Author Topic: "Mars City One" first Mars settlement location  (Read 2335 times)

Online Robotbeat

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"Mars City One" first Mars settlement location
« on: 06/20/2017 03:37 AM »
So, cruising the SpaceX image gallery, I found this image that's just a screenshot from the ITS video:
www.spacex.com/sites/spacex/files/2016_-_12_mars_city_one_utopia-final-smf.jpg?itok=hOsVYCGf

The title popped out: "mars_city_one_utopia"

This looks like SpaceX's internal working name for their initial settlement site. At first, I thought "Utopia" was just a very un-self-aware name, but it's almost certainly referring to the Utopia impact basin (where Utopia Planitia is), a vast -4km elevation area in the northern hemisphere of Mars:
https://www.google.com/mars/#lat=33.000000&lon=-241.399997&q=Utopia
Utopia also happens to harbor a huge amount of frozen water, as large as Lake Superior (see this article published a day after Musk's IAC talk: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/2016GL070138/abstract
and this article about the article: http://www.sci-news.com/space/water-ice-utopia-planitia-mars-04392.html ).

So it seems SpaceX was at least at some point considering Utopia as a settlement site.

And "Mars City One" is a very Muskian name. (Also remiscent of "Space Station Alpha," or "Alpha," which is/was ISS's callsign.)
« Last Edit: 06/20/2017 03:41 AM by Robotbeat »
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Offline meekGee

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Re: "Mars City One" first Mars settlement location
« Reply #1 on: 06/20/2017 04:02 AM »
Nice sleuthing...
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Offline Oersted

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Re: "Mars City One" first Mars settlement location
« Reply #2 on: 06/20/2017 08:22 AM »
Well, utopia also just means "positive future fantasy", so I don't think we can say that it almost certainly refers to that location...

Online Semmel

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Re: "Mars City One" first Mars settlement location
« Reply #3 on: 06/20/2017 08:24 AM »
Strange that the image shows primarily Allegheny Vallis. Utopia Planetia is behind the horizon on the image.

Online Robotbeat

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Re: "Mars City One" first Mars settlement location
« Reply #4 on: 06/20/2017 10:52 PM »
Strange that the image shows primarily Allegheny Vallis. Utopia Planetia is behind the horizon on the image.
Well, sure, because they're showing right before entry. As you come in to Mars entry, your landing site will be beyond the horizon. :)
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Online Semmel

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Re: "Mars City One" first Mars settlement location
« Reply #5 on: 06/21/2017 05:26 AM »
Well, sure, because they're showing right before entry. As you come in to Mars entry, your landing site will be beyond the horizon. :)

Had the same though today morning. Can be correct. How far out is ITS in this image and how much would Mars rotate by the time ITS enters the atmospher?

PS: We are absolutely not overinterpreting scarce information. Absolutely not. No chance this could ever happen!

Offline jpo234

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Re: "Mars City One" first Mars settlement location
« Reply #6 on: 06/21/2017 07:14 AM »

Had the same though today morning. Can be correct. How far out is ITS in this image and how much would Mars rotate by the time ITS enters the atmospher?

PS: We are absolutely not overinterpreting scarce information. Absolutely not. No chance this could ever happen!

It's not just rotation. To shed speed, the Spaceship needs a loooong dive through the atmosphere, so it has to perform its reentry when the actual landing site is still beyond the horizon.

Online Semmel

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Re: "Mars City One" first Mars settlement location
« Reply #7 on: 06/21/2017 07:21 AM »
It's not just rotation. To shed speed, the Spaceship needs a loooong dive through the atmosphere, so it has to perform its reentry when the actual landing site is still beyond the horizon.

Sure, but the question here is: how long does ITS take to arrive at Mars from the position shown in the image and how far Mars rotates in that time. If its about 12 hours, then the landing site should face ITS. By the time ITS enters the atmosphere, the city is on the far side of Mars and it would fit the long dive through the atmosphere. All depends how far ITS is from Mars at the time the image was rendered.

Offline IRobot

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Re: "Mars City One" first Mars settlement location
« Reply #8 on: 06/21/2017 09:09 AM »
And "Mars City One" is a very Muskian name. (Also remiscent of "Space Station Alpha," or "Alpha," which is/was ISS's callsign.)
Or Mega-City One from Judge Dredd.

Online AncientU

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Re: "Mars City One" first Mars settlement location
« Reply #9 on: 06/21/2017 09:38 AM »
Utopia, as the caption stated, is a fine first city name. 
Names won't be militaristic... more likely fanciful.

Please don't turn this into a naming thread, though.
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Offline Oersted

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Re: "Mars City One" first Mars settlement location
« Reply #10 on: 06/28/2017 08:22 PM »
Please don't turn this into a naming thread, though.

You just did :-)

Offline happyflower

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Re: "Mars City One" first Mars settlement location
« Reply #11 on: 07/06/2017 11:43 PM »
I wonder if the site chosen will have more to it than the most rudimentary requirements at first. There are must haves for a Mars starter base:

1. Flat area in the 30-50 Km diameter range. Both for landing and also for driving around.
2. Not too hard: non rocky (or at least smaller rocks)
3. Not too soft: super soft area that has way too much dust.
4. lowest altitude possible (so you have the most atmosphere to slow down with), and also more atmosphere above you.
5. Must be water rich. Both for drinking and radiation shielding. Not necessarily "hard" ice, but maybe ice sheets.
6. Must have gravel, sand and rock around (for construction).
7. Some place interesting to look at, OR
8. Some place with scientific interest, like craters, outcrops, canyons and dune fields close by.
9. Higher latitudes (more access to water, but dark and boring in winter). Also no sun for large solar array farms so will probably be powered with nuke power.
10. Lower latitudes (less water, but more sun, and a small velocity boost to your rockets at launch).

I think any location that meets most of these requirements will work out. Not sure how many of these requirements are met with Utopia Planitia though.




Offline ThereIWas3

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Re: "Mars City One" first Mars settlement location
« Reply #12 on: 07/06/2017 11:56 PM »
50 km diameter flat area, but close to something interesting?   :)  I think ITS will be able to do a pinpoint landing with much smaller tolerances than that.
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Offline happyflower

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Re: "Mars City One" first Mars settlement location
« Reply #13 on: 07/07/2017 12:07 AM »
Oh I was not being clear. I understand that ITS will have pin point landing (I mean gosh they are talking about landing back on Earth on its launching mounts. That is pretty pin point). I was speaking more generally. You need a big area to support landing many supply vessels and crew ships over a number of missions which will eventually turn into a spaceport I guess. But you are probably right and that number maybe a bit bigger than needed. :)
« Last Edit: 07/07/2017 12:13 AM by happyflower »

Online Robotbeat

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Re: "Mars City One" first Mars settlement location
« Reply #14 on: 07/07/2017 02:46 AM »
Musk has only talked about solar power. NASa has the Kilopower modules, but they're tiny. The largest design is just 10kW, and they're pretty expensive. And ITS will need like 1MW. So SpaceX will have to rely on solar for ISRU. (Although a few Kilopower modules might be enough for other uses.)
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