Also, the Ames Common Bus that they worked with some years ago is no longer what they are using. They have had two different designs since then. I am more concerned with the constant changes (similarly for Astrobotic).
Quote from: Phil Stooke on 07/13/2017 03:37 pmAlso, the Ames Common Bus that they worked with some years ago is no longer what they are using. They have had two different designs since then. I am more concerned with the constant changes (similarly for Astrobotic).Original design used toroidal (donut) tank and stacked smaller on larger for bigger lander, would've resulted in different stage designs. They wanted to go as secondary payload on GTO missions, which would've meant complying with owner of missions demands. Advent of Electron, Firefly and LauncherOne allowed them to buy whole LV starting at $5M. Hence change to new modular design. I'm guessing they designed for Electron first and foremost with bigger LauncherOne giving them two stage option. MX5 and MX9 clustering of stages is probably brilliant afterthought. Mass production of common stage helps keep build cost down. You've got give these guys credit for thinking outside box.I don't see any reason the MX1E won't fly, maybe not in 2017. With this lander they have overcome the biggest barrier to space, launch cost.
Where's the evidence that the money is there to build MX-1? I haven't even seen any evidence they actually have the $5 million to pay for the Electron launch, let alone the lander.
Perhaps most intriguingly, Moon Express says it is self-funded to begin bringing kilograms of lunar rocks back to Earth within about three years. “We absolutely intend to make these samples available globally for scientific research, and make them available to collectors as well,” said Bob Richards, one of the company’s founders, in an interview with Ars.
Quote from: ChrisWilson68 on 07/13/2017 05:42 pmWhere's the evidence that the money is there to build MX-1? I haven't even seen any evidence they actually have the $5 million to pay for the Electron launch, let alone the lander.From Eric Berger's article I cited yesterday:QuotePerhaps most intriguingly, Moon Express says it is self-funded to begin bringing kilograms of lunar rocks back to Earth within about three years. “We absolutely intend to make these samples available globally for scientific research, and make them available to collectors as well,” said Bob Richards, one of the company’s founders, in an interview with Ars.https://arstechnica.com/science/2017/07/private-company-plans-to-bring-moon-rocks-back-to-earth-in-three-years/
Quote from: FutureSpaceTourist on 07/13/2017 06:44 pmQuote from: ChrisWilson68 on 07/13/2017 05:42 pmWhere's the evidence that the money is there to build MX-1? I haven't even seen any evidence they actually have the $5 million to pay for the Electron launch, let alone the lander.From Eric Berger's article I cited yesterday:QuotePerhaps most intriguingly, Moon Express says it is self-funded to begin bringing kilograms of lunar rocks back to Earth within about three years. “We absolutely intend to make these samples available globally for scientific research, and make them available to collectors as well,” said Bob Richards, one of the company’s founders, in an interview with Ars.https://arstechnica.com/science/2017/07/private-company-plans-to-bring-moon-rocks-back-to-earth-in-three-years/In what way is that evidence that they have the money?You've seen the evidence up-thread that Naveen Jain has a history of lying about the finances of companies he has run, and the term "self-funded" is vague enough to be meaningless. Companies sometimes use this term to mean that they hope to pre-sell products to fund their development. Who knows what it means in this instance.
Quote from: synchrotron on 07/13/2017 01:24 pmQuote from: meberbs on 07/12/2017 06:16 pmQuote from: synchrotron on 07/12/2017 05:59 pmMoon Express shows off mockups, other providers' prototype hardware, and powerpoint slides. Their launch date has slipped year-for-year dating back to 2015. Why are they still getting coverage? Because they tweet?They are still getting coverage because your statements about them are false. They have done tests including powered landing tests on their own hardware. The current expected launch is in less than six months, incompatible with your claim of year for year slips. Especially since expected launch was in 2017 as of 2015.Maybe you have them confused for some other company.edit: typoIncorrect. Better check which post has the false statements. Moon Express did not develop the landing technology. It's out of Ames. They have not funded it and they are not the design authority.Yours, on all counts. External funding, partnerships, etc. are an expected part of doing business. It doesn't matter if they got NASA funding or used NASA technology (which is available to U.S. companies for a reason). They have tested hardware, and they are building and testing the flight hardware.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAMPD65dvIY&feature=youtu.be
Quote from: meberbs on 07/12/2017 06:16 pmQuote from: synchrotron on 07/12/2017 05:59 pmMoon Express shows off mockups, other providers' prototype hardware, and powerpoint slides. Their launch date has slipped year-for-year dating back to 2015. Why are they still getting coverage? Because they tweet?They are still getting coverage because your statements about them are false. They have done tests including powered landing tests on their own hardware. The current expected launch is in less than six months, incompatible with your claim of year for year slips. Especially since expected launch was in 2017 as of 2015.Maybe you have them confused for some other company.edit: typoIncorrect. Better check which post has the false statements. Moon Express did not develop the landing technology. It's out of Ames. They have not funded it and they are not the design authority.
Quote from: synchrotron on 07/12/2017 05:59 pmMoon Express shows off mockups, other providers' prototype hardware, and powerpoint slides. Their launch date has slipped year-for-year dating back to 2015. Why are they still getting coverage? Because they tweet?They are still getting coverage because your statements about them are false. They have done tests including powered landing tests on their own hardware. The current expected launch is in less than six months, incompatible with your claim of year for year slips. Especially since expected launch was in 2017 as of 2015.Maybe you have them confused for some other company.edit: typo
Moon Express shows off mockups, other providers' prototype hardware, and powerpoint slides. Their launch date has slipped year-for-year dating back to 2015. Why are they still getting coverage? Because they tweet?
Quote from: ChrisWilson68 on 07/13/2017 08:58 pmQuote from: FutureSpaceTourist on 07/13/2017 06:44 pmQuote from: ChrisWilson68 on 07/13/2017 05:42 pmWhere's the evidence that the money is there to build MX-1? I haven't even seen any evidence they actually have the $5 million to pay for the Electron launch, let alone the lander.From Eric Berger's article I cited yesterday:QuotePerhaps most intriguingly, Moon Express says it is self-funded to begin bringing kilograms of lunar rocks back to Earth within about three years. “We absolutely intend to make these samples available globally for scientific research, and make them available to collectors as well,” said Bob Richards, one of the company’s founders, in an interview with Ars.https://arstechnica.com/science/2017/07/private-company-plans-to-bring-moon-rocks-back-to-earth-in-three-years/In what way is that evidence that they have the money?You've seen the evidence up-thread that Naveen Jain has a history of lying about the finances of companies he has run, and the term "self-funded" is vague enough to be meaningless. Companies sometimes use this term to mean that they hope to pre-sell products to fund their development. Who knows what it means in this instance.You asked about the money to build the lander. They literally are already building the lander. I haven't researched what funding sources they have had, but one way or another, they are spending that money now.
Quote from: meberbs on 07/13/2017 03:23 pmQuote from: synchrotron on 07/13/2017 01:24 pmQuote from: meberbs on 07/12/2017 06:16 pmQuote from: synchrotron on 07/12/2017 05:59 pmMoon Express shows off mockups, other providers' prototype hardware, and powerpoint slides. Their launch date has slipped year-for-year dating back to 2015. Why are they still getting coverage? Because they tweet?They are still getting coverage because your statements about them are false. They have done tests including powered landing tests on their own hardware. The current expected launch is in less than six months, incompatible with your claim of year for year slips. Especially since expected launch was in 2017 as of 2015.Maybe you have them confused for some other company.edit: typoIncorrect. Better check which post has the false statements. Moon Express did not develop the landing technology. It's out of Ames. They have not funded it and they are not the design authority.Yours, on all counts. External funding, partnerships, etc. are an expected part of doing business. It doesn't matter if they got NASA funding or used NASA technology (which is available to U.S. companies for a reason). They have tested hardware, and they are building and testing the flight hardware.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAMPD65dvIY&feature=youtu.beI repeat. They have not funded it and they are not the design authority. A prime contractor needs to be in charge of how the money is spent. Aligning yourself publicly via twitter and youtube with people who have funding and technologies in development does not make you the mission lead.
Quote from: meberbs on 07/14/2017 05:37 amQuote from: ChrisWilson68 on 07/13/2017 08:58 pmQuote from: FutureSpaceTourist on 07/13/2017 06:44 pmQuote from: ChrisWilson68 on 07/13/2017 05:42 pmWhere's the evidence that the money is there to build MX-1? I haven't even seen any evidence they actually have the $5 million to pay for the Electron launch, let alone the lander.From Eric Berger's article I cited yesterday:QuotePerhaps most intriguingly, Moon Express says it is self-funded to begin bringing kilograms of lunar rocks back to Earth within about three years. “We absolutely intend to make these samples available globally for scientific research, and make them available to collectors as well,” said Bob Richards, one of the company’s founders, in an interview with Ars.https://arstechnica.com/science/2017/07/private-company-plans-to-bring-moon-rocks-back-to-earth-in-three-years/In what way is that evidence that they have the money?You've seen the evidence up-thread that Naveen Jain has a history of lying about the finances of companies he has run, and the term "self-funded" is vague enough to be meaningless. Companies sometimes use this term to mean that they hope to pre-sell products to fund their development. Who knows what it means in this instance.You asked about the money to build the lander. They literally are already building the lander. I haven't researched what funding sources they have had, but one way or another, they are spending that money now.Having the money to start building a few parts is not the same as having the money to complete the job.
Quote from: ChrisWilson68 on 07/14/2017 04:37 pmQuote from: meberbs on 07/14/2017 05:37 amQuote from: ChrisWilson68 on 07/13/2017 08:58 pmQuote from: FutureSpaceTourist on 07/13/2017 06:44 pmQuote from: ChrisWilson68 on 07/13/2017 05:42 pmWhere's the evidence that the money is there to build MX-1? I haven't even seen any evidence they actually have the $5 million to pay for the Electron launch, let alone the lander.From Eric Berger's article I cited yesterday:QuotePerhaps most intriguingly, Moon Express says it is self-funded to begin bringing kilograms of lunar rocks back to Earth within about three years. “We absolutely intend to make these samples available globally for scientific research, and make them available to collectors as well,” said Bob Richards, one of the company’s founders, in an interview with Ars.https://arstechnica.com/science/2017/07/private-company-plans-to-bring-moon-rocks-back-to-earth-in-three-years/In what way is that evidence that they have the money?You've seen the evidence up-thread that Naveen Jain has a history of lying about the finances of companies he has run, and the term "self-funded" is vague enough to be meaningless. Companies sometimes use this term to mean that they hope to pre-sell products to fund their development. Who knows what it means in this instance.You asked about the money to build the lander. They literally are already building the lander. I haven't researched what funding sources they have had, but one way or another, they are spending that money now.Having the money to start building a few parts is not the same as having the money to complete the job.I going to assume GLXP admin team, NASA lunar CATALYST team and RL have lot more insight into MX business operations than we do. Drop this discussion, unless you can come up with written evident MX doesn't have finances to complete MX1 and launch.
Jan17 they had $40m cash injection. Should be enough to build a couple of MX1 landers and pay for their RL launches. http://pitchbook.com/profiles/moon-express-profile-investors-funding-valuation-and-analysisThey are not relying on $20m XPrize it is definitely worth going for.
Quote from: synchrotron on 07/14/2017 02:34 pmQuote from: meberbs on 07/13/2017 03:23 pmQuote from: synchrotron on 07/13/2017 01:24 pmQuote from: meberbs on 07/12/2017 06:16 pmQuote from: synchrotron on 07/12/2017 05:59 pmMoon Express shows off mockups, other providers' prototype hardware, and powerpoint slides. Their launch date has slipped year-for-year dating back to 2015. Why are they still getting coverage? Because they tweet?They are still getting coverage because your statements about them are false. They have done tests including powered landing tests on their own hardware. The current expected launch is in less than six months, incompatible with your claim of year for year slips. Especially since expected launch was in 2017 as of 2015.Maybe you have them confused for some other company.edit: typoIncorrect. Better check which post has the false statements. Moon Express did not develop the landing technology. It's out of Ames. They have not funded it and they are not the design authority.Yours, on all counts. External funding, partnerships, etc. are an expected part of doing business. It doesn't matter if they got NASA funding or used NASA technology (which is available to U.S. companies for a reason). They have tested hardware, and they are building and testing the flight hardware.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAMPD65dvIY&feature=youtu.beI repeat. They have not funded it and they are not the design authority. A prime contractor needs to be in charge of how the money is spent. Aligning yourself publicly via twitter and youtube with people who have funding and technologies in development does not make you the mission lead.So who is this mystery organization that is letting Moon Express take credit for all of their accomplishments?Are you claiming this is somehow an unauthorized NASA mission, where the truth of the situation is being cleverly hidden from the organizers of the google lunar x-prize?Are you claiming that Moon Express's employees just sit around and do PR pieces and none of them have done any design work at all on the missions they claim to be selling?
Quote from: meberbs on 07/14/2017 04:52 pmQuote from: synchrotron on 07/14/2017 02:34 pmI repeat. They have not funded it and they are not the design authority. A prime contractor needs to be in charge of how the money is spent. Aligning yourself publicly via twitter and youtube with people who have funding and technologies in development does not make you the mission lead.So who is this mystery organization that is letting Moon Express take credit for all of their accomplishments?Are you claiming this is somehow an unauthorized NASA mission, where the truth of the situation is being cleverly hidden from the organizers of the google lunar x-prize?Are you claiming that Moon Express's employees just sit around and do PR pieces and none of them have done any design work at all on the missions they claim to be selling?Yes, it appears to me that most of the activity is PR. I have not said that any NASA center is doing anything unauthorized - you are making stuff up. No NASA entities are touting that there is a Moon Express mission in the offing.If it's not all just PR, can you tell me who is on the Moon Express design team? Who is the chief engineer? Or has any spacecraft equipment organization received a request for proposal for a flight delivery from Moon Express? If launch is in Q2 2019, they must be a year away from delivering flight units for integration into the spacecraft. Why no tweets of the copious amounts of hardware they are building? They seem to have time to send out CGI graphics of the "mission after then next one we gonna fly", so it can't just be that they are too busy.
Quote from: synchrotron on 07/14/2017 02:34 pmI repeat. They have not funded it and they are not the design authority. A prime contractor needs to be in charge of how the money is spent. Aligning yourself publicly via twitter and youtube with people who have funding and technologies in development does not make you the mission lead.So who is this mystery organization that is letting Moon Express take credit for all of their accomplishments?Are you claiming this is somehow an unauthorized NASA mission, where the truth of the situation is being cleverly hidden from the organizers of the google lunar x-prize?Are you claiming that Moon Express's employees just sit around and do PR pieces and none of them have done any design work at all on the missions they claim to be selling?
I repeat. They have not funded it and they are not the design authority. A prime contractor needs to be in charge of how the money is spent. Aligning yourself publicly via twitter and youtube with people who have funding and technologies in development does not make you the mission lead.
If launch is in Q2 2019, they must be a year away from delivering flight units for integration into the spacecraft.