Author Topic: Soyuz-2.1v - EMKA - Plesetsk - February 28, 2018  (Read 2923 times)

Offline Stan Black

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Soyuz-2.1v - EMKA - Plesetsk - February 28, 2018
« on: 10/21/2017 04:23 PM »
A new thread for the possible launch of a classified payload on late December or beginning of 2018 from the Plesetsk Cosmodrome.

Original posts were from Lotos launch thread that takes place on December 1, 2017.


Do we at least know by now what version of the Soyuz-2.1 will be used?  ;)
I would not be surprised if it is a Soyuz 2.1b. Many were ordered.

The rockets insured in this period are either 1b or 1v.
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=26990.msg1697849#msg1697849
« Last Edit: 01/11/2018 08:32 PM by Satori »

Online Olaf

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Re: Soyuz-2-1b - Lotos - Plesetsk - December 1, 2017
« Reply #1 on: 10/23/2017 07:18 AM »
It will be a 2-1v, but it is now delayed to November.
http://www.militarynews.ru/Story.asp?rid=1&nid=464881

Online Galactic Penguin SST

Re: Soyuz-2-1b - Lotos - Plesetsk - December 1, 2017
« Reply #2 on: 10/23/2017 07:32 AM »
It will be a 2-1v, but it is now delayed to November.
http://www.militarynews.ru/Story.asp?rid=1&nid=464881

Interesting to see that just a little bit earlier ago the next 2.1v wasn't going to fly until 2018: https://iz.ru/648333/dmitrii-strugovetc/novyi-soiuz-sbrosit-baki

Maybe the Russian military are now transferring the last payloads planned on Rockot (up to 3 flights as per reports before the Sentinel 5p launch) to the S-2.1v?
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Offline Nicolas PILLET

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Re: Soyuz-2-1b - Lotos - Plesetsk - December 1, 2017
« Reply #3 on: 10/23/2017 12:54 PM »
Tentatively scheduled for 18th November.
Nicolas PILLET
Kosmonavtika : The French site on Russian Space

Offline Nicolas PILLET

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Re: Soyuz-2-1b - Lotos - Plesetsk - December 1, 2017
« Reply #4 on: 10/24/2017 09:32 PM »
Launch delayed indefinitely.
Nicolas PILLET
Kosmonavtika : The French site on Russian Space

Online Phillip Clark

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Re: Soyuz-2-1b - Lotos - Plesetsk - December 1, 2017
« Reply #5 on: 10/25/2017 01:44 AM »
Launch delayed indefinitely.

Any indications why?
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Offline Alter Sachse

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Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Soyuz-2-1b - Lotos - Plesetsk - December 1, 2017
« Reply #7 on: 11/03/2017 04:08 PM »
see reply # 1
It seems to be this satellite (Liana/Lotos or "Lotos FO")
http://www.russianspaceweb.com/2017.html#milsat
This report is about a Soyuz-2.1B not 2.1V
Something is wrong.
25.10. is mentioned (-->2.1v)
and Lotos is too heavy for 2.1v...
2.1B must be another launch ?
« Last Edit: 11/03/2017 04:09 PM by Alter Sachse »

Online Phillip Clark

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Re: Soyuz-2-1b - Lotos - Plesetsk - December 1, 2017
« Reply #8 on: 11/03/2017 04:23 PM »
see reply # 1
It seems to be this satellite (Liana/Lotos or "Lotos FO")
http://www.russianspaceweb.com/2017.html#milsat
This report is about a Soyuz-2.1B not 2.1V
Something is wrong.
25.10. is mentioned (-->2.1v)
and Lotos is too heavy for 2.1v...
2.1B must be another launch ?

I think that the confusion is because originally it wasn't known which version of the Soyuz-2 would be used on this launch.   When it became clear it was to be a Soyuz-2-1V that narrowed down the payload which could be carried.l
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Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Soyuz-2-1b - Lotos - Plesetsk - December 1, 2017
« Reply #9 on: 11/03/2017 04:25 PM »
see reply # 1
It seems to be this satellite (Liana/Lotos or "Lotos FO")
http://www.russianspaceweb.com/2017.html#milsat
This report is about a Soyuz-2.1B not 2.1V
Something is wrong.
25.10. is mentioned (-->2.1v)
and Lotos is too heavy for 2.1v...
2.1B must be another launch ?

I think that the confusion is because originally it wasn't known which version of the Soyuz-2 would be used on this launch.   When it became clear it was to be a Soyuz-2-1V that narrowed down the payload which could be carried.l
Note: Information that I have is that there are not any Soyuz-2.1v launchers available for launch at this time in Plesetsk Cosmodrome at this time but one will become ready after the launch listed below for either the very end of the year or early next year.

Updated Information:
http://russianspaceweb.com/2017.html
Quote
Dec. 1: A Soyuz-2-1B rocket to launch the first 14F145/Lotos military satellite for the Liana electronic intelligence network from Plesetsk. The mission was previously planned for Oct. 25, 2017, but had to be postponed until beginning of November and until November 18, at the earliest, due to problems with the satellite. On Oct. 25, space officials were expected to hold a meeting in Moscow on the status of the mission. The launch was then postponed until December 1, 2017.

....

December: A Soyuz-2-1v rocket to launch a classified payload from Plesetsk.
« Last Edit: 11/03/2017 04:37 PM by russianhalo117 »

Offline Stan Black

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Re: Soyuz-2-1b - Lotos - Plesetsk - December 1, 2017
« Reply #10 on: 11/04/2017 08:19 AM »
1st post says this:-

Quote
According to a post from Nicolas Pillet on the schedule thread, there will be a Soyuz-2 launch from Plesetsk on 25th October 2017.
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=43835.msg1727496#msg1727496

Does not say variant/class/type of rocket to be launched; is it a 1v or a 1b.

Guesswork posts then follow.

From repy 7, 23rd October
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=43835.msg1741003#msg1741003
Quote
The next launch of the Soyuz 2.1v rocket was planned for October, but for technical reasons it was decided to postpone it to November.
http://www.militarynews.ru/Story.asp?rid=1&nid=464881

So to Mr. Zak and www.russianspaceweb.com

Using Archive.org
https://web.archive.org/web/20171023195111/www.russianspaceweb.com/2017.html

23rd October update has no mention of Lotos, just this entry:-

Quote
November: A Soyuz-2-1v rocket to launch a classified payload from Plesetsk. The mission was previously planned for Oct. 25, 2017.

Then in November it became:-

Quote
Dec. 1: A Soyuz-2-1B rocket to launch the first 14F145/Lotos military satellite for the Liana electronic intelligence network from Plesetsk. The mission was previously planned for Oct. 25, 2017, but had to be postponed until beginning of November and until November 18, at the earliest, due to problems with the satellite. On Oct. 25, space officials were expected to hold a meeting in Moscow on the status of the mission. The launch was then postponed until December 1, 2017.

December: A Soyuz-2-1v rocket to launch a classified payload from Plesetsk.
« Last Edit: 11/04/2017 08:29 AM by Stan Black »

Offline zubenelgenubi

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Cross-post:
Soyuz-2-1v - December 27
http://novosti-kosmonavtiki.ru/forum/messages/forum14/topic14042/message1711028/#message1711028
***

If this Soyuz-2-1v carries a Volga upper stage to a SSO or other polar orbit, as all 3 previous launches of this "make/model" have, are there any "expected" payloads with an estimated mass within the capabilities of this LV?
(I assume that since no payload has been announced, it's a classified payload.)

Gunter's Space Page lists 1400 kg as the maximum payload mass to SSO: http://space.skyrocket.de/doc_lau_det/soyuz-2-1v_volga.htm
***

EDIT 11/28: Are there any payloads designed for launch on Soyuz-2-1v, with no upper stage?
(To state this another way, are there any payloads designed for launch on Soyuz-2-1v, which contain their own propulsion, and do not need an upper stage to place itself into a final orbit?)
« Last Edit: 11/28/2017 06:11 PM by zubenelgenubi »
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Offline Stan Black

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Is this the payload?

Quote
Оказание услуг по авиационной перевозке контейнера с ЭМКА, контейнеров с НТО на космодром «Плесецк» и его страхованию
http://zakupki.gov.ru/223/purchase/public/purchase/info/common-info.html?regNumber=31705773827

Quote
9) Проведены исследования по созданию космического комплекса ДЗЗ на базе экспериментального малого космического аппарата (ЭМКА).
Перспективы развития в сегменте НПК «Космические комплексы» в 2017 году:
- осуществление запуска экспериментального малого космического аппарата;
- продолжение исследований по созданию космического комплекса ДЗЗ на базе экспериментального малого космического аппарата;
http://www.vniiem.ru/ru/uploads/files/god_otchet_2016.pdf
« Last Edit: 11/25/2017 08:10 PM by Stan Black »

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Is this the payload?

Quote
Оказание услуг по авиационной перевозке контейнера с ЭМКА, контейнеров с НТО на космодром «Плесецк» и его страхованию
http://zakupki.gov.ru/223/purchase/public/purchase/info/common-info.html?regNumber=31705773827

Quote
9) Проведены исследования по созданию космического комплекса ДЗЗ на базе экспериментального малого космического аппарата (ЭМКА).
Перспективы развития в сегменте НПК «Космические комплексы» в 2017 году:
- осуществление запуска экспериментального малого космического аппарата;
- продолжение исследований по созданию космического комплекса ДЗЗ на базе экспериментального малого космического аппарата;
http://www.vniiem.ru/ru/uploads/files/god_otchet_2016.pdf

This looks interesting. VNIIEM's annual report for 2016 talks about the development of a remote sensing satellite "on the basis of an experimental small space apparatus" (EMKA), which is listed separately from Kanopus. Among the objectives for 2017 it mentions the launch of "Kanopus-V-IK, Meteor M nr. 2-1, Kanopus nr. 3 and 4 and EMKA".

The other document is a contract for the transportation of EMKA to Plesetsk in November 2017.

EMKA is also mentioned several times in this VNIIEM procurement document for  2017 :
www.vniiem.ru/ru/uploads/files/plan_zakupok_2017-11.08.xls

The document mentions : delivery of brochures for EMKA in June 2017 (for the MAKS aerospace show??), painting of the payload fairing for EMKA in July 2017 and transportation of VNIIEM managers and personnel to the launch site by May 2018 (which would not be consistent with a Dec 2017 launch date, but it may have been moved forward).

I'm not sure if anything like this was shown at MAKS-2017. Not likely if this is a military mission.

The bus could be the same one used for Kanopus, Lomonosov and BKA (the Belorussian satellite), which has been identified as UMKP-400 (UMKP = Universal Small Space Platform) and MSP (Small Servicing Platform). VNIIEM also worked on a heavier platform called UMKP-800 that it proposed early this century for Meteor and Elektro, but it did not get selected at the time. It's described in detail in an issue of the VNIIEM journal in 2001:
http://jurnal.vniiem.ru/text/100/2.pdf
This should also be compatible with the Soyuz-2-1v, but it's unlikely to be still under development.
 

Offline Satori

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - ?? - Plesetsk - December 27, 2017
« Reply #14 on: 12/07/2017 06:29 PM »
Delayed to 2018.

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - EMKA - Plesetsk - 2018
« Reply #15 on: 12/20/2017 10:08 PM »
https://iz.ru/682354/dmitrii-strugovetc-aleksei-ramm/rossiia-ispytaet-eksperimentalnyi-sputnik-razvedchik

Sources within the Ministry of Defense and space industry have confirmed to Izvestia that the payload for the Soyuz-2-1v launch is a small reconnaissance satellite developed by VNIIEM and known by the acronym EMKA ("Experimental Small Space Apparatus"). Launch was originally scheduled for October and then slipped to November, December and eventually January due to technical problems with the payload.

As evidence for the existence of the satellite the Izvestia journalist gives the same documents referred to earlier in this thread by Stan Black (the VNIIEM annual report for 2016 and a transportation document), which were subsequently also posted on the NK forum. It looks very much like the Izvestia journalist found out about EMKA  via the NK forum and then contacted sources in the Ministry of Defense and the space industry to confirm that it is the payload for the upcoming Soyuz-2.1v launch. Kudos to Stan Black for tracking down this payload.

Offline William Graham

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - EMKA - Plesetsk - 2018
« Reply #16 on: 12/31/2017 11:26 PM »
The Russian launch schedule thread lists this one as scheduled for this week. Has there been any indication that it is holding that schedule? Has anybody seen any NOTAMs that could indicate a launch is close?

Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - EMKA - Plesetsk - 2018
« Reply #17 on: 01/01/2018 02:18 AM »
The Russian launch schedule thread lists this one as scheduled for this week. Has there been any indication that it is holding that schedule? Has anybody seen any NOTAMs that could indicate a launch is close?
Anatoly Zak has it listed now on his site in the first quarter after Soyuz MS-08 due to ongoing payload issues although he does not yet call it EMKA. He foresee's no launches until February at this time.
http://russianspaceweb.com/2018.html
« Last Edit: 01/01/2018 02:22 AM by russianhalo117 »

Offline Alter Sachse

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Offline zubenelgenubi

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - EMKA - Plesetsk - February 28, 2018
« Reply #19 on: 01/11/2018 09:47 PM »
Do we know if this launch will use an upper stage, such as Volga, or launch with no upper stage?

If not, when do we find out--when the LV is rolled out to the pad and images are released?
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Online Phillip Clark

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - EMKA - Plesetsk - February 28, 2018
« Reply #20 on: 01/11/2018 09:51 PM »
Do we know if this launch will use an upper stage, such as Volga, or launch with no upper stage?
If not, when do we find out--when the LV is rolled out to the pad and images are released?

The Volga stage will presumably be hidden within the payload shroud, so it won't be visible.
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Offline Stan Black

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - EMKA - Plesetsk - February 28, 2018
« Reply #21 on: 01/11/2018 10:05 PM »
Do we know if this launch will use an upper stage, such as Volga, or launch with no upper stage?
If not, when do we find out--when the LV is rolled out to the pad and images are released?

The Volga stage will presumably be hidden within the payload shroud, so it won't be visible.

From what I have found, I think the first six rockets had associated Volga upper stages. The initial five are part of one contract for the Russian military. The sixth was for Lomonosov satellite.
« Last Edit: 01/12/2018 07:20 AM by Stan Black »

Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - EMKA - Plesetsk - February 28, 2018
« Reply #22 on: 01/12/2018 12:38 AM »
The Russian launch schedule thread lists this one as scheduled for this week. Has there been any indication that it is holding that schedule? Has anybody seen any NOTAMs that could indicate a launch is close?
Anatoly Zak has it listed now on his site in the first quarter after Soyuz MS-08 due to ongoing payload issues although he does not yet call it EMKA. He foresee's no launches until February at this time.
http://russianspaceweb.com/2018.html
Anatoly Zak has determined that EMKA is actually a Spacecraft Platform for the MKA programme and not the name of the Spacecraft flying:
http://russianspaceweb.com/2018.html#mka
Quote
Feb. 28: A Soyuz-2-1v rocket to launch a classified payload based on the experimental small-satellite platform, EMKA, from Plesetsk.
« Last Edit: 01/12/2018 04:19 PM by russianhalo117 »

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - EMKA - Plesetsk - February 28, 2018
« Reply #23 on: 01/12/2018 07:23 AM »
Anatoly Zak has determined that EMKA is actually a Spacecraft Platform and not the name of the Spacecraft flying:
http://russianspaceweb.com/2018.html#mka
Quote
Feb. 28: A Soyuz-2-1v rocket to launch a classified payload based on the experimental small-satellite platform, EMKA, from Plesetsk.
[/quote]

That would be confirmed by the fact that the VNIIEM annual report for 2016 (mentioned earlier in this thread) talks about "a satellite based on EMKA". The name of the satellite itself is probably classified. No Ministry of Defense designator (like 14F...) identified yet either.

Offline Stan Black

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - EMKA - Plesetsk - February 28, 2018
« Reply #24 on: 01/12/2018 07:29 AM »
The Russian launch schedule thread lists this one as scheduled for this week. Has there been any indication that it is holding that schedule? Has anybody seen any NOTAMs that could indicate a launch is close?
Anatoly Zak has it listed now on his site in the first quarter after Soyuz MS-08 due to ongoing payload issues although he does not yet call it EMKA. He foresee's no launches until February at this time.
http://russianspaceweb.com/2018.html
Anatoly Zak has determined that EMKA is actually a Spacecraft Platform and not the name of the Spacecraft flying:
http://russianspaceweb.com/2018.html#mka
Quote
Feb. 28: A Soyuz-2-1v rocket to launch a classified payload based on the experimental small-satellite platform, EMKA, from Plesetsk.

Look back at the earlier posts: remote sensing satellite “on the basis of an experimental small space apparatus" (EMKA)”.
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=44139.msg1753080#msg1753080

Mr. Zak has done this before, during the 1st Bars-M launch for example. Contents of his website are edited or changed but you can already find details in the NSF.

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - EMKA - Plesetsk - February 28, 2018
« Reply #25 on: 01/12/2018 03:45 PM »
There could be a link between EMKA and two small high-resolution remote sensing satellites described in the 4/2014 issue of the VNIIEM journal "Voprosy elektromekhaniki". One is called "Zvezda" ("Star") and the other MKA-V (MKA standing for "small satellite" and "V" for high resolution). Zvezda is described as a technology demonstrator for MKA-V. Zvezda is a 150 kg satellite in a 300 km orbit with a maximum resolution of 0.5 m and a minimum lifetime of one year and MKA-V is a 250 kg satellite in a 450 km orbit with a maximum resolution of 0.6 m and a minimum lifetime of five years. VNIIEM was said to be wiling to launch Zvezda in the first quarter of 2015 without any government funding in order to pave the way for MKA-V.  More details (including a drawing of MKA-V) here:

http://jurnal.vniiem.ru/text/141/17-22.pdf
(see p. 18-19)

Zvezda/MKA-V were apparently presented here as civilian remote sensing satellites, but might just as well be used for military purposes.

Zvezda is also mentioned in a paper given by VNIIEM specialists at the Korolyov Academic Readings in January 2015. Here it is described as a 200 kg satellite in a near-circular 500 km Sun-synchronous orbit with a minimum lifetime of 5 years. The paper focused mainly on the selection of orbit correction engines for the satellites. The authors say that the choice had fallen on the hydrazine-fueled K50.-10-5 thermal catalytic thrusters of OKB Fakel (also installed on NPO Lavochkin's Kosmos-2519 satellite).

http://ihst.ru/files/pdfs/Korolevskie-chteniya-2015-Materialy.pdf
(see p. 59-60)







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