Author Topic: Space Ship Two - General Thread  (Read 737506 times)

Offline QuantumG

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #680 on: 10/17/2012 01:36 am »
$10 mil is less than $90 mil.

If you want to compare it to something SpaceX.. which I know everyone loves to do these days.. you should be comparing it to the Falcon 1:

Quote
Historically, the Falcon 1 was originally planned to launch about 600 kilograms (1,300 lb) to low-Earth orbit for US$6,000,000 but later declined to approximately 420 kilograms (930 lb) as the price increased to approximately US$9,000,000. The final version of the Falcon 1, the Falcon 1e, was projected to provide approximately 1,000 kilograms (2,200 lb) for US$11 million. The vehicle is now retired.

- Wikipedia.

There's also talk of 3U cubesat launches for ~$400k being a viable market. I don't think XCOR has released any numbers on their nanosat launcher yet.

The key concept to low cost launchers is that some people just want to get a small payload into space and they can't, or prefer not to, for a number of different possible reasons, get a secondary payload slot on a larger launcher.
Human spaceflight is basically just LARPing now.

Offline Comga

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #681 on: 10/17/2012 03:45 am »
Also on the Virgin Galactic page with the (old news) article, earlier this week was the eighth anniversary of the winning of the X-Prize.

Who would have thought that commercial flights would still be a year or two away?
The future isn't what it used to be.
What kind of wastrels would dump a perfectly good booster in the ocean after just one use?

Offline QuantumG

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #682 on: 10/17/2012 03:57 am »
Also on the Virgin Galactic page with the (old news) article, earlier this week was the eighth anniversary of the winning of the X-Prize.

Who would have thought that commercial flights would still be a year or two away?

Me. As soon as they announced they were building a bigger vehicle, a production line for the bigger vehicle even, I said loudly and often that they'd take a decade to fly customers. After 5 years, I started asking if they'd figured out they bit off more than they can chew yet. Virgin Galactic still hasn't acknowledged reality but I think Scaled Composites has.

Human spaceflight is basically just LARPing now.

Offline spectre9

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #683 on: 10/17/2012 04:18 am »
Lack of updates about RM concerns me.

If they want to show that this is safe/reliable/the best option being all hush hush isn't the way to do it.

Offline JBF

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #684 on: 10/19/2012 11:19 pm »
New article up at Wired http://www.wired.com/autopia/2012/10/spaceshiptwo-oxidizer-tank/ including pictures of the oxidizer tank install.

"In principle, rocket engines are simple, but that’s the last place rocket engines are ever simple." Jeff Bezos

Offline Garrett

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #685 on: 10/21/2012 11:25 am »
and an article by Jeff Foust:
Virgin and XCOR progress towards powered test flights
http://www.newspacejournal.com/2012/10/20/virgin-and-xcor-progress-towards-powered-test-flights/

Includes a link to a blog post on the corporate Virgin website by Sir Richard Branson:
 http://www.virgin.com/richard-branson/blog/rocket-men

Attached are the other two images released by Virgin
- "Nothing shocks me. I'm a scientist." - Indiana Jones

Offline john smith 19

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #686 on: 10/23/2012 04:17 pm »
From the article:

LauncherOne will be a two-stage vehicle capable of carrying up to 500 pounds (225 kilograms) to orbit for prices below $10 million.

Note that's about $20klb which is actually *more* expensive than the Pegasus XL design the last time I checked ($15k/lb).

Given you're dealing with a launch plane *designed* for the air launch of a 2nd stage and a 2 stage liquid fuelled LV this is frankly *quite* depressing.

It doesn't even have the option to be launched outside the US as I'm pretty sure it would become *deeply* entangled in the madness of ITAR with a US built plane and rocket stages.  :(
MCT ITS BFR SS. The worlds first Methane fueled FFSC engined CFRP SS structure A380 sized aerospaceplane tail sitter capable of Earth & Mars atmospheric flight.First flight to Mars by end of 2022 TBC. T&C apply. Trust nothing. Run your own #s "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof" R. Simberg."Competitve" means cheaper ¬cheap SCramjet proposed 1956. First +ve thrust 2004. US R&D spend to date > $10Bn. #deployed designs. Zero.

Offline Robotbeat

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #687 on: 10/23/2012 04:48 pm »
Cost per launch matters. Sometimes more than cost per kilogram.
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Offline john smith 19

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #688 on: 10/23/2012 08:00 pm »
Cost per launch matters. Sometimes more than cost per kilogram.
Certainly. As does being primary rather than secondary payload.
But I'm wondering if the market is there for this at this *price*.
MCT ITS BFR SS. The worlds first Methane fueled FFSC engined CFRP SS structure A380 sized aerospaceplane tail sitter capable of Earth & Mars atmospheric flight.First flight to Mars by end of 2022 TBC. T&C apply. Trust nothing. Run your own #s "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof" R. Simberg."Competitve" means cheaper ¬cheap SCramjet proposed 1956. First +ve thrust 2004. US R&D spend to date > $10Bn. #deployed designs. Zero.

Offline Mackilroy

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #689 on: 10/26/2012 03:30 pm »
As of July this year LauncherOne had at least four customers, so there is some market for it.

Offline spectre9

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #690 on: 10/27/2012 04:53 am »
I hope they do a powered flight this year.

I suspect they're still aiming to do it. Plenty of time.  :)

That tank doesn't look too scary. It's just the fact it's right next to where the passengers sit and very highly pressurised that has me worried.

Inspection and quality control will have to be maintained. How many times do they refill?

Offline zaitcev

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #691 on: 10/29/2012 01:19 pm »
That tank doesn't look too scary. It's just the fact it's right next to where the passengers sit and very highly pressurised that has me worried.
You know, many cities in U.S. have taxi cabs fueled with CNG.

Offline spectre9

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #692 on: 10/29/2012 01:45 pm »
Which is fine for city streets.

SS2 does a supersonic reentry of the atmosphere.

People are resistant to shaking and vibration.

Offline kch

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #693 on: 10/29/2012 01:58 pm »

Inspection and quality control will have to be maintained. How many times do they refill?

507 ... or was it 12?  Who knows ... ;)

Offline Garrett

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #694 on: 10/29/2012 03:52 pm »
That tank doesn't look too scary. It's just the fact it's right next to where the passengers sit and very highly pressurised that has me worried.

You do realize that this is a rocket to space?  :P
- "Nothing shocks me. I'm a scientist." - Indiana Jones

Offline spectre9

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #695 on: 10/30/2012 12:40 am »
It's a commercial market.

One I intend to spend money in if I ever can.

There's Blue Origin and XCOR. I trust them more, they should be operational long before I can afford a flight myself  :)

I'm never getting on a SS2. Even if I was given a free ride. You need to remember the thing with death traps. Those that die first don't get a warning. Challenger, Concorde... It's morbid to think but you need to be sensible with your life.

Offline Lars_J

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #696 on: 10/30/2012 01:25 am »
I'm never getting on a SS2. Even if I was given a free ride. You need to remember the thing with death traps. Those that die first don't get a warning. Challenger, Concorde... It's morbid to think but you need to be sensible with your life.

I suggest you never cross the street again, and certainly don't ever get into an automobile. You need to be sensible with your life.

Offline spectre9

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #697 on: 10/30/2012 01:43 am »
I would rather ride a Mercury Redstone.

I want to go by myself.  :P

Offline aquarius

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #698 on: 10/30/2012 03:03 pm »
It's a commercial market.

One I intend to spend money in if I ever can.

There's Blue Origin and XCOR. I trust them more, they should be operational long before I can afford a flight myself  :)

I'm never getting on a SS2. Even if I was given a free ride. You need to remember the thing with death traps. Those that die first don't get a warning. Challenger, Concorde... It's morbid to think but you need to be sensible with your life.

What makes you think New Shepard and Lynx will be safer than SS2?
« Last Edit: 10/30/2012 03:14 pm by aquarius »

Offline simonbp

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Re: Space Ship Two - Updates
« Reply #699 on: 10/30/2012 03:11 pm »
Or any light aircraft, for that matter? Or driving to the airfield?

Hybrids may not be as cheap as some people argue, but they are no more inherently dangerous than any other aerospace propulsion system. The accident that TSC suffered would have been about as bad if it were a LOX tank suffering a rapid decompression...

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