414718976

15 months since Ascender 26 flew (to half the altitude of this flight).

Edit: JP's blog entry

Quote
Last Sunday the Ascender 36 airship took off from our new launch facility in Northern Nevada.

The first flight of Ascender 36 was a real shake down. It took two hours more than planned to get her into the air. Instead of the forecasted calm morning, we had windy condition with the wind howling from the opposite direction. However when we got her into the air she put her nose up and screamed in to the sky. Our minimum goal was to fly to 7,000 feet. If all went well we would push bit by bit to 10,000 feet. Our goal climb rate was 400 feet per minute. In the end we climbed an average 582 feet per minute and flew all the way to 13,512 feet. We landed her 11 miles down range.
« Last Edit: 09/13/2016 06:14 AM by FutureSpaceTourist »

Offline Archibald

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #22 on: 09/13/2016 07:32 AM »
How strange ! Half UFO sighting, half Pink Floyd flying pig :)

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #23 on: 09/13/2016 08:25 AM »
Here are a couple of recent infographics from JP Aerospace.

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #24 on: 02/08/2017 06:23 AM »
Quote
Ascender 36 bring readied for launch at Area 42

https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/829139660920074240

Quote
Ascender 36 mission patch $20.   Help keep us flying! 
On Amazon: http://a.co/1ehiysz

https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/829143940829884416

Offline Danderman

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #25 on: 02/08/2017 06:39 AM »
Is that JP's submarine in the poster?

Online FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #26 on: 02/08/2017 06:52 AM »
Is that JP's submarine in the poster?

Yes (assuming you mean the picture above 'Integration')

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #27 on: 02/12/2017 05:30 AM »
Quote
Kevin with first inner helium cell for Ascender 9 airship.

https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/830602971100491776

As the number usually represents length in feet I think the '9' is a typo and should be '90'.

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #28 on: 02/13/2017 07:09 PM »
Hmm, seems the 9 isn't a typo after all

Quote
Sunday the team was working away on Ascender 9 airship. Here's a pic of the left wing.
https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/831230942106693635

Quote
Left tail of the Ascender 9 airship.
https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/831231070955712513

Quote
Test fitting a helium inner cell inside the Ascender 9 airship.
https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/831231245661175814

Quote
Inside the Ascender 9 airship outer envelope. Here's were inspecting the shell before anything is installed inside.
https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/831231843483545600

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #29 on: 02/13/2017 07:51 PM »
Missed one! Gives better idea of scale.

Quote
JP Aerospace, Sewing our way to space.

https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/831232772018614273

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #30 on: 03/15/2017 04:37 PM »
JP was on The Space Show again yesterday: http://thespaceshow.com/show/14-mar-2017/broadcast-2882-john-powell-jp-aerospace

Update on current/near-term:

- Their (small) hypersonic wind tunnel is operating at Mach 3.8 (was designed for Mach 4 but can't reach it)
- Over 100 firings now of their (tiny) plasma engines
- Looking to use air beam structures as the internal struss for an airship this fall
- Ascender 36 to fly again in about a month
- 100 ft airship [must be Ascender 9?]  this June, currently half-way through construction
- This airship will ultimately go to 45,000 ft
- Will start construction of 175ft Ascender later this year (may be September), which will ultimately fly to 65k – 70k ft
- Next dark star station flight probably not until late 2018
- Still making progress and no show stoppers yet. Now 4 full-time staff on board.

Longer-term:

- Will be 18+ months until an Ascender crosses 100k ft
- Plan for dark station at 140k ft is not to use exotic materials but to just replace components as required (eg internal floatation cells every 30 days). That way they can use cheap, readily available plastics and instead take the hit on maintenance
- JP Aerospace will look to do space tourism, but only once they have airships carrying people regularly
- The huge airship that climbs from the dark station to space wouldn’t break Mach 1 until past 200k, maybe 240k ft

Offline Proponent

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #31 on: 03/16/2017 01:31 PM »
Nothing about the airship-to-orbit idea?

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #32 on: 03/16/2017 05:43 PM »
Nothing about the airship-to-orbit idea?

It's nearly all airship-to-orbit! AtO is a 3 part system, Ascender is the first part, dark star station the second, the hypersonic wind tunnel supports research into active drag reduction for the third part etc.

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #33 on: 03/18/2017 11:07 AM »
Quote
We just finished the first truss section for Ascender 9.
Fifteen of these make up the keel.

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1224940220888486&id=164912363557949

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #34 on: 03/30/2017 08:11 PM »
A series of tweets by JP yesterday that give an overview of some of the different elements of what they are doing and how it fits into airship to orbit.

Only the first tweet had text:

Quote
How the research fits together.
https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/847195937717895168
https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/847196417000996864
https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/847196492410503168
https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/847196572366458881

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #35 on: 04/11/2017 06:59 PM »
One picture per tweet:

Quote
The Mach Glider program is a test series for Airship to Orbit development. Here's a block 4 Mach Glider being launched from a Tandem airship
https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/851862264697167872

Quote
Block 4 Mach Glider
https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/851862706458025984

Quote
Photo looking down on one of our early Mach Glider test flights.
https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/851866677524389888

Offline ChrisWilson68

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #36 on: 04/20/2017 09:34 AM »
Nothing about the airship-to-orbit idea?

It's nearly all airship-to-orbit! AtO is a 3 part system, Ascender is the first part, dark star station the second, the hypersonic wind tunnel supports research into active drag reduction for the third part etc.

Too bad the "active drag reduction" bit is the only part that really matters.  They need to reduce drag by a factor of a million.  In the real world, people go to great lengths to reduce drag by a few percentage points.

If they could actually achieve "active drag reduction" by the factor of a million they need to reach orbital speed, then they would revolutionize lots of much, much bigger industries than space launch.

They've provided no evidence so far to support the extraordinary claim they are able to pull off such a feat.

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #37 on: 04/21/2017 06:40 PM »
First time I remember seeing a size for Ascender 9:

Quote
The new keel truss for the Ascender 9 airship (the hundred footer). The truss weights only 21 pounds.
#jpaerospace

https://twitter.com/johnmpowell1/status/855479045961654272

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Re: JP Aerospace updates
« Reply #38 on: 04/21/2017 06:50 PM »
They need to reduce drag by a factor of a million. 

Why a million? IIRC JP has claimed the amount of drag reduction they need is similar to what was achieved in lab tests in the 60s/70s(?).  Obviously a lab is very different from an operational vehicle but it certainly didn't sound like JP thinks it's anything like a factor of a million.

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